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RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line

 
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RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/7/2010 11:29:34 PM   
Nemo121


Posts: 5821
Joined: 2/6/2004
Status: offline 		Marines have a high replacement rate and death is the coin of war.

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Well, that's that settled then.

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Post #: 1021
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/7/2010 11:31:51 PM   
traskott


Posts: 1546
Joined: 6/23/2008
From: Valladolid, Spain
Status: offline 		Yes, but, IIRC, you can only can recover one squad lost per turn/day, so a div which lost 1/3 will take 4 months to recover.

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Post #: 1022
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/7/2010 11:50:15 PM   
Nemo121


Posts: 5821
Joined: 2/6/2004
Status: offline 		1. It isn't necessary to wait until a unit is at full strength to commit it to combat. In Western militaries there appears to a mania for waiting until units are at full strength before committing them. We see the same in this game where most people follow a very western methodology. A USMC unit at 60% strength is quite capable of offensive action and may, if pressed into service before the enemy is ready for it, achieve much more than it would at 100% TO&E strength 2 months later.

2. There are other divisions which can carry the load in the meantime.

3. When the ferryman demands a toll you have no option but to pay it. Preference matters little to the demands of objective reality.


So, your point is valid traskott ( IMO ) but I think that the emphasis on full TO&Es is not necessarily helpful.

_____________________________

John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.

(in reply to traskott)
Post #: 1023
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/7/2010 11:51:00 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Not reaslly 2/3 of the Div are in Pearl now so its only 1/3 on the atoll.

I dont like abandoning forces but I have gotten myself into a pretty strategic pickle - I can get out of it I just need to be patient.

I have a pipeline of strength arriving and all that I can do now is compromise myself by taking unnessecary casualties.

In 90 days KB becomes an irrelevance as far as stopping me goes - PZB needs a decisiver carrier battle now the simple fact is I dont and actually I probably dont want one.

I just need to sit tight and not do anything stupid until then

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Post #: 1024
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/7/2010 11:58:06 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		I have another 5 full Divs at Peal plus 2 - 3 more in Indpt Regts and Bns all prepped for different targets

Another 6 or 7 Bde Gps at Aukland all prepping for new targets.

7 or 8 Divs at Brisbane all prepping for targets.

De facto when I get started LCU's are not a problem.

Shipping and covering the TF's are.

I made a mess of it by depending on a carrier led assault for the opening phase without clear superioirty in that arm.

I was was willing to fight it out with KB bu losing 1/4 of my carrier air to subs has reduced me to parity at best so why take the risk.

With hindsight had I left some naval assets in Indian Ocean and SWPAC I could be hitting Andaman islands and Port Moresby now but I over concentrated into CENTPAC and I am now paying the price.

The absoulute worst thing I could do now is take on KB and lose better to wait a few weeks or a couple of months and then make it count

Every day that passes he burns fuel at the end of a nasty logistics pipeline de facto its almost impossible for KB to remain in these waters for a long time so I can wait - I dont like it but its the smart thing to do for now given the mess I got myself into.

Andy

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Post #: 1025
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/8/2010 12:05:10 AM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		He had Yamato et al plus Cruisers plus AR ships plus lots of subs and KB operating out here and my subs sunk a couple of tankers - I doubt he can operate for long in these waters.

If I weas him I would counterinvade Palmyra now with whatever he can muster and then withdraw claiming the victory.

He wants to tempt me out and having put torps into 2 carriers he must assume I aint going to play ball anywhere beyond 1 or 2 days transit of Pearl which is not where he wants to fight.

He is crossing waters with over 40 subs all it takes is a couple of lucky breaks and he is in trouble at the end of a nasty long comms line.

PZB has won this round largely due to his subs but all that it has achieved is stop me from risking my carriers int eh very engagement I think he needs.

Just now facing 700 carrier aircraft 1/3 of which are RN i.e Stringbags and Sea Hurricanes and my best fighter the F4F

He needs and wants a fight now.

In three months the odds shift from parity with the IJN having the fighter edge in quality to 2:1 in my favour with all my USN carriers having Hellcats.

Scaring me back to prot and safety is the worst thing he could have done - a tactical victory costing him a strategic one

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Post #: 1026
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/8/2010 12:10:53 AM   
cookie monster


Posts: 1693
Joined: 5/22/2005
From: Birmingham,England
Status: offline 		Be patient thats alot of firepower coming to the Allies mid 43 onwards. Then the island hopping begins.

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Post #: 1027
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/8/2010 1:51:32 AM   
Keifer


Posts: 92
Joined: 9/27/2007
From: San Diego, CA
Status: offline 		If he sends the KB to support a counter invasion on Palmyra, go take Wake.

He'll have to react and it is nicely distant from his LBA.

That should drive him nuts.

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Post #: 1028
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/8/2010 2:14:20 AM   
cookie monster


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Post #: 1029
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/8/2010 9:08:41 AM   
traskott


Posts: 1546
Joined: 6/23/2008
From: Valladolid, Spain
Status: offline 		@Nemo: I always forgot your "soviet aproach to ground warfare" .

@Andy: How much Saratoga is damaged by the torpedo ? US Carriers usually can hold more than u can expect. I have had the Hornet sailing around with 15 major flooding dmg and she makes PH-Noumea-Melbourne-combat and back to PH without trouble !!!

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Post #: 1030
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/11/2010 11:15:36 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		All my carriers wil survive

Saratoga will be back when Essex arrives in about 80 days
Hornet about 3 weeks before it.

Broadly in 80 days 3 x RN CV's come out of refit with a capacity of 54 and 3 USN CV's return from yard dogs or from new construction.

And I get 3 more CVE's

But I cannot afford to sit still until they return so 4 Carriers are out prowling I figure he may reinvade or wait certainly my subs havwent seen KB for a while so I suspect fuel has dragged them back to Truk or Kwajalein.

I just need to be patient not do anything to stupid and wait for 80 days before the Hydra offensive kicks into high gear

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Post #: 1031
RE: Burma Corps Stands Fast on the katha Line - 11/13/2010 2:49:35 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Well where to begin....

You know how I said I had to be patient....

well I was never any good at followign my own advice

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Post #: 1032
Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 2:51:41 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		OK I was trying to catch Yamato on a bombardment run but to be safe I only took my fast carriers leaving the CVE's behind.

I get into position and miss Yamato on timing.

So I pull back knowing KB has retired to the marshalls because my subs saw them go...

So I move NE of Palmyra intending on heading back to Pearl.

When.....


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Post #: 1033
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 2:53:18 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		KB pops out 8 hexes away south of Palmyra launches a full deck strike that cripples SODAK and 3 of 4 carriers..

Wasp is almost certainly a gonner as is SODAK.

Enterprise will get away

Indomitable and Hornet might make it

Not a good day for the allies

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Post #: 1034
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 2:59:48 PM   
EUBanana


Posts: 4552
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From: Little England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

In 90 days KB becomes an irrelevance as far as stopping me goes - PZB needs a decisiver carrier battle now the simple fact is I dont and actually I probably dont want one.

I just need to sit tight and not do anything stupid until then



quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

KB pops out 8 hexes away south of Palmyra launches a full deck strike that cripples SODAK and 3 of 4 carriers..

Wasp is almost certainly a gonner as is SODAK.

Enterprise will get away

Indomitable and Hornet might make it

Not a good day for the allies



...Ouch.

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Post #: 1035
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 3:04:43 PM   
traskott


Posts: 1546
Joined: 6/23/2008
From: Valladolid, Spain
Status: offline 		OUCH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Well, looks like as you need a whole full new plan now.

(in reply to EUBanana)
Post #: 1036
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 3:10:27 PM   
WLockard


Posts: 183
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Status: offline 		The best laid plans of mice and men ...

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Post #: 1037
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 3:11:05 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Thanks EUbanana I deserve that.

Ever done something you know is wrong when you are doing it but still do it anyway....

Thats what I did !!!

(in reply to traskott)
Post #: 1038
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 3:13:01 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		I think Indomitable might get away but Wasp is dead and Hornet maybe as well....

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Post #: 1039
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 3:22:23 PM   
traskott


Posts: 1546
Joined: 6/23/2008
From: Valladolid, Spain
Status: offline 		Well, time to push over New Guinea and pull back the offensive at CENPAC for a year.... No other solution is available

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Post #: 1040
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 3:48:29 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Huh ? I have not yet begun to fight ;)

Depending on what gets away CENTPAC is far far from dead !!!


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Post #: 1041
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 3:51:39 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		All that this defeat means is that Palmyra is probably lost.

in 3 months even if all of Hornet, Wasp and Indimatble are sunk I will have

3 x RN CV's ansd 1 x CVL = 180
10 x CVE's = 300
Big E, Sara and Lady Lex plus Essex = 360

If Hornet and Indy get away add 140 to that total.

Thats why what I did was so moronic

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Post #: 1042
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 3:52:50 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
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From: Argleton
Status: offline 		Are you doing no withdrawals in this game?

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Post #: 1043
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 4:12:31 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		yes

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Post #: 1044
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 7:36:21 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		None could run fast enough Wasp Hornet and Indy all went down but my subs took Kaga with them

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Post #: 1045
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 10:25:34 PM   
DivePac88


Posts: 3119
Joined: 10/9/2008
From: Somewhere in the South Pacific.
Status: offline 		My commiserations Andy...

But things are not all that bad, as KB is fast approaching it's use-by-date. You have repaired carriers, and new carriers not far-off. Plus not long now, and Hellcats arrive, then his incoming strikes will be getting chewed to pieces.

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Post #: 1046
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 10:32:25 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		I would love to say I was unlucky or that it was unfair but the truth is I was a moron took an unessecary ruisk because I didnt like leaving 3rd marines rotting on a rock.

I have paid a heavy proce 3 Carriers and 2 Battleships have been sunk plus a few other ships.

However I will be back

(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 1047
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 10:37:16 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		OK I am looking at the plan.

In last few days I lost 3 CV's - originally I was going to re commence Hydra in June 43 it will now need to wait until mid July so a 6 week delay - in July I recieve 3 Essex class and 3 new CVL's so more than offsets the losses I just took.

However this delay probably means no time for the SEAC side of the offensive which is irritating

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Post #: 1048
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 10:46:13 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		I am also irritatyed by Burma the whole point of drawing PZB into a war in north burma was to get him out of position for the real amphib attack that part of the plan is probably scuppered now I will need to reconsider

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Post #: 1049
RE: Deafeat in CENTPAC - 11/13/2010 10:47:59 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		43 was supposed to be about position and bases and getting ready for the killer blow in 44 when I went deep - i.e. take the Gilberts, PM, Solomons and Sumatra at the run before he can react so I am ready to hit Marshalls,Marianas, New Britain, Borneo and Malaya in 44

This is now in question

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Post #: 1050
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