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V-Low Aircraft - 6/21/2010 3:09:55 AM

Tarawa565

Posts: 33
Joined: 6/9/2010
Status: offline

Hello,

So I have been playing some missions and was wondering which aircraft were V-Low capable. In real life, F-111's are but in the game when I set them on V-low they crash. Is this supposed to be this way? Which aircraft can go V-low? Does weather play a part in this? Sorry for all the questions.

Thanks,
David

Post #: 1

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/21/2010 4:41:53 AM

TonyE

Posts: 1551
Joined: 5/23/2006
From: MN, USA
Status: offline

Hi David,
Whether the F-111 has the NOE (Nap of 'the' Earth) flag varies depending upon the battleset and database you are using. We only have editable databases in the EC2003 and newer battlesets and in those cases you could use the platform editor to check for the presence of the flag. What battleset are you playing?
That said I'm starting to become convinced that this is an item that should be visible in game. I resisted for a long time but am starting to "see the light" so I expect you'll see the NOE capability indicated somewhere in the game in a future patch.

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to Tarawa565)

Post #: 2

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/21/2010 1:53:07 PM

Tarawa565

Posts: 33
Joined: 6/9/2010
Status: offline

Thanks for the information, I have been playing the NACV North Atlantic battleset....particulary scenario 14.0, also, although this is sort of off topic...I can't turn on the jammers on my EF-111. The plane is loaded for "Patrol" with 4 ALQ-99 ECM Pods but when I go to turn it on all of the radars are greyed out.

And that sounds like a great feature to add!

Thanks,
David

(in reply to TonyE)

Post #: 3

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/21/2010 9:51:21 PM

TonyE

Posts: 1551
Joined: 5/23/2006
From: MN, USA
Status: offline

I'm sure you already guessed but I just verified that the EF-111 and F-111 do not have the NOE flag in the original NACV battleset.

Correct as well on the ALQ-99 of the EF-111 in that battleset, the jammers can't turn on since the game requires radars to be enegergized to enable the jamming, no radar, no jam...

Two good reasons to focus play in EC2003 and newer (notably user-created scenarios).

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to Tarawa565)

Post #: 4

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/21/2010 9:55:58 PM

TonyE

Posts: 1551
Joined: 5/23/2006
From: MN, USA
Status: offline

A few of the aircraft in that scen that can do VLow without crashing are:
A-6
F/A-18
Tornado GR.1
Su-24

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to TonyE)

Post #: 5

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/22/2010 1:37:36 AM

Tarawa565

Posts: 33
Joined: 6/9/2010
Status: offline

Thank you for the information, and I have already started doing that. It does seem sort of a shame though since the older battlesets are interesting and I like the classic NATO vs. Warsaw Pact Cold War gone hot stuff.

Was that done intentionally with the F-111 and not giving it V-low capability or was that an oversight? Just trying to understand the development of the game a little better.

Thanks,
David

(in reply to TonyE)

Post #: 6

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/22/2010 2:15:41 AM

TonyE

Posts: 1551
Joined: 5/23/2006
From: MN, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tarawa565

Thank you for the information, and I have already started doing that. It does seem sort of a shame though since the older battlesets are interesting and I like the classic NATO vs. Warsaw Pact Cold War gone hot stuff.

Was that done intentionally with the F-111 and not giving it V-low capability or was that an oversight? Just trying to understand the development of the game a little better.

Thanks,
David

Agreed that it is a shame but I agree with the decisions the guys that came before me (some of them still being around such as Brad/CV32). When the code was given a new life in the 2002 timeframe the team at the time decided not to put the effort into developing the tools to modify the existing battlesets other than that required to bring the EC2000 battlesets up to the EC2003 standard. That allowed the team to focus on going forward but they valued the history and wanted to keep all of the older battlesets functional. Since then we've tried to keep the old scenarios running but occasionally we consciously make code changes that may act to the detriment of the older battlesets while improving the EC2003 and newer battlesets. Most of the changes have benefitted both old and new but the focus is on the newer battlesets. I've considered dropping the older battlesets entirely on a number of occasions but have never quite been able to let them go (they'd still run in a 'legacy' game engine).

So the F-111 not having VLow capability imho is an oversight made roughly 20 years ago when the original NACV battleset was introduced.

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to Tarawa565)

Post #: 7

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/22/2010 3:10:51 AM

Tarawa565

Posts: 33
Joined: 6/9/2010
Status: offline

Okay, thanks for all the information. :). I guess thats understandable giving priority to the new battlesets which I am thouroughly enjoying. Are there any plans for new "old" battlesets? Or are all the battlesets looking at the more recent conflict areas and more hypothetical scenarios? I've just always loved those Cold War ones :).

I would make the scenarios myself but unfortuneatly I'm running Win 7 64 so no SE for me :(.

I really am enjoying this game thouroghly and thanks to you and all the other Developers for a great game.

David

(in reply to TonyE)

Post #: 8

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/22/2010 3:25:48 AM

TonyE

Posts: 1551
Joined: 5/23/2006
From: MN, USA
Status: offline

You aren't the only one who would like new "old" battlesets!

Hehe, if you are serious about remaking the scens, we'll find you a way to run the SE

. Brad even has a good start on a database for the timeframe that we used when remaking the USNI battleset. We'd love to chat with you on IRC sometime (see left side of http://www.harpgamer.com ).

One scenario you might really like is Fortress Keflavik, the NATO version can be grabbed at http://harpgamer.com/harpforum/index.php?autocom=downloads&showfile=519 (there is a Soviet version in that download category too).

Similar deal with a different twist at http://harpgamer.com/harpforum/index.php?autocom=downloads&showfile=450

Different author: http://harpgamer.com/harpforum/index.php?autocom=downloads&showfile=366

Hunt for Red October http://harpgamer.com/harpforum/index.php?autocom=downloads&showfile=321

I guess I like Ralf's scens, especially when they have my dear F-14, http://harpgamer.com/harpforum/index.php?autocom=downloads&showfile=236

Any scenario by Mark Gellis tends to be golden too, the small size tricks you into thinking they should be easy!

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to Tarawa565)

Post #: 9

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/22/2010 4:06:56 AM

Tarawa565

Posts: 33
Joined: 6/9/2010
Status: offline

I downloaded "Fortress Keflavik" already :)

And thanks for all the other links, I'll have to check those out too.

I would love to help out in any way I can, my time is somewhat limited but I if I could help out in any small way just let me know.

Thanks,
David

(in reply to TonyE)

Post #: 10

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/22/2010 8:26:38 PM

mavfin

Posts: 274
Joined: 6/22/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TonyE
That said I'm starting to become convinced that this is an item that should be visible in game. I resisted for a long time but am starting to "see the light" so I expect you'll see the NOE capability indicated somewhere in the game in a future patch.

I would love to either be able to see the NoE flag in-game, along with whether missile systems are sea-skimmer-capable. Obviously, if I don't know what a missile-system is, I don't need to know that, but once I identified, I should have that info.

Barring it being in-game, any chance of a read-only tool to read the old DBs for that info?

_____________________________

--Mav

(in reply to TonyE)

Post #: 11

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/22/2010 8:29:26 PM

TonyE

Posts: 1551
Joined: 5/23/2006
From: MN, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mavfin
Barring it being in-game, any chance of a read-only tool to read the old DBs for that info?

<shakes magic 8-ball>It is doubtful

But yes, we'll get the NoE showing in the platform display.

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to mavfin)

Post #: 12

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 6/22/2010 9:19:40 PM

mavfin

Posts: 274
Joined: 6/22/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TonyE

quote:

ORIGINAL: mavfin
Barring it being in-game, any chance of a read-only tool to read the old DBs for that info?

<shakes magic 8-ball>It is doubtful

But yes, we'll get the NoE showing in the platform display.

That would be much more convenient than the:

1) save
2) set group to vlow
3) see if losing a/c or not
4) continue or reload from save

method. :D

Thanks, Tony!

_____________________________

--Mav

(in reply to TonyE)

Post #: 13

RE: V-Low Aircraft - 8/9/2010 8:31:56 PM

Akmatov

Posts: 495
Joined: 7/26/2000
From: Tucson, AZ, USA
Status: offline

Just my 2 cents, but it is a pity the old NATO vs WP scenarios are fading out of playability.

From a marketing point of view, there are probably few newer players all that interested. But some such conflict was the only real chance for major naval action from 1945 to 2010+. (I keep wanting to write a major convoy across the Atlantic to reinforce NATO fighting Backfires and Akulas just to get a better idea of who would win) As far as I can tell the only real opportunity for the foreseeable future will be between a declining USN (money, not people) and a rising People's Liberation Army Navy.

(in reply to Tarawa565)

Post #: 14