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RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 4:43:54 PM   
BrucePowers


Posts: 12094
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline 		There are a lot of risks here. No one ever said this game was easy

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 781
RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 5:02:39 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		Wow, lots of interesting comments:

AUSSIES: Thanks for the comments from the Aussies on RL situation in Darwin. A bit hard on the brits there jrcar, don't you think? Though I don't know. Certainly, they completely lacked invasion shipping, as the UK had a ton of other priorities for it. And given the situation in Europe, I doubt hardly ANY UK replacements were sent to India after 1942, just locals and commonwealth troops. They were in desparate straits in Europe for manpower, and that was #1 priority.

BURMA in GAME: That is very interesting that Miller is abandoning Upper Burma. Very Strange; I suppose the Open terrain is a huge problem, and Lower Burma is more defensible. Still, interesting. He loses the Oil field at Magwe, but maybe you had bombed it to bits anyway. It's not worth repairing for the Japanese. And with an airbase active at Akyab, it's not easy to pull the Oil out. Also a longer trip; for all these reasons, Burmese Oil isn't that important for Japan.

PARAMUSHIRO: What ground troops are up there at present? You dont' want to get alot of ground units destroyed. If you have fragments pulled out, I would let it go. You are in a bad strategic situation; you are "tethered" to a bad base, and your opponent has better control of the sea and air. I would rather fight somewhere that YOU have better air control, like the DEI. You definitely don't want to loiter awhile with CVEs, that's a good way to get them all killed.

Even if you lose it, you will force Miller to keep in large garrisons there, so it's not all bad. On the flip side, he got a bunch of free units when you landed. This whole thing should make Allied players think twice about a landing up there. It could be the purpose of your AAR is only to serve as a warning to others!

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Post #: 782
RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 5:13:01 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
BURMA in GAME: That is very interesting that Miller is abandoning Upper Burma. Very Strange; I suppose the Open terrain is a huge problem, and Lower Burma is more defensible. Still, interesting. He loses the Oil field at Magwe, but maybe you had bombed it to bits anyway. It's not worth repairing for the Japanese. And with an airbase active at Akyab, it's not easy to pull the Oil out. Also a longer trip; for all these reasons, Burmese Oil isn't that important for Japan.

PARAMUSHIRO: What ground troops are up there at present? You dont' want to get alot of ground units destroyed. If you have fragments pulled out, I would let it go. You are in a bad strategic situation; you are "tethered" to a bad base, and your opponent has better control of the sea and air. I would rather fight somewhere that YOU have better air control, like the DEI. You definitely don't want to loiter awhile with CVEs, that's a good way to get them all killed.

Even if you lose it, you will force Miller to keep in large garrisons there, so it's not all bad. On the flip side, he got a bunch of free units when you landed. This whole thing should make Allied players think twice about a landing up there. It could be the purpose of your AAR is only to serve as a warning to others!



Burma: I halted strategic bombing in CBI early in the game because I asked Miller to stop in China. Honestly, I think Miller's pulling back in Burma because his imagination - stoked in part by Cuttlefish's dilemma in Burma - has spooked him. There was no way the Alleis were going to accomplish anything here. I pulled a General Sherman!

Paramushiro: I absolutely agree with Q-Ball on this assessment. I think I need to let Para go in the interest of not getting anhiliated while trying to draw an inside strait. Q-Ball, I have pulled out little fragments of the main units at Para, so that much is done. I've already sent this turn, but when I get it back I'm withdrawing my carriers to Dutch Island or perhaps Kodiak to await further developments.

This war will be won in the DEI. That's where I'll attrit Miller for the next year, and then move forward toward the Home Islands.

(in reply to Q-Ball)
Post #: 783
RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 6:07:39 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline 		Just my thoughts; sure to be better ones from others.

1. I would leave your CVs out of it. You're right that him not knowing is better for your DEI efforts.
2. I would risk some/all of the CVEs to get supplies in. Their TBs might get some licks in if he catches them with STFs, and you should further attrit his fighter pilot pool. You get lots and lots more CVEs soon.
3. It's into May. You don't have to hold on but to the cold weather boundary.
4. Can you get any Lightnings up to Attu for LRCAP range?
5. Can you spare ten subs for a one-time supply run in there from Pearl? Won't get the airplanes up, but might help the LCUs slow down their deterioration.
6. Use 1-ship resupply convoys, five at a time, simultaneous. He can't get them all unless he fragments his TFs, and that makes them better sub bait. Waypoint some very far north, to the map edge, and then hug the coast southwest-bound, dash into Para. If five doesn't work, try seven. You'll get more AKs pretty soon too.

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The Moose

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Post #: 784
RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 7:02:06 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		05/05/43 and 05/06/43

NoPac:  Good suggestions, Bullwinkle, though P-38s don't have the range to fly LRCAP from Attu to Paramushiro.  And I really don't need to hold it until winter sets in - if I could make it until August the Allies would have carrier parity or superiority.  Over the previous two days there wasn't any sign of Japanese combat ships or carriers.  I have a host of supply ships (mainly LSTs and AKLs with a couple of xAKs) well west of Attu Island and just one to two days from Para.  I'm going to send them to Para in small TFs (each TF a single transport or transport plus an SC or KV).  I've also sent four good fighter squadrons to Para to provide CAP.  Finally, I posted CVE Barnes with F4F-4s well to the north to act as "noise" - sometimes the presence of multiple targets can confuse the enemy.  If I get unlucky and Miller chooses the next two days to commit the KB and/or combat ships, I lose the gamble.  If he doesn't, I could put 20,000 supplies ashore.  Meanswhile, the rest of the Allies carriers are pulling back to Dutch Island.  I feel pretty good about the decision to do things this way.

DEI:  A roll of the dice scores.  The B-24 raid on Kendari managed to score one hit on CVL Chiyoda setting her afire.  The real objective was to persuade Miller that Kendari isn't a safe harbor, and he has indeed pulled his carriers out.  I'm standing most of my 4EB down for a few turns.  In three days, I'm planning to unleash well over 100 at some base - perhaps Ambon, Lautem, or Koepang - as a show of strength designed to "impress" Miller with the number of bombers the Allies can put in the air.  I hope that will keep him cautious in the DEI.

Burma:  Prome looks empty, my ground troops are about three or four days march away, and I have the Indian paratroop unit 100% prepped for that target...but they finished the last turn two miles short of Akyab!  Augh!  Two miles!  I'll have to wait a few days and then if Prome remains empty I should be able to take the base.  If so, I think the Allies will make life most unpleasant for the Japanese around Rangoon, Moulmein, Tavoy and Port Blair.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 785
RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 7:11:35 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline 		I suggested P-38s because you said F4Fs were getting there. I was also envisioning drop tanks. I didn't do a range check on either aircraft. (I'm referring to Post #780.)

I think your plan to try the sneak-in is good. Holding Para. isn't as important as pinning him down up there as long as possible, although holding for LBA use would be great too.

< Message edited by Bullwinkle58 -- 1/29/2010 7:14:09 PM >

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Post #: 786
RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 7:13:03 PM   
Rob Brennan UK


Posts: 3685
Joined: 8/24/2002
From: London UK
Status: offline 		Just a quickie Conoerebel , I've just caught up and you were worried about over stacking Paramashiro. IIRC flying boats (that you counted towards groups) only count as one group if you have an AV/AVD support ship in port. so you could operate 3 PBY's happily without fear of overstacking the airfields.

PS .. i may be wrong about needing an AV/AVD type and floats just count as one anyway, but the added support from them alieviates the man AV support quite a bit in medium sized fields.

i'll go back to lurking now.

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sorry for the spelling . English is my main language , I just can't type . and i'm too lazy to edit :)

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 787
RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 8:14:47 PM   
DW

 

Posts: 161
Joined: 2/14/2008
Status: offline 		I think everyone would agree that the longer Paramushiro-jima holds out the better.

You've been quite clear in your AAR as to your quandary.  You can't run in supplies without air cover and you don't want to provide air cover because it would put your carriers at risk to KB.

I agree.  This isn't the time to place your carriers at risk.

If you're not going to try and run in a resupply convoy, then you don't really need to know where Japanese naval assets are located.  If you don't need to know where Japanese naval assets are located, then you don't need your PBYs flying naval search.

So, put every flying boat you can get your hands on to flying in supplies to Paramushiro-jima.

Strip them away from any place on the map where you could substitute long range LBA to provide naval search and move them north.  I don't know how many squadrons of PBYs you have on the map, but I would think you've quite a few.  All those planes flying in supplies will add up quicker than you think.

If you can get your airfield into shape, and if they have the range, get some Liberators pulling the same duty.  The same with any C-46s or C-47s you might have if they also have the range.

As another poster suggested, perhaps get some of your subs in on the act.  Do you have any APDs that could run in, dump off supplies and get out before Miller can react?  Perhaps some of those small fast 2000 ton APs (or were they AKs?) that I used to use in WITP?  They can both cover the distance and unload quickly.  Maybe you can get the two day turn thing working for you in this respect to get them in and out before Miller knows what happened.

And, as you don't think you can use your carriers in the north, move them out.  There's no sense in keeping them there if you can't risk them.  Are they due for upgrades?  If so, get them done.  Or, perhaps move them back down to the DEI and try and get a shot at mini KB.  Or, just keep them out of sight as you have been doing.

But, I don't think you should leave Paramushiro to wither on the vine, so to speak.  Move heaven and hell to get supplies in.







(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 788
"I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 8:26:47 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Latest email from Miller:  "I know from our last game that you are a master when it comes to deception, however your fake invasion of New Guinea is fooling nobody."

Wow, Miller is completely misreading the strategic situation if he thinks the Allied landings at Kaimana on New Guinea's southwest coast is fake.  The sooner I can turn that dot hex into a level five port/level eight airifeld the sooner the Allies take control of western New Guinea and the Moluccas. 

(in reply to DW)
Post #: 789
RE: "I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 8:33:28 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		Maybe it's counter-deception from Miller? Miller he plans to hit you hard there and wants you to be unready?

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 790
RE: "I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 8:39:17 PM   
John 3rd


Posts: 17178
Joined: 9/8/2005
From: La Salle, Colorado
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Maybe it's counter-deception from Miller? Miller he plans to hit you hard there and wants you to be unready?


I'm ALL about counter-deception! Go Mr. Miller. BANZAI!!!

Sorry about my JFB-ness.

Dan,

As you move about in the North, why not use your CVE to protect the convoys? If they are sunk--WHO CARES?! Protect your CVs and use your CVEs to damage the Japanese Naval Air Groups.

My .02...


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Member: Treaty, Reluctant Admiral and Between the Storms Mod Team.

Reluctant Admiral Mod:
https://sites.google.com/site/reluctantadmiral/

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 791
RE: "I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 9:06:02 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		It isn't counter-deception.  He thinks the New Guinea landings are a ruse. He couldn't be more wrong.

John, when the Allied player loses four CVs in '42, the CVEs can become essential to survival.  I have nine on the board now - that means with CVEs alone I can put 250 aircraft in a hex.  Team them with CVs and it's a potent package.  I understand what you mean - I can sea how sacrificing CVEs to save Para would make perfect sense.  What I DON'T want to do is sacrifice CVEs and lose Para anyhow.

The Allies get Essex this month, three fleet CVs in July, and at least one CVL by July.  If I'm patient and don't fritter my carriers away, the Allies will have a force to reckon with come August.

(in reply to John 3rd)
Post #: 792
RE: "I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 9:39:48 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		05/07/43 and 05/08/43

Email Communications:  Following that cryptic email comment, I asked Miller what he thought I was up to and this was his reply:  "Well I think your main thrust will be in the DEI, just like our last game."  He's right on target with that, but apparently he isn't connecting how a big base on New Guinea's southwestern end is a big part of the eastern DEI.

NoPac:  I was wondering where the Japanese subs had gone to?  Well, they were all parked off the Kamchatka coast, so my transport TFs ran into a wolfpack:  I-173 got AKL Maple, I-180 got AKL Susana and LST 454, I-165 got an xAK; I-176 got LST 469; and I-22 got xAK Idaho.  Mind you, most of these ships had an ASW escort, but Allied ASW doesn't do much in this game.  Most of the surviving ships made it to Para, but had barely begun unloading by the end of the two-day turn.  I was lucky that Miller had his Helens set to hit Para's airfield (for some reason none of my fighters flew CAP on the first day, but about 12 got up the second; I have no idea why).  Tomorrow the Helens will be hunting ships, so I don't expect to get much in the way of supplies unloaded.  On a more positive note, this keeps Miller's focus on Paramushiro and I sure like having his subs way off at Kamchatka.

DEI:  The big 4EB raid is set to hit Koepang tomorrow.  Recon shows 24 aicraft (probably patrol) and an AMC in port.  The raid's primary purpose is to give Miller a healthy respect for the number of 4EB the Allies can put in the air.  Bathhust Island's airbase goes to level five tomorrow.  Babar is at two.  Saumlaki is at three and moving slowly.  Aru and Taberfane remain at one.  Kaimana on the New Guinea coast is 10% to both level one for both port and airfield.

Akyab:  50th Indian Paratroops are set to assault Prome tomorrow.  I believe this base is vacant, which amazes me.  Miller has 24 units at Rangoon and many more fleeing that way from Miektila.  If he realized he was running from a bunch of villagers banging pots and beating sticks together he'd be furious.  If I can seize Prome, secure it, and build the airfield, the Japanese will have trouble in the Rangoon vicinity.


< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 1/29/2010 9:40:02 PM >

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 793
RE: "I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 10:01:34 PM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline 		IFF you have ecided to assume the loss of Paramushiro it becomes more important that it perform a task.

Looks like Miller has sent a substatial sub force there, the fact he got a convoy may make him think you are very serious about holding the place, this drwas heat off your DEI thrust.

In my game against Admiral Abe Imamura I found it easy for they japanese to interdict shipping into Darwin from east and west. Betty regularly hit ships in Broome and rounding Cape York. I solved this by posting some Buff's to Broome and they provided convoy escort(they have good range for this) I also retook Cocos/Keeling Is, this provides cover for convoys from Colombo/Capetown as well as recce into Java/Sumatra.

Occupying it also stops japan from posting Betty or Emily there!

Keep your chin up, you are learning how it plays out just like IRL rather than having played the game to death and know all of the tricks.


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(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 794
RE: "I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 10:16:07 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		Are you using restricted units in Burma, or no?

In my game vs. Cuttlefish, I did initially, I just wasn't thinking they should stay in India. As I advanced, I realized that they were WAY too powerful, and after some research said "Oh, those probably should have to stay in India". I am now pulling all of them out.

If you are doing this with Non-Restricted units, I can't beleive Miller is leaving like that. 24 units in Rangoon? They can't stay there; Rangoon can be isolated by taking Pegu.

If he isn't making a stand in Burma, is he moving all the way back to Moulmein and Siam?

Post a map of Burma when you get a chance, please....

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Post #: 795
RE: "I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 10:20:04 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		I'll post a map of Burma tonight or tomorrow.

I am NOT using restricted units in Burma (except I did use them against Akyab, but Akyab is connected by road only to India, so I felt that was legit).  All units advancing toward Prome are either unrestricted or have been "bought" with political points.

I have not told Miller I was restricting myself in this way.  In part, I think it accurately reflects the uncertainties of war.  He's not exactly certain of what he's facing and, as a result, he's ended up evaluating the threat about as accurately as the Pinkerton men did in the Civil War.

(in reply to Q-Ball)
Post #: 796
RE: "I'm calling your bluff!" - 1/29/2010 10:59:14 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		The situation in Burma in mid-May 1943 (note: the Allies just took Prome).




Attachment (1)

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Post #: 797
RE: Developments - 1/29/2010 11:07:00 PM   
jrcar

 

Posts: 3613
Joined: 4/19/2002
From: Seymour, Australia
Status: offline 		Maybe a bit harsh, but from what I've read the Bits in India were happy to largely do the status quo, and weren't going to risk anymore. I certainly don't blame them for that... but

IMHO if they had had different leadership or intent then they could have made their own shipping (India has had decent ship yards for a LONG time) and if that had of been less risk adverse (again I don't blame them for that, considering what had gone before, and the focus on Europe, and the basically what you have is it from the higher command), then they could have done things more aggresively.

So they did things for good reasons during the war, but those reasons (IMHO) were not that valid so having the Brits conduct amphib ops in the Indian Ocean area is feasible, if you consider the implications of what a bad loss means (the gutting of units that will probably NEVER refill).

That was their quandry, they knew they had one shot, if they lost it then they were in trouble again... so they kept that shot, and the fleet, as a force in being. A cautious approach that largely worked, but one that we don't have to follow :)

Cheers
Rob


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

Wow, lots of interesting comments:

AUSSIES: Thanks for the comments from the Aussies on RL situation in Darwin. A bit hard on the brits there jrcar, don't you think? Though I don't know. Certainly, they completely lacked invasion shipping, as the UK had a ton of other priorities for it. And given the situation in Europe, I doubt hardly ANY UK replacements were sent to India after 1942, just locals and commonwealth troops. They were in desparate straits in Europe for manpower, and that was #1 priority.




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AE BETA Breaker

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Post #: 798
RE: Developments - 1/30/2010 12:48:49 AM   
janh

 

Posts: 1216
Joined: 6/12/2007
Status: offline 		My preference would be to hold on to Paramushiro.   Have you gotten any intelligence as to a possible counter-invasion?

Making some show with a carrier group in the Solomons or somewhere might be a worthy thing to keep him guess.  If I'd interpret his comments, I say he doesn't quite know what is going on presently, but tries to get some "email response" out of you that can help him evaluate the seriousness of the threats in DEI and New Guinea.   It would look to me like your opponent is a bit paralysed right now and ceding the book to you since he would like to stage something, but knows the risk running into your still potent carrier force.  As Japanese, I'd as quickly as possible "clear" the threat to the Kuriles, and the "safest" time window is already past.  Another 2 months, and you'll have plenty of naval air platforms, and almost all of your BB's back.

I think relocating some fragments from the units in Para is fine.  But I'd indeed try to resupply them (the "Washington Express"...) and even get the airbase back up until you get the carriers.  Even use a couple of CVE for protection.  You'll get plenty of those in the next two years anyway -- at worst, loosing them now will cause you a 3-4 months delay.  But maybe they'll get lucky and score a hit.

The war will be won in the DEI, but it will be won much cheaper if you don't allow him to build centers of gravity, and gain local initiative.  Any plane, man and ship you destroy up there, and any week you hold out on Para, will be well worth it on the long run.   And I am really not convinced you will loose Para if you contest him.  Just don't let him concentrate.  He will probably try to pull a Lee (at Chancellorsville) or a Mannstein and temporarely strip one AO to hit you with superior forces in another, and then relocate.  The Germans mastered this operational technique in WW2 and showed how you can still keep a 4:1 or 5:1 superiority at bay for a considerable while.  Don't allow him that.







(in reply to jrcar)
Post #: 799
RE: Developments - 1/30/2010 12:54:25 AM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		5/9/43 and 5/10/43
 
NoPac:  A Japanese combat TF finished off a bunch of the transports at Paramushiro.  A little supply got ashore, but not much.  This reinforces the impression I've had that it will be nearly impossible to resupply Para.  I'm dedicating more patrol aircraft and subs to carry supply, but that'll be about it.  I am keeping the carriers in NoPac for awhile just in case Miller sends the KB down to the DEI.

DEI:  It appears that the Mini-KB is heading toward the eastern DEI - patrol aircraft sighted carriers SE of Kendari on a easterly heading.  Could be a raid; could possibly be providing cover for some kind of counter-invasion.  I've put all of Darwin's 4EB on naval strike and have adjusted CAP percentage for fighters at Darwin, Saumlaki, Bathhurst Island and Babar Island.

Burma:  Indian paratroops take the vacant town of Prome.  The precipitous Japanese retreat to Rangoon continues.  The Allies will try to fortify Prome and build up it's airfield.

China:  Miller might be pulling back from Changteh; he's moved on Hengyang, but he's not going to do any better there than he's done at Changsha and Changteh.  Too easy for the Allies to shuttle troops over interior lines, and with our artillery house rule in effect well-entrenched Chinese units do okay.

Allied Carriers:  The thought of the Allied carriers set to arrive over the next three months is almost intoxicating.

(in reply to jrcar)
Post #: 800
RE: Developments - 1/30/2010 2:31:18 PM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		NoPac - I agree with Q-Ball about pulling out a fragment just in case you need to rebuild LCUs. The rest stay to fight to the end. Make him commit as much here as necessary. Even if you lose these bases, he will be forced to keep extra troops there in fear that you will return later.

Burma/China - Do you have enough PPs to buy out some Chinese LCUs and head them for Burma?? You have the supply in Burma/India to rebuild them and it would make your supply situation in China better (less mouths to feed).

Subs - I would have some run into various bases in the NoPac to gain intel using Patrol Zones.

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 801
RE: Developments - 1/30/2010 4:58:27 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		5/11/43 and 5/12/43
 
NoPac:  KB showed up west of Attu and demolished a few small transports.  CVE Barnes is not far away, so I'm sweating the next turn as she flees toward Adak Island.  Yes, I've evacuated cadres of my most important units at Paramushiro (the infantry division and Marine regiment) and will continue doing so.  But Para is a lost cause.  She will fall to the Japanese within the month unless Miller does something awfully dumb, which I don't expect.

SoPac:  The Allies took Baker Island, thus reducing the LOC between West Coast and SWPac.  I think Miller has decided that holding and vigorously defending far-flung outposts in this area doesn't make sense when the war has shifted to the DEI and (tempoarily) NoPac.  In my WitP games I almost totally ignored this area, but if Miller doesn't put up "due diligence" I'll try to nibble and chew up some territory, starting with Tarawa, both to further shorten LOC and provide an alternate and low-risk route of advance while the real war continues in the DEI.

SWPac:  The Mini-KB sortied as did the Allied 4EB from Darwin.  My bombers took some shots at various light carriers (the group includes CVL Nissin, CV Hiyo, CVE Chiyoda, and more) but missed.  I wouldn't have expected more, but in these confined waters and with this many subs and bombers around, eventually Miller's going to get unlucky and something bad is going to happen.  I'm worried about committing the Allied carriers in this vicinity given the total lethaliy of Japanese subs in my game; don't know what I can do about it or if I can avoid sending them here.  Something to mull over.

Burma:  The Allies have consolidated their hold on Prome and are advancing on the base across the river (due west in real life) from Rangoon.  I think it's vacant and it can be built up to at least level seven.  If the Allies are able to take, hold, and build up this base and prome, it may be possible to make life untennable for the Japanese at Rangoon and vicinity.  Very strange, but delightful, that this is happening while nearly every British unit is already at Darwin.  (NYGiants:  I have four Chinese units in Burma, but I like your idea of seeing if they can build "big" using Indian supply).

China:  I think the status quo will resume indefinately, though Miller is apparently and gradually shifting his line of attack toward Hangchow and possibly Kweilin and Liuchow.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 1/30/2010 5:00:40 PM >

(in reply to ny59giants)
Post #: 802
RE: Developments - 1/30/2010 5:11:15 PM   
khyberbill


Posts: 1941
Joined: 9/11/2007
From: new milford, ct
Status: offline
quote:

Okay, I need advice and counsel from all the advisors who favored continued Allied effort to support and hold Paramushiro


I trust you have a few Marine Squadrons there that have upgraded to Corsairs. They can make a real difference. In my PBEM battling over Darwin, I am getting kill ratios of between 6:1 and 27:1 against Tonys and Tojos. My foe says they are high exp pilots (many 80+). In Burma, I moved two squads of F6F-3s from some CV's and they are doing almost as well against the same kind of opposition.

_____________________________

"Its a dog eat dog world Sammy and I am wearing Milkbone underwear" -Norm.

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 803
RE: Developments - 1/30/2010 5:16:55 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		My Corsairs don't do anything.  I just had a high-experienced squadron get chewed alive in the DEI and about five turns ago the same thing happened to a decent squadron at Paramushiro.

I have no more fighters at Para.  No supplies.

(in reply to khyberbill)
Post #: 804
RE: Developments - 1/30/2010 6:10:25 PM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		It looks like only the Chinese Divisions can be bought out. There are 12 of them with about 200 AV each. All the Corps seem to be restricted. 

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 805
RE: Developments - 1/30/2010 8:59:51 PM   
khyberbill


Posts: 1941
Joined: 9/11/2007
From: new milford, ct
Status: offline 		I have had just the opposite experience. That is what makes this game interesting. I have one squad that has 47 kills to no losses. My foe is pulling his hair out. I use them primarily on sweeps or CAP at 30k.

_____________________________

"Its a dog eat dog world Sammy and I am wearing Milkbone underwear" -Norm.

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 806
RE: Developments - 1/31/2010 8:20:57 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		5/13/43 to 5/18/43
 
NoPac:  Japanese landings commenced at Paramushiro on the 15th.  The coastal artillery unit did a decent job banging up the transports, but not good enough to sway the ultimate outcome.  To this point Miller has about 1200 AV ashore - probably not enough to vanquish the Allies, even with low supply troubles.  Para could hold out awhile.  CVE Prince William ate a torpedo off Attu, but only suffered light damage.  She's making for Seattle.  When it's all said and done I'll have to think through all the plus and minus aspects of this operation.  Although there have been certain important and far-reaching benefits, I doubt they were worth the cost.  Meanwhile, the Allied carrier TFs will skirt French Frigate Shoals on the way to Christmas Island to refuel.  From there I think the big carriers and some of the CVEs will proceed to Oz; some of the CVEs I may use to support an invasion of Tarawa, as long as I can put that together before the KB could possibly arrive. 

SoPac:  The Allies will invade the vacant (and still green) dot hex of Tabitatu (sp?) south of Tarawa, which will tip my hand about my intention to hit Tarawa.  I have no idea if the Japanese are firmly in place at Tarawa or not; I won't invade if it's stoutly defended.  CV Essex arrived at Panama City and is on the way to Tahiti.

SWPac:  The KB and combat TF (including Mutsu and Nagato) pulled back after roughing up Saumlaki a bit.  A Marine Base Force with 100 torpedo support is at Brisbane and making for Darwin.  I may try to insert this unit at Saumlaki (or perhaps Babar or Kai-eilenden) to give the Allies the ability to use Avengers in this area.

Burma:  Prome airfield is up to level two but it'll be awhile before I can get a base force up to the front lines.  The Chinese took Mandalay.

China:  Miller dropped a paratroop unit on the hex behind Changsha, which created problems because it severed the easy connection between Changsha and Hengyang.  He had three units at Hengyang, which shouldn't be enough to do squat, but I forgot that my units there haven't been tested during the war and therefore have relatively low experience (I should have been training them but forgot).  The Japanese have dropped forts from four to 1 and I'm worried about the future of this city.  I had two 100% prepped units moving here from Changsha, but the paratroop assault made them do funky things - sent them off toward the north.  So the "quicky and easy reinforcements" aren't going to happen.

(in reply to khyberbill)
Post #: 807
RE: Developments - 2/1/2010 4:23:59 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		5/19/43 to 5/24/43
 
NoPac:  Paramushiro continues to hold - the Japanese are bombarding each turn and have about 1500 AV ashore.  For some reason my transport subs won't load, so I'm using patrol aircraft to evacuate cadres.  I bet Para falls within the week.  I will have held it about three months.

SoPac:  Troops are loading for the dot hex south of Tarawa.  D-Day is about eight days away.  Tarawa is only a level two airfield, so my hunch is that the airfield isn't filled with fighters and bombers.

SWPac:  The Allies continue to send small TFs with supplies to the various bases (and Miller uses small combat TFs and subs to contest), give the engineers time to boost airfield and port levels (Saumlaki's airfield just went to level four), and target 4EB against Ambon, Koepang, and Lautem on a rotating basis.  The Allies have a massive presence at Darwin now - 3500 AV with a true host of engineers and other support units.  This suits me fine - once the Allies are ready to move forward the troops needed to "feed the advance" will be close by.  Once Paramushiro falls, Miller will send the bulk of the IJN this way.  Most of the Allied navies will already be here, so this promises to be the focus of a great deal of activity.

Burma:  The Allies took Magwe and Tyang Gyi and will take the base across the river from Rangoon (Bessien?) tomorrow.

China:  A nightmare here.  The Japanese took Hengyang.  This forces the Chinese to defend the two cities to the rear, meaning the Chinese line is extended and the garrisons diluted.  This threatens the entire Chinese MLR - Changsha, Changteh, Kwielin, Liuchow and Nanning are all threatened and may become untennable.  The Japanese breakthrough came as a result of bad luck (I usually had the city behind Changsha garrisoned by infantry, but Miller caught me at an open period when he dropped his paratroops), worse luck (the loss of that city to paratroops diverted my Hengyang reinforcements to the woods hex north of town instead of forward to Hengyang, which was within easy marching distance), incompetence (I had failed to train most of the units garrisoning Henyang), and good moves by Miller (the paradrop combined with the rapid move on Hengyang overwhelmed the defenses before reinforcements could arrive).  What with the deplorable condition of China due to the strategic bombing early in the game, this is a real threat to unhinge the entire theater.  China has been real sore spot since early in the game when Miller used massive artillery (17 units) and strategic bombing to blow gaping holes in the defenses).  Since then he has refused to call off the dogs.  My hope is that one of these days I can make him pay for his "crimes."  I have some ideas...

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 808
RE: Developments - 2/1/2010 4:58:29 PM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		Your situation is not so bad in China as you think-especially considering the date. My pbemail is only June 1942 and my opponent has already taken all of the cites that you mention and I am fighting on the river line behind them. I have lost Sian as well. However, I found that once my lines moved back into wooded rough and rough terrain, the pace of the Japanese assault ground to a halt and he is losing some attacks there and having supply problems. I think I am going to lose most if not all of China but I put the blame on the state of the game before the fixes. (You have probably seen my thread about river crossings and shock. This is one more probem that need addressing.) However, I think if we were to restart the game, China would now work a lot better and I would do better there.

Perhaps I would ask for no moved into China from other theaters before 1942 as well.

Basically, there is no way to hold the clear terrain. However, it the rivers actually provided some better defensive benefit then the Chinese could at least delay in the open terrain better.

All of my Chinese units are up to about 45-55 experience and that seems to help as well.



_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 809
RE: Developments - 2/1/2010 5:04:06 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Many of my Chinese units have 60 experience now.  The Chinese are able to stand behind fortifications as long as "nuclear artillery" isn't employed.

Were I to start another game, I'd use these House Rules:

1.  No strategic bombing in CBI (by either Allies or Axis) until 1944.
2.  No more than one artillery unit for each two divisions.
3.  I'd also strongly consider something tying artillery units to infantry in Manchuko - perhaps the Japanese have to withdraw (and pay political points) one infantry division per artillery unit.

With those things in place China should be much more historical and not subject to ludicrous and a-historic strategy.

P.S. I lost Sian a long time ago.

P.P.S. It's going to take me a long time, but eventually my opponent shall pay for his excesses in China.

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 810
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