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Something needs to be done about SPWAW

 
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Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/1/2010 5:03:08 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		I don't post much, but I've been playing SPWAW since it came out.

SPWAW needs an update from Matrix. It needs to be Windows-7-compatible and high-resolution-capable. (It could also use a lot more terrain height levels, etc.)

Time and technology are marching on, and SPWAW is standing still technology-wise.

The cancellation of Combat Leader (which was very disappointing!) means that SPWAW will continue to be Matrix's tactical WW2 game for the foreseeable future.

Matrix needs to give it a technology makeover and do essentially what WinSPWW2 does: have a free, low-res version and a forty dollar high-res version. We'd buy it.

Otherwise the march of technology is going to eventually force a migration to WinSPWW2 whether we like it or not.

Matrix usually shows pretty good sense, which is why I am one of its best customers. It's time to show some of that sense here and now.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.
Post #: 1
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/1/2010 7:40:34 PM   
Oldguard1970

 

Posts: 578
Joined: 7/19/2006
From: Hiawassee, GA
Status: offline 		I'd be happy to buy a new version.  I am having trouble getting the game to open.  DirectDraw or something like that is unhappy now that I am using Win 7.  (I went to the Depot to download and try the windowed fix for the problem, but I'm still out of luck.) 

I remember reading about an agreement that the code was free and could never be sold, so MATRIX could face some legal trouble if it were to try to sell the game.  I also seem to remember hearing that one can't even find anyone left who would be in a position to release the restriction.

I suppose an update of the code could still raise some legal questions.  Fine.  Update the code so it will work with a newly designed scenario.  I'll pay for the scenario!

This is such a grand game.  It would be a major loss if it fades away because people are not allowed to sell a new version that would work with the new systems.

_____________________________

"Rangers Lead the Way!"

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 2
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/1/2010 10:51:54 PM   
Arctic Blast


Posts: 1168
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		The problem is that Matrix doesn't have any ownership of the code on which SPWAW is based...all of that old SSI catalog is owned 100% by Ubisoft. From what I understand, Matrix had permission to use the SP3 code base to build SPWAW, but that's it...they don't have any long term rights to it beyond that initial development.

So the only option left is to completely remake an entirely new game from the ground up, with a new engine and enough new changes that Ubi can't come around and say "Wait a minute...you're completely ripping off the Steel Panthers system that we own."

_____________________________

Meditation on inevitable death should be performed daily.

(in reply to Oldguard1970)
Post #: 3
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/2/2010 1:08:31 AM   
JEB Davis


Posts: 443
Joined: 12/27/2005
From: Michigan, U.T.B.
Status: offline 		I'm sorry, but this is what's going to happen to this discussion.

The Depot has a "beating a dead horse" smiley for all the dozens of threads full of discussions about updating the code, but I couldn't find one here so the toilet will have to do.

There will be no updates to the code. Search and you will find many discussions, some of which will contain the various reasons why there will be no updates to the code. Version 8.403 is it. If only someone would prove me wrong, what a joyful day that would be.

_____________________________

Reduce SP:WaW slaughter, "Low Carnage":
Settings: 80Spot,80Hit,100R/R,XXXTQ,110TkT,150InfT,180AvSoft,130AvArm,150SOFire / Command & Ctrl ON / AutoRally OFF
Enhanced http://enhanced.freeforums.org
Depot https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/spwawdepot/

(in reply to Arctic Blast)
Post #: 4
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/4/2010 2:52:12 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		Well, in that case it's goodbye to SPWAW.

That's a real shame. I'll miss it. But that's what happens when the technology advances and games don't keep up.

Playing SPWAW in 1900x1200 would have been perfect. Alas, it is not to be.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to JEB Davis)
Post #: 5
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/5/2010 1:30:32 AM   
JEB Davis


Posts: 443
Joined: 12/27/2005
From: Michigan, U.T.B.
Status: offline 		While sometimes the lack of support gives me a bad attitude,
I will not be giving up SPWAW and will always do my best to
have an old computer around to play it on without any hassles.

They are cheap on eBay and I'd imagine will be available for
many years to come.

SPWAW still can't be beat, and WinSPWW2 can't hold a candle to it.

So for now it's even more of a shame that you're giving up.

_____________________________

Reduce SP:WaW slaughter, "Low Carnage":
Settings: 80Spot,80Hit,100R/R,XXXTQ,110TkT,150InfT,180AvSoft,130AvArm,150SOFire / Command & Ctrl ON / AutoRally OFF
Enhanced http://enhanced.freeforums.org
Depot https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/spwawdepot/

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 6
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/5/2010 7:25:59 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		I didn't give up on it. It gave up on me.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to JEB Davis)
Post #: 7
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/5/2010 11:07:26 PM   
planner 3

 

Posts: 616
Joined: 3/7/2008
Status: offline 		MATRIX customer: "Revise game...."

MATRIX CEO.......: "OK"

MATRIX Engineer.. "What's my budget ?"

MATRIX Proj Mgr "10K"

MATRIX CEO "Whats our profit/loss on this ?

MATRIX Auditor "11K Loss...."

and so on and on to infinity.......I'm sure we will never see any improvements on a game that they can't sell..........MHO


< Message edited by planner 3 -- 5/5/2010 11:08:54 PM >

_____________________________

"As Pogo said, 'We have met the enemy and he is us' "

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 8
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/6/2010 4:35:12 AM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		Isn't it odd that Shapnel Games keeps updating WinSPWW2 and WinMBT and making money off of them, yet everyone here is somehow convinced - at the same time - that yes, SPWaW is a better game than other one of them, but that somehow SPWaW just wouldn't make any money if it went that route.

Balderdash.



_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to planner 3)
Post #: 9
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/6/2010 4:41:30 AM   
junk2drive


Posts: 12907
Joined: 6/27/2002
From: Arizona West Coast
Status: offline 		The Camo duo is not making their living from WinSP, Matrix makes it's living from profitable wargames. That's the difference.

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 10
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/6/2010 5:06:34 AM   
KG Erwin


Posts: 8981
Joined: 7/25/2000
From: Cross Lanes WV USA
Status: offline 		As long as my old PC (with Win XP) is running, SPWAW will remain on my HD. We should be thankful that a group of dedicated fans keeps the game alive.

If you wanna keep playing, simply buy a used PC with Win XP strictly for SPWAW and other old games.

Matrix is finished with the SP engine. You may as well get over it.

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 11
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/7/2010 2:47:30 PM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		This is a game in which I invested nearly 10 years of my life to develop and improve it. Without a doubt, it was worth every minute. For me it is the greatest tac-level game ever to see the light of day.

Now to see it slipping away is sad, very sad. But then I think of so many things in life and war that have slipped away with time. For me it is timeless, but then neither the game nor I are that. I began with scenario design and testing for the first Steel Panthers, back in when...1994? That was a long time ago! Since then, retirement from my work, divorce, remarriage and a lot of other things have transpired.

I hope someday another tactical level game of this caliber will appear. So far it has not. So like others, I'll keep an XP computer just for the game if nothing else. Hundreds of scenarios, campaigns and 3 mega campaigns later, and it is still my favorite. I think it is the only game I never tire of.

Thanks to all of you loyal SPWAW players! You kept me going at it even in the hardest of times.

_____________________________


In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 12
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/7/2010 6:50:38 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline 		It's not slipping away just yet....... (wink wink)


BTW thanks for all your work Bill!


< Message edited by Alby -- 5/7/2010 6:51:42 PM >

_____________________________



(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 13
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/7/2010 6:58:53 PM   
NCrawler

 

Posts: 30
Joined: 6/4/2003
From: Sherwood, AR
Status: offline 		Long time no see Bill. How are things? You're right about the SP series, it keeps pulling me back in as well. It's the *ONLY* game that I will consistently play at 800x600 and ever since I found what was causing the palette corruption, I don't even have to maintain an XP machine to play it anymore. Hey, have you seen or heard from Scott Grasse lately? I've been trying to get back in touch with everyone that I knew back in the early SP:WaW days...



NC

(in reply to Alby)
Post #: 14
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/8/2010 3:52:55 AM   
Wild Bill

 

Posts: 6821
Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
Status: offline 		Hello my fellow warriors! No, you are right. After I wrote this tear jerker, I went and tried the new patch for Windows 7. It works...great! I can't tell you how thrilled I was. With all that has gone on in my life and that of my lovely wife, gaming has taken a back seat...I mean nose bleed back seat. Things are better now. She is cancer free and we are now working on getting her back to full health. She still has the stomach tube for sufficent nourishment but we are getting there. And thanks fro the kind words. When something is as much fun as SPWAW, it hardly seems like work. The ability to create and recreate in such a fine game system is still a thrill for me.

I remember all of you that worked with me so hard on these projects. We do have an unbreakable bond. I appreciate every one of you....WB

_____________________________


In Arduis Fidelis
Wild Bill Wilder
Independent Game Consultant

(in reply to NCrawler)
Post #: 15
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/8/2010 6:09:22 AM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

The Camo duo is not making their living from WinSP, Matrix makes it's living from profitable wargames. That's the difference.


So you do understand that Shrapnel is at least making money off of WinSPWW2 and WinMBT, right? Which means that same approach would, logically, make money for Matrix as well, right?

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to junk2drive)
Post #: 16
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/8/2010 6:24:25 AM   
junk2drive


Posts: 12907
Joined: 6/27/2002
From: Arizona West Coast
Status: offline 		Shrapnel probably makes a little bit off of the few sales of the CD version and loses a little on the downloads of the free version and updates.

The updates are done by Don and Andy because of their commitment to that version of SP, not for the money. If Matrix paid a programmer to do what Don and Andy do, Matrix would probably never see a return on their investment.

All of that said, if Matrix had some volunteers and could sell a CD like Shrapnel/Camo does it could be a win/win.

Things may change with the merger too.

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 17
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/8/2010 4:03:34 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		Exactly. It would be a win-win and a moneymaker.

And it needs to be done.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to junk2drive)
Post #: 18
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/9/2010 2:56:40 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wild Bill

Hello my fellow warriors! No, you are right. After I wrote this tear jerker, I went and tried the new patch for Windows 7. It works...great! I can't tell you how thrilled I was. With all that has gone on in my life and that of my lovely wife, gaming has taken a back seat...I mean nose bleed back seat. Things are better now. She is cancer free and we are now working on getting her back to full health. She still has the stomach tube for sufficent nourishment but we are getting there. And thanks fro the kind words. When something is as much fun as SPWAW, it hardly seems like work. The ability to create and recreate in such a fine game system is still a thrill for me.

I remember all of you that worked with me so hard on these projects. We do have an unbreakable bond. I appreciate every one of you....WB


Great news Bill, it is really good to see you around again!!


< Message edited by Alby -- 5/9/2010 3:03:39 PM >

_____________________________



(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 19
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/13/2010 1:55:11 AM   
osiris_slith

 

Posts: 240
Joined: 1/5/2007
Status: offline 		Hi All

I really dont understand the thinking by Matrix because if a small company can reproduce WinSPWAW and Win MBT and that company collected about a $100+ from me it would make sense to upgrade the old games. If Matrix would refurbish and rebuild JTCS I would gladly give them $200 for it!!!! I just dont see that kind of thinking here.

Instead they produce Panzer Command Kharkov which is a complete waste of time (and my money) or strategic level games which few people play (because I really want to play economics and politics when Im invading Russia or conquering Europe) maybe its time for Matrix to either give up JOhn Tillers and SPWAW and give it to company who will refurbish and rebuild those games.

There easy to play and easy to learn by all ages.. I still cant play Kharkov and I dont see what the big hoopla about it was since the graphics are sub par (companred to JTCS and SPWAW, Panzer Command Kharkov graphics just plain suck!!! and its suppose to be a brand new game) If thats what Matrix is producing thats very scary and not to mention playing Panzer Command Kharkov is tedious and boring and has a steep learning curve.

In the past 3 years other then SPWAW JTCS and OAOW I have not found a single game by Matrix that I would consider buying after my experience with Panzer Command Kharkov.

Rene

There you go..dont expect much from this company. The best best is lobby the producers of WinSPWAW to rebuild OAOW

Rene



< Message edited by osiris -- 5/13/2010 1:57:51 AM >

(in reply to Alby)
Post #: 20
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/14/2010 4:04:32 AM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: osiris

Hi All

I really dont understand the thinking by Matrix because if a small company can reproduce WinSPWAW and Win MBT and that company collected about a $100+ from me it would make sense to upgrade the old games. If Matrix would refurbish and rebuild JTCS I would gladly give them $200 for it!!!! I just dont see that kind of thinking here.


Exactly. And that's the problem.

They have the best WWII tactical game here ever and they're just going to do nothing and let it rust out.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to osiris_slith)
Post #: 21
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/16/2010 3:41:28 PM   
Oldguard1970

 

Posts: 578
Joined: 7/19/2006
From: Hiawassee, GA
Status: offline 		Hello WildBill,

Excellent news. You and your lady are in my prayers.

You earn special thanks from all of us who enjoy this fine game. Thanks for all of your work, and welcome back.

_____________________________

"Rangers Lead the Way!"

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 22
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/17/2010 2:17:42 PM   
Josh

 

Posts: 2576
Joined: 5/9/2000
From: Leeuwarden, Netherlands
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wild Bill

This is a game in which I invested nearly 10 years of my life to develop and improve it. Without a doubt, it was worth every minute. For me it is the greatest tac-level game ever to see the light of day.

Now to see it slipping away is sad, very sad. But then I think of so many things in life and war that have slipped away with time. For me it is timeless, but then neither the game nor I are that. I began with scenario design and testing for the first Steel Panthers, back in when...1994? That was a long time ago! Since then, retirement from my work, divorce, remarriage and a lot of other things have transpired.

I hope someday another tactical level game of this caliber will appear. So far it has not. So like others, I'll keep an XP computer just for the game if nothing else. Hundreds of scenarios, campaigns and 3 mega campaigns later, and it is still my favorite. I think it is the only game I never tire of.

Thanks to all of you loyal SPWAW players! You kept me going at it even in the hardest of times.


Thanks for your efforts, this game sure has given me countless hours of gamefun... back in the nineties
And as you say, not a tactical game comes close. But it does show its age, well, like we are I guess

Good to hear you lady is recovering.

(in reply to Wild Bill)
Post #: 23
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/29/2010 10:12:22 PM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline 		A great wargame is rusting out here because no one will put any effort into updating it.

Color me very sad.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to Josh)
Post #: 24
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/30/2010 4:29:43 PM   
Alby


Posts: 4855
Joined: 4/29/2000
From: Greenwood, Indiana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Steely Glint

A great wargame is rusting out here because no one will put any effort into updating it.

Color me very sad.



No one??

ENHANCED

_____________________________



(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 25
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 5/30/2010 5:54:26 PM   
junk2drive


Posts: 12907
Joined: 6/27/2002
From: Arizona West Coast
Status: offline 		Great job Alby and team but it still doesn't change the OS problems and modern screen resolutions.

Sooner or later someone will make a clone. Been done with Panzer General.

(in reply to Alby)
Post #: 26
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 6/1/2010 9:10:29 AM   
Krec


Posts: 548
Joined: 3/9/2001
From: SF Bay Area
Status: offline 		i am still playing this baby 3-4 times a week online and loving every minute.  When and if its redone ,  the new version will have a steep hill to climb to over take this all time classic. To this day ,  everytime i am buying my force i get a rush that no other game gives me. Carefully deploying my forces, on the map ,  pre plotting my arty,  setting my airstrikes giving orders to my infiltrators wondering what kind of forces i will be facing this time ,  man I LOVE THIS GAME!!   Alby yor mod has givin me so much enjoyment i cant tell you.  the infantry is kickass the oob clean up is awesome.  thank you so much !!  

_____________________________

"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country." Patton


(in reply to junk2drive)
Post #: 27
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 7/23/2010 12:11:23 AM   
Steely Glint


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/23/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: junk2drive

Sooner or later someone will make a clone. Been done with Panzer General.


Hopefully sooner than later. I wish Matrix would do something.

_____________________________

“It was a war of snap judgments and binary results—shoot or don’t, live or die.“

Wargamer since 1967. Matrix customer since 2003.

(in reply to junk2drive)
Post #: 28
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 7/23/2010 11:24:47 PM   
Arctic Blast


Posts: 1168
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline 		The only thing that can really be 'done' at this point is a whole new game.

_____________________________

Meditation on inevitable death should be performed daily.

(in reply to Steely Glint)
Post #: 29
RE: Something needs to be done about SPWAW - 7/25/2010 10:17:29 PM   
V22 Osprey


Posts: 1593
Joined: 4/8/2008
From: Corona, CA
Status: offline 		Let's face it, it's 2010, and SPWAW is starting to show it's age. Without active developers this game is pretty much doomed, as one day when tech advances far enough it won't run at all. I agree with JEB...WinSPWW2 will never touch SPWAW, however it is sad that tech and age is creeping up on good ole SPWAW....and fast.

I say we make a petition or donate and make fund to help matrix get the rights to Steel Panthers.

I admit though....I've moved on to JTCS...



_____________________________


Art by rogueusmc.

(in reply to Arctic Blast)
Post #: 30
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