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RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/12/2011 11:40:28 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Klydon

What were your impressions of the Cav corps TD?

Outstanding winter offensive btw. Lot of guards units, which is one of the things the Russians want out of the winter. That should give you a good core of units to work with, especially when you can start assembly of infantry corps.



Ah the Cavalry Corps. I am... very disappointed with them. But I am pretty certain this is due to my OWN INCOMPETENCE!

As you may remember I created 11 on the first december turn. Theoric offensive value: around 5 (which seems threatening). Real offensive value: very poor To my surprise I found out such corps (let's say 5=x) cannot defeat a lone German infantry division (let's say a miserable ant 1=1 ). Infiltration duties? Almost zero value as well. A tank brigade is far far better.

I mentioned my own incompetence. Why? Because they were kept attached to Stavka... Had they been attached to Front Armies MAYBE their performance would have been much better.

In other words, I haven't used them correctly, I suspect

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Post #: 871
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 12:03:08 AM   
Klydon


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Status: offline 		Interesting. I was just curious on them. Did you take advantage of the fact you can attach support units to them to make them a bit tougher? Pioneers and probably tank battalions are the way to go I would think.

The thing I found with them is it is tough to rest them and let their fatigue drop down in order to get their really good mobility going again.

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Post #: 872
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 12:06:41 AM   
Ketza


Posts: 2227
Joined: 1/14/2007
From: Columbia, Maryland
Status: offline 		My limited experience fighting the Calvary corps has shown them to be fairly easy to punch around and rather brittle.

They due tend to be squirm though the lines however which seems to be their main job.

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Post #: 873
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 12:53:41 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Klydon
Interesting. I was just curious on them. Did you take advantage of the fact you can attach support units to them to make them a bit tougher? Pioneers and probably tank battalions are the way to go I would think.

The thing I found with them is it is tough to rest them and let their fatigue drop down in order to get their really good mobility going again.


What I said! I am an utter incompetent! No, I haven't attached anything. I forgot I could do that LOL

Anyway (now trying), I only can attach AA Bns and Tricycle Regs (evil kids ride them though). Am I missing something?

Yes, Ketza, that has been my experience. Rather lousy units. I guess the future upgrades will strenghten them.

Still, I don't blame anyone of you (those who convinced me to form them) On this blizzard offensive I haven't used infiltration that much. I have basically pushed 2ndACR's forces. Suffice to say that I have almost totally ignored the Cavalry divisions as well (I have like 15). The tank brigades are the deal: lots of MPs.

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Post #: 874
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:08:01 AM   
TulliusDetritus


Posts: 5521
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Status: offline 		Ok. Attacks done. "Only" 37 retreats this turn. Far better than the december attacks but, less than the attacks made on the last 4 or 5 turns.

Active Fronts (only 2, remember):

Northwest
Southern

Leningrad attacks.




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Post #: 875
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:10:04 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Volkhov and Northwest (active, I advance) Fronts.




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Post #: 876
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:11:37 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Kalinin Front. Notice the high defensive value of 2ndACR's forces here Few attacks are possible.




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Post #: 877
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:13:04 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Western Front. Not advancing either.




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Post #: 878
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:17:12 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Bryansk Front. "Normality" is back. I pull back the 1st Shock and 43rd Armies.




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Post #: 879
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:19:06 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Southwestern Front, northern part (not advancing, except one tank brigade).




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Post #: 880
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:20:38 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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Post #: 881
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:22:07 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		And finally the Southern Front. Advancing.




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Post #: 882
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:25:57 AM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Anyway the south without the battle things. You can better appreciate what are my choices here.




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RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 1:31:23 AM   
TulliusDetritus


Posts: 5521
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Status: offline 		And what about Crimea? I haven't shown this map during the blizzard. Well, this place was simply quiet 2ndCAR did very well his homework AND managed to kick me out this place the turn BEFORE blizzard (T24)! Hadn't he done that...




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Post #: 884
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 4:51:02 AM   
Klydon


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

What I said! I am an utter incompetent! No, I haven't attached anything. I forgot I could do that LOL

Anyway (now trying), I only can attach AA Bns and Tricycle Regs (evil kids ride them though). Am I missing something?

Yes, Ketza, that has been my experience. Rather lousy units. I guess the future upgrades will strenghten them.

Still, I don't blame anyone of you (those who convinced me to form them) On this blizzard offensive I haven't used infiltration that much. I have basically pushed 2ndACR's forces. Suffice to say that I have almost totally ignored the Cavalry divisions as well (I have like 15). The tank brigades are the deal: lots of MPs.


They can only attach what is available at the immediate HQ they are attached to, so I am guessing that means that particular HQ does not have any sapper regiments or tank battalions attached to it. (You can't attach artillery to units). You can form new support units (1 command point each) in a HQ. By next turn, it will be filled and available to be used. You should then be able to move it to the unit in question. You do want to lock the HQ the unit reports to or the support unit may not stick unfortunately.

Hopefully this helps.

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Post #: 885
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 8:00:24 AM   
randallw

 

Posts: 2057
Joined: 9/2/2010
Status: offline 		The early cavalry corps is not very large, about 15 or 17k of men.  It sounds like the size of multiple infantry divisions, but it isn't.

Do not depend on the CV showing on a counter to see if a unit is really ready for a fight or not.  Look inside!

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Post #: 886
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 8:11:53 AM   
Tarhunnas


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From: Hex X37, Y15
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

Anyway (now trying), I only can attach AA Bns and Tricycle Regs (evil kids ride them though). Am I missing something?



Tricycle regiments with evil kids! That was good! ROFL


< Message edited by Tarhunnas -- 5/13/2011 8:12:19 AM >

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Post #: 887
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 8:17:08 AM   
Tarhunnas


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus
Ah the Cavalry Corps. I am... very disappointed with them. But I am pretty certain this is due to my OWN INCOMPETENCE!

As you may remember I created 11 on the first december turn. Theoric offensive value: around 5 (which seems threatening). Real offensive value: very poor To my surprise I found out such corps (let's say 5=x) cannot defeat a lone German infantry division (let's say a miserable ant 1=1 ). Infiltration duties? Almost zero value as well. A tank brigade is far far better.

I mentioned my own incompetence. Why? Because they were kept attached to Stavka... Had they been attached to Front Armies MAYBE their performance would have been much better.

In other words, I haven't used them correctly, I suspect


I have not gotten to the winter yet in my campaign, but even in normal weather, and in mud, cavalry is extremely good at oozing through gaps in the enemy line or exploiting and making a nuisance of themselves. It is by far the best Soviet units for that kind of missions. They are not very good at fighting though, and very brittle, so I expect them to take a beating, but if they can upset things for the Germans, that's worth it.

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Post #: 888
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 3:56:01 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Klydon

They can only attach what is available at the immediate HQ they are attached to, so I am guessing that means that particular HQ does not have any sapper regiments or tank battalions attached to it.


Ahhhh, that explains it. Thank you

You're correct, Randall, the numbers don't mean anything here. A 5=x should be supposed to defeat a 1=1 ant. But they don't, unless perhaps they have support units and are attached to a Front Army -in range. And that's what I did not do (my own incompetence).

Tarhunnas, don't make the mistakes I made. Attach support AND attach the Corps to armies. Anyway, you will find out they CANNOT infiltrate enemy lines that much. The tank brigades are much better, believe me (each army has one, sometimes two, and I may concentrate three or four -attached to Stavka- in key places). Unless the lack of support and the fact that they were attached to Stavka (next to Moscow) was the cause of the low MPs.

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Post #: 889
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/13/2011 7:27:40 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Klydon
That should give you a good core of units [Guards] to work with, especially when you can start assembly of infantry corps.



As for the Infantry Corps, I am not sure I will form a lot during 1942... As I see it they are an offensive weapon. But I am realistic. I will not push for Berlin on 1942. I will be still too weak. The AARs clearly prove this (especially PDH amazing offensives and massacres). My objectives will be unchanged (because I am well aware of this weakness): protect Moscow and Leningrad and avoid the destruction of the Red Army. As always, in that order.

On this scenario I need lots of units to play with. Especially infantry divisions that will be [of course!] concentrated in depth to stop the main German push (if there is one).

Now that does not mean I will not form infantry corps at all. Some should be formed. They will be part of the Stavka Reserve, ready to be sent to critical places -along with the Guard and Shock Armies. Defensive duties, as it should be.

But that's all I need, I think. 1943 will be the year of the Infantry Corps, no doubt.

< Message edited by TulliusDetritus -- 5/13/2011 7:30:31 PM >

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RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 8:17:02 AM   
randallw

 

Posts: 2057
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Status: offline 		A 1941 Soviet unit of CV 5 may simply have a sizable amount of equipment in it, like a tank or motor division, but it's experience level may not be that good; much of that equipment can break in one battle.

If you want to win a battle vs 1941 Germans it takes a large amount of numerical superiority, perhaps 6:1 or more.
Simply throwing a nice CV difference may not be enough.

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Post #: 891
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:26:51 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Turn 37

26 february 1942


If I well understood, this is the last turn of the blizzard thing. Well, I think I am quite happy after all And not only because I managed to bag some German units. I think I took back quite many hexes after all. I was not very optimist when I started. After all it was my first blizzard.

Apparently, getting Guards units is a very important goal. If I remember correctly I had started the offensive with only six. Now I have 44, so that makes 38 Guards Rifle divisions harvested during this long offensive.

I will also post a screenshot with the front-line on turn 24 and then now, to better appreciate what was achieved.




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Post #: 892
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:30:01 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		And the last serie of the various attacks across the whole front. Rather tedious if you ask me. I won't need to do that from now on!

Active Fronts:

Southwestern
Southern

Leningrad attacks.




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Post #: 893
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:31:59 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Volkhov and Northwest Fronts attacks. Not advancing.




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Post #: 894
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:34:17 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Kalinin Front. As always, 2ndACR was very strong. The good thing is this part of the front was not my priority.




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Post #: 895
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:36:23 PM   
TulliusDetritus


Posts: 5521
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Status: offline 		Western Front attacks.




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Post #: 896
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:37:33 PM   
TulliusDetritus


Posts: 5521
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Status: offline 		Bryansk Front attacks.




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Post #: 897
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:40:24 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		Southwestern Front massacres part one. Many many attacks here. Oh, I think I hadn't mentioned Zhukov was put in charge of this front, and Vatutin and Tolbukhin assigned to two armies of this front. I had done that during the "Mud Offensive" and they were not removed.




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Post #: 898
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:42:16 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Status: offline 		And Southwestern Front massacres part two.




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Post #: 899
RE: Stalin's in the gulag - Tullius (Soviet) vs 2ndACR ... - 5/14/2011 3:43:18 PM   
Sabre21


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Status: offline 		About how many Soviet attacks per blizzard turn were you able to make and how many failed? I was running 35 to 40 per turn with one third of them failing. There was a substantial increase in armament points after I did my testing, so I would expect numbers to be higher, just not sure by how much.

As for cavalry, I prefer to leave most of them singly as divisions since they do tend to get easily routed. I use them for infiltration more so than for direct combat. I use the various airborne corps Hq's and then leave the Hq's assigned to either Stavka or the front so as not to overload my assault armies. I'll create a single cav corps with a sapper regiment, a tank and some other support unit, and assign it along with 4 cav divisions to the abn corps Hq. That gives me some flexibility on their use. I will run several of these cav formations with each of my main blizzard counterattcking forces.

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