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WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 8/31/2010 3:33:51 PM   
dfinan

 

Posts: 51
Joined: 8/31/2010
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Anyone know a good current computer game for surface Naval ship combat in WWI to WWII. There was an old computer game called Great Naval Battles from SSI. I would love to see that redone and updated, or maybe take an old Board game like Task Forces Battlewagons and convert it into a computer game.
Post #: 1
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 8/31/2010 3:42:40 PM   
NefariousKoel


Posts: 2930
Joined: 7/23/2002
From: Murderous Missouri Scum
Status: offline 		HPS has it's "Naval Campaigns" series. I've not played them.

http://www.hpssims.com/

NWS has it's own systems you may check out. They have demos, too.

http://yhst-12000246778232.stores.yahoo.net/nawasi.html



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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 8/31/2010 3:57:13 PM   
Nebogipfel


Posts: 98
Joined: 3/16/2010
Status: offline 		Hi dfinan,

try this one: WARSHIP COMBAT : NAVIES AT WAR from NWS

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Post #: 3
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 8/31/2010 5:01:01 PM   
Hertston


Posts: 3564
Joined: 8/17/2002
From: Cornwall, UK
Status: offline 		Storm Eagle's Jutland, if you can live with the DRM; research that before buying. There is a demo to try.

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Post #: 4
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/1/2010 1:34:56 AM   
jomni


Posts: 2827
Joined: 11/19/2007
Status: offline 		I think Warship Combat fits the bill

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/1/2010 3:46:12 AM   
Phatguy

 

Posts: 1348
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From: Buffalo,ny
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NefariousKoel

HPS has it's "Naval Campaigns" series. I've not played them.

http://www.hpssims.com/

NWS has it's own systems you may check out. They have demos, too.

http://yhst-12000246778232.stores.yahoo.net/nawasi.html




I see no demos

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Post #: 6
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/1/2010 5:04:27 AM   
Fallschirmjager


Posts: 6793
Joined: 3/18/2002
From: Chattanooga, Tennessee
Status: offline 		WW I naval combat really needs a champion right now. It is a unexploited gold mine. The HPS games are terribly simple and not very good.
Jutland is ok but is fatally flawed by giving you too much to command at one time which makes the game completely unwieldy. Add to that a terrible control system and you have a game with promised but it's core gameplay is so flawed as to make it unplayable.

What the industry really needs is a WW 1 game using the WITP engine set in the North Sea and Med. The era of dreadnoughts and battle cruisers and armored cruisers is almost completely untapped.
I would pay $70 with almost no questions asked.

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/1/2010 6:09:46 AM   
jomni


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager
What the industry really needs is a WW 1 game using the WITP engine set in the North Sea and Med.


Too bad War Plan Orange is set in the Pacific.
Was Naval Combat in WWI significant enough to win the war?

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/1/2010 6:18:53 AM   
Fallschirmjager


Posts: 6793
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From: Chattanooga, Tennessee
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jomni

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager
What the industry really needs is a WW 1 game using the WITP engine set in the North Sea and Med.


Too bad War Plan Orange is set in the Pacific.
Was Naval Combat in WWI significant enough to win the war?


WPO is fantastic but was always a game that was secondary and once AE was announced was doomed.
Matrix needs to develop a AAA WW1 naval title and promote it as one of their showcase games. I think the game would be both a commercial and critical success.

As to your question. It was said of Jellicoe that he was the only man on either side who could have lost the war in an afternoon.


You can also look at the sheer massive amount of material, money, time and effort placed into programs between 1880-1914 under England, Germany, France, Italy, Austria, Russia and the United States and even nations like Greece, Turkey and Brazil.
There were naval races happening all over the world and massive progressions in technology and massive build ups in navies in terms of numbers of ships.

< Message edited by Fallschirmjager -- 9/1/2010 6:33:42 AM >

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/1/2010 9:59:56 AM   
Lützow


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

You can also look at the sheer massive amount of material, money, time and effort placed into programs between 1880-1914 under England, Germany, France, Italy, Austria, Russia and the United States and even nations like Greece, Turkey and Brazil.
There were naval races happening all over the world and massive progressions in technology and massive build ups in navies in terms of numbers of ships.


Nobody could have stand against the UK royal navy. World wars in Europe were all about land warfare and that's why we won't see anything on a strategic/operational level, but featuring single battles like Jutland. A WW1 naval game with chances to win for both sides, which is crucial for multiplayer, would be pure fantasy and hence not fun.


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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/1/2010 5:19:18 PM   
NefariousKoel


Posts: 2930
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From: Murderous Missouri Scum
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: apathetic lurker

..


Sorry.. that's just the order page. There is a link on NWS' Yahoo store that will take you to their site with more detailed info and links such as the demo. There should be a link at the bottom of each of those title's pages on the one I listed. Just click on them.
I see no demos



< Message edited by NefariousKoel -- 9/1/2010 5:20:04 PM >

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 12:54:40 AM   
Fallschirmjager


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lützow


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

You can also look at the sheer massive amount of material, money, time and effort placed into programs between 1880-1914 under England, Germany, France, Italy, Austria, Russia and the United States and even nations like Greece, Turkey and Brazil.
There were naval races happening all over the world and massive progressions in technology and massive build ups in navies in terms of numbers of ships.


Nobody could have stand against the UK royal navy. World wars in Europe were all about land warfare and that's why we won't see anything on a strategic/operational level, but featuring single battles like Jutland. A WW1 naval game with chances to win for both sides, which is crucial for multiplayer, would be pure fantasy and hence not fun.



The Naval war was closer in August 1914 than at the time of Jutland in terms of numbers of ships. The Royal Navy added many times more ships during the war than did the Germans and outright stole two ships from the Turks to give them even greater numbers.
And the German strategy of the time was to pare down the RN's strength through the use of the naval mine and the submarine. It also came close a few times to isolating parts of the Grand Fleet and engaging it.
A game based on this would be extremely fun. The strategy itself if played out a few hundred times could realistically work enough times for it to make a fun and historically plausible game.

And WITP is in no way balanced. The Allies after 12 months have an overwhelming advantage but there are still hundreds of PBEMs played. So I don't think many people share your sentiments or opinions.
Finally there could be some alternate scenarios that did not devolve into pure fantasy that would also be fun.
The game would be a commercial success. Of that I have no doubt as long as the game was done well and properly marketed.


< Message edited by Fallschirmjager -- 9/2/2010 12:56:21 AM >

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Post #: 12
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 6:22:08 AM   
dogma

 

Posts: 1
Joined: 9/1/2010
Status: offline 		I believe I ran across pacific war at armchair forums..Great game

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 6:27:35 AM   
warspite1


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Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager


......and outright stole two ships from the Turks to give them even greater numbers.

Warspite

Is that right? Had the Turkish Government paid for them, only for the Admiralty to take them over without re-imbursing the Turks? Or did the UK pay for the, as then, incomplete vessels?



< Message edited by warspite1 -- 9/2/2010 6:39:40 AM >

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 6:43:55 AM   
Aurelian

 

Posts: 3916
Joined: 2/26/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager


......and outright stole two ships from the Turks to give them even greater numbers.

Warspite

Is that right? Had they paid for them and the Admiralty took them over without re-imbursing the Turks?


Two ships. Renamed Agincourt and Erin. Seized by the British after the war started. (Their Turkish crews were already there to take delivery.) Turks never got the money back. Both were ordered first by Brazil, who backed out, and then bought by the Turks.

< Message edited by Aurelian -- 9/2/2010 6:46:21 AM >

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Post #: 15
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 7:04:14 AM   
warspite1


Posts: 41353
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager


......and outright stole two ships from the Turks to give them even greater numbers.

Warspite

Is that right? Had they paid for them and the Admiralty took them over without re-imbursing the Turks?


Two ships. Renamed Agincourt and Erin. Seized by the British after the war started. (Their Turkish crews were already there to take delivery.) Turks never got the money back. Both were ordered first by Brazil, who backed out, and then bought by the Turks.

Warspite1

Yes, and given Turkey's ultimate decision to join the Central Powers, a sensible decision. The RN could not afford these ships to be used against them.

No doubt actions like these could be said to have helped push the Turks toward Germany, so paying for the ships - as the British did with Chile and the Latorre and Cochrane - might have been the better course of action.....



< Message edited by warspite1 -- 9/2/2010 7:22:46 AM >

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Post #: 16
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 8:35:00 AM   
SireChaos

 

Posts: 710
Joined: 8/14/2006
From: Frankfurt, Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager


......and outright stole two ships from the Turks to give them even greater numbers.

Warspite

Is that right? Had they paid for them and the Admiralty took them over without re-imbursing the Turks?


Two ships. Renamed Agincourt and Erin. Seized by the British after the war started. (Their Turkish crews were already there to take delivery.) Turks never got the money back. Both were ordered first by Brazil, who backed out, and then bought by the Turks.

Warspite1

Yes, and given Turkey's ultimate decision to join the Central Powers, a sensible decision. The RN could not afford these ships to be used against them.

No doubt actions like these could be said to have helped push the Turks toward Germany, so paying for the ships - as the British did with Chile and the Latorre and Cochrane - might have been the better course of action.....




Ask yourself... had the British not stolen these ships, would the Turks ever have joined the Central Powers?

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Post #: 17
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 4:57:54 PM   
Aurelian

 

Posts: 3916
Joined: 2/26/2007
Status: offline 		There really isn't any way to know for sure which way they would of gone. However, the Turkish military was divided on which way to go. Their navy was pro British, while the army was pro German.

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Post #: 18
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 8:27:31 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 41353
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SireChaos


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aurelian

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager


......and outright stole two ships from the Turks to give them even greater numbers.

Warspite

Is that right? Had they paid for them and the Admiralty took them over without re-imbursing the Turks?


Two ships. Renamed Agincourt and Erin. Seized by the British after the war started. (Their Turkish crews were already there to take delivery.) Turks never got the money back. Both were ordered first by Brazil, who backed out, and then bought by the Turks.

Warspite1

Yes, and given Turkey's ultimate decision to join the Central Powers, a sensible decision. The RN could not afford these ships to be used against them.

No doubt actions like these could be said to have helped push the Turks toward Germany, so paying for the ships - as the British did with Chile and the Latorre and Cochrane - might have been the better course of action.....




Ask yourself... had the British not stolen these ships, would the Turks ever have joined the Central Powers?

Warspite1

Sirechaos - I clearly did ask the question - hence my response

You have clearly made up your mind - it does not mean you are right........






< Message edited by warspite1 -- 9/2/2010 8:38:32 PM >

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Post #: 19
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 9/2/2010 9:03:27 PM   
hellfirejet


Posts: 1052
Joined: 12/16/2008
From: Scotland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

WW I naval combat really needs a champion right now. It is a unexploited gold mine. The HPS games are terribly simple and not very good.
Jutland is ok but is fatally flawed by giving you too much to command at one time which makes the game completely unwieldy. Add to that a terrible control system and you have a game with promised but it's core gameplay is so flawed as to make it unplayable.

What the industry really needs is a WW 1 game using the WITP engine set in the North Sea and Med. The era of dreadnoughts and battle cruisers and armored cruisers is almost completely untapped.
I would pay $70 with almost no questions asked.


I'm in total agreement with that,the closest game for WW1 naval is War Plan Orange,but unfortunately I had to add Germanys High seas fleet to it my self using the editor,I have also added all of Britains Pre-Dreadnoughts,Battlecruisers,Armoured cruisers + a load off French,Italian etc,I just wish they would do an Admirals Edition!

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/21/2011 12:14:14 PM   
redcoat


Posts: 1035
Joined: 8/31/2005
From: UK
Status: offline
Steam and Iron looks like a promising WW1 naval game.

Link

Screenshot zip pack

It won’t be out until January though. I will have spent all my Chrimbo games money at the Matrix sale by then.

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RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/21/2011 3:59:33 PM   
SuluSea


Posts: 2358
Joined: 11/17/2006
Status: offline 		I was hoping for a resurrection of Carrier Force a game which looked to have much promise. I'm in search of a quality naval game as well, since we have a plethora of land base games much of them rehashing the same subject matter.

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Post #: 22
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/21/2011 4:20:22 PM   
n01487477


Posts: 4779
Joined: 2/21/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SuluSea

I was hoping for a resurrection of Carrier Force a game which looked to have much promise. I'm in search of a quality naval game as well, since we have a plethora of land base games much of them rehashing the same subject matter.

+1
If I could take a year off I'd code the damn thing myself in C#. Or if Matrix / GG released the code they put together, then maybe a quoram of likeminded ppl could get it done.

I don't have this as it's not a digital download http://www.hpssims.com/Pages/Products/NavCamp/Midway/midway.html but would like to try it.

Cheers

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Post #: 23
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/21/2011 5:51:13 PM   
Perturabo


Posts: 2614
Joined: 11/17/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: redcoat


Steam and Iron looks like a promising WW1 naval game.

Link

Screenshot zip pack

It won’t be out until January though. I will have spent all my Chrimbo games money at the Matrix sale by then.

I don't think "looks" is a good word.

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Post #: 24
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/22/2011 1:18:22 AM   
Fallschirmjager


Posts: 6793
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From: Chattanooga, Tennessee
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quote:



It won’t be out until January though.



Of 1995?

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Post #: 25
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/22/2011 5:43:03 AM   
Perturabo


Posts: 2614
Joined: 11/17/2007
Status: offline 		More like 1985, am I right?

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People shouldn't ask themselves why schools get shoot up.
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Post #: 26
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/22/2011 11:04:08 AM   
Perturabo


Posts: 2614
Joined: 11/17/2007
Status: offline 		What's so good about Warship Combat?

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Post #: 27
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/24/2011 4:23:13 PM   
SuluSea


Posts: 2358
Joined: 11/17/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: n01487477


quote:

ORIGINAL: SuluSea

I was hoping for a resurrection of Carrier Force a game which looked to have much promise. I'm in search of a quality naval game as well, since we have a plethora of land base games much of them rehashing the same subject matter.

+1
If I could take a year off I'd code the damn thing myself in C#. Or if Matrix / GG released the code they put together, then maybe a quoram of likeminded ppl could get it done.

I don't have this as it's not a digital download http://www.hpssims.com/Pages/Products/NavCamp/Midway/midway.html but would like to try it.

Cheers

I'm very surprised Matrix haven't canvassed the forum looking for people to carry the torch where the previous folks left off as there are some talented people hanging around. Maybe they have and we haven't heard about it.


FWIW, NWS has Midway for a much better price, I've dealt with them before and haven't been disapointed in their operation.

Have a good day my friend!

< Message edited by SuluSea -- 11/24/2011 4:28:46 PM >

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Post #: 28
RE: WWI-WWII Naval War Game - 11/24/2011 5:10:29 PM   
Prince of Eckmühl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: n01487477

I don't have this as it's not a digital download http://www.hpssims.com/Pages/Products/NavCamp/Midway/midway.html but would like to try it.

Cheers

HPS Midway is a great little game. It's got a lot more flavor to it than Carriers at War, and plays well MP. It could use some polish, though. For instance, there's no AI for friendly subs. If a player has one in his OOB, he has to micromanage its every action. That said, HPS has a long history of updating/supporting its games, so there's still hope that items like that can be remedied. And I probably ought to mention the publisher's Guadalcanal game that was upgraded to the Midway standard with the release of patch 1.07. Scenarios cover everything from Java Strait to the Leyte Gulf actions. Between the two titles, there are certainly a lot of gaming hours to be had.


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