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Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 8:40:34 AM

Arnhem44

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From: Singapore
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Hi all,

Okay, here's my problem, I've gone through the threads regarding ship withdrawal and have done all I think I need to do but am still unable to send Her Majesty's tugboat on her merry way. Please feel free to hit me over the head with the proverbial frying pan if I'm doing it wrong.

I've got a Brit CV disbanded in Colombo due to withdraw in about 2 weeks, trouble is it's laid up with 52 float and 42 eng damage, both major. I read in one of the threads that as long as the combined damage is below 100 I can withdraw the ship but as it turns out I can't. Now I know I can withdraw from Colombo as I have the option of withdrawing a disbanded CL from there as well. Any idea what condition I haven't fulfilled? Do I have to really haul her off map to get her withdrawn? I'm getting conflicting data from the past threads which is adding to my general sense of confusion.

Post #: 1

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 9:22:17 AM

JeffroK

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Is your CV in the shipyard??

I think it has to be "available" to be able to be selected.

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Post #: 2

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 9:31:26 AM

Misconduct

Posts: 1864
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From: Cape Canaveral, Florida
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I haven't been able to withdrawal from colombo, but Karachi and Cape town.

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Post #: 3

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 10:39:43 AM

Sardaukar

Posts: 9847
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From: Finland/Israel
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Bombay or Karachi are bases where withdrawals are possible in India. Or off-map bases.

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Post #: 4

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 10:46:08 AM

moonraker65

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From: Swindon,Wilts. UK
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With that much damage though you may want to wait until at least the Flt is down a bit before moving to Bombay or Karachi.

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Post #: 5

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 10:56:24 AM

JeffroK

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I thought you could use Colombo, I've never used Karachi or Bombay in AE???

I could also be wrong, only happens regularly.

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Post #: 6

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 10:56:24 AM

Sardaukar

Posts: 9847
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From: Finland/Israel
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Well..if she sinks, no need to pay PP anymore...

52 float should be OK if there is not much Sys damage (which includes pumps etc.) High Sys/High Flooding = disaster usually.

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"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von B�lov, 1870-

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Post #: 7

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 12:49:58 PM

John Lansford

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Send her to Bombay or Karachi; can't disband at Columbo. Heaven knows I've tried often enough to know this by now.

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Post #: 8

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 1:06:55 PM

JeffroK

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You must have your legs crossed the wrong way, in AE I have always disbanded in Colombo and just checked and I am (pretty sure) I'm right.

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Post #: 9

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 1:33:24 PM

Don Bowen

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From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
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A ship can not be withdrawn if total damage is over 99 OR any individual damage is over 50.

Colombo is a valid withdrawal port.

(in reply to JeffroK)

Post #: 10

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 1:37:18 PM

Don D

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quote:

trouble is it's laid up with 52 float and 42 eng damage, both major. I read in one of the threads that as long as the combined damage is below 100

I believe the rule is combined below 100 and all individual components below 50.

Ah, I'm too slow.

< Message edited by Don D -- 7/15/2010 1:38:07 PM >

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Post #: 11

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 1:46:05 PM

Arnhem44

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Hi all,

Thanks for the responses and thanks Don for the clarification on the damage levels.

< Message edited by Arnhem -- 7/15/2010 1:48:59 PM >

(in reply to JeffroK)

Post #: 12

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 3:03:36 PM

Rainer

Posts: 1210
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From: Neuching, Bavaria, Germany
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quote:

Send her to Bombay or Karachi; can't disband at Columbo. Heaven knows I've tried often enough to know this by now.

quote:

Bombay or Karachi are bases where withdrawals are possible in India. Or off-map bases.

quote:

I haven't been able to withdrawal from colombo, but Karachi and Cape town.

Don Bowen:

quote:

Colombo is a valid withdrawal port.

Hm, I find it strange to see three members of "Matrix Legion of Merit" giving false advice.
Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate all messages, but I also expect the more experienced players to consider that many a newbee is looking for advice in this place.

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Scen #1 Allied vs AI Level Hard Daily Turns
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Post #: 13

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 3:30:51 PM

Sredni

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ????

You can withdraw ships from some of the national home bases and any offmap port. You can withdraw a ship 30 days prior to the withdrawal date. and later. If you do not withdraw by the withdrawal date, the daily political point penalties start.

On map withdrawal locations are:
San Francisco
Vancouver
Karachi
Sydney
Wellington

Any ship of any allied nationality may withdraw from any of these ports. A ship may be withdrawn in a damaged state. Repairs will be completed offmap and the repair time will delay the return of the ship. That is, a ship that is due to return in 10 months but with damage that would take 2 months to repair will return fully repaired in 12 months.

When a ship scheduled for withdrawal is in a valid withdrawal port and is within 30 days of withdrawal (or later), a button will appear to accomplish withdrawal.

This is the info I have on withdrawals and valid withdrawal locations, I can't recall who or where I got it from. I'm pretty sure I havn't been able to withdraw ships at colombo or at bombay. I havn't tried to do so for ages though so I'm not 100% sure on that. My last british CV is withdrawing in another month and it's still staged in colombo. I'll give it a try there next time I play.

(in reply to Arnhem44)

Post #: 14

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 3:51:11 PM

Rainer

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That's the point I was trying to make.
We probably should have a system of "Authorized Statements"

Which we have: just look for posts from Don Bowen et al.
Then again - feedback and shared experience from the community is invaluable (even devs haven't seen EVERYTHING within this vast chunk of software).
Just let's make sure we all have a chance to know what is a piece of advice and what is a (well meant) guess.

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WitP/AE
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Data base changes by Andy Mac October 16, 2012
Scen #1 Allied vs AI Level Hard Daily Turns
Art Mods by TomLabel and Reg
Topo Map by chemkid

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(in reply to Sredni)

Post #: 15

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 5:10:17 PM

Sardaukar

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Colombo has not worked for me as withdrawal port, in any scenarios I have played. So respectfully, I don't think it's set as withdrawal port at least in scen 1 and derivatives.�I always have to send ships to either Bombay or Karachi.

< Message edited by Sardaukar -- 7/15/2010 5:11:31 PM >

_____________________________

"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von B�lov, 1870-

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Post #: 16

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 5:31:44 PM

Rainer

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I do not doubt your observation at all.
My experience is different (scen 1, Allied against Japanese AI, latest beta patch).
I could sucessfully withdraw all British ships from Colombo as required (Current Game date July 22, 1942).
Therefor I believe your case should be investigated, meaning next time a withdrawal of a British ship is due I recommend to try, and in case it fails to post a save with the appropriate "noise", so the devs have a chance to look at.

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WitP/AE
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Data base changes by Andy Mac October 16, 2012
Scen #1 Allied vs AI Level Hard Daily Turns
Art Mods by TomLabel and Reg
Topo Map by chemkid

WitW / Torch
1.01.37 - 1.01.44 beta

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Post #: 17

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 5:40:54 PM

Nomad

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I have not been able to withdraw from Bombay after building it to level 9, but Karachi does work.

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Post #: 18

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 5:43:07 PM

ckammp

Posts: 756
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From: Rear Area training facility
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Ship Withdraw

A ship may withdraw from any off-map port or from any TF that is off-map.

On-map withdraw is allowed as follows:
- Any level 9 port.
- National home ports of United States/Canada/India/Australia/New Zealand, regardless of the port size.
- Any level 7 or larger port on the US or Canadian West Coast.
- Any level 7 or larger Indian port E of Ceylon (including Ceylon).
- Any level 7 or larger port in SE Australia, plus Perth.
- Any level 7 or larger port in New Zealand.
- No ship can be withdrawn from an on-map port where the enemy has air superiority.
- For on-map withdraw, a ship's total damage may not exceed 99 and no individual damage type (system, floatation, engine) may exceed 50.

(in reply to Rainer)

Post #: 19

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/15/2010 7:48:58 PM

morganbj

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Wouldn't it be great if the post from ckammp was a mouseover pop-up on the ship withdrawal screen somewhere? One that could be easily changed (e.g., in a simple txt file) when the underlying code was modified.

... and then thousand other little nifty details, too.

sigh

(in reply to ckammp)

Post #: 20

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/16/2010 8:03:15 AM

JeffroK

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rainer

quote:

Send her to Bombay or Karachi; can't disband at Columbo. Heaven knows I've tried often enough to know this by now.

quote:

Bombay or Karachi are bases where withdrawals are possible in India. Or off-map bases.

quote:

I haven't been able to withdrawal from colombo, but Karachi and Cape town.

Don Bowen:

quote:

Colombo is a valid withdrawal port.

Hm, I find it strange to see three members of "Matrix Legion of Merit" giving false advice.
Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate all messages, but I also expect the more experienced players to consider that many a newbee is looking for advice in this place.

Rainer,

The ranks allocated by Matrix are based on volume, not quality, just look at my exalted ranking (IRL, L/Cpl, T/A/UP)

But there are so many "truths" to AE its best to try it out for yourself.

< Message edited by JeffK -- 7/16/2010 8:05:45 AM >

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Post #: 21

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/16/2010 9:10:35 AM

Sardaukar

Posts: 9847
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From: Finland/Israel
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It's not that we are lying, you know.

It's just that it seems to work differently depending on under which version the game is started or which scenario is in question. So what doesn't work for me might work for you. For me, Colombo or Perth do not work currently, all being 7 or bigger ports in 2 different games. And I am experiences enough in game to know about those other requirements.

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"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von B�lov, 1870-

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Post #: 22

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/16/2010 1:47:33 PM

Rainer

Posts: 1210
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I'm with you.

What I am trying to say is that the difference between "facts", "assumptions", "opinions" and "guesses" should be observed, to avoid confusing people looking for advice and help.
Then again, I'm the first one to agree that AE is very hard to handle when it comes to testing. So many variables, so many rules (a lot not documented for a variety of reasons).
What it all comes down to is probably some matter of style.
Writing "CAP is BROKEN! Fix it!" is not what devs need, and does not help people looking for advice (I think we all can agree to this).

What I suggest is - at least in the Technical Forum (which is sort of mail box for the devs) to make sure a post about something "weird" has
1. all technical info (version, setup etc),
2. concise and precise description of case in question - possibly with an attached screenshot
3. most often an attached save (or better yet, save before and after event).
And finally - if needed - a sort of explonation why the poster thinks the case stated is "out of order".

With that level of info we all can make life for devs so much easier. Giving us players in return a chance to see an improved version sooner or later.

PS: JeffK, Sardaukar - my statement above has no relation to your valuable and appreciated posts. It is intended to be a sort of "call to the community".

_____________________________

WitP/AE
1.7.11.26b
Data base changes by Andy Mac October 16, 2012
Scen #1 Allied vs AI Level Hard Daily Turns
Art Mods by TomLabel and Reg
Topo Map by chemkid

WitW / Torch
1.01.37 - 1.01.44 beta

(in reply to JeffroK)

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RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/16/2010 11:16:04 PM

Sredni

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I just tested withdrawing a carrier at Colombo and was able to do so. Level 9 port. The carrier wouldn't withdraw at Bombay with a level 7 port. Carrier withdrew like normal at Karachi.

This is with version 1.0.3.1102a in scenario 1 (havn't installed the latest beta patch yet).

I'm almost positive I had tried withdrawing ships in the past at Colombo and couldn't do so. I think that's what got me hunting withdrawal info in the first place which lead me to find out about the ability to withdraw at homeports. I just can't recall 100% for sure.

(in reply to Rainer)

Post #: 24

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/17/2010 12:39:32 AM

Don Bowen

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From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sredni

I just tested withdrawing a carrier at Colombo and was able to do so. Level 9 port. The carrier wouldn't withdraw at Bombay with a level 7 port. Carrier withdrew like normal at Karachi.

This is with version 1.0.3.1102a in scenario 1 (havn't installed the latest beta patch yet).

I'm almost positive I had tried withdrawing ships in the past at Colombo and couldn't do so. I think that's what got me hunting withdrawal info in the first place which lead me to find out about the ability to withdraw at homeports. I just can't recall 100% for sure.

There is a port size requirement for on-map ports (except for national home ports). It was intended that Bombay be a valid withdrawal port but a minor mixup prevented it (corrected in latest Patch - 4 beta I believe). There are very few "literals" in AE code - no list of ports or any such thing. The Western Indian ports are denoted by map region but the definition was to strict and Bombay was a little too far west. As I said, fixed now.

But remember all, port size matters and a port that can not withdraw a ship when the port is smaller can do it when the port gets built up.

All of this is over my objections, by the way. The original release required the player to move the ship off map. That way there is no issue with use of withdrawal to save a damaged ship or to magically move it out of harm's way. T'were it up to me, that's the way it would still be.

(in reply to Sredni)

Post #: 25

RE: Allied Ship withdrawal - 7/17/2010 3:50:45 PM

PaxMondo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

... The original release required the player to move the ship off map. That way there is no issue with use of withdrawal to save a damaged ship or to magically move it out of harm's way. T'were it up to me, that's the way it would still be.
....

I'd support that (off-map withdrawal only).... no reason for it not to be, except as a sop to poor planning!

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Pax

(in reply to Don Bowen)

Post #: 26