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Regarding the next official AAR - 7/10/2010 11:11:39 AM   
squatter

 

Posts: 1033
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline 		I know this will upset a few people, but I would politely like to request that for your next AAR you ask a different member of the testing team to write it other than Pyledriver.

I respect the amount of time that Pyledriver put into his last AAR, and that many people obviously enjoyed it.

I personally, however, found his style of dealing with posters on his thread obnoxious. I for one, could not bear to read another AAR from him.

As I said, I respect that others obviously enjoyed his AAR, but if there is any possibility of another tester posting the next one - especially if it is head-to-head rather than vs AI, then that would be great.

Hope this doesnt sound rude, it's just one user's opinion.

Post #: 1
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/10/2010 2:18:05 PM   
ComradeP

 

Posts: 7192
Joined: 9/17/2009
Status: offline 		Another perspective would be refreshing, as we're now familiar with PyleDriver's style.

(in reply to squatter)
Post #: 2
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/10/2010 4:10:03 PM   
wiking62


Posts: 141
Joined: 3/30/2006
From: England
Status: offline 		Jon (Pyledriver) likes to showcase the game without having to answer questions that are not directly linked to his AAR. If you ask questions about his tactics etc he is more than willing to answer, however he has always made it very clear that any other question should be asked in a seperate thread. I for one have no problem with this.

I think stating Jon's attitude is "obnoxious" to some posters is very unfair. Whilst another testers AAR, viewpoint will always be welcome (Elmo's are also a great read) I for one will be eagerly awaiting Jon's next AAR. Everyone has a different style of writing and as long as they are showcasing the game during the development cycle I for one will be very happy.

(in reply to ComradeP)
Post #: 3
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/10/2010 6:30:04 PM   
critter


Posts: 139
Joined: 3/26/2004
Status: offline 		I liked Pyle Drivers AAR's and hope to read more of his or any others.
But I echo squatters thoughts on some of the testers comments to other posters in these threads. While we all appreciate their work I've been put off by more than a few of their Holier than thou attitudes. While they in no way deserve to be called "Yes men" in the end they are just doing something we'd all like to do. But got in to late or didn't know the right person.
Remember after its out and everyone has it. No one will remember who play tested it. GG will get the checks and most of the community will be looking for the next great game.

(in reply to wiking62)
Post #: 4
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/10/2010 7:08:20 PM   
Wild


Posts: 364
Joined: 12/10/2007
Status: offline 		I find this thread to be extremely obnoxious.
Jon wanted to concentrate on strategy and tactics in his AAR. He asked several times,that if people had other questions to start another thread.
People were either to lazy to read his requests or simply felt their questions were so important that they could disregard his very reasonable request.
I am very disappointed with the attitude of many in this forum. In my opinion many people are acting like spoiled kids. This is a grongard game and we should set a higher standard for ourselves.
Jon i'm looking forward to your next AAR.

(in reply to critter)
Post #: 5
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/10/2010 7:42:37 PM   
Ron

 

Posts: 506
Joined: 6/6/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wild

I find this thread to be extremely obnoxious.
Jon wanted to concentrate on strategy and tactics in his AAR. He asked several times,that if people had other questions to start another thread.
People were either to lazy to read his requests or simply felt their questions were so important that they could disregard his very reasonable request.
I am very disappointed with the attitude of many in this forum. In my opinion many people are acting like spoiled kids. This is a grongard game and we should set a higher standard for ourselves.
Jon i'm looking forward to your next AAR.



Please, you are off-topic, this thread is only for those who wish to complain and/or have a beef with Pyledriver's AAR style. You are making it hard to concentrate on the flow, if you want to discuss defense or justification of Pyledriver's AAR style then start your own thread. Thank you.


(in reply to Wild)
Post #: 6
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/10/2010 8:06:30 PM   
Wild


Posts: 364
Joined: 12/10/2007
Status: offline 		nm


< Message edited by Wild -- 7/10/2010 8:10:46 PM >

(in reply to Ron)
Post #: 7
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/10/2010 8:07:31 PM   
Wild


Posts: 364
Joined: 12/10/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wild

I find this thread to be extremely obnoxious.
Jon wanted to concentrate on strategy and tactics in his AAR. He asked several times,that if people had other questions to start another thread.
People were either to lazy to read his requests or simply felt their questions were so important that they could disregard his very reasonable request.
I am very disappointed with the attitude of many in this forum. In my opinion many people are acting like spoiled kids. This is a grongard game and we should set a higher standard for ourselves.
Jon i'm looking forward to your next AAR.



Please, you are off-topic, this thread is only for those who wish to complain and/or have a beef with Pyledriver's AAR style. You are making it hard to concentrate on the flow, if you want to discuss defense or justification of Pyledriver's AAR style then start your own thread. Thank you.




(in reply to Ron)
Post #: 8
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 10:08:17 AM   
janh

 

Posts: 1216
Joined: 6/12/2007
Status: offline 		It simply may be that some readers hope for more information in an AAR presently than purely the strategy aspects, but want to learn more about the game, its features, its mechanics.  Simply figure out what the game is, how it relates to games that one may have played before, and what one can truly expect from it.  Kind of advertising the game with the AAR, showing off as much positive as possible.  But of course those side remarks are useless for you guys from the alpha testing team, only to us newbies.  And of course they'd dilute the AAR somewhat.  On the other hand it is tiresome to go back, find the new thread that discusses blabla feature etc.   Or find the appropriate post in the long "War in the East Q&A" thread.  I simply wouldn't have enough time to go through that "threat" of  almost 40 pages, so I can understand that Squatter would have preferred a different style AAR.   Both arguments for and against are equally valid, and it probably doesn't really matter what the form of the AAR is, the content is crucial.  

(in reply to Wild)
Post #: 9
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 12:29:18 PM   
SGHunt


Posts: 873
Joined: 1/20/2010
From: Lancaster, England
Status: offline 		When someone is taking time to showcase the game for me, no strings, no costs, just for free, I tend to follow their rules.    The use of the word obnoxious here is bang out of order - direct, rough, even rude, but not obnoxious.   Please can we all be more careful about the language we use - it matters.   It sets a tone.   Read the post back to yourself before sending and think how would you like it if it was coming back at you.  

Squatter - you twice mentioned politeness and not wishing to appear rude.   Just taking out that key trigger word (obnoxious) would have altered the whole tone of your email.   Better still, why not just ask for someone else to post an AAR to get a different perspective.  

Personally, Jon's skill at handling his panzers was what I wanted to see and hear about, and comment on.   His game play taught me so much about the purpose of all the detailed mechanics, supply, C&C etc, in a very clear way.    That's why I was gripped.

Stuart 

(in reply to janh)
Post #: 10
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 4:50:58 PM   
critter


Posts: 139
Joined: 3/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wild

I find this thread to be extremely obnoxious.
Jon wanted to concentrate on strategy and tactics in his AAR. He asked several times,that if people had other questions to start another thread.
People were either to lazy to read his requests or simply felt their questions were so important that they could disregard his very reasonable request.
I am very disappointed with the attitude of many in this forum. In my opinion many people are acting like spoiled kids. This is a grongard game and we should set a higher standard for ourselves.
Jon i'm looking forward to your next AAR.


Next time don't publish his AAR till it's finished. That way people who see things thay puzzle them won't be tempted to ask about them.
Several times I saw points brought up that needed attention. That wouldn't have been known about if it wasn't in the AAR. Mud, Air Losses, ATV losses and OOB omissions. Allot of the times I saw them answered with ATTITUDES not consistant with a gronard game.
This won't be the first time a game will be released with errors or even WRONG.
The testers are privy to the way GARY want's it done, not the final authority on the East front. IT seems silly to see something in an AAR picture and then have to start anorher thread to discuss it.
Standard goes both ways. Allot of the people on this forum have the same books and were studying the war when the testers were playing with army men.
Looking forward to PD's next AAR.

< Message edited by critter -- 7/11/2010 5:11:50 PM >

(in reply to Wild)
Post #: 11
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 4:59:05 PM   
Hard Sarge


Posts: 22741
Joined: 10/1/2000
From: garfield hts ohio usa
Status: offline 		okay how is this

new campaign, on Challenging, I am the German, the AI is the Russian

it is one of the new battles for training the player

here is the start

it is called, Road to Minsk

as you see, the main goal is to break though and take Minsk






Attachment (1)

_____________________________


(in reply to critter)
Post #: 12
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 5:00:03 PM   
Hard Sarge


Posts: 22741
Joined: 10/1/2000
From: garfield hts ohio usa
Status: offline 		and here is the end




Attachment (1)

_____________________________


(in reply to Hard Sarge)
Post #: 13
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 5:05:49 PM   
Hard Sarge


Posts: 22741
Joined: 10/1/2000
From: garfield hts ohio usa
Status: offline 		I had a Div next to Mog that could of made a attack, but I knew I had the numbers to win, so held off (I wouldn't of gambled with the attack in a real game, so wouldn't do it in a test game)

now, if you like, maybe we can set up a longer version of the AAR, if not, well, that is the short and sweet version of it

(and just in case, it is a WIP, and it's needs more work, which is why I am being obnoxious about it, give us a couple of days and maybe we can show case it a little better, but it shows some of the smaller stuff we are trying to get added to the overall game)

_____________________________


(in reply to Hard Sarge)
Post #: 14
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 5:08:46 PM   
Neal_MLC

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 2/2/2010
Status: offline 		That was a very enlightening AAR there Hard Sarge,  The finesse the way you posted was truly elegant and I so glad you waited until the campaign was done avoiding all those unnecessary posts.

As Hard Sarge so aptly demostrated, an AAR is a journey not a destination.

_____________________________

no matter where you go, there you are

(in reply to Hard Sarge)
Post #: 15
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 5:31:17 PM   
critter


Posts: 139
Joined: 3/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge
now, if you like, maybe we can set up a longer version of the AAR, if not, well, that is the short and sweet version of it


Thats funny.. No what I'd like is for you to print it out..Roll it up and stick it up your ass.
I don't really care. Things that I've seen that I'd like to see addressed ( production, counter info. Finland) have already been answered by the game designer. Not by a tester that acts like an Ahole because he thinks he has some kind of authority .
If you read the above posts and came away with this answer. What can I add?

< Message edited by critter -- 7/11/2010 5:32:17 PM >

(in reply to Hard Sarge)
Post #: 16
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/11/2010 11:23:15 PM   
stevekten

 

Posts: 13
Joined: 11/19/2004
Status: offline 		I'm glad to see im not the only one that did not like his AAR style. To much hey look at how great i am!

(in reply to critter)
Post #: 17
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 1:13:01 AM   
pompack


Posts: 2582
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: University Park, Texas
Status: offline

(in reply to stevekten)
Post #: 18
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 1:42:09 AM   
knilli

 

Posts: 75
Joined: 12/30/2008
From: Joey Land
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: hart2412

Jon (Pyledriver) likes to showcase the game without having to answer questions that are not directly linked to his AAR. If you ask questions about his tactics etc he is more than willing to answer, however he has always made it very clear that any other question should be asked in a seperate thread. I for one have no problem with this.

I think stating Jon's attitude is "obnoxious" to some posters is very unfair. Whilst another testers AAR, viewpoint will always be welcome (Elmo's are also a great read) I for one will be eagerly awaiting Jon's next AAR. Everyone has a different style of writing and as long as they are showcasing the game during the development cycle I for one will be very happy.


I agree!

(in reply to wiking62)
Post #: 19
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 1:45:57 AM   
knilli

 

Posts: 75
Joined: 12/30/2008
From: Joey Land
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

and here is the end






I love it!

(in reply to Hard Sarge)
Post #: 20
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 4:25:02 AM   
wurger54

 

Posts: 152
Joined: 7/28/2007
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: von Jaeger
When someone is taking time to showcase the game for me, no strings, no costs, just for free, I tend to follow their rules.   


Pretty much my thoughts on the subject. At one point I made a crack that was off topic and out of line. I think I humbly watched the rest of the time rubbing my slighty red face. If the style of the AAR players grates, leaving the missives unopened is always an option... right!

Personally I appreciated the AAR as handling a key subject for Ost front Grogs...' Now that we've gotten ourselves out here on the steppes, what the hell do we do in '42'?

(in reply to SGHunt)
Post #: 21
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 10:11:09 AM   
Naughteous Maximus


Posts: 301
Joined: 3/9/2010
From: Los Angeles, California
Status: offline 		One must wonder, "What would the Fuhrer do" in this situation?

(in reply to wurger54)
Post #: 22
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 4:17:45 PM   
Hard Sarge


Posts: 22741
Joined: 10/1/2000
From: garfield hts ohio usa
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: knilli


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

and here is the end






I love it!



just in case, this screen has already changed, so...



_____________________________


(in reply to knilli)
Post #: 23
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 8:33:09 PM   
daft

 

Posts: 406
Joined: 5/18/2002
Status: offline 		Why not make AAR's such as Pyledriver's read only?

_____________________________


(in reply to Hard Sarge)
Post #: 24
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 8:45:51 PM   
Banzan

 

Posts: 288
Joined: 3/13/2010
From: Bremen, Germany
Status: offline 		I think its not fair to "have a go" on PyleDriver. He spend a lot of time for the AAR, and even when i agree to some extend that is "writing style" is different, he made a lot of people having fun following his AAR.

Keep in mind, not everybody is some kind of author and can write perfect stories and comments.
Different minds have different ways to express their ideas :)

(in reply to daft)
Post #: 25
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 9:42:47 PM   
ajds

 

Posts: 44
Joined: 11/1/2006
From: Apple Valley, California USA
Status: offline 		If you don't like the man's style, then don't read his work.  That was a lot of work to post, and he is entitled to his own opinion of himself.  Consider it an opinion piece, but please don't complain or whine about someone else's effort.

(in reply to Banzan)
Post #: 26
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 10:02:51 PM   
Neal_MLC

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 2/2/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ajds

If you don't like the man's style, then don't read his work.  That was a lot of work to post, and he is entitled to his own opinion of himself.  Consider it an opinion piece, but please don't complain or whine about someone else's effort.



I agree completely, You don't read books by authors you don't like, don't read AARS if you don't like the poster's style. AND!!! don't subject us to your complaining either.

(in reply to ajds)
Post #: 27
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 10:20:23 PM   
MarcA


Posts: 1181
Joined: 3/2/2005
From: England
Status: offline 		PyleDriver is doing us all a favour, have you ever heard the phrase "Don't look a gift horse in the mouth".

If you had constructed your request in a more positive way, maybe by asking PyleDriver if he could allow some modification to his AAR style to aid understanding, your point may have come across better

(in reply to Neal_MLC)
Post #: 28
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/12/2010 11:24:02 PM   
wodin


Posts: 10762
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: England
Status: offline 		Blimey....PD has admitted he is a hothead on a few occasions...so be it...I just read the AAR I've never commented on one before anyway....Its upto other testers to make an AAR and not many have come forward...at least we have one tester to read and enjoy.

_____________________________

My website


https://www.awargamersneedfulthings.co.uk/

(in reply to MarcA)
Post #: 29
RE: Regarding the next official AAR - 7/13/2010 12:13:38 AM   
PyleDriver


Posts: 6152
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Occupied Mexico aka Rio Grand Valley, S.Texas
Status: offline 		My best regards to those who liked it. I stated early in my AAR that comments out of the flow (topics) of the game were like commericals in a good movie. I don't know about you but I hate them (commericals). I tried to keep it so a viewer could go back to the previous turn without having to go thru 20 other posts to find it. That was my logic...

_____________________________

Jon Pyle
AWD Beta tester
WBTS Alpha tester
WitE Alpha tester
WitW Alpha tester
WitE2 Alpha tester

(in reply to wodin)
Post #: 30
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