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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball)

 
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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/23/2010 8:51:25 PM   
crsutton


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smeulders


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton
Perhaps a good use for Allied AMCs is to patrol and intercept this sort of stuff as they generally have pretty good armament. Don't know if it works for Japanese AMC as it looks as if they have smaller guns.                                       


Just intercepted a Japanese AMC by a Dutch DD and 2 Clemson DD, it didn't take long for the AMC to go down. They look very fragile against destroyers as their low speed and manoeuvre make them easy targets for torpedoes. I'd guess that Allied AMC may be similarly vulnerable.




Some of the Allied AMC are bigger and carry six inch guns. Durability in the 25 to 30 range. I think they would be a match for one or two DDs but that is about all. Of course Mr. long lance would be a problem. I really can't find much else for my AMCs to do anyways except excort convoys. Japanese subs seem to love sinking them. A couple of the British ship are listed as Q ships. I tried using one as a trap and had it cruising around Columbo. First Jap sub it ran accross blew it out of the water....Well, they worked in WPO.

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 2:30:26 PM   
Canoerebel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58
I'm about where you are in my new game. I also got those guys to Ceylon, then sent them directly to Port Blair. I'm not going to have the 18-months seige there I had in the first game, and PB is invaluable in 1943.


No way I can try a "Fortress Port Blair" tactic against Q-Ball. He's just turn it into a massacre of Allied troops. My best shot is to make sure it isn't an easy pick-up for him - that he has to commit some time and resources. By landing most of an Indian brigade (80 AV) a few weeks ago, I hope I've accomplished that.

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Post #: 92
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 2:39:52 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		1/3/42
 
Flee for Your Lives!  The Allied CLs that scattered at Carnarvon mostly made good their flight; only CL Java took some damage from bomb-toting IJN strike aircraft.  I'm a little surprised that Brad has sent the Mini-KB this far south this early.  In the first place, I think he's low on mission sorties and torps.  In the second, he sighted my carriers at Sydeny a week or ten days back.  Perhaps he also sighted them later as they made their way east past New Zealand?

Air Stingers:  The USAAF B-17s made their first appearance since very early in the game.  Flying from Soerabaja, they roughed up the airfield at Balikpan, destroying a handful of aircraft on the ground.  Now I've moved them to Batavia.

Naval Stingers:  The 4-DD TF that recently approached Truk, then withdrew to Wake, then moved north of Midway...is set to rendezvous with an AO well to the east of Honshu.  If this DD force doesn't stumble into some carriers or other bad news, it will refuel and then visit Tokyo Bay.

Japanese Expansion:  Q-Ball is landing 144th Regiment at Port Moresby.  The AV of the garrison is nearly that of the aggressors, so I don't know if he's brought enough.  On the other hand, most of my guys have pretty low experience and supply is low too.

Allied Reinforcements:  This is a critical, but "behind the scenes," part of the game.  The Allies are currently landing a Marine regiment and defense batallion at Pago Pago (I-2 took some depth charging there from one of the old Stinger TFs); part of 41st Division is aboard AP Queen Elizabeth currently east of Hawaii and headng for Sydney.  Two Brit brigades are on transports heading for Ceylon.  An army battalion is about to depart Seattle for the Aleutians.  And a Marine parachutte batallion recently landed at Midway.

Jap Subs:  I-15 lurking off the southwest cape of Oz sank two xAKL.

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Post #: 93
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 4:23:53 PM   
desicat

 

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Status: offline 		What is happening at Wake Island? Can it continue to hold? Any traps set there?

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Post #: 94
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 6:05:11 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		Other than supplies, I'm not sending anything else to Wake.  Why not, you ask?  It's one of those judgment calls that could be argued either way.  My feeling is that Q-Ball was thoroughly frustrated with how his Wake landings went.  When he returns, he won't be leaving things to chance.  Perhaps I could beef up the garrison and cause him further angst, but I suspect that I would just be reinforcing defeat.  He won't be messing around next time.

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Post #: 95
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 6:26:32 PM   
crsutton


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Status: offline 		Yep, playing scen #2 Pago Pago was my "line in the sand". I did not think I could hold Noumea or anything north of it if he wanted them. Turns out he did not venture that way but Pago Pago was a pin pin cusion if he did. Against a competent player like QBall you have to "Rope a Dope" him, and look to hit him when he is not looking.

Hey I like the sound of that. I no longer play the Sir Robin defense but call my version the "Rope a Dope".






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Post #: 96
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 7:32:59 PM   
koontz

 

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Status: offline 		Sounds wise! Even it would possible to fly in reinfocerments?
But likely the REG from Guam will join the party!

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Post #: 97
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 7:42:45 PM   
HMS Resolution


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel
...it will refuel and then visit Tokyo Bay.


Sweet fancy Moses!

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Post #: 98
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 8:02:09 PM   
ny59giants


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Status: offline 		Wake Island suggestion - If you have any spare DD's , form a SC TF of 2 to 4. Then, use your CM and other Minelayers from Pearl to follow them in with orders to follow at 2 to 3 hexes. Come in from North to NE direction. Give him something else to worry about. 

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Post #: 99
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 8:08:30 PM   
Bullwinkle58


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel


Naval Stingers:  If this DD force doesn't stumble into some carriers or other bad news, it will refuel and then visit Tokyo Bay.



But, but . . .

That's AHISTORICAL!!!! That's SUICIDAL!!!

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Post #: 100
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 10:16:05 PM   
vettim89


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel


Naval Stingers:  If this DD force doesn't stumble into some carriers or other bad news, it will refuel and then visit Tokyo Bay.



But, but . . .

That's AHISTORICAL!!!! That's SUICIDAL!!!



No, that's Dan. I look at it this way: yes, it is not exactly reality based, but ...... a lot of the actions by Japanese players are just as ahistorically aggressive. So if this move foces Q-Ball to guard his rear areas a little better than mission accomplished. The new NavSearch rules truly take away the NavSat view of the game that WiTP gave us. You actually have to look for stuff now. Paranoia is your friend

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Post #: 101
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/24/2010 11:57:09 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		Tim, that's what Bullwinkle meant (he was being devilishly wry).

:)

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Post #: 102
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/25/2010 12:02:54 AM   
BrucePowers


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Status: offline 		If you enter Tokyo Bay do the CD guns get to fire at you?

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Post #: 103
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/25/2010 12:07:59 AM   
Bullwinkle58


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BrucePowers

If you enter Tokyo Bay do the CD guns get to fire at you?


CR may be the first player in history to find out. I'm betting no, unless there are invasion orders somewhere, or the force is high enough in prior DL to make it mandatory.

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/25/2010 12:28:52 AM   
HMS Resolution


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Status: offline 		You really should call it Operation COMMODORE, in honor of Matthew Perry.

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/25/2010 1:48:10 AM   
Cribtop


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Status: offline 		I assumed that Canoe meant they would loiter just outside of the Yokohama base hex - if they're really going to enter Tokyo Bay it's a one way mission due to CD guns and LOTS of mines (300+ in each of two hexes). Not to mention the Home Island planes that will suddenly stop training and start bombing on turn two of the op. Still, it's damn cool either way.

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/25/2010 4:04:47 AM   
JeffroK


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Status: offline 		Naval Stingers:  The 4-DD TF that recently approached Truk, then withdrew to Wake, then moved north of Midway...is set to rendezvous with an AO well to the east of Honshu.  If this DD force doesn't stumble into some carriers or other bad news, it will refuel and then visit Tokyo Bay.

Anything the Air Force can do, the Navy can do better!!


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Post #: 107
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/26/2010 1:48:07 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		1/4/44 and 1/5/44
 
Stingers:  The small Allied DD TF refueld and is steaming southwest on a course that will allow it to visit Japan's east coast.  (I'm not actually sure which port will be the target, yet,  but I'll avoid mines if possible).

Japanese Advances:  Landings at Sorong and Jesselton.  Also, paratroops took the Sumatran base west of Medan.  I think this is to prevent the Allies from evacuating troops via that road to Sabang (and thence to Port Blair).  Neat move by Q-Ball, but I don't think it will have much impact.  Most of the troops I was evacuating have already departed Sabang (both by air transport to Port Blair and by several small xAP/xAKL TFs that have come and gone over the past week).

Malaya:  Man, I've messed up the retreat to "Fortress Singapore."  I've had lots of troops get cut off and isolated up the peninsula.  All of these guys had a head start and things were going well at first, but the Japanese troops moved more quickly.

Philippines:  The second Japanese deliberate attack at Clark Field came off at 1:1, didn't touch the one fort, and cost the Japanese far more casualties.  Three divisions including 4th are involved in this attack.

China:  Given enough time to prepare good forts, the Allies can take a stand at Nanning, Chengyang, and Loyang.  But once any of those three fall you have to be careful or the enemy can cut off your retreat route and anhiliate your army.  So, after Chengyang fell, I ordered an evacuation of Loyang.  The troops got away clean and will make a stand in the forested hexes to the southwest.  The Chinese are still standing at Nanyang, but I'll have to retreat fairly soon. 

Mini-KB:  I lost track of some of the DD and CL after I split them up at Carnorvan to send them fleeing to safety.  CL Tromp reached Port Headland, but I didn't realize it.  So several turns later Japanese naval strike aircraft finished her off.

SigInt:  Recevied a report that 53rd Division is prepping for Diamond Harbor.  I need to check if that's an unrestricted unit or one of those in Manchuria so that I can better evaluate the legitimacy of the threat.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 7/26/2010 1:49:49 PM >

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Post #: 108
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/26/2010 3:33:41 PM   
Galahad78

 

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Status: offline 		Subscribed!! Cannot wait to see what happens to those little brave ships! 

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/26/2010 11:18:02 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

1/4/44 and 1/5/44
 
Stingers:  The small Allied DD TF refueld and is steaming southwest on a course that will allow it to visit Japan's east coast.  (I'm not actually sure which port will be the target, yet,  but I'll avoid mines if possible).

Japanese Advances:  Landings at Sorong and Jesselton.  Also, paratroops took the Sumatran base west of Medan.  I think this is to prevent the Allies from evacuating troops via that road to Sabang (and thence to Port Blair).  Neat move by Q-Ball, but I don't think it will have much impact.  Most of the troops I was evacuating have already departed Sabang (both by air transport to Port Blair and by several small xAP/xAKL TFs that have come and gone over the past week).

Malaya:  Man, I've messed up the retreat to "Fortress Singapore."  I've had lots of troops get cut off and isolated up the peninsula.  All of these guys had a head start and things were going well at first, but the Japanese troops moved more quickly.

Philippines:  The second Japanese deliberate attack at Clark Field came off at 1:1, didn't touch the one fort, and cost the Japanese far more casualties.  Three divisions including 4th are involved in this attack.

China:  Given enough time to prepare good forts, the Allies can take a stand at Nanning, Chengyang, and Loyang.  But once any of those three fall you have to be careful or the enemy can cut off your retreat route and anhiliate your army.  So, after Chengyang fell, I ordered an evacuation of Loyang.  The troops got away clean and will make a stand in the forested hexes to the southwest.  The Chinese are still standing at Nanyang, but I'll have to retreat fairly soon. 

Mini-KB:  I lost track of some of the DD and CL after I split them up at Carnorvan to send them fleeing to safety.  CL Tromp reached Port Headland, but I didn't realize it.  So several turns later Japanese naval strike aircraft finished her off.

SigInt:  Recevied a report that 53rd Division is prepping for Diamond Harbor.  I need to check if that's an unrestricted unit or one of those in Manchuria so that I can better evaluate the legitimacy of the threat.

Canoerebel,

If it's not too late, I wanted to suggest another 'port of call' for your destroyers on the Japanese mainland. Would it be feasible for you to run them into Nagasaki, Shimonoseki, Shanghai or Port Arthur? These are more likely IMO of having ships in TFs either loading or unloading. In my games, Tokyo harbor is only fleetingly used compared to these others. I'd even recommend Ominato over Tokyo for liklihood of interdicting TFs at sea (and you're less likely to get shot to pieces by naval guns).

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 1:28:12 AM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		1/6/42 to 1/9/42
 
Blaze of Glory:  In conjunction with Japan's successful invasion of Port Moresby, the KB took station NE of Townsville.  Each day the carriers crept a little closer to Oz, so I decided to sortie CA Canberra to try for an intercept.  It wasn't meant to be a suicide mission as I ordered Canberra to retire to Cairns and enter the port there (forgetting, I think, that the port is too small at this point).  Anyhow, Canberra made contact and fought it ought with a 4-CV TF.  She managed to fire on CV Zuikaku and scored three hits against CV Akagi.  Then Canberra retired to Cairns where she sank under a barrage of 19 bombs carried by Vals.  Q-Ball made a wisecrack about the affair, but that's the third time in the game that Allied combat ships have managed to fire on the KB.  From now on, the Australian forces in this game will proudly proclaim, "Remember the Canberra!"

Stingers (and reply to Chickenboy):  The four DD TF is making it's final run towards the east coast of Honshu.  The target is the "sound" off the port of Kobe.  If that doesn't achieve results, I may withdraw or I might try another target (like Nagasaki).  Chickenboy, Allied DD TFs have already made successful raids against Toyohara and Shikuka a few weeks ago.  While I want this raid to succeed without loss, the primary objective is to impress on Q-Ball vulnerability along sections of his perimeter he ordinarily wouldn't protect.  P.S.  SS Thresher just sank a small TK near Shikuka.

More Surface Combat:  CL DeRuyter and some DDs clashed with a small IJN DD force at Horn Island, Australia.  One of the IJN DDs took fairly heavy damage.

Japanese Advances: Makassar, Port Moresby, Malacca and Sorong fall.  The Japanese are landing in strength at the base east of Batavia.  Wake Island's defenders repulse two more attack.

Allied Reinforcements:  Queen Elizabeth with most of an USA Infantry regiment will reach Sydney or Melbourne in three or four days.  Time to worry about subs.

Allied Carriers:  Saratoga is at Balboa; Yorktown is leaving San Diego for Balboa; Lex and Ent are south of Tahiti making for Balboa.  From there I may send the carriers to Capetown and thence Mombassa.  I have a hunch Q-Ball will make some moves in the Indian Ocean or Bay of Bengal.  I don't want to go up against the KB under any circumstances, so my current plan is to keep my carriers hidden - force in being - or to employ them against a Mini-KB or relatively lightly protected invasion force.

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 1:33:59 AM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Here's the current Stinger operation:




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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 2:13:24 AM   
Capt. Harlock


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quote:

Anyhow, Canberra made contact and fought it ought with a 4-CV TF.  She managed to fire on CV Zuikaku and scored three hits against CV Akagi.  Then Canberra retired to Cairns where she sank under a barrage of 19 bombs carried by Vals.


It sounds like you're getting a bit low on cruisers. A good thing the Allies, unlike the IJN, receive plenty of cruiser reinforcements.

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 2:28:40 AM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		I'll have to double-check, but the Allies are fine on cruisers at the moment, having only lost the one CA and a few CLs (Tromp and Perth come to mind).  It's BBs that I'm short of at the moment.

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Post #: 114
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 2:46:28 AM   
desicat

 

Posts: 542
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Status: offline 		Wake still holds. Can the Japanese take it without reinforcing? If the KB is elsewhere any hope for help getting through? This really has to be bothering him and unplanned for, may cause him to make a mistake?

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Post #: 115
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 3:43:22 AM   
witpqs


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Each day the carriers crept a little closer to Oz, so I decided to sortie CA Canberra to try for an intercept.  It wasn't meant to be a suicide mission as I ordered Canberra to retire to Cairns and enter the port there (forgetting, I think, that the port is too small at this point).


In AE ships can disband in any size port.

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Post #: 116
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 3:58:40 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		1/10/42
 
Stinger, Japan:  My DD force was sighted by an Alf patrol.  A handful of Kates sortied from a Honshu airfield but missed their target.  This means I need to scrub the mission, but the primary objective was served - to alert Brad to the possibility of threats to his northern perimeter.  The DDs are going to switch course and circumnavigate the volcano islands.  This will take them further into enemy-controlled waters, but they should remain distant from airbases.  Of course, a carrier would do them in, but I have a hunch that this will work.

Stinger, Tarawa:  Three DDs are moving north from Pago Pago to scout around Tarawa.  They will then retire to Pearl Harbor.

Oz:  Lots of Japanese activity here.  A port attack at Cairns by KB-strike aircraft sank five coastal ships.  Betties from Timor claimed an xAP at Darwin.  And the Japanese are landing at Horn Island.  CL DeRuyter will lead a small TF to Horn Island (arriving tonight).  Queen Elizabeth has been diverted to Newcastle in hopes that the sub threat might be lower there.  She should arrive in about two days.

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Post #: 117
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 9:08:29 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		1/11/42
 
Stinger, North:  The Allied DD TF is west of Iwo Jima and was again sighted by enemy patrols.  I have two objectives here:  (1) to steer my guys back to safety if possible, and (2) hopefully to make Brad have to think about every TF in the area.  Brad won't ever panic nor will he rattle, but neither does he want to needlessly lose ships.  (SS Sargo got an xAKL not too far away, which should help appearances of danger).

Oz:  The Japanese take Horn Island shortly after a little naval battle between CL DeRuyter and escorts vs. CAs Furtaka and Kako and two DDs.  Each side had one DD take damage.  It appears that the KB is retiring back toward Milne Bay and thence to Rabaul.  Good riddance.  Now I have to deal with IJ airbases at Horn and Port Moresby.  Plus, IJ LBA from Timor sank a few more small Dutch xAP at Darwin.  Not sure yet how I'm going to get DeRuyter and friends around the bottlenecks at either end of the Torres Strait.

Philippines:  The third IJA deliberate attack at Clark Field comes off at 1:2, but drops forts to zero and inflicts equal damage.  This base can't hold out much longer.

Singapore:  The Allies retreat into Singapore continues.  It looks like the Allies will end up with about 600 AV after all the trouble with troops getting caught, roughed up, and then retreating down the LOR (least optimum route).

All Eyes on Newcastle!  Queen Elizabeth will arrive at Newcastle, Australia, tonight barring a sub encounter.  What a game!  So much going on, yet to me the biggest even next turn is whether a single AP makes port safely.  If she does, the Allies have most of a US Army RCT ashore.  That will yield some piece of mind...


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Post #: 118
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 9:17:24 PM   
anarchyintheuk

 

Posts: 3921
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Status: offline 		Newcastle have a big enough port? Can't remember atm.

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Post #: 119
RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 7/27/2010 9:21:05 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Newcastle is a size four.  That's big enough to land most (or all?) of the troops aboard.  In my previous game I used QE to land troops at Noumea when it was a size two.  She couldn't get all the equipment ashore, but most of the men landed safely.

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