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v1.00.95 pilot training issue

 
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v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 12:36:49 AM   
goran007

 

Posts: 143
Joined: 9/3/2009
From: croatia
Status: offline
new beta patch allowed us to choose pilot experience level and manual/auto assignment of replacement.

One of the options was also to assign group to training (cant remember actual name) but offered an option to release pilots to reserve pool and on other hand to assign new from replacement pool. 'Training group option' is now gone, is that on purpose?
Post #: 1
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 12:59:37 AM   
pompack


Posts: 2582
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: University Park, Texas
Status: offline 		I believe that it is if the group in question is scheduled for withdrawal

(in reply to goran007)
Post #: 2
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 1:05:01 AM   
Boozecamp

 

Posts: 44
Joined: 7/13/2007
From: Bellingham, WA
Status: offline 		Not working for me either.  Wha happon?

(in reply to pompack)
Post #: 3
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 3:09:54 AM   
Nomad


Posts: 5905
Joined: 9/5/2001
From: West Yellowstone, Montana
Status: offline 		103. Disabled the ability to make a group a temporary on-map Trainer.

I think they took that ability out.

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Post #: 4
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 3:53:26 AM   
Gary D


Posts: 164
Joined: 6/6/2002
From: Southern California
Status: offline
quote:

103. Disabled the ability to make a group a temporary on-map Trainer.

104. On-map Trainers will have a higher chance of OpsLoss for low EXP and/or high
FATIGUE pilots.


This has me wondering if there are "permanent" on map training groups somewhere in the OOB?

Or 104 pertains to any group that is on the map training?

(in reply to Nomad)
Post #: 5
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 4:05:05 AM   
Boozecamp

 

Posts: 44
Joined: 7/13/2007
From: Bellingham, WA
Status: offline 		Weird.  I read the readme and perused the changes to see if there was anything different from the beta.  I distinctly remember reading 104 but totally missed 103. 

Training groups were one of my favorite features of the beta.  I guess you can still do the same thing with any squadron, although the process is much more tedious, two clicks per pilot...

(in reply to Gary D)
Post #: 6
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 5:57:47 AM   
Swenslim

 

Posts: 437
Joined: 4/15/2005
From: Odessa, Ukraine
Status: offline 		Hm, i agree, this is very bad news. Traning groups was very good idea.

(in reply to Boozecamp)
Post #: 7
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 9:16:35 AM   
michaelm75au


Posts: 13500
Joined: 5/5/2001
From: Melbourne, Australia
Status: offline 		Creating temporary Trainer groups was a bone of contention with the OOB. It was pulled for more 'discussion'.

It may make a comeback, depending on feedback.


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Post #: 8
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 9:27:12 AM   
goran007

 

Posts: 143
Joined: 9/3/2009
From: croatia
Status: offline 		It was awesome thing i was quite disappointed when i saw it was missing.

get it back asap

(in reply to michaelm75au)
Post #: 9
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 11:41:30 AM   
viberpol


Posts: 838
Joined: 10/20/2005
From: Gizycko, Poland, EU
Status: offline 		Hmmm... I didn't update the game with a newest patch because of this "103. feature".
As I managed to occupy all SRA in my PBEM, I changed many, many groups into trainer squadrons with 50-80 pilots in them.
now, can you please explain what happens with the groups already assigned as training groups after patching?
Are they still working?
Will I be able to send the semitrained (50-70 exp) pilots to reserve pool?
Or they're lost and stuck with the group up to the bitter end? Because they'll never achieve the status of elite <80 pilots while training to be pulled out through TRACOM.

[EDIT]

Frankly speaking I find the vicissitude of introducing/removing vital feature quite frustrating.
One can say there should be no rules change while all sides agreed on them (PBEM).
But while the new patch simultaneously removes bugs there's no possibility not to agree on rules' change.


< Message edited by viberpol -- 12/9/2009 11:56:02 AM >

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(in reply to goran007)
Post #: 10
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 1:00:58 PM   
Smeulders

 

Posts: 1879
Joined: 8/9/2009
Status: offline 		You can still remove them from the unit by sending them to the reserve one by one. I've patched from beta to official Patch 2 and my trainer units still exist, though I can't make new ones.

One interesting note though, I wanted to reverse my temporary trainer units to regular units, to keep in line with the changes to the game, but was not allowed to do so ! There seems to be a delay that forces you to keep units as designated trainers for at least a (short?) month (They have been trainers for a good week now and there is still a 21 day delay). Makes sense of course, you shouldn't be able to make it a trainer unit just because you're pulling it from the line for a week, but I did find it strange it wasn't noted anywhere. (Of course, I may have completely missed that note)

(in reply to viberpol)
Post #: 11
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 1:11:09 PM   
viberpol


Posts: 838
Joined: 10/20/2005
From: Gizycko, Poland, EU
Status: offline 		Thanks Smeulders for the update.

The on-map trainer group had never been able ("never" -- I mean since latest beta of course) to be switched back after a time shorter than month.
What was important for me -- that I wouldn't freeze all those semitrained (I mean 50-79 exp; NOT over 80 because they're treated as elite and can be pulled out through TRACOM) pilots sent to squadrons in Mandzuria etc.
As I see it the solution is to create training groups before patching with official patch, so that they could still work after that.



< Message edited by viberpol -- 12/9/2009 1:15:48 PM >

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Post #: 12
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 1:40:52 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: viberpol
Frankly speaking I find the vicissitude of introducing/removing vital feature quite frustrating.
One can say there should be no rules change while all sides agreed on them (PBEM).
But while the new patch simultaneously removes bugs there's no possibility not to agree on rules' change.


We make no guarantees when it comes to _beta_ updates. The team decided that training groups were not ready for official release yet.

The rest of the improved pilot management/training is still there.

< Message edited by Erik Rutins -- 12/9/2009 1:44:51 PM >

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CEO, Matrix Games LLC



For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

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(in reply to viberpol)
Post #: 13
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 3:23:18 PM   
jackyo123

 

Posts: 697
Joined: 2/4/2008
Status: offline 		question - is there any reason to have pilots in TRACOM anymore? Since there are no more training groups?

thanks

(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 14
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 3:37:20 PM   
viberpol


Posts: 838
Joined: 10/20/2005
From: Gizycko, Poland, EU
Status: offline 		As I understand it, pilots in TRACOM do not affect the experience gain of pilots in on-map squadrons.
Their (on-map pilots) experience was to be boosted by elite pilots pulled out from TRACOM back on map and into training squadrons.

TRACOM did make a difference as far as the base levels of training exp. (1 - 12 months, seen as "replacement") is concerned.

But BTW, after 3 months of war (scenario 2) with about 80 navy pilots available in TRACOM every month I actually noticed a slight DECREASE of final base experience (from 50 to 49) but a small INCREASE of experience in these partial base training periods (divided in quarters). Quite strange.

Anyway, the on-map training seemed to be really effective and possibly this was the reason the devs decided to change it in the official patch.
However, as it seems that squadrons set as training groups are still working (still training pilots pretty fast but with slightly bigger ops looses), I cannot see the reason why to cancel the functionality of creating new training groups.
This would affect new games, but not those PBEMs that are still going and were updated with the beta first.


< Message edited by viberpol -- 12/9/2009 3:48:54 PM >

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Post #: 15
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 3:40:57 PM   
joey


Posts: 1408
Joined: 5/8/2004
From: Johnstown, PA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelm

Creating temporary Trainer groups was a bone of contention with the OOB. It was pulled for more 'discussion'.

It may make a comeback, depending on feedback.



I am not interested in any "discussion". I would love to a see a hot fix reinstalling TGs. In the mean time, I plan on uninstalling the patch and reinstalling the beta to get them back. They were the best feature addition to WITPAE yet!!!!!

(in reply to michaelm75au)
Post #: 16
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 5:03:59 PM   
Gary D


Posts: 164
Joined: 6/6/2002
From: Southern California
Status: offline 		I also liked the temporary training squadrons in the beta. However the beta was truly a beta, where a player could plunder pilots from the restricted squadrons with no downside. Getting that fixed even if meant giving up the training squadrons until the training squadron concept can be polished seems pretty prudent.

As someone else mentioned, the AI needs a compensating advantage if a human player is going to have another stick to beat it with!


(in reply to joey)
Post #: 17
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 5:42:44 PM   
goran007

 

Posts: 143
Joined: 9/3/2009
From: croatia
Status: offline 		people do enjoy seeing a lot of aces in 1944+, and i think noone would continue playing if his pilots get massacred.

It sounds reasonable to me that after 3-6 months bunch of novice pilots training advanced tactics and wingman doctrine under guidance of aces would become really good (70).

from 70 to 80 pilots need another month or so of combat missions.

90+ pilots should be nearly undestructable unless they are on overvelmed in the air or killed by AA and bombardment on the ground.

Pilot training with beta moved quite near what a real pilot training would be like.

I would also agree with few others that pilot training was nicest new feature and was quite sad when i realized it was removed.

Atleast give us option 'advanced training on/off' button, i know i wouldnt think twice

< Message edited by goran007 -- 12/9/2009 5:48:15 PM >

(in reply to Gary D)
Post #: 18
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 10:07:23 PM   
jackyo123

 

Posts: 697
Joined: 2/4/2008
Status: offline 		here here - put it back in!

(in reply to goran007)
Post #: 19
RE: v1.00.95 pilot training issue - 12/9/2009 11:27:28 PM   
Barb


Posts: 2503
Joined: 2/27/2007
From: Bratislava, Slovakia
Status: offline 		I like the idea to convert groups to training and back! I want it back...

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Post #: 20
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