Question: is there a CHS-AE or equivalent?

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> Scenario Design and Modding >> Question: is there a CHS-AE or equivalent?

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Question: is there a CHS-AE or equivalent? - 7/3/2010 1:14:59 AM

rtrapasso

Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
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OK - i bought this game a year ago, but haven't played it as it seems that it is not historical from reading the AARs...

With the new beta patch, i decided to try out the game, but, alas, it seems my fears are well grounded...

After running the 7 December turn 5 times in a row, it seems the USN will lose about 1 BB per enemy aircraft shot down... averaging something like 4 BBs sunk, and about 4 enemy aircraft downed by flak over PH on average... this is on 7 December... i suspect more BBs will sink in the days immediately afterward.

Also, there seems no way for the Allies to alter Dec 7 (or is there?)* The Prince of Wales and Repulse get attacked off Mersing on December 7 (no choice - even though historically they were not there on Dec 7). i also notice Batan Island is occupied without resistance (it did have Allied troops there, though).

This is only after a cursory perusal of what is going on.

In summary: the game (at least Scen 1 on Dec 7) does not seem historically accurate, neither in dispositions, nor in accuracy of combat simulations.

Allied AA power seems very nerfed (and from complaints about what is going on in 1944, it seems rather extreme)... Allied carrier A to A seems seriously out of whack, surface ship encounters ditto...

So, my question is: is there currently (or in progress) a mod to try to address the historical inaccuracies, and maybe approach what CHS was in WITP?

CHS had it's problems (anemic air to air model, but at least it seemed to affect both sides equally.)

*EDIT - just discovered i had the "Historical First Turn on" for the Japanese... oops... at least the Japanese can alter their turn.

< Message edited by rtrapasso -- 7/3/2010 1:52:29 AM >

Post #: 1

RE: Question: is there a CHS-AE or equivalent? - 7/3/2010 2:09:35 AM

Walloc

Posts: 3141
Joined: 10/30/2006
From: Denmark
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso

After running the 7 December turn 5 times in a row, it seems the USN will lose about 1 BB per enemy aircraft shot down... averaging something like 4 BBs sunk, and about 4 enemy aircraft downed by flak over PH on average... this is on 7 December... i suspect more BBs will sink in the days immediately afterward.

Also, there seems no way for the Allies to alter Dec 7 (or is there?)* The Prince of Wales and Repulse get attacked off Mersing on December 7 (no choice - even though historically they were not there on Dec 7). i also notice Batan Island is occupied without resistance (it did have Allied troops there, though).

In summary: the game (at least Scen 1 on Dec 7) does not seem historically accurate, neither in dispositions, nor in accuracy of combat simulations.

Allied AA power seems very nerfed (and from complaints about what is going on in 1944, it seems rather extreme)... Allied carrier A to A seems seriously out of whack, surface ship encounters ditto...

So, my question is: is there currently (or in progress) a mod to try to address the historical inaccuracies, and maybe approach what CHS was in WITP?

*EDIT - just discovered i had the "Historical First Turn on" for the Japanese... oops... at least the Japanese can alter their turn.

Well AE is as i understand it made by in large the same ppl that made CHS so in that sense u alrdy have the "mod".

There are a few mods out, possibly u should look at Dabigbabes. Havent played aroudn with it much yet so i cant give u an opinion.

As too PH. U can either play with historic turn or not. I've tested it a bit after some anecdotal evidence. For some reason on average playing the non historic start gives both higher flak losses and few sunk BBs. Tested each 35 times, exitting the program after each and on average there is a noteble difference. I have never seen 29 jap losses, no but i saw up 18 losses in non historic start doing PH as per historic start.
Never saw that with historic turn. On average around 1� less BB sinks too. Why this is i cant tell u since both have suprise rules and exact same strike settings.

If u play with the non historic first turn its not only the japanease that can change orders so can the allied side. Aka force Z dont have to be ordered into its "death ride". Some have house rules saying u can change that TF orders others u cant.

Else there is always scn 6. U cant get much more historic than that.

Kind regards,

Rasmus

(in reply to rtrapasso)

Post #: 2

RE: Question: is there a CHS-AE or equivalent? - 7/3/2010 2:30:26 AM

Halsey

Posts: 5069
Joined: 2/7/2004
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This is all Brady's fault...

I won't go into details.

(in reply to rtrapasso)

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RE: Question: is there a CHS-AE or equivalent? - 7/3/2010 5:02:38 PM

JWE

Posts: 6580
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso
So, my question is: is there currently (or in progress) a mod to try to address the historical inaccuracies, and maybe approach what CHS was in WITP?

Howdy Bob. As Walloc mentioned DaBabes scenarios try to address historical accuracy. As to the various combat models, the game is still undergoing certain tweaks to various portions of the engine. It would be a tail chasing exercise to seriously mod things until the engine gets stable.

DaBabes has lots of data tweaks in it, but more in the nature of lining things up with respect to one another and defining mathematical expressions for the data. Once everything is lined up correctly, and the engine gets stable, data tweaks can be done by raising or lowering entire classes of devices with a uniform and specific mathematical function. Right now, it's just polishing things and waiting ..

Ciao.

_____________________________

Home of DaBabes

(in reply to rtrapasso)

Post #: 4

RE: Question: is there a CHS-AE or equivalent? - 7/3/2010 8:36:52 PM

topeverest

Posts: 3376
Joined: 10/17/2007
From: Houston, TX - USA
Status: offline

RTRAPASSO,

Cant say I disagree with your observations, but the average allied win date still seems to be ahead of historical. From a top down perspective, the game probably still is a bit allied centric. Not sure it is possible to make the changes your comments hint at and keep any sense of that delicate thing we call play-balance. to be sure, I dont label myself an expert, but I've modded most of what you suggest amending and found the allies to play far stronger. In any event, I find the game to be an exceptional piece of design work. With the added functionality of the editor, most players can design and or play just about any version they choose.

IMO, the attempt has been to 'center' the game so that able opponents would likely finish around the historical rather than focus on hyper-accuracy of the distinct elements.

_____________________________

Andy M

(in reply to JWE)

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RE: Question: is there a CHS-AE or equivalent? - 7/3/2010 9:17:17 PM

chesmart

Posts: 908
Joined: 1/14/2007
From: Malta
Status: offline

I think Big Babes will be to AE what CHS was to WITP (When it will be finalised, Because John, Don, MO and Lady Grogneuse know their history and equations and want to create a scenario wich is more historical than stock)

(in reply to topeverest)

Post #: 6

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