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Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO

 
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Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 7:54:39 PM   
kirkgregerson

 

Posts: 497
Joined: 4/9/2008
Status: offline 		I've just finished closing some sizable pockets of su units on t3 of the 41-45 campaign. My #'s show NO, yes 0, captured trucks? What gives?

From all my readings on the War in the East, the Germans loved the Russian trucks as they were much more robust to handling the road or lack of road conditions for all season. Much better than German/European trucks that were build for more paved road travel.

Many stats about how much captured Russian equipment the axis armies used on the east front. So I think something in the logic is wrong that I have no captured trucks?

What am I missing??? ANYBODY get any captured trucks yet?
Post #: 1
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 7:56:45 PM   
Flaviusx


Posts: 7750
Joined: 9/9/2009
From: Southern California
Status: offline 		How many captured trucks were the Germans using 3 weeks into Barbarossa?





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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 7:57:35 PM   
Joel Billings


Posts: 32265
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From: Santa Rosa, CA
Status: offline 		Are you looking at the trucks captured on the losses screen? That's how many of your trucks were captured by the enemy.

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 8:41:32 PM   
kirkgregerson

 

Posts: 497
Joined: 4/9/2008
Status: offline 		well I've made 30+ units surrender. Would think I'd have at least 1 captured truck. Looking in that spot and says 0.


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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 8:48:31 PM   
kirkgregerson

 

Posts: 497
Joined: 4/9/2008
Status: offline 		In the first week of Barbarossa the Germans captured about 3,000 Russian tanks.  My guess (can't find exact #'s yet) is that they capture a similar # of Russian trucks.  I'm sure many not in great shape.  But I have read that OKH made extensive use of captured Russian trucks to try (and not successfully) provide the necessary amount for the incredible demands of the eastern front.

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 9:10:00 PM   
elmo3

 

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Joined: 1/22/2002
Status: offline 		Could be a bug. Will do some testing on this issue tonight.

< Message edited by elmo3 -- 12/10/2010 9:12:27 PM >

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 9:23:30 PM   
Arstavidios

 

Posts: 780
Joined: 11/19/2004
Status: offline 		Germans made extensive use of catpured whatever.
Tanks, guns, mortars, ammo, trucks and men.Large numbers of russians ended up as pretty much support squads :)

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 9:25:53 PM   
Flaviusx


Posts: 7750
Joined: 9/9/2009
From: Southern California
Status: offline 		My understanding is that the Germans really didn't use most of the stuff they captured until 42. Later on, yeah, but not so much in 41.

However, this truck thing may be bugged and we will sort it out.





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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 9:26:51 PM   
paullus99


Posts: 1985
Joined: 1/23/2002
Status: offline 		Of course, in the first week or two, did they really think they were going to need all that captured equipment (and worth the time to get them into service) - I believe Hitler said it would be a 6 - 8 week campaign.....

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 9:36:07 PM   
Smirfy

 

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Who is going to drive these captured trucks? By September the Germans were stripping logistic units to put more men at the front. Sure as Flaviusx suggests getting truck and hiwi or whatever spare body working 1942 is slightly more reasonable. Its not like qualified drivers and mechanics were dropping out of trees in Germany or eastern Europe in 1941

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Post #: 10
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 9:54:20 PM   
kirkgregerson

 

Posts: 497
Joined: 4/9/2008
Status: offline 		Germans have had the concept of using other enemy nation captured equipment for a while before Barbarossa. A decent amount of capture French vehicles were already in use at some capacity in the German Army.

Don't think the beginning of Barbarossa would be any different for OKH. I believe anything and everything the German army could make use of beg, borrow, or steal.. they would make use of it.


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Post #: 11
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 10:49:07 PM   
FM WarB

 

Posts: 292
Joined: 2/14/2008
Status: offline 		How many usable trucks would the Russian units that got bagged have had? I'm guessing trucks could have gotten out of the pockets or been further to the rear to start with in some cases.

Would you like to have been the German Motor Officer who already has German, Italian, Czeck and french trucks who gets some shot up Russian trucks to put on the road?

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Post #: 12
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 11:15:51 PM   
The Gnome


Posts: 1233
Joined: 5/17/2002
From: Philadelphia, PA
Status: offline 		If I'm reading this right, there are two separate issues:

1 - Capturing the truck

2 - Using the captured truck

I'm just starting some scenarios now, and will look to see if I notice any anomalies revolving around #1. As far as #2 goes, I would hope everything I capture goes into some pool, even if the captured equipment is not used until some set of criteria is reached.

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Post #: 13
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/10/2010 11:16:36 PM   
Great_Ajax


Posts: 4774
Joined: 10/28/2002
From: Alabama, USA
Status: offline 		Did the Russian trucks use the same kind of fuel that the Germans used? I seem to recall that they did not.

Trey

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 12:55:01 AM   
elmo3

 

Posts: 5820
Joined: 1/22/2002
Status: offline 		OK I ran a test for 60 turns and here are the results. As you can see the Soviets have had about 9K of their trucks captured and they have captured less than 1K Axis trucks. The reason the current turn totals are 0 is because the screen shots are from the start of the turn after the supply phase. So the code is working although you could argue about whether the numbers are historical or not. Every game is different and I played this test on Normal so the AI probably did not do as well as historical.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by elmo3 -- 12/11/2010 12:58:13 AM >

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 2:33:03 AM   
CarnageINC


Posts: 2208
Joined: 2/28/2005
From: Rapid City SD
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: el hefe

Did the Russian trucks use the same kind of fuel that the Germans used? I seem to recall that they did not.

Trey


This didn't keep the Germans or Russians from using captured tanks which used different fuels. If you have the capacity to keep enemy AFV in fuel you should have the capacity to keep enemy trucks in fuel also. I definitely think this part of the game is broken. After all your capturing enemy fuel stocks all the time.

< Message edited by CarnageINC -- 12/11/2010 2:35:18 AM >

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 2:35:58 AM   
siRkid


Posts: 6650
Joined: 1/29/2002
From: Orland FL
Status: offline 		If I'm not mistaked the Germans don't get to start using capatured equipment until Oct 41.

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Post #: 17
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 2:46:14 AM   
FM WarB

 

Posts: 292
Joined: 2/14/2008
Status: offline


quote:

If you have the capacity to keep enemy AFV in fuel you should have the capacity to keep enemy trucks in fuel also.


If you had trouble keeping your own afv in fuel, you would have to keep your own trucks in fuel to fuel them. Captured (sometimes damaged) trucks and afv, using different fuel and with different maintenance headaches would be way down the list of priorities.

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Post #: 18
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 4:01:54 AM   
Tophat1815

 

Posts: 1824
Joined: 1/16/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kirkgregerson

I've just finished closing some sizable pockets of su units on t3 of the 41-45 campaign. My #'s show NO, yes 0, captured trucks? What gives?

From all my readings on the War in the East, the Germans loved the Russian trucks as they were much more robust to handling the road or lack of road conditions for all season. Much better than German/European trucks that were build for more paved road travel.

Many stats about how much captured Russian equipment the axis armies used on the east front. So I think something in the logic is wrong that I have no captured trucks?

What am I missing??? ANYBODY get any captured trucks yet?



Rule section 21.3 captured equipment on page 284. The equipment goes to a captured equipment pool and is allocated to replacement units using the same type of equipment. I would assume this would take X number of game turns,so look at this over time with arrival of new formations. Also look at refitting units. I'll take note of it and look myself. Always better to look before we start to scream its broke..

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 4:23:49 AM   
kirkgregerson

 

Posts: 497
Joined: 4/9/2008
Status: offline 		ok, wait... think I was reading 'Trucks Captured' as trucks that the player had captured from the enemy.  But now it seems that this is not the case, rather trucks the enemy has captured from YOU.

Thus, having 0 here makes sense.  The enemy has not captured any of my trucks ... yet.  So is there a way for me to see how many enemy trucks I've captured when playing against AI?  Because I can't see his reports of captured trucks.

Thanks for clearing this up.

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Post #: 20
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 4:57:11 AM   
Phatguy

 

Posts: 1348
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Buffalo,ny
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: FM WarB




quote:

If you have the capacity to keep enemy AFV in fuel you should have the capacity to keep enemy trucks in fuel also.


If you had trouble keeping your own afv in fuel, you would have to keep your own trucks in fuel to fuel them. Captured (sometimes damaged) trucks and afv, using different fuel and with different maintenance headaches would be way down the list of priorities.


Not really.....If I have a pool of captured(both damaged and undamaged enemy equipment)that uses different fuel from my own equipment and I have a large quantity of captured fuel my own equipment cannot use I would utilize that fuel and equipment in a heartbeat. Especially if I had trouble keeping my own rolling due to lack of fuel.

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Post #: 21
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 7:51:47 AM   
Joel Billings


Posts: 32265
Joined: 9/20/2000
From: Santa Rosa, CA
Status: offline 		Correct, you only see the number of your generic vehicles captured by the enemy. We don't have any info on number you've captured. Unlike other equipment, captured vehicles are placed immediatly in your motor pool.

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 11:48:01 AM   
Icekill

 

Posts: 19
Joined: 6/17/2005
From: Toledo, Spain
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joel Billings

Correct, you only see the number of your generic vehicles captured by the enemy. We don't have any info on number you've captured. Unlike other equipment, captured vehicles are placed immediatly in your motor pool.


And couldn't also be add the number of trucks that YOU captured to the post battle stats in a future patch?

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Post #: 23
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 1:40:03 PM   
Arstavidios

 

Posts: 780
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Status: offline 		Where do you go to see what you have captured?

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 1:52:19 PM   
elmo3

 

Posts: 5820
Joined: 1/22/2002
Status: offline 		Trucks captured and destroyed are listed on the losses screen.  The "L" key.

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 2:04:51 PM   
Arstavidios

 

Posts: 780
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Status: offline 		And other equipments like guns or tanks?

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Post #: 26
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 2:06:59 PM   
elmo3

 

Posts: 5820
Joined: 1/22/2002
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arstavidios

And other equipments like guns or tanks?


Here is part of the losses screen:




Attachment (1)

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 2:07:33 PM   
karonagames


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From: The Duchy of Cornwall, nr England
Status: offline 		Captured equipment like Afvs and arty is listed in the production report.

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RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 3:57:54 PM   
kirkgregerson

 

Posts: 497
Joined: 4/9/2008
Status: offline 		elmo3,

Currently there is no where to see captured enemy truck totals. The prod screen only shows YOUR trucks that were captured by the enemy.

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Post #: 29
RE: Capture Trucks has to be broken IMO - 12/11/2010 5:36:35 PM   
elmo3

 

Posts: 5820
Joined: 1/22/2002
Status: offline 		Checking on that.

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