Slitherine

quote:

ORIGINAL: jb123

How do you guys escort some of the xAPs (QE comes to mind) with high cruising speeds that are usually 5-10 knots faster than dd and CL cruising speeds? I don't want to put the TF on full speed. I guess I could form a surface combat TF to follow the faster ship but I find that escorting valuable things is best done with a combination of escorts in the valuable TF and separate TFs following.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jb123

How do you guys escort some of the xAPs (QE comes to mind) with high cruising speeds that are usually 5-10 knots faster than dd and CL cruising speeds? I don't want to put the TF on full speed. I guess I could form a surface combat TF to follow the faster ship but I find that escorting valuable things is best done with a combination of escorts in the valuable TF and separate TFs following.

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin

quote:

ORIGINAL: jb123

How do you guys escort some of the xAPs (QE comes to mind) with high cruising speeds that are usually 5-10 knots faster than dd and CL cruising speeds? I don't want to put the TF on full speed. I guess I could form a surface combat TF to follow the faster ship but I find that escorting valuable things is best done with a combination of escorts in the valuable TF and separate TFs following.

HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bsq

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin

quote:

ORIGINAL: jb123

How do you guys escort some of the xAPs (QE comes to mind) with high cruising speeds that are usually 5-10 knots faster than dd and CL cruising speeds? I don't want to put the TF on full speed. I guess I could form a surface combat TF to follow the faster ship but I find that escorting valuable things is best done with a combination of escorts in the valuable TF and separate TFs following.

HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

It's known as 'limiting lines of approach'. Basically with the speed of the Queens, the speed of the submarines, the range and speed of the torpedoes they would have been impossible to hit. (Perhaps late war Kaitens in ambush may have been able to get them). Use them unescorted, they move 16 - 18 hexes a day and QE can carry at least 2 LCU's (one at a time) from the West Coast to Aus before she has to be withdrawn.

BTW what annoys me more about these ships is the amount of system damage they take when cruising or at mission speed - come on whoever wrote the parameters for these two ships, they did not need a 6 week yard service between troop carrying runs, yet that's what the game does to them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bsq

2 LCU's ONE AT A TIME as I stated in the original reply.

They take weeks to repair - QE has 21 sys 0 flot and 1 Eng and it was estimating 41 days in San Fransisco for repairs - so sorry sys damage is an issue on an 80k GRT ship. (this was after 1 run to West coast followed by 1 return run to Sydney and back.

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin
HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

quote:

ORIGINAL: RDonlon

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin
HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

This is one of the most pretentious posts I have seen in many years. I assume you are not a developer because if you were you would have put that in your curious ciriculum vitae. Since you are not, I wonder what in the world you are talking about. Just who do you think you are? And don't play stupid games please. I work for State at sec level 5.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jb123

How do you guys escort some of the xAPs (QE comes to mind) with high cruising speeds that are usually 5-10 knots faster than dd and CL cruising speeds? I don't want to put the TF on full speed. I guess I could form a surface combat TF to follow the faster ship but I find that escorting valuable things is best done with a combination of escorts in the valuable TF and separate TFs following.

USS St. Louis firing on Guam, July 1944. The Cardinals and Browns faced each other in the World Series that year

quote:

ORIGINAL: RDonlon

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin
HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

This is one of the most pretentious posts I have seen in many years. I assume you are not a developer because if you were you would have put that in your curious ciriculum vitae. Since you are not, I wonder what in the world you are talking about. Just who do you think you are? And don't play stupid games please. I work for State at sec level 5.

quote:

ORIGINAL: RDonlon

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin
HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

This is one of the most pretentious posts I have seen in many years. I assume you are not a developer because if you were you would have put that in your curious ciriculum vitae. Since you are not, I wonder what in the world you are talking about. Just who do you think you are? And don't play stupid games please. I work for State at sec level 5.

quote:

ORIGINAL: RDonlon

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin
HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

This is one of the most pretentious posts I have seen in many years. I assume you are not a developer because if you were you would have put that in your curious ciriculum vitae. Since you are not, I wonder what in the world you are talking about. Just who do you think you are? And don't play stupid games please. I work for State at sec level 5.

quote:

ORIGINAL: wild_Willie2

quote:

ORIGINAL: RDonlon

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin
HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

This is one of the most pretentious posts I have seen in many years. I assume you are not a developer because if you were you would have put that in your curious ciriculum vitae. Since you are not, I wonder what in the world you are talking about. Just who do you think you are? And don't play stupid games please. I work for State at sec level 5.

Hi RDonlon.

Like any other forum, this forum has a larger group of users ranging from chronic NAY sayers, to active/retired navy men, to people with PhD's that like to argue their posts with a lot of math/technical content. As there is a "relative" form of free speech on this forum you will have to deal with each poster individually, whether you like their style of posting or not.

For people that you do not like, there is a small green button next to the "buddy" button that will let you block posts from those posters, but be warned, this also works for every other poster that thinks that your posts are not wanted..

Gr.

William.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Frank

quote:

ORIGINAL: wild_Willie2

quote:

ORIGINAL: RDonlon

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin
HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

This is one of the most pretentious posts I have seen in many years. I assume you are not a developer because if you were you would have put that in your curious ciriculum vitae. Since you are not, I wonder what in the world you are talking about. Just who do you think you are? And don't play stupid games please. I work for State at sec level 5.

Hi RDonlon.

Like any other forum, this forum has a larger group of users ranging from chronic NAY sayers, to active/retired navy men, to people with PhD's that like to argue their posts with a lot of math/technical content. As there is a "relative" form of free speech on this forum you will have to deal with each poster individually, whether you like their style of posting or not.

For people that you do not like, there is a small green button next to the "buddy" button that will let you block posts from those posters, but be warned, this also works for every other poster that thinks that your posts are not wanted..

Gr.

William.

please, donßt scare him, he is sec level 5 and works for the state!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Frank

maybe he will be better at level 6!

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Frank

maybe he will be better at level 6!

There's something screwy about this discussion. I don't remember the US Department of State running its own clearance system. I suspect a troll.

quote:

ORIGINAL: bsq

Whisper

You're right of course, but as he added nothing to the discussion other than to pick on another member, I think he had it coming (especially with his 'years' on forums...).

quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

quote:

ORIGINAL: RDonlon

This is one of the most pretentious posts I have seen in many years. I assume you are not a developer because if you were you would have put that in your curious ciriculum vitae. Since you are not, I wonder what in the world you are talking about. Just who do you think you are? And don't play stupid games please. I work for State at sec level 5.

now this is a funny second post...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Whisper

quote:

ORIGINAL: bsq

Whisper

You're right of course, but as he added nothing to the discussion other than to pick on another member, I think he had it coming (especially with his 'years' on forums...).

Yeah, he was a jerk. But the other guy was a jerk too. How do we deal with this crap?

You got some pretentious buttwipe who pretends he knows something, and then you get people who claim the buttwipe's claims are bogus. I really don't care who is bogus or not. I do know who is pretentious.

quote:

ORIGINAL: RDonlon

quote:

ORIGINAL: herwin
HISTORY

The Queens did not use escorts. They cruised at 29-30 knots, which was sufficiently fast that a sub had a near-nil chance of developing a target solution in the time between first detection and engagement. (When I was doing the system modelling for A/N BSY-2, I had to model this process. There are a number of books in the open literature that address the issues of interest.) Note that the American CVTFs moved at about that speed when strategically deploying, but with cruisers (but not destroyers, however) in attendance to protect against SAGs. They were also pretty much invulnerable to submarine attack.

I don't know what the game does. Most TFs and convoys moved at speeds that subs could handle. This is the sort of issue that you need a background in OR and some submarine experience to get right.

This is one of the most pretentious posts I have seen in many years. I assume you are not a developer because if you were you would have put that in your curious ciriculum vitae. Since you are not, I wonder what in the world you are talking about. Just who do you think you are? And don't play stupid games please. I work for State at sec level 5.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Djordje

quote:

ORIGINAL: Whisper

quote:

ORIGINAL: bsq

Whisper

You're right of course, but as he added nothing to the discussion other than to pick on another member, I think he had it coming (especially with his 'years' on forums...).

Yeah, he was a jerk. But the other guy was a jerk too. How do we deal with this crap?

You got some pretentious buttwipe who pretends he knows something, and then you get people who claim the buttwipe's claims are bogus. I really don't care who is bogus or not. I do know who is pretentious.

And then we get random people like you who for some reason feel the need to make useless posts.

As far as Herwin is concerned almost all of his posts contained some really useful information. And he never just states something, he also explains his point of view in clear and concise way.

On the other hand the only thing your post did was to make me even more thankful to the one that thought of the nice little green button. I just hope there is no limit for the number of people that can receive its treatment as these forums seem to attract some strange people lately.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Frank

please, donßt scare him, he is sec level 5 and works for the state!