RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball)

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RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 9/8/2010 5:15:54 PM

Canoerebel

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Q-Ball suggested Scenario One; I countered with a proposal for Scenario Two.

Why?

The two most exciting and enjoyable parts of the game are: (1) the Japanese offensive that takes place after the preliminaries are concluded; figuring out where the push will come and trying to counter it and getting pushed to the wall; and (2) planning, organizing and implementing the first really big - not just big - Allied offensive of the war: the one that determines the major vector of attack for a year or two or more.

In order to maximize the fun involved, I requested Scenario Two.

(in reply to Grfin Zeppelin)

Post #: 361

RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 9/8/2010 10:18:24 PM

Nemo121

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Crsutton,

quote:

Nemo this is scen #2. I think CR will confirm that the Japanese air force is just all too powerful well into 1944.

I'm not sure that's true. In April 1942 in a scenario 2 game I am playing I am able to dominate the IJAAF and land-based IJNAF forces when we meet. To be fair I've made sure I've only sent trained pilots against them and I've picked my fights but over ground I really need to control the IJAAF and IJNAF doesn't come calling often and when it does it takes serious losses. Over pretty much everything else it can easily assert aerial supremacy but what use is aerial supremacy over non-essential terrain? Not much use...

quote:

I am in 2/43 in my game and even though I have lost about 1800 fewer planes than Japan, my opponent does seem to be at all bothered. He can still take total fighter superiority anywhere he wants. He has about a gadjillion tojos in his pool-not to mention zeros and oscars whereas two days of heavy air combat leaves me with no fighter reserves.

Hmm, perhaps you are simply fighting too much and should "save up" for a few months - refusing all combat for those months - so that you can outmass him at a single point of contact and attrit him faster than he attrits you. In the end also it doesn't actually matter if you can or cannot outlast him. What matters is convincing your opponent that you can, irrespective of the reality of the situation. I have often, VERY often, in games convinced people I have deep pockets of fighters and bombers etc when the reality was I had a dozen or a score of planes in reserve while they had hundreds. I broke their self-belief and thus their perceptions defeated them when the objective reality was actually totally in their favour.

Maybe you need to pick a fight or two which break their self-belief and perception of this correlation such that they no longer rely on it and take it as read? Definitely though if you don't have a month or twos worth of replacements in the pool I would suggest you are fighting too often. In April 1942 I have 1 month+ of planes ( and up to 2 months for some types ) in the pools for my major fighter types. Does this mean I've kept some backyard squadrons flying P-36s etc? Sure but what does that matter if they aren't in combat?

quote:

The sweep is not a possiblity for the Allies in scen #2 until much later as the losses can not be replaced.

Again, to be devil's advocate... why? Why can't you sweep? When I recently had a mixed Dutch P40E and British Hurricane II group escort some Hudson bombers into an area defended by 13 Zeroes I lost 5 P-40Es and 2 Hurricane IIs in return for downing all 13 Zeroes. I, in effect, got a 2:1 kill rate with planes on escort duties who were at a height disadvantage also. I'd expect to do better than 2:1 if those planes were sweeping and if you can shoot down 3 fighters for every 1 you lose on a sweep then, combined with the creation of a pool by refusal to fight for 2 months while building the necessary pool, I don't see why sweeps would be impossible.

It would also be beneficial to mix plane nationalities and services so that in any day if you lose 20 planes those plane losses are spread between USN, USMC, USAAF, British and Ozzie pilots such that no one arm of service/nationality has to bear the entire burden.

quote:

It is so bad that I don't even bother using medium bombers anymore as they just get slaughtered and I have no replacements anyways. The only thing that keeps them honest is the heavy bombers and there just are not enough of them.

Really? I'm getting roughly 1 bomb hit on AKs per 6 to 7 medium bombers committed to naval attack missions near my bases. Over the past fortnight I think I've lost 6 medium bombers but I've hit 6 or so xAKs or xAKLs near the base I'm flying medium bomber naval attack missions from. I should point out that the two nearest enemy bases are both CAPed and even with the CAP I'm still shooting down more fighters than I'm losing on escort - overall my fighter vs fighter losses on escort are running about 1.5 to 1 in my favour.

When using medium bombers I do tend to try to hit undefended targets as much as possible but if you build a good fighter force you can go against moderately defended targets at acceptable cost. The key is to build a good fighter force which requires not fighting at all for 2 to 3 months. That takes discipline though.

Same thing with Ceylon here. The Allies shouldn't commit any airpower to that fight. Just pull back and only commit the airpower when the Delhi line is reached. Retreat and train and court-martial any pilot who fires a shot in anger

I know this might seem very contrary but, really, these are the results I'm achieving in my game. I think that looking at most AARs most Allied players fight FAR too much and this prevents them fighting effectively over strategic points. They fritter their strength away over meaningless points and then can't win the fight over crucial points. That was my assessment from reading AARs before I began my PBEM and shaped my strategy. I'm achieving very different results than others and I think these favourable results are down to this strategic approach.

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Post #: 362

RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 9/8/2010 11:32:28 PM

crsutton

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Nemo,

I think a lot has to do with the opponent. I am fighting a very good opponent who knows the game in and out and does not make many mistakes. He is not afraid to lose airplanes and will mass them to overwhelm me at any point simply because he can out produce me and easily replace his losses. In fact, I think that is the key to Japanese strategy in scen #2-go after the Allied airforce whenever and wherever you can. He uses his force in mass and has kept my fighters under his thumb all game long. Until I start to put up enough fighters to counter his endless supply of tojos, I just have to deal with it. I spring a lot of traps but can't afford the losses involved with sweeps. In scen#2 Japan can win the battle of attrition until well into 43.

He is cautious and my mediums really never get a shot at naval interdiction.

I will say this. His bombers are just as crappy as my mediums-actually worse (they did get this part right). Once again, he can produce a lot but has had to rein them in a bit. Some night attacks and no more attempts to close airbases. So, I can see the light. The real problem is fighters and that won't change until the P47 and hellcats come on line in a few months or perhaps even the 2nd edition of the corsair. Then I can afford to sweep.

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Post #: 363

RE: Here come the Rebels! (Canoe v. Q-Ball) - 9/8/2010 11:49:39 PM

Nemo121

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crsutton,

Ok we'll have to agree to disagree. I think though that your problems come from you allowing him to get at your forces too often and too early just as most Allied players allow.

As to the endless supply of Tojos etc... No, he doesn't have an endless supply and neither does he have an endless supply of pilots. In fact the more places he has to defend the less training he can do and the fewer qualified pilots he can produce with the result that his ability to produce "endless" pilots is reduced even more. You've got to look at it hollistically but, generally, there are ways to force him to cut down on forces available for training and lessen his ability to sustain attrition.

As to opponents... I'm not sure about that applying in the way you think. I think it has more to do with the approach of most Allied players than their Japanese opponents - after all the Japanese opponent can only bring the Allied player to ground when the Allied player decides to fight. Decide not to fight in the air and he simply cannot attrit your air force. Those few Allied players who are taking a different approach and really declining the temptation to be drawn into aerial combat except in a few crucial places tend to gain aerial superiority in those places by mid-42. The Aussies vs Amis is another example of this strategy bearing fruit for the Allies.

So, it does depend on the players but I think it depends much more on the Allied player's approach than the Japanese player's approach. Of course looking beyond the conventional wisdom of variable Japanese production and its effects is a difficult thing.

Still, if your conclusion is different I respect that and apart from the above rejoinders will leave you to your conclusions. I'll abandon the thread hijack now and retreat to my AAR lair again.

_____________________________

John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 364

Mission Accomplished! - 9/9/2010 12:48:45 AM

Canoerebel

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3/15/42 and 3/16/42

Mission Accomplished! A few weeks ago, I noted that the Allies might undertake an on-the-fly amphibious operation to retake Palm Island, just offshore Townsville. Well, Brad just evacuated his garrison and the island changed hands automatically. Mission accomplished with no losses - to either side, but that suits me at the moment. It's a tiny base and largely irrelevant, it's worth 10 points in Japanese hands...so the flip means much more than that from an auto-victory determination standpoint.

Ceylon: The Japanese tried the first deliberate attack at Trincomalee. With two divisions, one regiment, and tanks, the attack came off at 1:1, dropped forts from 3 to 2, and inflicted considerably higher casualties on the Allies. Another attack or two will do the trick, but Trincomalee should hold perhaps another week. DD Isaac Sweers arrived at Colombo as a reinforcement. I sent her west at flank speed, but she found the KB lurking near Trivandrum. She didn't complete her mission. The KB also launched 33 Kates against an ML...and missed. The KB is moving north along the coast. There's no shipping worth hunting, but Brad doesn't know that. He's even split the KB into two groups several hexes apart. I assume he's trying to lure the Allies in...but I remain unlurable.

Supplies: Ceylon doesn't hold nearly as much supplies as would ordinarly be the case. My fears about a Japanese move this way led me to minimize the supply runs. Colombo has less than 80k; Trincomalee about 7k. The bulk of the supplies are in Bombay. I found far too little in Karachi - about 7k - so I adjusted the supply demand and now Karachi is up to 80k.

Sub Wars: I-4 nabbed an xAK near San Diego. The transport limped into port and promptly sank. It reminded me of the cargo ship without a helmsman in Jurrasic Park II or III or XVI or whatever.

(in reply to Nemo121)

Post #: 365

RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/9/2010 2:56:48 PM

Canoerebel

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3/17/42

Ceylon: A deliberate attack at Colombo drops forts to 3, comes off at 1:1, and leaves the Japanese rather disrupted. Nevertheless, the attack was more potent than I had expected on the first try. Over at Trincomalee, another attack comes off at 1:1 drops forts to 1, but roughs up the Japanese more than I would have expected. So I think Trincom will fall in a few days; Colombo in probably about ten days.

KB: The two elements have united near Mangalore. I think Brad's a little reluctant to venture forward out of fear that my carriers may be lurking to the north.

DEI: Soerabaja falls to the enemy. That's the last major Allied outpost in the DEI.

Philippines: Brad has withdrawn 4th Division from Clark Field. He's got my troops penned up and he's holding them with a fairly small force, but I'm out of supplies. He must be gleaning troops from all over to bolster his push into India (or possibly Oz, though I think that is highly unlikely).

Capetown: The Allied carriers remain here along with a half-dozen USAAF V Bomber and II Fighter squadrons. The aircraft were on the way to Oz back when I thought that might be the target. I may send them to India.

Aleutians: A Marine regiment arrived at East Coast, so I had to decide a prep target. AFter considering Baker Island, Suva and Nadi, I ultimately selected Attu Island. This most remote of the Aleutian chain is currently undefended and is often an automatic pick up for the Japanese. Garrison it strongly, and build up the chain of islands toward the mainland, and - *presto* - there is the appearance of a growing menace to Japan in the north. That's the impression I want to create. It is also possible that the Allies will ultimately move in that direction, although that's not part of the master plan. Strongly garrisoning Attu Island now is tantamount to a successful, sizeable invasion at this point in the game. Also, I'm moving two Canadian brigades forward to Prince Rupert. They will eventually go to Anchorage, freeing up the units there for duty in the Aleutians.

Force in Being: Brad has no idea where the Allied carriers are and that is paying big dividends. Not so much around India, where the KB is more than a match, but in the Pacific where he hasn't sniffed foward at all. We're still very, very early in the game, which is bad news for me in India, but in the Pacific the fact that Brad isn't advancing is very helpful.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 9/9/2010 3:00:18 PM >

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/9/2010 3:43:14 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Aleutians: Also, I'm moving two Canadian brigades forward to Prince Rupert. They will eventually go to Anchorage, freeing up the units there for duty in the Aleutians.

This is a good idea I think I'll steal. I never quite know what to do with the Canucks. I have a soft spot (three of four grandparents were Canadian, as was my mother), but they, somewhat like the Kiwis, always seem to get lost in the sauce.

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Post #: 367

RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/9/2010 8:04:49 PM

Canoerebel

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3/18/42 and 3/19/42

Ceylon: Trincomalee falls on to a shock attack on the 18th. Colombo holds on a 1:1 deliberate attack on the 19th, which drops forts to two and inflicts roughly equal casqualites. I think Colombo will hold out for the next attack, then fall. That may give me four to six more days to get my ducks in a row. A TF including BBs Haruna and Kongo sighted close to Colombo.

KB: Far north, now, in the Arabian Sea, the KB managed to sink two picket xAKL that were fleeing like fishing craft before a hurricane. The big question: will Brad keep the KB posted there to blockade Karachi?

Madras: Japanese fighters from Ceylon tried back-to-back sweeps over Madras. The first day, they scored a 2:1 victory. I adjusted altitude and the next day the Japanese got skunked, losing at least four Zeros while the Allies lost nada.

Another Force in Being Item: In my previous post I failed to mention perhaps the biggest dividend of the "force in being" use of the carriers. Not only has Brad declined to send invasion TFs forward in the Pacific, he has also kept his combat ships out of sight. IE, no raids on ports that might catch vulnerable Allied transports. (If you happen to be reading both AARs, please refrain from hinting in Brad's that he should be making use of his combat ships; I like the status quo.)

Ship Losses: Other than Pearl Harbor, Allied ship losses have been minimal to date. I attribute this mostly to the use of escorts with convoys, thus thwarting sub attacks. The Allied grand plan for the game calls for massive amounts of shipping, so this is important.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/9/2010 8:13:28 PM

HMS Resolution

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I'd just like to say, before all bets are in, that your grand plan is invading Tokyo.

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 10:29:37 AM

Galahad78

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I'll bet, on the other hand, that you will not follow the same route as on your previous game with Miller. I'm betting on a CenPac thrust

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 2:02:04 PM

JohnDillworth

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quote:

I'll bet, on the other hand, that you will not follow the same route as on your previous game with Miller. I'm betting on a CenPac thrust

How about going right for Truk? Hard to get good recon but but you might be able to put together 5 good divisions plus ships and support by early 43. There might not be any carriers left on either side after, but if you can pin it down his LBA is limited at that location.
Hey, a kid can dream

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 2:38:23 PM

Canoerebel

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Keep the suggestions coming! I read each one and it's always food for thought.

I should note that I've had my main target in mind since December 7, 1941. I've been planning since then and even prepositioning some assets (mainly extra ships). But I don't plan to implement this until sometime in mid- or late '43, so that's a long time away. I won't say any more about my intended target for OpSec reasons.

I will say that in my other three WitP or AE games I have never invaded the followings bases: Lunga, Shortlands, Rabaul, Truk, Guam, Saipan, Tinian, or Babeldaob/Palau. My first three games featured advances through the DEI, Hokkaido (plus Iwo Jima), and the DEI. All things being equal, I prefer going right for the throat - either the Home Islands or the SRA. But last game I could certainly see some of the advantages to following a more historical path.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 9/10/2010 2:39:02 PM >

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Post #: 372

RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 3:53:31 PM

Chickenboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HMS Resolution

I'd just like to say, before all bets are in, that your grand plan is invading Tokyo.

I'd say Guam, Tinian and that other underdeveloped island in the Marianas.

Cut off the Gilberts and Marshalls altogether, but large redundant forces needed to pull it off. Should be doable in mid-1943 with new a/c carriers, upgraded Hellcats / Avengers and some stiff LCUs to do the dirty work.

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 4:00:41 PM

crsutton

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

3/18/42 and 3/19/42

[
Another Force in Being Item: In my previous post I failed to mention perhaps the biggest dividend of the "force in being" use of the carriers. Not only has Brad declined to send invasion TFs forward in the Pacific, he has also kept his combat ships out of sight. IE, no raids on ports that might catch vulnerable Allied transports. (If you happen to be reading both AARs, please refrain from hinting in Brad's that he should be making use of his combat ships; I like the status quo.)

I have been a big advocate of this tactic from day one. If the Allied carriers are still afloat, a cautious Japanese player is limited to one invasion at a time as they cannot risk splitting KB. I am sure many IJNs will be agressive and ignore this and perhaps reap great sucess. But to split KB early is really one of the biggest ways for a Japanese player to lose the game. So the risk is great.

Losing three Allied carriers early-even if you sink three Japanese in return, allows the Japanese player much more freedom of action throughout 1942.

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Post #: 374

RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 4:10:08 PM

John 3rd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

quote:

I'll bet, on the other hand, that you will not follow the same route as on your previous game with Miller. I'm betting on a CenPac thrust

How about going right for Truk? Hard to get good recon but but you might be able to put together 5 good divisions plus ships and support by early 43. There might not be any carriers left on either side after, but if you can pin it down his LBA is limited at that location.
Hey, a kid can dream

I've always felt that a Truk and Marianas Thrust by the Allied Player early would be potentially devastating to the Japanese...

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 4:21:18 PM

Chickenboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd

quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

quote:

I'll bet, on the other hand, that you will not follow the same route as on your previous game with Miller. I'm betting on a CenPac thrust

How about going right for Truk? Hard to get good recon but but you might be able to put together 5 good divisions plus ships and support by early 43. There might not be any carriers left on either side after, but if you can pin it down his LBA is limited at that location.
Hey, a kid can dream

I've always felt that a Truk and Marianas Thrust by the Allied Player early would be potentially devastating to the Japanese...

I think a thorough capture of the Marianas with rapid buildup makes Truk an instant backwater.

Truk has some sizeable CD and other defenses that make it a formidable island to tackle. Kind of like Palau IRL-if you don't REALLY need it to capture your strategic goals, don't bother with the waste of equipment and manpower necessary to accomplish your strategic objectives.

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 4:42:56 PM

John 3rd

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The man has a good point...

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 5:31:41 PM

JohnDillworth

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quote:

I think a thorough capture of the Marianas with rapid buildup makes Truk an instant backwater.

Truk has some sizeable CD and other defenses that make it a formidable island to tackle. Kind of like Palau IRL-if you don't REALLY need it to capture your strategic goals, don't bother with the waste of equipment and manpower necessary to accomplish your strategic objectives.

Truk is a great base. If you have it you can perhaps skip the Marianas and take Palau on your way to the Phillipines. The Marianas are also decent bases, but not decent enough to host a B-29 offensive so I don't know that they are worth taking. Take Truk and you can bypass anything the Japanese have in the South Pacific including New Guinea, a big chunk of nasty combat. Easier said than done I know. This is tough even vs the AI. It only might be worth it if it relatively unguarded. A human player would have had to make a major mistake to leave this lightly guarded. I'm only thinking this way because an offensive in India on top of China commitments will require compromises elsewhere. The real trick is to get recon planes over it. Anybody know if those few F4F-7's can be stuck on a carrier?

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 7:22:59 PM

Canoerebel

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3/20/42 and 3/21/42

Ceylon: Colombo held against another 1:1 deliberate attack. This one dropped forts to 1 and inflicted more casualties on the Japanese. The base might hold through another attack. I hope so.

KB: The KB poked its head far, far into the Arabian Sea, finishing off two picket xAKL that were trying to get out of the way. A Japanese replenishment TF is heading north, so the KB may well stake out a position to try and prevent reinforcements from reaching India.

Adjusting the Defenses: I've moved two top-notch Australian brigades and an Indian brigade from the Calcutta area to Surat, the port north of Bombay. This is the place I think Brad is most likely to invade. Anything south of there will mean a long, drawn out land campaign, which suits me.

Sweep Stakes: Brad is continuing large-scale fighter sweeps over Madras, but the Japanese are losing more aircraft than the Allies. Probably at a 3:1 rate, though the actual losses aren't very high. Perhaps 15 IJ fighters to 5 RAF.

Aleutians: The Allies paid political points for 1st USN Engineers and will send the unit to Attu Island ahead of the Marine regiment now on its way to Seattle from East Coast. I am very, very anxious to occupy, fortify, and secure the Aleutian chain. This is the most important Allied offensive that will take place during the first half of '42 - even though there's no enemy troops present at the moment.

Sub Wars: Wow, Japanese subs are ramping up the action. I-4 off San Diego got xAP President Taylor, fortunately empty. This is one of the few successful sub attacks against an escorted convoy. Three subs are off San Fran. I-170 south of Pearl got an xAKL. I-2 got an xAK near Albany, just east of Perth, while RO-33 missed a shot in the same area.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 9/10/2010 7:27:01 PM >

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 8:00:40 PM

JohnDillworth

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Dan,You are about 3 months in. How goes the pilot training?

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 8:13:24 PM

Chickenboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Sweep Stakes: Brad is continuing large-scale fighter sweeps over Madras, but the Japanese are losing more aircraft than the Allies. Probably at a 3:1 rate, though the actual losses aren't very high. Perhaps 15 IJ fighters to 5 RAF.

Ugh. This was awful. Not the game activity, but the pun. I may have to rethink my subscription to your AARs, CR.

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 8:32:14 PM

DTurtle

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Aleutians: The Allies paid political points for 1st USN Engineers and will send the unit to Attu Island ahead of the Marine regiment now on its way to Seattle from East Coast. I am very, very anxious to occupy, fortify, and secure the Aleutian chain. This is the most important Allied offensive that will take place during the first half of '42 - even though there's no enemy troops present at the moment.

Why do you think that defending (they are American a the start) the Aleutians is so important? What would you lose, should he decide to invade them?

Let me put it this way: So far, you have done almost nothing to make the situation more difficult/complex for Q-Ball. Any and all mistakes that Q-Ball has done so far were mistakes he did himself, without any real input from your side. You are basically sitting passively at the side, and letting him do his thing.

Why this passive posture?

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 8:51:34 PM

Canoerebel

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DTurtle, you are mistaking an absence of armed conflict for passivness. The Allies are not being passive. They are actively reinforcing forward positions as quickly as possible, though the progress is slowed by lack of political points and lack of units.

It's March 1942, for goodness sakes. Where excactly should the Allies be attacking?

I think most players will agree that it is nearly impossible for the Allies to mount a credible amphibious operation in early 1942 - both in the real war and against a good opponent. Moreso in Scenario Two which gives Japan extra goodies.

So, what you are probably saying is, "Why haven't you used the one offensive asset you do have, the Allied carriers?"

I played a hunch and had them correctly positioned for an invasion of India, but I'm not willing to take on the combined might of the KB at this point. Mink-KB, yes; full KB, no. Why? Many reasons including that articulated by crsutton, above. The odds of achieving anything favorable are low and the cost of revealing their position could be very, very high even if they accomplish something.

As for the Aleutians, far, far too many players, both Japanese and Allied, ignore this region. In Allied hands, it is a pistol pointed right at Japan's head. Brad knows I've used the northern route with success in the past - and without success on another occasion - so he's going to take extra pains to garrison and defend his NoPac territory. That means less units elsewhere, which suits me. Moreover, most of the Aleutians are vacant early in the game - an easy conquest for Japan. If the enemy takes and garrisons those bases, the Allies are challenged to reclaim them. If the Allied player does organize an amphibious operations, he runs the risk of facing a much larger Japanese force. IE, the risks can be great. So, occupying and securing the Aleutians is a tremendous step forward for the Allies. Believe me, I can use those bases to my advantage even if I never move further forward in NoPac.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 9/10/2010 8:53:49 PM >

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Post #: 383

RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 8:58:08 PM

Canoerebel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth
Dan,You are about 3 months in. How goes the pilot training?

I think I'm making satisfactory progress.

Three months into the game I think I've set up my training squadrons correctly, and the pilots seem to be advancing in skill as expected. I'm just reaching the point where I'm sending 50/70 pilots to general reserve. I haven't reached the point yet where I'm drawing from general reserve into front line units. That will follow very soon (as reflected in a post I just made in the War Room).

So I'm catching on to pilot training, but my dislike of it is even greater than I had feared back when I avoided it. I detest it. I cannot imagine how pilot training ended up in a game of this scope.

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 9:24:28 PM

Canoerebel

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One other point about how a lengthy spell of inactivity can sometimes work to the advantage of the Allies. When the Allies are seemingly quiet, it sometimes seems to spook the Japanese player into doing something rash or into misreading the situation. I'll bet most players have experienced this to some degree or other, but here are two examples from my last game with Miller:

1) In February 1942, as the Allies were preparing to invade the Kuriles, most of the action was taking place between Townsville and Darwin. The Allies had a large number of ships at Townsville awaiting an "all clear" to make the hazardous run through contested waters to Darwin. The force included at least one BB and many transports. Miller saw that force at Townsville - then watched as it grew and grew as additional ships made it to T'ville only to be held there because I wasn't sure where the KB was. Miller understandably thought this growing and clearly powerful force was gathering to invade New Guinea or vicinity. He kept his carriers positioned to respond. Meanwhile, the real peril was in NoPac and I had a two-week window without the KB to open my invasion.

2) A few months later, the Allies gathered a force of vast size at Darwin. I didn't move out for weeks, but the growing menace clearly worried my opponent. Eventually he committed the KB to launch a huge strike against Darwin from long distance. The strike was pretty effective, but at a cost of hundreds of valuable Japanese navy pilots and aircraft.

I'm not counting on Brad doing something like that in this game - you can never predict with certainty that something of that nature will occur - but it's possible. The lack of Allied activity in the Indian Ocean may lead him to make a mistake.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 9/10/2010 9:25:21 PM >

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 10:32:43 PM

JeffroK

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I agree with keeping the Allied CV as a force in being, but is Cape Town the right place??

Your force can exit via the Indian Ocean to India (if available) or Perth and take a long time to move into the Pacific. It can also sail to Panama (about 20 days in transit?) or via Pt Stanley, around the Cape and on to Tahiti. You are keeping your force together but its poorly placed to do much other than force QBall to be careful in the Indian Ocean.

Should it be moved to a more strategic base where it is more capable of quickly getting into the action, if Pearl Harbor is too risky, maybe any West Coast port or Panama where it can get into action more quickly (and also pick up upgrades faster than at Cape Town)

I would also consider allowing some CV to " be seen", a quick circuit of Attu, Johnston Is, Midway etc might get spotted by Emily, Netty or a sub search and make QBall wonder what you are up to!

But don't rush into things like you did (with a lot of help from the gallery

), you probably have 1000 turns to go and in this scenario you don't start to overwhelm the empire until much later than IRL.

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 11:49:07 PM

JohnDillworth

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quote:

I think I'm making satisfactory progress.

Three months into the game I think I've set up my training squadrons correctly, and the pilots seem to be advancing in skill as expected. I'm just reaching the point where I'm sending 50/70 pilots to general reserve. I haven't reached the point yet where I'm drawing from general reserve into front line units. That will follow very soon (as reflected in a post I just made in the War Room).

So I'm catching on to pilot training, but my dislike of it is even greater than I had feared back when I avoided it. I detest it. I cannot imagine how pilot training ended up in a game of this scope.

The 50/70 rule seems to be the way 2 go. I may have mentioned it before, but the single most important factor in training seems to be the inspiration rating of the leader. You have a bunch of 60+ guys, put them in charge.
I have been doing OK with level bombers, but fighters definitely move faster.

I agree 100% on training. Waste of time but a necessary evil. I hope that it will eventually be gotten ride of

< Message edited by JohnDillworth -- 9/10/2010 11:51:18 PM >

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 11:55:37 PM

Canoerebel

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JeffK, actually, my carriers are positioned optimally.

From the outset, I said that Allied carriers would only be used to defend Hawaii, Australia, or India, and then only in the event of the most dire emergency. I also wanted to keep my carriers hidden for "force in being" purposes. Since almost any base on the map is subject to unlucky sightings by Glens, subs, or other wandering enemy ships, that left me with two main choices: Panama City or Capetown.

I played a hunch that Brad was going to focus on either Australia or India, so I chose Capetown. Now my carriers are well hidden, but close-enough to the main theater of action to sortie should the need arise.

As for showing a carrier, that would weaken rather than strengthen my position. Brad knows I have a history of using my carriers early. Right now he has absolutely no idea where they are. He has to allow for them showing up anywhere on the map. If I reveal even one carrier smewhere, that tells him that the rest of my force, if separated, is that much weaker.

No, even though my plan is not perfect, I like it and I think that it is working very well. If I secure the entire Aleutian chain, I'll chalk that up as a major victory on a par with anything else I could do by the end of March 1942.

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/10/2010 11:59:52 PM

vettim89

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Hey Dan,

One thing you have not mentioned (unless I missed it) is the use of the RN subs. Here is one way where Q-Ball has done you a favor. Until 1943 your subs with working torpedoes are relatively short legged. He has done you a favor here by moving right into their wheel house. Any plans for them? How many RNN subs did you get out of the DEI and where are they now? Hitting a IJN CV would be great but those are usually well protected. That said, he will need a lot of supplies to keep all his new bases going and fuel his offensive. He will be stretching his ASW assets pretty thin. Then in just nine short months the USN fleet boats starting hitting things, he will be even further stretched. You are taking it on the chin now but I have no doubt he will feel some logistical pressure very soon.

In my WiTP game, I remember my opponent Larry bemoaning the day the US torpedoes started working. He desperately wanted those annoying minelaying mission to come back. Of course you can't do that very well in WiTP but every little bit helps.

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RE: Mission Accomplished! - 9/11/2010 12:19:37 AM

DTurtle

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

DTurtle, you are mistaking an absence of armed conflict for passivness. The Allies are not being passive. They are actively reinforcing forward positions as quickly as possible, though the progress is slowed by lack of political points and lack of units.

It's March 1942, for goodness sakes. Where excactly should the Allies be attacking?

I think most players will agree that it is nearly impossible for the Allies to mount a credible amphibious operation in early 1942 - both in the real war and against a good opponent. Moreso in Scenario Two which gives Japan extra goodies.

Nemo in his game (also Scen. 2) started with (limited) counteroffensives in January '42. Now, Q-Ball might be an enemy of another caliber, but I did not get the impression that Nemo calculated with this while making his early plans. Page 5 of his AAR includes some good discussion of the possible risks and rewards of his approach.

I'll leave at that, since I don't want to distract further from your AAR. It will, of course, be interesting to see the effects of your approach.

At the very least, this is a very interesting game.

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