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Squeeze This! - 1/7/2010 9:00:13 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		1/31/43 and 2/1/43
 
Squeeze This:  Zoiks, the Japanese unleashed eleven BBs on Saumlaki, destroying nine aircraft on the ground and doing moderate damage to the airfield.  Before those ships arrived, SBDs sortied and hit Fuso with two bombs, but damage didn't seem to amount to anything.  Then I got SigInt that part of 4th Japanese Division is aboard an AP heading for Saumlaki! Yikes!  The Allies have two BBs and two big amphibious transports at Darwin.  They are in a ticklish spot.  After giving it much thought - and in part concluding those amphibious ships weren't going to have an opening to hit Lautem - I've ordered them to unload.  I've also ordered several Aussie units already at Darwin to begin prepping for Saumlaki, and I'll begin air transport Gull Battalion immediately.  If Miller sends his BBs against Darwin over the next two days...well:  OUCH...but hopefully he won't. 

Saumlaki:  So Miller will try to wrest this island from the Allies.  Japanese amphibious capability isn't all that great and the garrison is 310 AV behind two forts, so perhaps it won't be easy.  I'll have six or eight subs there to greet him.

Operation Port Royal (Invasion of the Kuriles):  Okay, anybody want to hazard a guess as to the KB's location?  Remember, 200 Kates hit Darwin a week ago, followed by about 50 Vals a day or two later.  Now, with eleven BBs in the area, I can't imagine the KB would be far away.  If there's anybody out there that's followed this closely over the past weeks you know I've been hoping to draw the KB far from NoPac so that I can invade the Kuriles.  I've begun loading the transports at Seattle and they have plenty of time to make the journey in time for the end of winter Arctic conditions (March 1).  If the Japanese BBs are concentrated in the DEI, one dilemma is solved - I won't be outgunned in the Kuriles (the Allies will have about six slow BBs).  Dilemma two was threat of being overwhelmed by carriers - I'll have eight CVEs toting roughly 160 F4Fs.  That's decent CAP and can protect the fleet against anything except a real strong fleet CV force.  I think Onnekotan Jima and and island or two to the south are open or very lightly held (Onnekotan gets an Army regiment, base force, CD unit, engineers, and a little more).  Paramushiro may have a Naval Guard unit, perhaps a little more, and it will get a full Army division, Army regiment, Marine regiment, CD, engineers, base forces, artillery, tanks, etc.  With the base that lightly held, and the assault force so large, I think I can succeed if given just three or four days to unload in decent order.  So...do I roll the dice?  I still have some time to decide as it will take a good 20 days to load and position my forces somewhere just north of Attu Island.

Subwars:  I-27 is attacked at Darwin but later sinks CL Leander; Thresher gets a genuine AK (no "x" involved) near Okinawa; I-36 gets an AK near Auckland.  One benefit of the war heating up in the DEI is that Miller is probably going to pull some subs back that way, perhaps clearing some of the more distant (to him) sea lanes.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 1/7/2010 9:01:36 PM >

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 601
RE: Squeeze This! - 1/7/2010 9:56:07 PM   
Chickenboy


Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

1/31/43 and 2/1/43
 
Squeeze This:  Zoiks, the Japanese unleashed eleven BBs on Saumlaki, destroying nine aircraft on the ground and doing moderate damage to the airfield.  Before those ships arrived, SBDs sortied and hit Fuso with two bombs, but damage didn't seem to amount to anything.  Then I got SigInt that part of 4th Japanese Division is aboard an AP heading for Saumlaki! Yikes!  The Allies have two BBs and two big amphibious transports at Darwin.  They are in a ticklish spot.  After giving it much thought - and in part concluding those amphibious ships weren't going to have an opening to hit Lautem - I've ordered them to unload.  I've also ordered several Aussie units already at Darwin to begin prepping for Saumlaki, and I'll begin air transport Gull Battalion immediately.  If Miller sends his BBs against Darwin over the next two days...well:  OUCH...but hopefully he won't. 

Saumlaki:  So Miller will try to wrest this island from the Allies.  Japanese amphibious capability isn't all that great and the garrison is 310 AV behind two forts, so perhaps it won't be easy.  I'll have six or eight subs there to greet him.

Operation Port Royal (Invasion of the Kuriles):  Okay, anybody want to hazard a guess as to the KB's location?  Remember, 200 Kates hit Darwin a week ago, followed by about 50 Vals a day or two later.  Now, with eleven BBs in the area, I can't imagine the KB would be far away.  If there's anybody out there that's followed this closely over the past weeks you know I've been hoping to draw the KB far from NoPac so that I can invade the Kuriles.  I've begun loading the transports at Seattle and they have plenty of time to make the journey in time for the end of winter Arctic conditions (March 1).  If the Japanese BBs are concentrated in the DEI, one dilemma is solved - I won't be outgunned in the Kuriles (the Allies will have about six slow BBs).  Dilemma two was threat of being overwhelmed by carriers - I'll have eight CVEs toting roughly 160 F4Fs.  That's decent CAP and can protect the fleet against anything except a real strong fleet CV force.  I think Onnekotan Jima and and island or two to the south are open or very lightly held (Onnekotan gets an Army regiment, base force, CD unit, engineers, and a little more).  Paramushiro may have a Naval Guard unit, perhaps a little more, and it will get a full Army division, Army regiment, Marine regiment, CD, engineers, base forces, artillery, tanks, etc.  With the base that lightly held, and the assault force so large, I think I can succeed if given just three or four days to unload in decent order.  So...do I roll the dice?  I still have some time to decide as it will take a good 20 days to load and position my forces somewhere just north of Attu Island.

Subwars:  I-27 is attacked at Darwin but later sinks CL Leander; Thresher gets a genuine AK (no "x" involved) near Okinawa; I-36 gets an AK near Auckland.  One benefit of the war heating up in the DEI is that Miller is probably going to pull some subs back that way, perhaps clearing some of the more distant (to him) sea lanes.

I'd say you got his attention, sir.

Those IJN BBs are going to have to return to a large port or a port with a large AKE to reload, lest they be caught low on ammo in a combat zone. You may have a couple of turns of respite from bombardment BB TFs now-he probably won't be able to do much bombarding of Darwin in the interim, but may opt for a surface raid before retiring.

IIRC, Paramushiro and most of the other kuriles that are worthwhile to you have CD units in AE. These are worthy of respect for any unloading allied amphibious assault. I know you don't want to betray your intentions with reconning too early, but will you have some recon intelligence before making landfall? Will you have sufficient surface combatants to include a few CLs in the transport TFs AND provide strong SCTF presence nearby?

I have both Vals and Kates in my mini-KB. I'd hesitate to conclude the presence or absence of the larger KB body based upon the make up of attacking aircraft. But...200 Kates likely come from 8-10 carriers: that's a lot of birds. With the entire BB fleet breathing down your neck, you make a good case for the kitchen sink being in the DEI. Roll them Kurile bones, Canoerebel...

_____________________________


(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 602
RE: Squeeze This! - 1/7/2010 10:59:22 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		2/2/43 to 2/3/43
 
Squeeze This:  A sorry day for the Allies as lots of things go wrong, but it certainly could have been worse...and may yet get worse.

DEI:  The eleven Japanese BBs did not show, but a powerful carrier force - Hiyo and several CVEs were identified by name - showed up SW of Darwin and launched multiple attacks against Darwin's shipping.  I had 210 fighters at the base, but only a handful flew CAP for some reason - perhaps part of the reason is that I had them set at only 40%, but usually a raid is detected and the rest will get into the action.  Enough Kates got through to hit PofW and Revenge with TTs, and also damaged some transports.  This is bad.  I have to disband the two BBs into port until I see where the carriers go.  I've nudged the CAP up to 70% and set a P-38 squadron at Katherine to fly LRCAP.  Miller lost 90 aircraft and the Allies about 15 - alot of the Japanese losses were Jake recon planes.

Subwoes: I-25 put two TTs into BB North Carolina near Sydney; a Japanese sub got a tanker near Auckland; RO-61 got a PC near Horn Island; and I-171 supposedly put a TT into Revenge at Darwin but this turned out to be a sync myth.

NoPac:  Loading continues apace at Seattle.  Already loaded ships are moving to Vancouver to create dock space.  I think most of the ships will be ready to sail in three days, leaving just a few laggards to load and then catch up.  Some of the Kates flying the strike vs. Darwin were identified as coming from Hiyo.  That's not the KB, but it's not a CVE either.  I wish I knew where Zuikaku and friends were stationed at the moment.

Chickenboy:  Yup, I have his full attention! I'm aware that there's an intrinsic CD unit at Paramushiro.  Recent SigInt showed just over 5,000 troops there and one of them is 45th Naval Guards.  He doesn't have much, and I think with all the BBs present I can handle that.  But I'm still worried about Zuikaku and friends.  Is Miller out-thinking me so much that he's anticipating this move?  I probably can't take that chance, so I don't think I give the green light until I sight at least part of the "real" KB down around the DEI.

Summary:  It's been a pretty rough day for the Allies and things are quite tense, but subs are what's really driving me crazy.

(in reply to Chickenboy)
Post #: 603
Making a Nuisance of Oneself - 1/8/2010 5:18:15 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Gents,

I have realized for a month or two that I have become irritating in registering concerns about the game.  I sound like I'm whining even to myself many times.  My concners are honest, though, and I sincerely hope that bringing concerns to the attention of the developers allows them to become aware of potential problems, evaluate them, determine whether they can and should be fixed, and then take steps to address those that they believe are legitimate.

In the game to date I've been especially concerned about these things:

1.  China:  At first, the game was totally screwed up in China.  It was within the solitary discretion of the Japanese player to overrun China through strategic bombing, massed use of artillery, and the fact that the Chinese couldn't defend in the open or behind fortifications.  The developers have since fixed the affect of artillery on fortifications, thus eliminating most of this problem.  The balance - mainly strategic bombing - hasn't been addressed but can be easily avoided by house rules.  This is good.

2.  Artillery Death Stars:  Massed artillery was death on the opposition at first.  As noted above, the developers have rectified the lethal nature of artillery against fortified positions.  However, artillery against unfortified troops remains far too powerful.  At this point it seems that the developers are saying that this may be too complicated to fix - that by tweaking the affect of massed artillery it might bork the affect of just a few artillery units, thus playing havoc with the island campaigns where an artillery unit or two is being used.  We'll have to wait and see whether and how this will be addressed.  For now, the employment of massed artillery against unintrenched troops seems to yeild wildly inflated casualties based upon my recent experience in Burma.

3.  Nuclear Subs:  This is the thing that most bothers me about the game.  It is an octopus with several pernicious tentacles:  (1)  the lethal nature of subs against ASW has been addresses by the developers [and they deserve our gratitude for doing so]; (2) subs in general are far, far too lethal against shipping.  I know that Alled subs were lethal in the real war - at least late in the war - and it's too early to see whether they will be historically lethal or wildly, exaggeratedly lethal, but I know that Japanese subs are far, far too lethal in the game.  They hit everything they shoot at; they shoot at everything; they remain with impunity inside port hexes where mines, ASW ships, and ASW aircraft are essentially worthless; they sink docked ships; they hit the biggest and fastest ships; and tankers and oilers and big merchantmen seem to be too brittle.  Sub warfare, at least in '42 and '43, was a game of cat-and-mouse, not a one-sided bloodbath in which the Japanese sank everything in sight.

4.  Sweeps:  I registered complaints about sweeps, but then learned that a big part of the problem was my own lack of understanding about how sweeps and bombing missions are designed to work and how to orchestrate them.  I abandoned this complaint since I became convinced I was largely responsible for my own woes and that I was therefore whining without reason.  To a much lesser extent, I continue to keep my eyes on this feature, though, because I do think it has some problems.  I'm not sure about this yet, but I've begun to suspicion that when Allied fighters and bombers target the same hex in the same turn, the Allied bombers always seem to go first (either escorted lightly or unescorted) with most or all of the Allied fighters coming later.  By the time the bulk of the fighters arrived, the Japanese fighters have finished ravaging the bombers and have retired, so the Allied fighters have no targets to square off against.  That bugs me a bit [I'm sorry, it just does].  What has recently tickled my curiosity, though, is that this doesn't seem to happen with the Japanese.  In China, at least, it seems like the Japanese fighters and bombers come in together.  I admit, however, that this discrepancy could be the result of my own failures rather than to some weird feature in the game itself.  I haven't mentioned it yet because I'm not even sure it's really happening - it's just something I want to be aware of so that I can continue to watch combat replays.

'Nuff said.

Canoe "the somewhat reluctant whiner" Rebel

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 604
The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 7:57:04 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		2/4/43 to 2/5/43
 
The Big Squeeze:  Zoiks, Scoob, I'm caught in a vice.  The Japs have thrown everything - and I mean EVERYTHING - into the eastern DEI.  I'm worried and I'm excited:  worried because I have some problems to surmount; excited because it creates possibilities.

Here come da judge!:  The full KB showed up just off Darwin and Miller sent in three waves of eleven battleships to hammer the shipping.  The Allied combat TFs (which consisted of CAs, CLs, and DDs) and PT boats performed heroically.  The combat ships squared off against the first big Jap TF that included three BBs.  CA Dorsethsire went down and several other ships were damaged; CA Tone was damaged and a number of other ships took some hits; then the Japanese retired.   The next two BB groups tangled with the PT boats, which apparently distracted them and tuckered them out.  By the end, the Yamato group got in and tore up one transport TF (destroying perhaps eight AK and APs, a DMS, and another ship or two.  That's pretty light damage considering what came at Darwin.  The two damaged RN BBs remain disbanded in port and I am left to wonder what might have happened if they had been in the fight.

Here come da other judge!:  The KB hung around, but for some reason only launched a few piddly strikes that claimed an AP north of Darwin.  About 30 Zeros and 25 Vals did venture toward Darwin, but the sizeable Allied CAP mauled them.  Squadrons from Zuikaku, Shokaku, and other fleet carriers were identified.  I cannot be certain that ALL Japanese fleet carriers are present, but I am certain that MOST of them are.

Worried:  As long as the KB is in the vicinity I have to keep my ships at Darwin.  As long as my ships are at Darwin I have to maximize the CAP over the base.  That means I can't base any bombers here.  As soon as I get a breather, I'll evacuate all shipping from Darwin.  Then I'll pull out most of the fighters and insert bombers.  I hope I can do this by the time the Japanese amphibious force arrives at Saumlaki.  Meanwhile, the airfield at nearby Taberfane just went to level one, so I can base some fighters there until Miller shuts it down too.

Possibilities:  All or most of the KB is in the DEI.  If only it was a week or so later, I'd have the all clear to proceed with the invasion of the Kuriles.  I can't invade until March 1 due to winter conditions.  I need to keep Miller down here at least another week or ten days, even if it costs me some assets.  Most of the Kuriles invasion fleet is loaded now - it is massive, the ground forces carried are massive, and I don't see how the invasion can't succeed if the KB isn't around.  Even if Miller has some carriers up north, which could well be, I think the eight American CVEs (carrying roughly 160 fighters) could offer protection long enough for the invasion to work.  Landings are slated for Paramushiro, Onnekotan, and Ketoi Jima.  The latter two will be garrisoned but vulernable to counterattack, but I don't think Miller can take back Paramshiro once I get it.  That will create a crisis for him - two hotspots at opposite edges of the map. 

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 605
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 8:08:33 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Two other things of note:

1)  If the KB remains far away, I might even take a chance on diverting the invasion to Sikhalin Island.  Shikuka and Toyohara are tremendously attractive, and seem to be lightly held at the moment.  None of my troops are prepped, but I think I would have an overwhelming force.  This is something to seriously consider.  Since the Allies have a strong presence in the western Aluetians it isn't as if I would be colonizing the moon.

2)  BB North Carolina took two TTs near Sydney.  She retired and disbanded into port at Hobart.  For some reason that seems funny to me - I have an American battleship pinned down in Tasmania.  She'll stay there until SYS damage is zero and then head along the south edge of the map to Panama City, thence to the West Coast.  Or maybe I'll send her via Capetown.

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 606
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 8:23:20 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline
quote:


None of my troops are prepped, but I think I would have an overwhelming force.  This is something to seriously consider.  Since the Allies have a strong presence in the western Aluetians it isn't as if I would be


One thing in AE: Landing un-prepped troops seems very hazardous, more so than WITP. Figure on half of those troops coming ashore disrupted, with some at the bottom of the sea.

I wonder how bad it would be if you tried unprepped troops in Wintertime.....

The Kuriles are much more vulnerable in AE than in WITP. As early as Feb 1942, I'm thinking about defensive preparations up there. You can't ignore it like WITP.

< Message edited by Q-Ball -- 1/8/2010 8:24:15 PM >

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Post #: 607
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 8:24:11 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		2/6/43 and 2/7/43
 
A quick update as I just got the combat replay file from Miller:

1.  No appearance by the Japanese combat TFs - they have probably retired to Soerabaja to re-supply.
2.  KB stationed north of Darwin with massive strikes against Taberfane.
3.  I'm probably going to try to evacuate my ships - or at least the combat ships - from Darwin tomorrow.  I'll probably send them scampering south to Perth.  BBs PofW and Revenge are damaged from the earlier KB strikes, so this will be a "limping sprint."
4.  Once these ships are gone I can moves some bombers to Darwin.
5. Japanese are landing at Taberfane.  This base is weekly held, so Miller will take it easily.
6.  From SigInt I know he's coming for Saumlaki, but he's going to have a much bigger challenge there since the base has 310 AV.
7.  Once the KB clears the area momentarily, I'll send new combat vessels to Darwin to (hopefully) keep Miller's attention on this area.
8.  This region will become the "meat-grinder" attritional battle for the foreseeable future.  That suits me because I have lots of big airbases nearby (Darwin, Katherine, Merauke) and plenty of supplies on hand.
9.  I think the Kuriles invasion fleet will depart Vancouver/Seattle in three days.  From there the ships head to Kodiak, thence through the Aluetians to a staging point north of Attu.  From there they will head to Japanese territory.
10.  If the KB remains in the DEI, I am pretty interested in shifting the invasion to Sikhalin Island.

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 608
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 8:39:39 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

quote:


None of my troops are prepped, but I think I would have an overwhelming force.  This is something to seriously consider.  Since the Allies have a strong presence in the western Aluetians it isn't as if I would be


One thing in AE: Landing un-prepped troops seems very hazardous, more so than WITP. Figure on half of those troops coming ashore disrupted, with some at the bottom of the sea.

I wonder how bad it would be if you tried unprepped troops in Wintertime.....

The Kuriles are much more vulnerable in AE than in WITP. As early as Feb 1942, I'm thinking about defensive preparations up there. You can't ignore it like WITP.


I won't be invading until spring (March 1). In my WitP game, though, I did invade Sikhalin Island in winter. There were so few troops there that I succeeded despite the winter-induced disruption.

If Miller has left Shikuka ungarrisoned, or essentially ungarrisoned, then landing a division and a regiment or two there (in springtime) would be enough to do the trick even if lack of prep was a problem. Then, once the port was taken, I would land the other troops. Then it would be a sprint to take Toyohara.

I'm toying with this at the moment. I might just concentrate on the Kuriles, or I may get fancy.




(in reply to Q-Ball)
Post #: 609
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 9:33:24 PM   
Oliver Heindorf


Posts: 1911
Joined: 5/1/2002
From: Hamburg/Deutschland
Status: offline 		Hi, according your problem with nuc subs, I agree to a certain rate. D´Subs find everything, attack everything and see everything-far too unrealistic, I agree.

But I dont see that ASW-Airwarfare is worthless.

It has been asked before in your AAR : Did you trained your pilots well in ASW warefare ?  I remeber you said, that this level of micromanagement is nothing for you.

I am only in 3/42 yet but I have already more than +20 trained pilots with 60 +exp level in ASW warfare due to training alone.

When I order one of these airunits to ASW warfare instead of training, say good bye to any sub in the area. I sink them with bombs, or at least, I damage them badly and they face a hard time to go back to their harbour.

My question : did you changed your mind about the pilot training micromanagement ? Did you traind them yet in the game ?

I read your AAR everyday now, I must say that I am addicted. So I remember about your problems with subs but I for example cleard all harbour areas because of my ASW ACs by now exept East of Oz and So Pac where I still lack a bit of Aircraft.

Of course, in 12/41 & 1/42 ASW Airwarfare was nile. But after my 60 day training program of any unit in my game (I keep record of that thanks to Open Office), you WILL SEE how it works. Give it a try. Besides, I had lots of PBEMs in Witp - I have never seen anyone who lost so many ships to sub warfare alone. Either the code is "broken" like you say or there is anything not right with your settings of shipping lines.

Sorry for capturing your AAR. Keep it up, I really enjpoy reading it.






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Post #: 610
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 9:45:01 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Yes, I've trained my ASW air crews.  Many are in the mid 50s now.  The best ones are in a multitude of ASW Kingfishers stationed at LA and San Diego.  They've been surprisingly ineffective.  I've had a few reports of hits that are most likely FOW.  On a scale of 1 to 10, with air patrols being useful against subs, I'd rate them a one.

(in reply to Oliver Heindorf)
Post #: 611
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 11:19:15 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

6.  From SigInt I know he's coming for Saumlaki, but he's going to have a much bigger challenge there since the base has 310 AV.


I should know this, but does SigInt feed off of base preparation designations, or TF destinations?

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 612
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/8/2010 11:35:53 PM   
Chickenboy


Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

6.  From SigInt I know he's coming for Saumlaki, but he's going to have a much bigger challenge there since the base has 310 AV.


I should know this, but does SigInt feed off of base preparation designations, or TF destinations?

As Allies, I've had it feed off of both / either the preparation designations OR the TF destinations.

_____________________________


(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 613
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/9/2010 12:15:32 AM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		Pilot experience was mentioned by someone as:
Naval Search - to find the subs
ASW Patrol - knowing what to do once you find them

Thus, we are may need to learn that both areas need to have significant experience present for your Kingfishers to be effect sub killers. Train up the Naval Search experience and then the ASW to the 40s or 50s. Then while some are assigned ASW Patrol have some percentage still training. I think many players are looking for the magic combination when it come to ASW, regardless of which side you play.


< Message edited by ny59giants -- 1/9/2010 12:17:30 AM >

(in reply to Chickenboy)
Post #: 614
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/9/2010 4:02:56 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		2/8/43 and 2/9/43
 
KB:  Remains near Saumlaki and hammers the Allied troops at Taberfane and Aui.  I want to keep them here another week or ten days, so I'm going to try to move in BB Washington if I get a little opening.  Washington is taking position at Portland Roads, tomorrow.  Meanwhile, PoW and some other damaged ships took the opportunity and made good their escape from Darwin towards Perth; they'll be fine barring subs (which is a BIG if in this game).

Darwin:  With PoW away, I was tempted to send Revenge the other way (to Townsville), but I'm going to hold her in Darwin another few days.  Leaving 72 F4Fs and one P-38 squadron at Darwin, I moved the rest of the fightes back to Katherine.  In there place are six or seven heavy bomber squadrons.  They'll target Ambon's airfield tomorrow.  I hope to catch a bunch of planes on the ground - these are aircraft that have been hitting Saumlaki and Taberfane.

The Islands:  Taberfane just fell to a Japanese assault; the Japs are launding at nearby Aui; nothing doing yet a Saumlaki, but it's coming.  I hope that Miller will feel the need to keep his carriers posted here to provide air cover when his amphibious troops arrive.  The raid on Ambon is designed to encourage that thought.

NoPac:  This was the point of no return.  I imposed a deadline on myself to decide today whether to suddenly shift invasion targets from the Kuriles to Sikhalin Island and it's big and lightly defended bases.  Got SigInt that Toyohara is held by just 8,000 troops and I know that there are just two units at Shikuka.  However, I decided to stick with the Kuriles because (1) my troops are fully prepped; (2) the Kuriles are relatively close to my big bases in the western Aleutians; and (3) it'll soon be spring making ground operations on Sikhalin much easier.  I did detect a unit on Onnekotan Jima for the first time, but unless Miller stations a powerful carrier force to meet the Allies ships, this invasion will succeed.  The Aliles just have too many troops coming for it not to succeed.  At least in the short term...  If the Allies do succeed Miller will have some problems.  He'll either have to throw everything at me or strongly garrison Sikhalin Island and Hokkaido for the rest of the game, drawing off assets from elsewhere.  If he throws everything at me, he'll have to reduce his presence in the DEI making things easier there.  The Allied transports and support ships left Vancouver two days ago and are steaming in the general direction of Kodiak Island.  The carriers and combat ships will leave Seattle in two days and will catch up.  I think we're on schedule to strike on March 1 (I may even do a preinvasion bombardment of Paramshiro on the 28th).

(in reply to ny59giants)
Post #: 615
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/9/2010 7:05:03 PM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline 		Hmmmm... having stayed with CHS, i've just now read through your excellent AAR... sort of glad i stayed with CHS at this point... it seems there are a lot of glitches that need to be ironed out, still...

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 616
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/9/2010 7:40:19 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		I am having an unusually difficult and rough go of it, rtpasso.  I think there are some pretty serious issues yet to be resolved (and I say that with respect and affection for both the game and the designers who are doing their best to identify and address glitches).  It is also possible that my woes could be pure bad luck, that I could just be awful, that my opponent could be or out-thinking me, or a combination of any or all of these.

That said the game is magnificent and as addicting as ever.  I hope the glitches will get resolved.  I think nuclear subs is the main one, in my book.  If nuclear subs gets fixed then the game is good to go in my opinion.  Most other issues I've seen can be addressed by house rules.  I've learned a heck of alot and look forward to game two (which may be weeks away or may be years away).

(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 617
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/9/2010 9:30:34 PM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline 		Canoe "the somewhat reluctant whiner" Rebel

Dont apologise,

Its only through problems being brought up by concerned players that we evolved from WITPAE, through umpteen patches upgrades such as CHS & RHS and now WITPAE.
I think we are at WITPAE Vanilla and have to go through it again, inreality doing the hardcore testing that isnt possible before the release.
Keep up the comments, how many of them have already resulted in patches to fix the game.

To the Devs, I know that AE is like a new born child and that any crtisism cuts to the heart, but dont look at it like that. 99.9% of the game is great, we just need to tweak that last bit. At least CanoeRebel complains politely


_____________________________

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(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 618
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/9/2010 11:20:16 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso

Hmmmm... having stayed with CHS, i've just now read through your excellent AAR... sort of glad i stayed with CHS at this point... it seems there are a lot of glitches that need to be ironed out, still...


Bob, you are going to absolutely love AE. Massive number of improvements over WITP. And, even before any bugs/shortcomings were fixed, it was still way better than WITP. As of now a long list of small/medium/big things have been addressed, and of course they have more on their list (they always do).

Good to see you here, Bob!

(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 619
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/9/2010 11:52:58 PM   
Cathartes

 

Posts: 2155
Joined: 1/5/2001
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffK

To the Devs, I know that AE is like a new born child and that any crtisism cuts to the heart, but dont look at it like that. 99.9% of the game is great, we just need to tweak that last bit. At least CanoeRebel complains politely



I've worked with some of the Devs. and they have too thick a skin for criticism to cut.

The most effective and encouraged from of criticism is backed up by sound data, reputable sources, game saves before and after a specific issue, and analysis or discussion of playing and/or testing that can be compared reasonably to history.

Then there's the issue of whether people fundamentally agree, then there's the issue of what's possible with coding and game engine, and above it all, there's Matrix Games.

Enjoying the AAR, roll on!




(in reply to JeffroK)
Post #: 620
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/10/2010 12:06:34 AM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs


quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso

Hmmmm... having stayed with CHS, i've just now read through your excellent AAR... sort of glad i stayed with CHS at this point... it seems there are a lot of glitches that need to be ironed out, still...


Bob, you are going to absolutely love AE. Massive number of improvements over WITP. And, even before any bugs/shortcomings were fixed, it was still way better than WITP. As of now a long list of small/medium/big things have been addressed, and of course they have more on their list (they always do).

Good to see you here, Bob!

Thanks!

i'll continue to monitor the progress of the game, and i'll start to play it at some point, hopefully when the more serious bugs are ironed out.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 621
The Cauldron, Part One - 1/11/2010 4:10:10 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Attached is a map of the eastern DEI in mid-February 1943. The Allies were expanding west, having established a large lodgement on Saumlaki and much smaller (and weaker) lodgements on Taberfane and Ari. The Japanese have taken the latter two, but haven't yet moved on Saumlaki. However, SigInt revealed that part of 4th Division is on a Maru heading this way. I have about eight submarines posted at Saumlaki and I'm trying to shuffle in bombers to Darwin - on one turn, 4EB hit Ambon; the following turn, I pulled out the 4EB and inserted three SBD squadrons and one TBF squadron hoping to get a shot at some shipping.

Saumlaki is the key to the entire fight. Keep it and the Allies can use it and Darwin, plus some new bases that can be built up (there are lots of possibilities) to eventually take control of this battle - it will take months, but the attrition aspect is what i want. Lose Saumnlaki and I'm back on my heals for awhile and have to "leap forward" (a dangerous thing) to get a forward air base.

I hope Miller has concluded that this is a critical campaign and that I've committed most of my forces. He's already damaged PoW and Revenge at Darwin, hit North Carolina at Sydney, and I'll soon be sending South Dakota, Washington, and Mississippi this way. Plus I've committed most of the air groups from Saratoga and Wasp.

This is a critical campaign in its own right, but it also serves as a crucial diversion. Far to the north an amphibous invasion is gathering in the Aluetians and set to strike....




Attachment (1)

(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 622
RE: The Cauldron, Part Two - 1/11/2010 4:31:42 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		As noted in the previous post, the main action is in the eastern DEI, but the western DEI isn't going to be quiet long... Actually, that's misleading information just in case my opponent were able to catch a whiff from the first part of the post (as can sometimes happen). The title of this post is to suggest that it, like the previous post, deals with the DEI. I don't want to give Miller any reason to suspect I'm up to anything in NoPac.

He's had a sub nosing around Adak Island that's sunk a merchant ship or two. He's probably aware that I'm building these bases. But to my knowledge he isn't aware that I'm about to invade.

If he shifts the KB to NoPac I'll have to cancel this operation. If he shifts the KB and I'm not aware of the shift and think those ships are still in the DEI...well, ouch.

The Allied amphibious and support ships are somewhere off the coast near Juneau and will reach the vicinity of Kodiak/Cold Bay in less than a week. The combat ships and carriers leave Seattle tonight and catch up about the time everyone nears Kodiak.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 1/11/2010 4:50:44 PM >

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 623
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/11/2010 4:59:57 PM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Yes, I've trained my ASW air crews.  Many are in the mid 50s now.  The best ones are in a multitude of ASW Kingfishers stationed at LA and San Diego.  They've been surprisingly ineffective.  I've had a few reports of hits that are most likely FOW.  On a scale of 1 to 10, with air patrols being useful against subs, I'd rate them a one.



Well, most of those kingfisher squadrons upgrade to SBDs and I don't think any of them get radar. Best to train up the planes that do get radar. Avengers, naval liberators and mitchells, cats, marniers. (Not that this will make a difference.) It hurts because I need them now but I have about 4 catalina units training in naval search and ASW at all times. My purpose is to have them trained for dual purpose work. Then I rotate them.

I tried something different this last turn. My air patrol spotted a snooping glen equipped sub off of Sidney. I just made up a surface TF of eight Brit and American DDs and vectored it to the hex. His sub took a shot, (what else is new) and missed and my DDs pounded the sub with three DCs hits. My best ASW attack in months. I made sure the surface TF had an rear admiral in charge. I am going to try this again. It will at least force him to move his subs.



_____________________________

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Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 624
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/11/2010 9:59:15 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		2/10/43 to 2/15/43
 
Operation Port Royal:  The leading Allied ships have reached Cold Bay and are slipping through the straits and into the Bering Sea.  They will take position north of Attu Island and are positioned right to initiate the invasions come March 1.  My only question:  Is Miller expecting this?  Factors that I'm weighing:

Factors that Suggest "Yes":  Miller has been outthinking me much of the game; he had access to my AAR several months ago after we had decided to halt the game; he saw that I was interested in Paramushiro back in the summer of '42; he knows that I invaded NoPac in my game with John III, and he should be aware of the build-up in the Aleutians.

Factors that Suggest "No":  He knows that I know he's aware of these things, so he may conclude I wouldn't do something that I'd already tipped my hand about; things have been quiet the entire game in NoPac - even his sub at Adak Island sank a couple of ships that had fuel and supplies - no troops; the massive battle taking place off the northwest coast of Oz - he's seen plenty of BBs already and has sighted Mississippi at Portland Roads; I hope he's figured out that the F4F groups at Darwin come from my last two American fleet carriers; all eleven Japanese BBs [or are there more?] just hit Darwin again; his carriers haven't been sighted in four days, but I think they are re-provisioning after the last action near Saumlaki.  Would he split the KB from his carriers and send the flattops sprinting north at the last minute?  I doubt it, but I can't be sure.

Bottom Line: D-Day is less than two weeks away.  If Miller commits the KB against Darwin again it'll be too late for them to sprint to NoPac in time to contest the invasion.  So here's hoping they show up again!  As bait, I'm sending Mississippi and Washington north from Portland Roads to Horn Island, hoping they'll be well spotted.  From there they are likely to head to Darwin unless the KB blocks their route.  If the KB is still in the DEI, I believe the Kuriles invasion is assured of success.

Darwin and the Eastern DEI: The shuffling of bombers in and out of Darwin - heavy bombers some days, naval strike aircraft on others - worked.  As noted previously, heavy bombers clobbered Ambon and destroyed more than 60 Japanese aircraft on the ground.  Then I swapped them for SBDs and TBFs, which sortied in big groups against various surface ships - mainly DDs involved in a FT invasion of an island near Saumlaki.  I think at least three Japanese DDs suffered heavy damage.  The three big Japanese BB groups returned to Darwin.  Once again, PT boats and a cruiser TF did heroic work.  At a cost mainly of CA Portland, many Japanese ships were damaged and the resulting bombardment was fairly ineffective.  A Japanese CA (Maya) was damaged and then took two TTs from Haddo.  Another sub claimed a Japanese DD.  Japanese troops are picking off the Dutch bases one at a time (Miller should have done this long ago), but so far no sign of the expected Saumlaki invasion.

Subwoes:  I-11 picked off an AP and two AKs near Perth; combat TFs picked off RO-61 and 62 near Portland Roads; Snook got an E near Okinawa; Sculpin was sunk near Rabaul and an S-boat took heavy damage near the Admiralty Islands.  Jap subs have been noteably absent from the Bombay/Karachi areas, SoPac, and the West Coast.  This is a big help.

China:  The Japanese tried another attack at Chengtah and lost 20,000 troops to less than 2,000 for the Allies.  Two Japanese units have withdrawn across the river and I think Miller has given up.  This is a good sign that things are as they should be in China, now (thank you, developers).  The Japanese employed plenty of artillery and bombers, but they were outnumbered by the Chinese who were well-entrenched and in a wooded hex.  No way the Japanese should have won this battle; had they done so it would've indicated things were still wacky.

SoPac:  Fiji commandos took one of the "Fruity" islands to the north of Fiji. 



< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 1/11/2010 10:02:26 PM >

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 625
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/11/2010 11:03:59 PM   
Keifer


Posts: 92
Joined: 9/27/2007
From: San Diego, CA
Status: offline 		Question about goals:

So I have been lurking here for a while and I'm wondering what is the strategic goal of your 3/1 surprise?

It's clear you have him in a war of attrition around Darwin which should play in the Allies favor. What is the goal of your surprise? More attrition? or something else?

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 626
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/12/2010 7:54:13 AM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		NoPac is a shortcut by which the Allies can win the war if the Japanese player isn't careful and experienced. Take the big bases at Paramushiro and on Sikhalin Island and your heavy bombers can destroy Japanese industry on Hokkaido and northern Honshu. Miller, however, is both experienced and aware that I employed this strategy to win one of my WitP games, so I don't expect him to let me get that far. What I do expect:

1. The invasions will succeed and the Allies are likely to be able to hold Paramushiro and possibly Onnekotan Jima, two bases that have big airfield potential. This puts Hokkaido within B-24 range.

2. Miller will be faced with a crisis. He has to react strongly and will have to protect Sikhalin, Hokkaido, and the southern Kuriles for the remainder of the game. He will also want to counterattack. The need for troops up here will draw off much strength from other areas. He'll need more troops up here than I'll have tied down up here.

3. The crisis in NoPac should reduce the heat a bit in the DEI. I doubt I'll continue to face the full KB and eleven BBs for some time to come. The DEI will be my main axis of advance in '43 (I could switch to NoPac if Miller didn't act quickly to defefend Sikhalin Island, but I believe he will).

(in reply to Keifer)
Post #: 627
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/12/2010 7:55:25 AM   
Galahad78

 

Posts: 386
Joined: 9/28/2009
Status: offline 		I admire your willpower, had I planned something so big as Operation Port Royal, and I couldn't bring them back: I would go ahead no matter what to see what happens  and probably get smacked by KB sprinting from DEI 

By the way, very nice AAR!

Good luck!

(in reply to Keifer)
Post #: 628
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/12/2010 1:36:55 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		2/16/43 and 2/17/43
 
Who's Out-thinking Who?  I have no idea!  The eastern DEI is a vortex and a cauldron that has both Miller's attention and my attention.  I'm trying to keep Miller focused here so that he doesn't send assets to the North Pacific.  Meanwhile, I have two combat TFs and three loaded troop TFs frozen in place at Portland Roads in northeastern Oz.  They are frozen because I'm afraid the KB will pounce on them if I move them toward Darwin.  Yet the KB has disappeared from the DEI and suddenly there are plenty of ships and planes at Rabaul.  Has Miller deduced that these combat ships and transports, in conjunction with the sustained Allied bombing campaigns vs. Port Moresby and Milne Bay, suggest that I'm heading for southeastern New Guinea?  Or is he that much further ahead of me that even now his carriers are steaming toward the Kuriles?  I confess I don't know!  If the KB isn't used in the DEI before March 1 I am going to be sweating bullets!

DEI:  Miller's bombers (mainly Helens) return to Saumlaki.  Still no sign of a Japanese amphibious force here, though.  The Japanese did take a vacant Babo on New Guinea's far western end.

NoPac:  I-169 got another TK, this one went down near Adak Island.  One torpedo and glug, glug.  The amphibious ships, carriers, and combat ships have made it into the Bering Sea, hopefully undetected by that sub or any other lurking subs.  They'll proceed generally west to a point north of Attu Island, from where they will pounce come March 1 (just ten days away!).  The force is powerful - in addition to the troops slated for Onnekotan and Paramushiro, I have a Marine regiment, Marine CD, and artillery unit slated for Ketoi Jima.  There are plenty of supply ships.

Burma:  I'm going to try to isolate Akyab - my 2,000 AV stack that's a hex west of Akyab will bypass the city, marching cross country to the "yellow road" hex east of Akyab.  This will cut off Akyab.  I am going to leave about 400 AV in the hex west of Akyab.  Miller will either have to fight his way out of the pocket or evacuate by sea.  Or perhaps he'll think of something else to do.

China:  Miller pulled two units back from Chengtah, as noted in my previous post, but that was it.  The remainder of the stack has stayed in place.  That suits me - I just want a stalemate in China for a long time until the Allies have a chance to get things going at some much later date.  I think Miller is gathering for a new punch at Liuchow in southeastern China, but I can move troops there relatively quickly and have begun doing so.

Subwars:  Sawfish got an AK near Manila and Haddo got a big AR with two TTs near Pontianak.  I-34 got an AKL near Saumlaki.

P.S.  Given the carnage in the game thus far - the debacle in China, the loss of my carriers, and the extreme losses to subs, I'm just about tuckered out.  I am preparing a concession speach "just in case" Miller outguesses and outplays me in NoPac.  I honestly don't think he's going to do so, but the "what if" is a scary thought.

(in reply to Galahad78)
Post #: 629
RE: The Big, Juicy Squeeze - 1/12/2010 3:27:21 PM   
LoBaron


Posts: 4776
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Vienna, Austria
Status: offline 		Good luck on operation Port Royale Canorebel!
And respect for hanging in there. You had enough tough times in this war. Time for revenge.

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Post #: 630
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