Slitherine

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...if Matrix and/or Tankerace feel that there would be that much revenue lost to a WPO conversion to AE by Graham, then wouldn't that be all the more reason for them to actually do the work themselves and create a WPO AE to release for sale.?

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ORIGINAL: pmn25

hellfirejet

So your saying you are making a pre WWI game? If so that would be great. As for matrix ressurecting WPO I wouldnt cross my fingers.

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I have decided since, there is very little chance of War Plan Orange,being upgraded or patched in the near or even distant future,that I have been left with no alternative, but to MATE WAR PLAN ORANGE WITH WAR IN THE PACIFIC ADMIRALS EDITION,since I own both games and WITP AE has a far better editor and graphics and AI.

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Hey guys this won't happen over night,it will take time but I will make it happen,I will be transfering as much as possible to the ADMIRALS EDITION EDITOR,to get the WAR PLAN ORANGE database working smooth in it's new home,just like the WAR IN THE PACIFIC original was given a face lift,well so will War Plan Orange

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The two programs can become one,the ship and aircraft art work works the same way in both versions,so my plan is to index the device database so everything is better orginised,I also plan to add the German airforce complete with Zeppelins

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think WAR PLAN ORANGE deserves nothing less than a major face lift and overhaul,what do you guys think yes /no?

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ORIGINAL: Connfire

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...if Matrix and/or Tankerace feel that there would be that much revenue lost to a WPO conversion to AE by Graham, then wouldn't that be all the more reason for them to actually do the work themselves and create a WPO AE to release for sale.?

Very well said. I sincerely hope that Tankerace and/or Matrix sees fit to reply to that question, as well as others that have been asked today. Hopefully an understanding acceptable to all can be reached.

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ORIGINAL: Tankerace

Agreed, I do not own the rights to the dreadnought era, and feel free if you wish to make your own Dreadnought mod for AE. That's all fine and dandy.



But,

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I have decided since, there is very little chance of War Plan Orange,being upgraded or patched in the near or even distant future,that I have been left with no alternative, but to MATE WAR PLAN ORANGE WITH WAR IN THE PACIFIC ADMIRALS EDITION,since I own both games and WITP AE has a far better editor and graphics and AI.

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Hey guys this won't happen over night,it will take time but I will make it happen,I will be transfering as much as possible to the ADMIRALS EDITION EDITOR,to get the WAR PLAN ORANGE database working smooth in it's new home,just like the WAR IN THE PACIFIC original was given a face lift,well so will War Plan Orange

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The two programs can become one,the ship and aircraft art work works the same way in both versions,so my plan is to index the device database so everything is better orginised,I also plan to add the German airforce complete with Zeppelins

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think WAR PLAN ORANGE deserves nothing less than a major face lift and overhaul,what do you guys think yes /no?

Do not indicate you are making a new game, in fact you've blatantly stated you are using my work as a springboard for your own project. I don't own the rights to the dreadnought era, but I do own the rights to War Plan Orange, which at the begining of this thread you said you were using. If you want to make your own dreadnought game do so, but use your own code, your own research, your own scenarios, etc. Don't use mine. That's my argument. Only in response to my post have you talked about "A new game," previous it was, and as quoted above, "mating WPO with WitPAE." Something I politely asked you not to do, or only do as a guide for other WPO owners, not just AE owners, to do.



As to supporting the game, my expansion idea was nixed by Matrix. I have not had time to update the game at all, and by update actually means "including new free stuff." I'm all for players making mod and free updates -- hell, that's how I got started. But I didn't take Matrix's WitP scenario and make them free downloads for UV owners, and I made sure that WPO could not play WitP scenarios. All I did was ask you to respect that right.



Would I like to do an update to WPO? Absolutely. But I don't have the time, Matrix has nixed my expansion idea, and the sad world of capitalism means I have to devote my energies to what gives me a paycheck -- which is not a free ware update to WPO.



That's not to say you won't see an AE update to WPO, but just not soon.



As to this "mod" or "game", whatever you want to call it, feel free to develop you own, but at the beginning of this thread you stated you were making a mod to AE using the game I created. The two are not one in the same.



And as to not be bothered to complete my work, I did exactly what I set out to do, create a wargame simulating a post WWI game set in the 1920s. The 1930s was something I wanted to do, nothing I ever promised to do. WPO only covers 1922-1930 in the title, and that's exactly what it does.

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ORIGINAL: Connfire

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...if Matrix and/or Tankerace feel that there would be that much revenue lost to a WPO conversion to AE by Graham, then wouldn't that be all the more reason for them to actually do the work themselves and create a WPO AE to release for sale.?

Very well said. I sincerely hope that Tankerace and/or Matrix sees fit to reply to that question, as well as others that have been asked today. Hopefully an understanding acceptable to all can be reached.

As to this question, for me anyway it isn't about the revenue. How would you feel if someone took something that you worked on for 15 months from scratch, that you happily got published and was truly a pride of acheivement and then just used it for themselves, and insinuated they would do so in a way that violated your copyrights on it and used your material without even bothering to ask first. That's what I'm protective of.

No matter how much revenue is lost, that is immaterial. The fact is that WPO is a copyrighted game and to make a mod that would in effect allow its core files to be used without ownership of the game is illegal, plain and simple. That is my argument.

I hardcore supported WPO its first three years of existence, but the game turned 4 last month. How much longer should I actively devote all of my excess time to the game after it has hit the point where I no longer make a lot of money off of it? I work a regular job, in six months I have a wife, and I'm starting a doctoral degree. I only have so much time. Nevertheless, WPO is my game, the fruits of my labor, and I will protect it as such.

Now, if Graham wants to contact Matrix about doing a licensed conversion under my direction, then I'm all for it. But that's not what I've seen proposed here today.

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Now, if Graham wants to contact Matrix about doing a licensed conversion under my direction, then I'm all for it.

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I'm all for players making mod and free updates -- hell, that's how I got started

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The fact is an AE editor won't work in WPO, as the two games are now very different, they started off the same sure, but now use very different scenario type files with different information, just as the program files themselves are very different, simply copying the editor file won't work as the .exe would need to be changed.

What you are asking would, as I stated earlier, require an Admiral's Edition update to WPO, which would need the approval of myself, Matrix, 2by3Games, and the AE team. If you would like to work on such a project that is fine, and I'll get in touch with people and see if we can make it happen, but it would be no easy undertaking but I would provide whatever support I can and assist you in any way possible.

The thing is, you are talking about mating one team's work with another team's work, and both parties have an interest in that.

Rather than ask for an AE update in the PM, your new idea seems to be doing another scenario -- which is absolutely fine, WPO is coded for just that. But if you want the AE changes -- which according to your thread you wanted to do -- you'll have to work under the supervision of Matrix to create a paid expansion that protects both peoples interests.

Now, is that what you are wanting to do, or now are you simply wanting to create a new dreadnought scenario for WPO? (if it is for AE, it is now blocked to prevent any pre 1936 scenario to protect WPO files from being used, not to mention none of the code would work anyway -- it took Mike wood about 10 months of heavy coding to get WPO where it was from WitP, code that AE does NOT have and makes it really implausible for a dreadnought scenario).

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ORIGINAL: hellfirejet

it all boils down to finance in the end,money makes the world go round,

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ORIGINAL: tex

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ORIGINAL: hellfirejet

it all boils down to finance in the end,money makes the world go round,

You got that right Graham!

Am I the only one who feels insulted in that for ages we have been asking for at the very least some information about future plans for this game, only to be totally ignored, but when they feel their bank account threatened we suddenly have all the attention in the world?

I own four Matrix games (which are not cheap, as you all know), but I seem to have lost any desire to add a fifth title to my collection.

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ORIGINAL: hellfirejet

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ORIGINAL: tex

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ORIGINAL: hellfirejet

it all boils down to finance in the end,money makes the world go round,

You got that right Graham!

Am I the only one who feels insulted in that for ages we have been asking for at the very least some information about future plans for this game, only to be totally ignored, but when they feel their bank account threatened we suddenly have all the attention in the world?

I own four Matrix games (which are not cheap, as you all know), but I seem to have lost any desire to add a fifth title to my collection.

Well I unfortuately have 12 Matrix titles all within 1 year,I'm going to see an shrink to get my head looked at,Tankerace say's that Matrix supports WPO,yes and pigs really do fly,when was the last time anyone from Matrix last made any comments on this forum ?to put it mildly they are extracting the urine from us,and I'm sick of it

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I think part of the problem with WPO and other Matrix niche games in not geting updated, is the fact you get all updates done for free,and they ain't gonna do that if they only sell 2 or 3 hundred copies,it all boils down to finance in the end,money makes the world go round,well why don't Matrix charge for these upgrades,say 10% of the value of the product in the first place.That way it might make the designers improve and expand on there games,and not let them wither and die.