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RE: Avatar - 12/31/2009 3:35:48 AM   
Jeffrey H.


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sven


quote:

ORIGINAL: sprior

Sherlock Holmes is a much better film.



QFT, and *somehow* it was a far better film sans an overt political bent.



...sounds like one for me.



_____________________________

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Post #: 31
RE: Avatar - 12/31/2009 3:42:48 AM   
Jeffrey H.


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From: San Diego, Ca.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Capt. Harlock

quote:

The attention to detail and the world they created was awesome


Visually, yes. From an anthropological basis, not so much. There wasn't a hint of what they do when it rains (no structures), how they handle their excrement, whether or not they have droughts and famines, what they do about birth defects or mental illness, etc., etc. Pandora looks like a fairyland, and from an engineer's jaundiced eye, it is.


Well it looks so nice to have a utopian society that somehow avoids the needs of a modern society.

What better way to contrast the evil doings of a real society with real needs.


_____________________________

History began July 4th, 1776. Anything before that was a mistake.

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Post #: 32
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 1:50:22 AM   
E

 

Posts: 1247
Joined: 9/20/2007
Status: offline 		Just saw Avatar... it was fun in a cutesy sort of way... Military Sci-Fi meets Disney/Pixar.  But then again, I was just looking to be entertained for awhile.

(in reply to Jeffrey H.)
Post #: 33
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 2:17:41 AM   
JagdFlanker


Posts: 689
Joined: 7/26/2003
From: Halifax, Canada
Status: offline 		the only thing that bothered me was the (land) animals on the planet all seemed to have 6 limbs while the natives only had 4 limbs

otherwise was pretty good in spite of the predictable story

one day a movie like this is going to shock the hell out of us when the underdog loses and gets wiped out like what would happen 99% of the time in that situation - THAT would have made the movie impressive

< Message edited by Flanker Leader -- 1/1/2010 2:18:13 AM >

(in reply to E)
Post #: 34
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 7:18:43 AM   
NefariousKoel


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quote:

The attention to detail and the world they created was awesome


I saw people stepping on tiles that lighted up like Michael Jackson's Billy Jean video. It's amazing new technology.. since the 80s.

If you need help visualizing that, here ya go (lights up where you step): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zi_XLOBDo_Y

< Message edited by NefariousKoel -- 1/1/2010 7:20:53 AM >

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Post #: 35
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 8:30:32 AM   
Twotribes


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JW

I know one person who saw it both 2D and 3D.  He says the 3D experience was incomparably better.  I saw it 3D and thought it was great.  A good movie, old theme, Dances with Wolves in Space as some have called it, but the special effects and 3D are simply incredible.  It is a great movie from that standpoint. 

I keep reading it is an antiwar movie, but I don't get that message from the  movie based on the actions of the indigenous big blue people.  If anything, it is a movie in part about how you have to fight for your liberty sometimes. 

There is also an obvious in-your-face environmentalist theme, but I've found very few people who saw the movie who really care about that theme one way or the other.



The obvious anti corporate, anti Government, anti materialistic theme sells well as sci fi cause well LOTS of sci fi have that as a theme. So when you are a die hard sci fi person it does not phase you a bit that the plot has that in it.

LOVED the movie, plot be damned ). Old hat though. As soon as you discover the main character is ( A crippled, B) A Marine, C) going to take over a body that is neither, the story is told. The rest is fluff.

So one ignores the plot and watches the movie for entertainment, and it ENTERTAINS very well. The mistake now would be for anti environmentalists to start thinking the Movie's success had anything to do with the message.

(in reply to jwarrenw13)
Post #: 36
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 10:49:55 AM   
leastonh1


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Status: offline 		How suitable would Avatar be for a 6yr old boy to watch? He's nuts about sci-fi and loves action movies. I want to keep him away from sex, bad language and gratuitous violence and wondered if Avatar is ok on that score?

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Post #: 37
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 11:48:43 AM   
sprior


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_H

How suitable would Avatar be for a 6yr old boy to watch? He's nuts about sci-fi and loves action movies. I want to keep him away from sex, bad language and gratuitous violence and wondered if Avatar is ok on that score?


It's rated 12A and I was apprehensive about taking my 10 yo. There are lots of people getting blown up, shot, stabbed, thrown off of heights etc. There's no blood, dismembered limbs laying around etc. The sex is confined to some tongue action. Hope this helps. Son loved it.

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Post #: 38
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 1:15:36 PM   
freeboy

 

Posts: 9088
Joined: 5/16/2004
From: Colorado
Status: offline 		ok, in regard to your child, sex, not gratuitus but has a major influence on the charactor developement, used as a bridge.. inappropriate for a child imo
violence, WAY into innapropriate for a child!
We are so desenthisized in our uber violent culture many may ask why I feel this why, seriously violent film.
My overall impression is its an anti war movie, or a pro "throw out the imperialist war movie", that troubled me some with the spiritual/sexual bonding to the beasts.. way way past a harmonious co existance.. but thats jsut me.. for actual film quality, those special things that take a story and make it memorable and enjoyable this is a very good movie...
Again, imo a totally inapropriate movie for your 6 year old.. good luck


< Message edited by freeboy -- 1/1/2010 1:17:43 PM >

(in reply to sprior)
Post #: 39
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 1:43:33 PM   
leastonh1


Posts: 879
Joined: 2/12/2005
From: West Yorkshire, England
Status: offline 		Thanks for the replies. It does sound like too much of an adult movie for him. As it's rated 12, a 10yr old going is fine, but not a 6yr old.

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2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
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Post #: 40
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 3:38:14 PM   
ASHBERY76


Posts: 2136
Joined: 10/10/2001
From: England
Status: offline 		Was there a single creature on that planet that was scary? Jurassic park was a lot more groundbreaking for effects in its time.

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Post #: 41
RE: Avatar - 1/1/2010 4:13:16 PM   
SlickWilhelm


Posts: 1854
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From: Rochester, MN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_H

How suitable would Avatar be for a 6yr old boy to watch? He's nuts about sci-fi and loves action movies. I want to keep him away from sex, bad language and gratuitous violence and wondered if Avatar is ok on that score?


I concur with freeboy's advice. I think the violence/battle scenes would scare the crap out of a six-year old. I didn't take my ten year old to it, although he probably could have handled it fine.

On the other hand, it could provide the perfect opportunity to explain what a human being and a blue, uh, thing do when they love each other.


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Post #: 42
RE: Avatar - 1/2/2010 10:45:52 AM   
leastonh1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Slick Wilhelm
I concur with freeboy's advice. I think the violence/battle scenes would scare the crap out of a six-year old. I didn't take my ten year old to it, although he probably could have handled it fine.

On the other hand, it could provide the perfect opportunity to explain what a human being and a blue, uh, thing do when they love each other.

I took him to see Planet 51 instead

He's already asking some rather awkward questions about sex and where babies come from. I'll pass on encouraging more lol!

_____________________________

2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
Richard Winters: We're paratroopers, Lieutenant, we're supposed to be surrounded.

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Post #: 43
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 1:23:17 PM   
Joe D.


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From: Stratford, Connecticut
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Punk Reaper

Just got back from Avatar 3D and we all thought it was a great film ...


My experince w/3D films is the same as w/3D games: disappointing.

Eye candy is no substitute for substance.

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Post #: 44
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 5:35:28 PM   
New York Jets


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From: St. Louis, MO but stuck in Bremerton,WA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Christ - I can't believe some of you! Do you not just see things for the enjoyment factor.

Ok...actually I feel sorry for you, because clearly you're so politically wrapped up you can't see out of it!

The only message I picked up from it was it was a good film with some great CGI...end of. Maybe one day you'll be able to watch something without trying to read to hard into the "subliminal" message!



Ahhhh. That old argument.

My wife once commented that she did not like to watch movies with me because I watch movies "like a movie critic." And, she's right. I do. I had a similar debate on my last TDY trip with one of the other guys who said words to the effect that he '"...goes to movies to enjoy himself. To be entertained." I couldn't agree more. So do I.

But, the things I look for, and am entertained by, in a movie are different than some. I'm entertained by good direction, good character development, good and original storytelling, good film editing, good dialogue, good casting, etc. I even like a good morality play or message movie if it's not too heavy handed and obvious.

As for GGI and special effects, I think too many directors rely on the new special effects technology snd forget how to make a good movie. James Cameron is a good, and definitely not only, example. Cameron's biggest turd, Titanic is a good example. And yes, I know it won 11 Academy Awards. Even the Academy screws up, too. Titanic had great special effects but, was otherwise mediocre. It had terrible charater development and writing. Crappy storytelling. It was, in my opinion, a B Grade movie wrapped up in millions of dollars worth of special effects.

The same goes for that uber-dud Pearl Harbor which was even worse and had even more transgressions but, it didn't win 11 Ocsars so I used Titanic as an example, instead.

Just my two cents.

I'll wait for this on DVD.

< Message edited by Chris Trog -- 1/3/2010 8:05:15 PM >

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Post #: 45
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 6:06:42 PM   
leastonh1


Posts: 879
Joined: 2/12/2005
From: West Yorkshire, England
Status: offline 		I have this regualr "debate" with a close friend of mine. He's into comparing directors and their work, critiquing movies based on their social, political, religious etc. commentary and all this other rubbish. Just go watch the bloody film, switch off yer brain and enjoy being entertained. Good grief.

I've even heard one idiot spouting almost religiously about the moral message in the original Star Wars. Talk about missing the point of going to the movies. Unbelievable. If you want politics, read a newspaper, watch the news, join a party. If you want religion, go to the nearest church, synagogue or wherever. If you want to be entertained, go to the cinema. Why does it have to be more complicated than that?

Chris, I think you have it wrong. You seem to be under the impression that movies with lots of CGI, by definition, are a bad thing. Really? Surely, they are just making the most of the latest technology. I think some put too much emphasis on dialogue or violence or sex or whatever. Doesn't mean I'm any more right than you are. You cited one well known example of how not to use CGI and that's fair enough, but don't tar "too many directors" with that brush.

Before anyone comes in with a flamethrower, this post was meant to be more tongue in cheek than serious. Even so....learn how to relax and enjoy things at face value. Not everything has to have a hidden message or meaning.


_____________________________

2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
Richard Winters: We're paratroopers, Lieutenant, we're supposed to be surrounded.

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Post #: 46
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 6:26:27 PM   
Joe D.


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From: Stratford, Connecticut
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_H

... If you want politics, read a newspaper, watch the news, join a party. If you want religion, go to the nearest church, synagogue or wherever. If you want to be entertained, go to the cinema. Why does it have to be more complicated than that?


Because it's not what I want, but what I don't want.

We're getting more than what we bargained for at the movies: once upon a time there were many subtle -- if not sublimal -- messages in many theaters urging patrons to visit the "lobby".

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Post #: 47
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 6:53:23 PM   
killroyishere

 

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quote:

if not sublimal -- messages in many theaters urging patrons to visit the "lobby".


Just great now I have an urge to eat popcorn and milk duds ohhh and a box of chocolate mints too.

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Post #: 48
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 7:07:57 PM   
Jeffrey H.


Posts: 3154
Joined: 4/13/2007
From: San Diego, Ca.
Status: offline 		Just saw sector 9 last night.....anyone see and or like that one ?

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Post #: 49
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 7:14:19 PM   
E

 

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Joined: 9/20/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_H

Not everything has to have a hidden message or meaning.



While I have heard that sometimes a cigar is just a cigar, you have to admit that no one who has seen this movie has been able to destroy a gigantic tree, full of giant blue aliens, on an alien planet that has more neurons than the human brain. Just because they're paranoid, doesn't mean Cameron isn't out to sublimate them!

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Post #: 50
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 7:33:54 PM   
jwarrenw13

 

Posts: 1897
Joined: 8/12/2000
From: Louisiana, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_H

I have this regualr "debate" with a close friend of mine. He's into comparing directors and their work, critiquing movies based on their social, political, religious etc. commentary and all this other rubbish. Just go watch the bloody film, switch off yer brain and enjoy being entertained. Good grief.

I've even heard one idiot spouting almost religiously about the moral message in the original Star Wars. Talk about missing the point of going to the movies. Unbelievable. If you want politics, read a newspaper, watch the news, join a party. If you want religion, go to the nearest church, synagogue or wherever. If you want to be entertained, go to the cinema. Why does it have to be more complicated than that?

Chris, I think you have it wrong. You seem to be under the impression that movies with lots of CGI, by definition, are a bad thing. Really? Surely, they are just making the most of the latest technology. I think some put too much emphasis on dialogue or violence or sex or whatever. Doesn't mean I'm any more right than you are. You cited one well known example of how not to use CGI and that's fair enough, but don't tar "too many directors" with that brush.

Before anyone comes in with a flamethrower, this post was meant to be more tongue in cheek than serious. Even so....learn how to relax and enjoy things at face value. Not everything has to have a hidden message or meaning.



There are apparently people who practice Jediism as an actual religious belief, a religion based on a movie.

(in reply to leastonh1)
Post #: 51
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 7:53:30 PM   
E

 

Posts: 1247
Joined: 9/20/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JW

There are apparently people who practice Jediism as an actual religious belief, a religion based on a movie.


A comment could be made here, but one should always follow The Prime Directive(tm). *ROFL*


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Post #: 52
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 8:03:15 PM   
New York Jets


Posts: 2087
Joined: 6/25/2001
From: St. Louis, MO but stuck in Bremerton,WA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_H

I have this regualr "debate" with a close friend of mine. He's into comparing directors and their work, critiquing movies based on their social, political, religious etc. commentary and all this other rubbish. Just go watch the bloody film, switch off yer brain and enjoy being entertained. Good grief.


As I stated, I enjoy being entertained differently than most moviegoers. I made that quite clear.

quote:

I've even heard one idiot spouting almost religiously about the moral message in the original Star Wars. Talk about missing the point of going to the movies. Unbelievable. If you want politics, read a newspaper, watch the news, join a party. If you want religion, go to the nearest church, synagogue or wherever. If you want to be entertained, go to the cinema. Why does it have to be more complicated than that?


i just don't see things as simplistically as that. What is the point of film making? To tell a story. Stories can be about politics, religion, current events, morality plays, etc. And yes, sometimes just visceral entertainment. Example: Two great films (by any standard) areThe Ox Bow Incident and Twelve Angry Men. They were both what you would call a 'message movie'. The Ox Bow Incident told a story about the perils of mob violence and vigilante justice, set against a back drop of the old west. Twelve Angry Men was a courtroom drama that was really about the dangers of predjudice and bigotry. But, they were both hugely entertaining movies. Maybe not to you or some others on this board. I am entertained by watching an actor or a director practice his craft.

quote:

Chris, I think you have it wrong. You seem to be under the impression that movies with lots of CGI, by definition, are a bad thing. Really? Surely, they are just making the most of the latest technology. I think some put too much emphasis on dialogue or violence or sex or whatever. Doesn't mean I'm any more right than you are. You cited one well known example of how not to use CGI and that's fair enough, but don't tar "too many directors" with that brush.


I don't have it wrong because I never said movies with a lot of CGI are bad. I said too many directors rely on CGI/special effects to rescue their movies. I loved The Lord of the Rings trilogy. They were chock full of CGI. Gladiator was a good movie and it had a lot of CGI, as well. And I found them both entertaining. Plus they fit a lot of my other criteria for good movies.

quote:

Before anyone comes in with a flamethrower, this post was meant to be more tongue in cheek than serious. Even so....learn how to relax and enjoy things at face value. Not everything has to have a hidden message or meaning.


No flamethrower. Just opinion. Some of my favorite movies are not message pieces or have no underlying messages. I loved Kelly's Heroes. I still like watching John Wayne movies. I watch many James Bond movies.

I know how to relax. As I stated over and over, I just relax, and am entertained, differently than you. I just, don't need to, and won't, 'shut off my brain' to do it.

And, props to those others with the same, or even higher, standards.

I'm a member of the 'film as art' school of thought. Some films just have more artistic value than others.




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Post #: 53
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 8:04:27 PM   
leastonh1


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From: West Yorkshire, England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.
Because it's not what I want, but what I don't want.

We're getting more than what we bargained for at the movies: once upon a time there were many subtle -- if not sublimal -- messages in many theaters urging patrons to visit the "lobby".

Fair comment. I suppose I'd just prefer to go to the cinema and use it as escapism, mostly anyway. Nothing more, nothing less. If I can be entertained for a couple of hours for a few pounds, that's good enough for me. I guess I was mistaken to discount those movies with an obvious agenda. I don't watch Star Wars to learn about the futility and waste of war, where I would expect to learn about exactly that by watching something like Flags of Our Fathers or similar. I'd rather keep the distinction between those films I watch for pure escapism or entertainment and those I watch to learn something.

quote:

ORIGINAL: E
Just because they're paranoid, doesn't mean Cameron isn't out to sublimate them!



quote:

ORIGINAL: JW
There are apparently people who practice Jediism as an actual religious belief, a religion based on a movie.

Very true. There were a few thousand here in the UK who claimed Jedi as their religion in the last census. But, there are those who apparently do take it quite seriously.

_____________________________

2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
Richard Winters: We're paratroopers, Lieutenant, we're supposed to be surrounded.

(in reply to jwarrenw13)
Post #: 54
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 10:10:31 PM   
Arctic Blast


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffrey H.

Just saw sector 9 last night.....anyone see and or like that one ?


If you mean District 9, yeah I quite liked that one. If not, then it's a movie I haven't seen.

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Post #: 55
RE: Avatar - 1/3/2010 11:24:39 PM   
Joe D.


Posts: 4004
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From: Stratford, Connecticut
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffrey H.

Just saw sector 9 last night.....anyone see and or like that one ?


I saw it, but despite the fact it was well-done, it was yet another rehash of caucasian corporate evil vs. disenfranchised "aliens".

Apparently the film had more impact w/South Africans who could remember their own District 6.



_____________________________

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The best fighter-bomber of World War II

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Post #: 56
RE: Avatar - 1/4/2010 1:40:27 AM   
SlickWilhelm


Posts: 1854
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From: Rochester, MN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_H

I suppose I'd just prefer to go to the cinema and use it as escapism, mostly anyway. Nothing more, nothing less. If I can be entertained for a couple of hours for a few pounds, that's good enough for me.


There's nothing wrong with doing that, Jim. I think that guys like Chris Trog go there for the same reason, but while he's watching he's also noticing things like the quality of the script, art design, cinematography, and countless other stuff that is there to either admire or roll your eyes at, depending upon the movie.

As for me, I usually go for the escape, and I try to wait til the movie is over before I think about the technical merits of it.


_____________________________

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Post #: 57
RE: Avatar - 1/4/2010 7:41:44 AM   
Twotribes


Posts: 6929
Joined: 2/15/2002
From: Jacksonville NC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JW


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jim_H

I have this regualr "debate" with a close friend of mine. He's into comparing directors and their work, critiquing movies based on their social, political, religious etc. commentary and all this other rubbish. Just go watch the bloody film, switch off yer brain and enjoy being entertained. Good grief.

I've even heard one idiot spouting almost religiously about the moral message in the original Star Wars. Talk about missing the point of going to the movies. Unbelievable. If you want politics, read a newspaper, watch the news, join a party. If you want religion, go to the nearest church, synagogue or wherever. If you want to be entertained, go to the cinema. Why does it have to be more complicated than that?

Chris, I think you have it wrong. You seem to be under the impression that movies with lots of CGI, by definition, are a bad thing. Really? Surely, they are just making the most of the latest technology. I think some put too much emphasis on dialogue or violence or sex or whatever. Doesn't mean I'm any more right than you are. You cited one well known example of how not to use CGI and that's fair enough, but don't tar "too many directors" with that brush.

Before anyone comes in with a flamethrower, this post was meant to be more tongue in cheek than serious. Even so....learn how to relax and enjoy things at face value. Not everything has to have a hidden message or meaning.



There are apparently people who practice Jediism as an actual religious belief, a religion based on a movie.


And what of Scientology?

(in reply to jwarrenw13)
Post #: 58
RE: Avatar - 1/4/2010 11:09:32 AM   
PunkReaper


Posts: 1085
Joined: 8/23/2006
From: England
Status: offline 		Don't go there...........

(in reply to Twotribes)
Post #: 59
RE: Avatar - 1/4/2010 7:21:39 PM   
leastonh1


Posts: 879
Joined: 2/12/2005
From: West Yorkshire, England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Slick Wilhelm
There's nothing wrong with doing that, Jim. I think that guys like Chris Trog go there for the same reason, but while he's watching he's also noticing things like the quality of the script, art design, cinematography, and countless other stuff that is there to either admire or roll your eyes at, depending upon the movie.

As for me, I usually go for the escape, and I try to wait til the movie is over before I think about the technical merits of it.

I must admit, I didn't think about Chris's post properly before I posted a reply. I do understand the sentiment even if I don't share it, other than to admire someone like Peter Jackson for his amazing LotR epic or Lucas & Spielberg for just about everything they've ever done. It would be quite nice to see cinema more as an art form, but I'm too long in the tooth to begin trying to alter my perceptions now

_____________________________

2nd Lt. George Rice: Looks like you guys are going to be surrounded.
Richard Winters: We're paratroopers, Lieutenant, we're supposed to be surrounded.

(in reply to SlickWilhelm)
Post #: 60
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