Allied off map fuel/supply

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

Allied off map fuel/supply

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> Allied off map fuel/supply

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/18/2010 10:18:42 PM

whippleofd

Posts: 617
Joined: 12/23/2005
Status: offline

Well after spending the time since release getting a handle on Japanese production, I thought I would forey into the other side.

For the Western Pacific/IO area Abadan is the obvious chioce for fuel since it pumps out 15,000 a day. With Capetown @ 250, Mombassa and Aden @ 100 it seems those are mearly for refueling convoys.
Off map supply could come from Cape Town with 2000 per day and Abadan with 1700. Mombassa and Aden seem only enough to support local needs. Am I on target here?

Unfortunately when AE came out I didn't bother learning much about the off map convoy system or utization of same. I've done some searching and can't seem to find much information on these. About the only thing I've picked up is to not switch destinations of convoys in the pipes. Anyone have any other links that would be good to read?

Thanks ahead of time.
Whipple

_____________________________

MMCS(SW/AW) 1981-2001
1981 RTC, SD
81-82 NPS, Orlando
82-85 NPTU, Idaho Falls
85-90 USS Truxtun (CGN-35)
90-93 USS George Washington (CVN-73)
93-96 NFAS Orlando
96-01 Navsea-08/Naval Reactors

Post #: 1

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/18/2010 11:03:06 PM

BPRE

Posts: 624
Joined: 10/16/2000
From: Stockholm,Sweden
Status: offline

The supply convoys arriving in Cape Town brings quite a bit of supply in addition to the weapons and also some fuel.
I've just played the AI but I have enough shipping to run extra convoys from the UK to Cape Town too although at the moment (April 42) it doesn't really look necessary.

/BPRE

(in reply to whippleofd)

Post #: 2

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/19/2010 2:26:32 AM

Bullwinkle58

Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BPRE

The supply convoys arriving in Cape Town brings quite a bit of supply in addition to the weapons and also some fuel.
I've just played the AI but I have enough shipping to run extra convoys from the UK to Cape Town too although at the moment (April 42) it doesn't really look necessary.

/BPRE

In early 1942 I too was running UK to CT. I left them on CS mode and ran the UK out of supply by accident. I shifted back to running four, five-ship convoys from Eastern US to CT, for fuel and supplies. CT feeds Perth/Adelaide, and it's key until Aden opens up, and even after that a bit. You have lots of spare xAK capacity in early 1942 and you can't run the Eastern US dry.

I also sent a lot of planes through CT, but not on ships. I used Transfer to Base from Eastern US and CT is an option. I didn't check the days to see if that works out that same as a transport TF, but doing it that way saves the ships for supplies. Once they're at CT, you can run them to Perth or Colombo with an xAKL per unit.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to BPRE)

Post #: 3

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/20/2010 12:57:13 AM

whippleofd

Posts: 617
Joined: 12/23/2005
Status: offline

A couple of good thoughts. Thanks you.

Any idea where I can find a listing of when these supply convoys arive?

Whipple

_____________________________

MMCS(SW/AW) 1981-2001
1981 RTC, SD
81-82 NPS, Orlando
82-85 NPTU, Idaho Falls
85-90 USS Truxtun (CGN-35)
90-93 USS George Washington (CVN-73)
93-96 NFAS Orlando
96-01 Navsea-08/Naval Reactors

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 4

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/20/2010 1:12:08 AM

freeboy

Posts: 9088
Joined: 5/16/2004
From: Colorado
Status: offline

I find myself over fueled and supplied in the East, pbem as allies, and am shipping and striping fleets sending to OZ.. I lost ALOT of tankers in the early war.. bad player bad, due to putting them in port to suck out oil and fuel, did not realize I could do that with AKs..
U really have pleanty of fuel and supplies... but if you feel the need you can pull from us us to India.. its overkill!

< Message edited by freeboy -- 1/20/2010 7:47:01 AM >

(in reply to whippleofd)

Post #: 5

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/20/2010 1:19:25 AM

Central Blue

Posts: 695
Joined: 8/20/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Whipple

A couple of good thoughts. Thanks you.

Any idea where I can find a listing of when these supply convoys arive?

Whipple

They appear as CD's in your land forces due to arrive screen. You will need to supplement fuel and supply to Cape Town if you plan to ship much of either from there. You can run it down pretty quick otherwise.

_____________________________

USS St. Louis firing on Guam, July 1944. The Cardinals and Browns faced each other in the World Series that year

(in reply to whippleofd)

Post #: 6

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/20/2010 1:29:57 AM

Bullwinkle58

Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Whipple

A couple of good thoughts. Thanks you.

Any idea where I can find a listing of when these supply convoys arive?

Whipple

They're in the LCU Arrival Queue with a CD tag. The names are self-explanatory. When in port they show under in the LCU green square even though they're ships, not as a TF. The different ones carry a mix&match assortment of devices and supplies/fuel. I'm in late 1943 and the ratio seems to have shifted to more supplies/fuel lately. I have over a million of both at CT and Aden that I didn't ship there. Don't even have enough hulls to haul it all. (The IJN subs have been unkind.)

< Message edited by Bullwinkle58 -- 1/20/2010 1:30:49 AM >

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to whippleofd)

Post #: 7

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/20/2010 10:38:07 AM

moonraker65

Posts: 556
Joined: 7/14/2004
From: Swindon,Wilts. UK
Status: offline

Cape Town is your main supply base for India/SEA and Oz. As long as you don't put too many CS Convoys there at one time then Colombo and Adelaide can be kept topped up. Abadan is your main Fuel base similarly. I tend to CS Convoy fuel to Colombo and when it has a good stockpile you can forward it to Oz or wherever it's needed. Also one CS Fuel convoy to either Karachi or Bombay seems to keep India happy. Any supplies produced at Abadan I use to keep Aden topped up with one CS Convoy.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 8

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/20/2010 9:29:07 PM

Bullwinkle58

Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: moonraker

Cape Town is your main supply base for India/SEA and Oz. As long as you don't put too many CS Convoys there at one time then Colombo and Adelaide can be kept topped up. Abadan is your main Fuel base similarly. I tend to CS Convoy fuel to Colombo and when it has a good stockpile you can forward it to Oz or wherever it's needed. Also one CS Fuel convoy to either Karachi or Bombay seems to keep India happy. Any supplies produced at Abadan I use to keep Aden topped up with one CS Convoy.

I've had probbaly three "phases" in off-map supply tactics in my AI game, now in Oct. 1943. I did a lot of what you say in 1942, although in retrospect I should have done more into Adelaide and less into Perth. I planned to redistribute Perth-Sydney with the xAKLs, but I didn't have enough escorts for that leg (they were being used on the CT-Perth leg, and weren't really needed vs. the AI.) Subs got a lot of them. In my next game I'll stock up Adelaide early on.

I also ran fuel all the way from Abadan to Perth, legging west to avoid LBA from Java, and that also probably wasn't smart. Next time I'll put those hulls on the East Coast--CT run to keep Africa well topped up before the CD convoys shift to supply/fuel, and forget the long N-S exposure. I've found that Colombo is pretty easy to get to 1M fuel if you do good ASW. And I concur that Karachi needs constant fuel for production in India. It's easy to miss.

Right now I'm trying an experiment. I've moved 15 good subs to Perth to establish a Freemantle squadron. It's short-legs to the oil and resource centers, although they are mostly shallow water and I'm taking a lot of damage. Good results on TKs though. I don't send them any farther north than Balikpapan, so there's some density. I've moved two base forces up to Exmouth (which starts as bare dirt), with supplies, AMs, PT boats for now. When I get to a Port 2 I'm going to move the AS from Peth and base the subs from there. That's a REALLY short round trip to the happy hunting grounds. I doubt the AI can deal with it, but I'd like to see how a PBEM game would go with this tactic. Exmouth is sort of exposed to CV raid, but OTOH it's easier for the defender to run away and repair. Might be a nice trade off between the damage the subs can do with short cycle times and the cost of keeping STFs around NW OZ.

This base and the sub offensive means I'm still running more supplies/fuel out of CT than I thought I'd be at this point in the game.

< Message edited by Bullwinkle58 -- 1/20/2010 9:31:07 PM >

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to moonraker65)

Post #: 9

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/21/2010 11:55:15 AM

moonraker65

Posts: 556
Joined: 7/14/2004
From: Swindon,Wilts. UK
Status: offline

I moved all the Dutch and PI subs to Townsville. That makes a good base also. Some good interdiction around New Guinea/Solomon Islands and I sank a fair few ships there. The Dutch subs tend to make the trip out to their former home where they have also had success. Haven't tried shipping Fuel from the East Coast to CT. May give that a go and see how it pans out.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 10

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/21/2010 1:29:38 PM

Bullwinkle58

Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: moonraker

I moved all the Dutch and PI subs to Townsville. That makes a good base also. Some good interdiction around New Guinea/Solomon Islands and I sank a fair few ships there. The Dutch subs tend to make the trip out to their former home where they have also had success. Haven't tried shipping Fuel from the East Coast to CT. May give that a go and see how it pans out.

That's a thought for my next game. In the first half of 1942 I had a small squadron out of Brisbane (historical, and an interesting RL story of command competition with SubPac in Pearl), but as the upgrades came due I sent off them off patrol to Pearl to get them done fast and never sent them back.

The only concern I'd have with Townsville in 1942 would be getting enough fuel up there. The AI loves to flood subs into that area of the map, especially the channel NW of Cairns. (They may be based at Rabaul, I don't know.) Those subs love to pounce on Port M.-bound supply runs. For whatever reason I've not had many in the Brisbane-Sydney corridor. But, I have had many, many between Tasmania and the mainland which have hit my Perth-Sydney runs hard. Those are especially hard to ASW because the short-legged AMs you get in OZ don't have any dwell time in that channel from any of the larger bases. I had to send real DDs to Sydney (which I needed elsewhere) to keep the carnage to a dull roar.

As I've said elsewhere, I think one of the best ASW tactics is to take away the bases. I did that in mid-Pac in mid-1942 with a CV raid, and my West Coast problem has diminished a great deal. Now, in October 1943, I'm staging the Rabaul invasion at Shortlands. I expect when that's done I won't have a lot of subs near Oz for the duration.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to moonraker65)

Post #: 11

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/21/2010 2:56:40 PM

moonraker65

Posts: 556
Joined: 7/14/2004
From: Swindon,Wilts. UK
Status: offline

I use Hudsons for a lot of my ASW work in Oz. You can upgrade a fair few Wirraway Squadrons to Hudsons. Once the III LR comes along it has ASV II Air to Surface Radar. A very useful tool. Put them at 5000 altitude and set their Patrol Arcs accordingly and they do a fairly good job. Get lots of contacts and attacks. Certainly keeps their heads down. Place them at key locations along the coast - Adelaide, Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane, Rockhampton, Bowen, Townsville & Cairns. This should give you decent coverage and acts as a good deterrant.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 12

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/21/2010 3:41:42 PM

John Lansford

Posts: 2662
Joined: 4/29/2002
Status: offline

I've got the Dutch subs plus some USN boats working out of Darwin; before Java and Timor fell I was running every ship I could grab down there loaded with fuel, and I've still got 80k+ fuel there even though it's 12/42 and I've got a cruiser squadron plus 2 dozen subs working from there. The AI sends regular Betty raids to hit the ships, but my 5 fighter squadrons chew them up and the pilots are getting huge experience boosts with all the kills. I've also got a sub/cruiser base at Townsville for S-boats and other ships operating around Rabaul.

I send fuel and supplies down to Perth from both CT and Columbo, and keep Columbo full of fuel with convoys from Abadan. I thought about sending TF's from Abadan directly to Perth but Columbo has so much fuel (over 600k) it's a lot faster to just send it down from there. I also run TF's from Perth to Sydney/Melbourne carrying fuel, but those have to be escorted since the AI puts subs in the channel between Tasmania and Melbourne.

(in reply to moonraker65)

Post #: 13

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/21/2010 8:29:23 PM

Bullwinkle58

Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: moonraker

I use Hudsons for a lot of my ASW work in Oz. You can upgrade a fair few Wirraway Squadrons to Hudsons. Once the III LR comes along it has ASV II Air to Surface Radar. A very useful tool. Put them at 5000 altitude and set their Patrol Arcs accordingly and they do a fairly good job. Get lots of contacts and attacks. Certainly keeps their heads down. Place them at key locations along the coast - Adelaide, Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane, Rockhampton, Bowen, Townsville & Cairns. This should give you decent coverage and acts as a good deterrant.

I'll try that next game. I must confess I havne't paid a lot of attention to specific devices on aircraft in this game. Any Bomber or patrol asset has been pressed into Search and ASW usage at one time or another. I've also done ASW at 1000 feet and Search at 2-5000 when I want the Search to really be ASW, and 10-13000 when I want it to really Search. Don't know if that's impacted my hits. I know Op losses go up at low altitudes, but the low ASw is a hold-over from WITP, where it was very important. Next game I'll have th ebasics down and will concentrate on more details.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to moonraker65)

Post #: 14

RE: Allied off map fuel/supply - 1/22/2010 10:58:32 AM

whippleofd

Posts: 617
Joined: 12/23/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Central Blue
They appear as CD's in your land forces due to arrive screen. You will need to supplement fuel and supply to Cape Town if you plan to ship much of either from there. You can run it down pretty quick otherwise.

Ah, I see that now. Thank you.

Whipple

_____________________________

MMCS(SW/AW) 1981-2001
1981 RTC, SD
81-82 NPS, Orlando
82-85 NPTU, Idaho Falls
85-90 USS Truxtun (CGN-35)
90-93 USS George Washington (CVN-73)
93-96 NFAS Orlando
96-01 Navsea-08/Naval Reactors

(in reply to Central Blue)

Post #: 15