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RE: The door of India is open

 
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RE: The door of India is open - 5/18/2011 11:32:29 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		ok i put them not on escort of the 4Es...just 40 CAP at Karachi..if ever they're gonna escort the torpedo bombers if Rader dares to get too close with his fleet

Thanks for the inputs

(in reply to SqzMyLemon)
Post #: 571
RE: The door of India is open - 5/18/2011 11:41:41 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		I took a deep look. Cannot withdraw them now guys. I have 535 operative fighters in Northern India (p-40Es, Hurricanes I, IIa-b-c, kitties, P-38s and p-39s) and i need every one of them.
Rader is doing something strange... we're now at the 13th of June and units are moving back from Surat (from 130 to 110 units in the last 2 days)...where is he going?!

Another cargo has safely arrived at Karachi with more 30k supplies...i need to heavily escort my AKs if i want them to escape to the packwolfs of subs he has placed in front of Karachi...it's a strange ASW war...Rader has put at least 20/25 subs that every day cover the hexes in front of Karachi...my ASW air units every day attack and hit at least 2 of them but they never sinks and they keep on coming...i calculated that they've sunk something like 35 AKs in the last month.....but it's a sacrifice that my merchant navy has to pay if we want to keep Karachi living... Like the Battle of the Atlantic...cool


(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 572
RE: The door of India is open - 5/18/2011 11:42:32 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		GreyJoy, I respectfully but strongly disagree with what yuo're being told about P-38Es. They are by far most effective as CAP over your most critical bases. Don't use them as escorts, and only use them sparingly in sweeps since those involve distance and battles over enemy airfields where you lose pilots and Japan doesn't.

In my big and protacted Battle of Bombay with Q-Ball, two Allied P-38 squadrons essentially held off and eventually broke the backs of the enemy airforce. Now, there will be differences - for some reason, Q-Ball was only able to commit his airforce in fairly limited numbers. Perhaps he was having supply problems. But my P-38s were what saved my bacon. I was down to just 10 or 15 between them, but they still fought hard. (The Hurricanes were also useful, but I didn't have much luck with the P-40Es or even the P-40Ks.)

(in reply to SqzMyLemon)
Post #: 573
RE: The door of India is open - 5/18/2011 11:51:57 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

GreyJoy, I respectfully but strongly disagree with what yuo're being told about P-38Es. They are by far most effective as CAP over your most critical bases. Don't use them as escorts, and only use them sparingly in sweeps since those involve distance and battles over enemy airfields where you lose pilots and Japan doesn't.

In my big and protacted Battle of Bombay with Q-Ball, two Allied P-38 squadrons essentially held off and eventually broke the backs of the enemy airforce. Now, there will be differences - for some reason, Q-Ball was only able to commit his airforce in fairly limited numbers. Perhaps he was having supply problems. But my P-38s were what saved my bacon. I was down to just 10 or 15 between them, but they still fought hard. (The Hurricanes were also useful, but I didn't have much luck with the P-40Es or even the P-40Ks.)


Thx CR. Very helpfull as usual.

I don't plan to sweep anything in the nearby future. I need to defend my bases. Point. I don't have numbers nor reinforcements to refill my squadrons. I'll keep them on the defence for the moment and they will only be committed on escort role if the target is a naval juicy target (the KB or a BB TF)...in that case their sacrifice could mean a better protection for my Albacores and Avangers which, may lead, to a couple of fishes in a CV stomache...which will worth the price.

I made some calculations....Rader can for sure attrit me. He has pools of thousands of planes and zeros are by far superior...but he's going to pay a price for that. 500 fighters with 65/70 air skilled pilots should be a tough nut to crack even for the allmighty IJAAF and IJNAF

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 574
RE: The door of India is open - 5/19/2011 5:54:44 AM   
String


Posts: 2661
Joined: 10/7/2003
From: Estonia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

GreyJoy, I respectfully but strongly disagree with what yuo're being told about P-38Es. They are by far most effective as CAP over your most critical bases. Don't use them as escorts, and only use them sparingly in sweeps since those involve distance and battles over enemy airfields where you lose pilots and Japan doesn't.

In my big and protacted Battle of Bombay with Q-Ball, two Allied P-38 squadrons essentially held off and eventually broke the backs of the enemy airforce. Now, there will be differences - for some reason, Q-Ball was only able to commit his airforce in fairly limited numbers. Perhaps he was having supply problems. But my P-38s were what saved my bacon. I was down to just 10 or 15 between them, but they still fought hard. (The Hurricanes were also useful, but I didn't have much luck with the P-40Es or even the P-40Ks.)


Thx CR. Very helpfull as usual.

I don't plan to sweep anything in the nearby future. I need to defend my bases. Point. I don't have numbers nor reinforcements to refill my squadrons. I'll keep them on the defence for the moment and they will only be committed on escort role if the target is a naval juicy target (the KB or a BB TF)...in that case their sacrifice could mean a better protection for my Albacores and Avangers which, may lead, to a couple of fishes in a CV stomache...which will worth the price.

I made some calculations....Rader can for sure attrit me. He has pools of thousands of planes and zeros are by far superior...but he's going to pay a price for that. 500 fighters with 65/70 air skilled pilots should be a tough nut to crack even for the allmighty IJAAF and IJNAF



I'd also suggest gathering every crack pilot with high exp (and not just air skill) you can, that's still alive from the beginning of the game. You want 70ish exp, air and defence for those birds as they are very very valuable. High exp prevents ops losses from accidents and damage, and I don't have to tell you what air and defence skills achieve.

_____________________________

Surface combat TF fanboy

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 575
RE: The door of India is open - 5/19/2011 9:23:41 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		15 June 1942

A 2-days raid of 60 B17s at Indore showed that we can still hurt japanese Air Force.
The base was protected by not less than 70 fighters on CAP. Despite this stiff opposition, my bombers managed to get through without a scratch and we closed the airfield, destroying 72 planes on the ground for the loss of only 1 B-17 (operation loss!). A good result indeed that will for sure keep Rader honest. Surat may be well defended, but he cannot have heavy AA and impenetrable CAP everywhere

At the Marshalls/Gilbert we paradropped the 3rd Marine para unit at Abenama (from Baker) - 1 hex south of Tarawa - and my brave guys dislodged the Naval Guard unit that was there. Tomorrow 2 raiders battallions will attack with fast transports Makin Atoll and Nauru Island. Already moved catalinas at Abenama and a base force is being air transported there.
I sent a decoy TF (a fake amphib TF) composed of 10 APs, 5 AKs, 2 DDs, 4 APDs and 2 AVPs 13 hexes south east of Maloap...Rader managed to send 40 betties escorted by 37 zeros...they sunk everything in 2 days...well, if i needed to know how efficient are the air defences of the Marshalls even at long distances....well...now i do know. Deadly...absolutely deadly...
Think the strategy of the "fast jumps", getting close to Tarawa using para drops and fast tranports, it's the safer way to go.
Let's see now how much he has in the Bonins...he cannot be everywhere!


String...that's what i'm trying to do...not that easy however...my best pilots are already there (the AVG is in perfect shape!)

(in reply to String)
Post #: 576
RE: The door of India is open - 5/19/2011 2:22:11 PM   
Prydwen


Posts: 156
Joined: 2/23/2009
Status: offline 		That's a good result with the B17s.  Losing the transport TF is an eye opener that's for sure! Did they have any air cover?

ItsAMadHouse

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 577
RE: The door of India is open - 5/19/2011 2:36:35 PM   
jeffk3510


Posts: 4132
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Kansas
Status: offline 		GreyJoy- Why didn't you have aircover for the "fake" invasion.  IMO that is a lot of shipping to lose for just that purpose...also, I agree with CR about the P38e's, I think they're fine planes in CAP.  What is your plan to secure your supply routes to Aussie?  Do you use Capetown to Perth, or are you building up Pago Pago and Suva?

Keep it up.  Looking forward to seeing some maps and battle results.

_____________________________

Life is tough. The sooner you realize that, the easier it will be.

Currently chasing three kids around the Midwest.

(in reply to Prydwen)
Post #: 578
RE: The door of India is open - 5/19/2011 2:48:42 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Itsamadhouse and Jeff,

  didn't have air cover because i didn't want to risk...wanted to test first what he has at hand in that theatre...he said he has spotted the TF the previous turn...so he could master a concentration of 80 crack planes in only 1 turn...that's something i have to keep in mind.
P-38s are set on CAP at Karachi and at Karachi only the torpedo bombers are active so if they're gonna escort something they're gonna escort a naval strike...which deserves a good escort Imho considering the possible targets.

Pago Pago is built and well defended and Suva is being resupplied via-new Zeland.
Oz is now plenty of fuel and supplies thanks to the EastCoast-CT-Adelaide route. At the moment Pago and Suva are absolutely inactive, cause i didn't have time nor resources to create a strong connection in SOPAC...i want to be sure first that Oz has enough troops, planes and resources and then i'll think about SOPAC.

Yes, tonight i'll post some maps...nothing changed however since the latest ones posted...in India there's a statlemate...Rader is probably gathering more forces for his final push and i'm sure he has a blitz plan for the crossing of the LOD...
The combined action of the RN CVs and of the 4Es are prooving to be a good deterrent till now...


(in reply to jeffk3510)
Post #: 579
RE: The door of India is open - 5/19/2011 3:04:18 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		For those interested i just check the VP ratio...3.53 to 1 ... And the only sector where i'm gaining some ground is in the air losses...army, naval and bases the situation is well beyond the 4-1 ratio

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 580
RE: The door of India is open - 5/19/2011 3:37:17 PM   
Nemo121


Posts: 5821
Joined: 2/6/2004
Status: offline 		It is also hugely inefficient.

To see if he had bombers you only had to cause a raid to fly. For that you just needed 2 DDs... Those speedy, manoeuvrable ships can often dodge torpedoes. Instead you lost over 20 ships for information which could easily have been gained by 2 ships.

_____________________________

John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 581
RE: The door of India is open - 5/19/2011 4:12:24 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		It's better to learn by winning than by losing, whenever possible, but for most people the sting of defeat more strongly imprints on our memories than anything else will. GreyJoy is making mistakes that you might expect only a newb under pressure working too quickly to make....but that's what he is. I think we all appreciate his willingness to soldier on when many would have given up, along with his determination to trust his judgment as much as possible. He's getting clobbered in doing so - and he'd rightfully be sacked for ignoring "the voices of wisdom and experience" if this was real life - but he'll learn alot.

(in reply to Nemo121)
Post #: 582
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 1:00:27 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Sorry guys...very late here...very tired and also a little bit drunk...will update tomorrow...however lots of bad news to come

night

(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 583
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 6:18:23 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		June 15-16 1942

My "light2 operation in the Gilbert/Marshalls was a disaster.
On the 15th two APDs TFs loaded with the 1st and 3rd Raders Bns unloaded them at Makin and Nauru Is. (Abenama had already be taken by the 3rd USMC para unit)...
The fast transports, that i supposed to work as the "Tokio Express", arrived at day instead that at night and they got caught during light time while they were still unloading....he sent a full strike coordinated attack, with at list two betties daitais and what looked like 3 sentais of zeros...we ended up with 8 APDs sunk.
Makin was undefended but at Nauru we found a full strenght naval guard unit...the 3rd raider got annihilated on the beach and not a single man survived

Then the news we were waiting for...
My subs-screen reported lots of Vals and Kates flyin naval search missions....just south of the Mariannas....the KB!
He was waiting for me right in the best place he could...between the Marshalls and the Bonins.
My full scale invasion TFs (supposed to invade Tarawa, Makin, Abenama, Nauru and Ocean) that were sitting with the CVs between Christmas and PH waiting to see how strong were the jap defences in the area had been ordered to get back to PH at full speed.
The whole operation is aborted.
With the KB around ready to strike and with that efficient crack LBA defence...there's no way i can hope to invade.
Lost some small asets in this operation (20/30 minor ships) and 3 good but small units (1st and 3rd raiders and the 3rd para)...nothing vital however

Again i've been too predictable. Was clear to Rader that i wanted to counterattack somewhere and he simply chose to place his best weapon in the best place he could (Mariannas)...right between the Solomons, Gilberts/Marshalls and the Bonins...wherever i had chosen to go he would have been there waiting for me.

Oh, then Tricomale fell against 1000 AVs (2 reinforced divisions), while Manila is still holding tight!

Oh forgot to say that in the Marshalls he managed to have what i counted like 12 subs...Since he discovered 2 turns ago my decoy TF (which had been sunk yesterday) a wolfs pack of 12 subs suddenly appeared close to Tarawa...i bet my recon of the last weeks has, as Nemo pointed out, revealed my intentions more than what i hoped. Lesson learnt
...
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Jun 15, 42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Makin at 136,125

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid spotted at 17 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M2 Zero x 57
     G3M2 Nell x 22
     G4M1 Betty x 23



Japanese aircraft losses
     G4M1 Betty: 1 damaged

Allied Ships
     APD Colhoun, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
     APD McKean, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
     APD Gregory
     APD Little, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
     APD Stringham, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk



Aircraft Attacking:
     22 x G3M2 Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
              Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo
      6 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
              Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo
     17 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
              Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo


 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Nauru Island at 127,128

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 26 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M2 Zero x 27
     G3M2 Nell x 22
     G4M1 Betty x 28



Japanese aircraft losses
     G4M1 Betty: 1 damaged

Allied Ships
     APD Edsall, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
     APD Alden, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk
     APD Manley
     APD John D. Edwards
     APD Bulmer



Aircraft Attacking:
     22 x G3M2 Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
              Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo
     28 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
              Naval Attack:  1 x 18in Type 91 Torpedo




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Nauru Island (127,128)

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 522 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 23

Defending force 1164 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 49

Allied adjusted assault: 0

Japanese adjusted defense: 17

Allied assault odds: 1 to 99 (fort level 0)

Combat modifiers
Defender: preparation(-), experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+), leaders(-), disruption(-), supply(-)


Allied ground losses:
     571 casualties reported
        Squads: 42 destroyed, 0 disabled
        Non Combat: 45 destroyed, 0 disabled
        Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled


Assaulting units:
   3rd Marine Raider Bn /2

Defending units:
   51st Naval Guard Unit


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Makin (136,125)

Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 528 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 19

Defending force 0 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 0

Allied adjusted assault: 6

Japanese adjusted defense: 1

Allied assault odds: 6 to 1 (fort level 0)

Allied forces CAPTURE Makin !!!

Combat modifiers
Attacker: shock(+), leaders(-), disruption(-)



Assaulting units:
   1st Marine Raider Bn /2


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3rd Marine Raider Battalion Wiped Out at Nauru Island by attrition!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BFF Brigade Wiped Out at Bombay by attrition!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1/1 Central Detach.  Wiped Out at Bombay by attrition!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1/1 Det. West Coast  Wiped Out at Bombay by attrition!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2nd Assam Rifles Battalion Wiped Out at Bombay by attrition!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2nd Burma Brigade Wiped Out at Bombay by attrition!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
9/11th Sikh Battalion Wiped Out at Bombay by attrition!!!

Allied Unit(s) surrounded at Bombay




The only good news is that we now know where the KB is...so we can play accordingly. And, as i said, untill the KB parked right in front of Karachi, the Aden Chanell cannot be completely closed...and so India has a chance!
Another raid is planned. This time we'll strike Bombay with 60 4Es. Recon says no fighter cover at Bombay and the port is full of minor ships. Good...we'll strike there. Want to deny him the use of Bombay as an active port for his main fleet. Let's see. Now he moved back all his bombers and fighters to Surat. More than 1500 a/c spotted there

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 584
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 6:29:25 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		.

Gotta say that i'm very happy i have not committed my invasion forces. Think it was to right and wisest choice to send those fake invasion TF and those fast transport little invasions...that has activated the trap he had prepared for me...imagine what if i was now unloading at Tarawa, under the pressure of those betties and with my CVs and my BBs (not to talk about my marines regiments) exposed to the threat of the coming in KB...




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by GreyJoy -- 5/20/2011 6:30:29 AM >

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 585
The Battle of India has begun! - 5/20/2011 8:41:58 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		June 17-18 1942

Sirs, i officially announce that the Battle of India has begun.

As predicted Rader has massed his air force and decided to reduce my air fighting ability before advancing and crossing the LOD.
In two days of fights he sent nearly 2000 planes to attack Hyderabad (S).
I had 200 fighters in place, rested and weel coordinated by radar.
It's been the most exiting reply i've ever watched till now.
My boys did a great job.

We've destroyed 250 planes for a loss of 72 of ours. Lost only 10 pilots in the process while i bet that most of his pilots were captured
Flak was not a factor unfortunately.

At the same time 60 4Es attacked Bombay port and destroyed some 20 minor aux ships (AS, PB, AV, etc....and one sub).

...more news to follow...


(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 586
RE: The Battle of India has begun! - 5/20/2011 9:32:20 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Jun 17, 42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 55th British Brigade, at 42,10 (Hyderabad (Sindh))

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 17 NM, estimated altitude 24,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 87
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 30



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 12
Buffalo I x 2
Hurricane IIa Trop x 5
Hurricane IIb Trop x 34
P-38E Lightning x 13
P-40E Warhawk x 115


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 7 destroyed
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 5 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-38E Lightning: 1 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 5 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
29 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet

------------------------------------------------

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 22 NM, estimated altitude 21,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 67
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 19



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 11
Buffalo I x 1
Hurricane IIa Trop x 7
Hurricane IIb Trop x 37
P-38E Lightning x 6
P-40E Warhawk x 93


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 3 destroyed
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 3 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Fulmar II: 1 destroyed
Hurricane IIb Trop: 1 destroyed
P-38E Lightning: 1 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 4 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
25 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Hyderabad (Sindh) , at 42,10

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 162 NM, estimated altitude 22,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 64 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 24
G3M2 Nell x 71
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 11



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 9
Buffalo I x 1
Hurricane IIa Trop x 6
Hurricane IIb Trop x 32
P-38E Lightning x 1
P-40E Warhawk x 71


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 4 destroyed
G3M2 Nell: 46 destroyed, 1 damaged
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 5 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Hurricane IIb Trop: 1 destroyed



Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 3

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x G3M2 Nell bombing from 18000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 250 kg GP Bomb, 4 x 60 kg GP Bomb

---------------------------------------------

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 173 NM, estimated altitude 19,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 69 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 8
G3M2 Nell x 55
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 2



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 8
Buffalo I x 1
Hurricane IIa Trop x 5
Hurricane IIb Trop x 22
Hurricane IIc Trop x 3
P-40E Warhawk x 47


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 2 destroyed
G3M2 Nell: 34 destroyed, 2 damaged

No Allied losses



---------------------------------------------------------

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 180 NM, estimated altitude 21,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 52 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 1
Ki-21-Ic Sally x 25
Ki-21-IIa Sally x 135
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 13
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 150
Ki-49-IIa Helen x 63



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 7
Hurricane IIa Trop x 4
Hurricane IIb Trop x 17
P-40E Warhawk x 27


Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-21-IIa Sally: 1 damaged
Ki-21-IIa Sally: 1 destroyed by flak
Ki-43-Ib Oscar: 1 destroyed
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 6 destroyed
Ki-49-IIa Helen: 1 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
Hurricane IIb Trop: 1 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 2 destroyed

---------------------------------------------------------
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 172 NM, estimated altitude 19,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 54 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 31
Ki-49-IIa Helen x 20



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 3
Hurricane IIa Trop x 2
Hurricane IIb Trop x 8
P-40E Warhawk x 8


Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 7 destroyed
Ki-49-IIa Helen: 1 destroyed, 3 damaged

No Allied losses




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Hyderabad (Sindh) , at 42,10

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 185 NM, estimated altitude 24,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 61 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 36



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 2
Hurricane IIb Trop x 2
Hurricane IIc Trop x 9
P-40E Warhawk x 1


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Hurricane IIb Trop: 1 destroyed
Hurricane IIc Trop: 1 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
28 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 1st RM Heavy AA Regiment, at 42,10 (Hyderabad (Sindh))

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 174 NM, estimated altitude 21,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 57 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 2
Ki-49-Ia Helen x 32



Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIc Trop x 1
P-40E Warhawk x 1


Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-49-Ia Helen: 2 damaged
Ki-49-Ia Helen: 1 destroyed by flak

No Allied losses



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Hyderabad (Sindh) , at 42,10

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 15 NM, estimated altitude 23,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 45



Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIc Trop x 1


No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
Hurricane IIc Trop: 1 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
45 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Jun 18, 42


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Hyderabad (Sindh) , at 42,10

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 187 NM, estimated altitude 21,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 62 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 135
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 9
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 173



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 3
Buffalo I x 1
Hurricane IIa Trop x 5
Hurricane IIb Trop x 29
P-38E Lightning x 8
P-40E Warhawk x 91


Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Hurricane IIb Trop: 1 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
42 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet
31 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet
44 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 20000 feet

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on Hyderabad (Sindh) , at 42,10

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 189 NM, estimated altitude 23,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 62 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 51
Ki-43-Ib Oscar x 9
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 171



Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 3
Buffalo I x 1
Hurricane IIa Trop x 5
Hurricane IIb Trop x 22
P-38E Lightning x 6
P-40E Warhawk x 87


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 3 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed





(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 587
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 9:47:55 AM   
modrow

 

Posts: 1100
Joined: 8/27/2006
Status: offline 		GreyJoy,

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy
The only good news is that we now know where the KB is...so we can play accordingly.


Do you know that? If you just rely on certain plane types spotting/spotted by subs, I think there may be also other possibilities, depending on HRs. This is true even if you have intel re. the units the planes belong to.

Just my 2cts

Hartwig


(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 588
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 10:00:03 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: hartwig.modrow

GreyJoy,

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy
The only good news is that we now know where the KB is...so we can play accordingly.


Do you know that? If you just rely on certain plane types spotting/spotted by subs, I think there may be also other possibilities, depending on HRs. This is true even if you have intel re. the units the planes belong to.

Just my 2cts

Hartwig




No, i'm not sure in that way, but the development of the situation strongly pushes me to believe so. We had not seen a single Val or Kate for ages in the pacific. Now, suddenly, as soon as my landings begin and i show an "interest" in the Gilberts, lots of subs report Vals and Kates attacking them south of Saipan and Guam.... to me that's clearly the KB which was sitting at Saipan or maybe Truk that has been ordered to come out and intercept my TFs...
I may be wrong but i think i'm 90% right

(in reply to modrow)
Post #: 589
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 3:52:15 PM   
jeffk3510


Posts: 4132
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Kansas
Status: offline 		I can't recall what you mentioned, but I would just stress reinforcing your WestCoast/Pearl to Aussie Pacific route (Suva, Pago Pago, and such) so that you NEVER have to take that back and have a solid base of operations and continue to pump Aussie economy and get fuel and supply to SOPac....

Also- A lot of your troops arrive in Aden and fuel via Abadan, what are your plans if he shuts down India IF he takes Karachi?

BTW- nice ratio on the air battle, I would be happy with those results if it were me.  Good job.

Not sure about the KB, sounds to me like they're around also.  Could be baby KB, or he could have split it up.  I would use those forces you planned to raid the Gilbert Isl. with to strengthen Suva, Pago Pago, and that area if it were me.  Reinforcing Suva heavily also has a nice airfield 1 or 2 hexes west of it on the same island for additional support.  Not sure what the name is, but it has the inf unit that combines with the one in Suva.

How is your pilot training coming along?  Good to see your subs in the Marshalls, just remember not to move them into a port hex or a coastal hex, they'll get smoked.

Enjoying your AAR, keep it up.



< Message edited by jeffk3510 -- 5/20/2011 3:54:45 PM >

_____________________________

Life is tough. The sooner you realize that, the easier it will be.

Currently chasing three kids around the Midwest.

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 590
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 4:27:52 PM   
Erkki


Posts: 1461
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline 		Can you trap the Netties with (layered) CV CAP before you bail out, or is it too late?

_____________________________


(in reply to jeffk3510)
Post #: 591
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 4:36:13 PM   
SqzMyLemon


Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

Then the news we were waiting for...
My subs-screen reported lots of Vals and Kates flyin naval search missions....just south of the Mariannas....the KB!
He was waiting for me right in the best place he could...between the Marshalls and the Bonins.


Another possibility is those Kate's and Val's are Japanese LBA based on Guam and Saipan. Depends how far South of the Marianas you say the reports were showing up? Are we talking 6-7 hexes or farther? I'm not saying it isn't KB, but be aware that Kate and Val sightings don't guarantee they are based from carriers.

< Message edited by SqzMyLemon -- 5/20/2011 4:38:21 PM >

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 592
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 4:40:16 PM   
jeffk3510


Posts: 4132
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Kansas
Status: offline 		I realize that they could be just LBA...however he lost a lot of ships on his fake invasion and lost some more when the LBA did show up in the Gilberts invasion.  It is probably safer to assume that it is KB, pull back and dig in, instead of trying to gain a foothold on something he can't hold anyways with the current situation IF KB is around.

< Message edited by jeffk3510 -- 5/20/2011 4:41:58 PM >

_____________________________

Life is tough. The sooner you realize that, the easier it will be.

Currently chasing three kids around the Midwest.

(in reply to SqzMyLemon)
Post #: 593
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 5:19:57 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Logic says to me that one was the KB (or a mini KB) cause my subs were already there and the Vals/Kates never showed up in these months...

Also consider that it's not time for the japanese upgrades so there's no reason the jap CVs had disappeared from India since the beginning of May...the only reason is that he moved the Kb back to the pacific.

However I'm changing my plans right now...will probably persist in a "light" and slow invasion movement...without my CVs...

(in reply to jeffk3510)
Post #: 594
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 5:21:00 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Erkki

Can you trap the Netties with (layered) CV CAP before you bail out, or is it too late?


Won't risk a lucky torpedo hit just to shoot down some Netties...i've already eaten 72 of them the last turn in India

(in reply to Erkki)
Post #: 595
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 5:24:55 PM   
SqzMyLemon


Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline 		That's understood jeffk . I'm pointing out they may not be from carriers. Until he learns more from recon and gets a positive sighting of KB or any carriers, then he could just be up against Japanese LBA. Until he knows more his planned operation could still be a go. I'm not saying invade or not, that's entirely his call. I agree though, due to the uncertainty of the situation caution is warranted.

(in reply to jeffk3510)
Post #: 596
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 5:44:16 PM   
SqzMyLemon


Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

Logic says to me that one was the KB (or a mini KB) cause my subs were already there and the Vals/Kates never showed up in these months...

Also consider that it's not time for the japanese upgrades so there's no reason the jap CVs had disappeared from India since the beginning of May...the only reason is that he moved the Kb back to the pacific.

However I'm changing my plans right now...will probably persist in a "light" and slow invasion movement...without my CVs...


In light of this post I'll just add a couple more comments. Unless something has changed in the recent patches, I believe the Shokaku and Zuikaku are due for upgrades in June, so they could be upgrading as we speak. They could also be upgrading in Singapore, not the Home Islands.

Until you showed your "fake" invasion force you hadn't spotted Val's and Kate's on naval search before despite your subs being stationed there for months. Whose to know Rader didn't have LBA units stationed elsewhere for these many months and only now redeployed them to this theatre since he now knows you may be coming?

Again, I'm not trying to tell you to do anything. All I'm throwing out here is a possiblity of what you might actually be facing and not what you perceive. If it turns out to be KB and you withdraw, good on you. If it's not, and you scrap your operations completely and then learn some CV's are upgrading and the rest are no where near the theatre, than you'll have missed an opportunity. Until you know for sure where his carriers are EVERYTHING has to be considered.

Good luck.

< Message edited by SqzMyLemon -- 5/20/2011 5:46:50 PM >

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 597
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 5:57:31 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SqzMyLemon

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

Logic says to me that one was the KB (or a mini KB) cause my subs were already there and the Vals/Kates never showed up in these months...

Also consider that it's not time for the japanese upgrades so there's no reason the jap CVs had disappeared from India since the beginning of May...the only reason is that he moved the Kb back to the pacific.

However I'm changing my plans right now...will probably persist in a "light" and slow invasion movement...without my CVs...


In light of this post I'll just add a couple more comments. Unless something has changed in the recent patches, I believe the Shokaku and Zuikaku are due for upgrades in June, so they could be upgrading as we speak. They could also be upgrading in Singapore, not the Home Islands.

Until you showed your "fake" invasion force you hadn't spotted Val's and Kate's on naval search before despite your subs being stationed there for months. Whose to know Rader didn't have LBA units stationed elsewhere for these many months and only now redeployed them to this theatre since he now knows you may be coming?

Again, I'm not trying to tell you to do anything. All I'm throwing out here is a possiblity of what you might actually be facing and not what you perceive. If it turns out to be KB and you withdraw, good on you. If it's not, and you scrap your operations completely and then learn some CV's are upgrading and the rest are no where near the theatre, than you'll have missed an opportunity. Until you know for sure where his carriers are EVERYTHING has to be considered.

Good luck.


completely agree Sqz!

In fact i'm not redploying my forces as Jeff suggested. i'll keep the pressure on this theatre. I now want to use an airbridge to move engeeners and base forces to Abenama. If i manage to create a level 1 AF there i can think about moving in some 50 fighters and estabilish a foothold in the Gilberts. At the same time i'll keep my units ready to embarc at PH.
On the 16th June i recieved the CV Wasp. Now i have 6 fully operational CVs...he will have to keep a strong presence here if he wants to stop me from gaining ground...and the Nemo's Iwo Jiima operation is still ready (1000 AVs are prepping for this scope)...so if/when i'll be sure where the KB is i'll be also able to decide where to attack. In the meantime i'll be as flexible as possible.

The good thing is that if the KB is supposed to be in the pacific, it's not in India...and that means my RN CVs will be free to raid his communication lines in the Arabian sea and at the same time make risky for him any attempt to close the Aden Channell with a Surface Fleet...

After the big battle of 15th and 16th June my air force in India is in a good shape. We've lost some airframes but very few pilots. Morale is very high and we got some 10 new aces. Pools remain in goos shape and fatigue is nowhere above 15 points.
I moved my air units mixing fresh squadrons with those who partecipated yesterday...have 3 Airfields to use and i'm willing to use them all.



(in reply to SqzMyLemon)
Post #: 598
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 7:05:40 PM   
modrow

 

Posts: 1100
Joined: 8/27/2006
Status: offline 		Greyjoy,

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy
Logic says to me that one was the KB (or a mini KB) cause my subs were already there and the Vals/Kates never showed up in these months...


IMHO the key question is: Do you believe your opponent knows the mechanisms of this game well or not. If he does, he is aware that attack planes on search/ASW duty will be spotted in the way you did, so he may be showing them to you. Which, again IMHO, would explain why they show up all of a sudden just as well as KB in transit (which I cannot rule out completely either, all I say is that the information you made accessible to us may be interpreted differently without less consistency).

quote:


However I'm changing my plans right now...will probably persist in a "light" and slow invasion movement...without my CVs...


Honestly, I am slightly confused. If you are convinced you act on solid intel, it may be necessary to change plans. But

a) I was under the impression that you had come to the conclusion that your opponent's long range naval attack planes in the region are crack, deadly and take apart amphibious TFs. Now, you want to send them in without air cover.

b) can a "light and slow invasion movement" still achieve what the purpose of your operation was? Or parts of it? Can you provide a list of your original aims and those results the operation is still supposed to provide?

Just my 2cts.

Hartwig

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 599
RE: The door of India is open - 5/20/2011 8:13:45 PM   
ADB123

 

Posts: 1559
Joined: 8/18/2009
Status: offline
quote:

If i manage to create a level 1 AF there i can think about moving in some 50 fighters and estabilish a foothold in the Gilberts.


Are you aware that a Level 1 Air Field can only support defensive Air operations, such as CAP? You can't fly LR CAP or Sweeps out of a Level 1 Airfield.

What could happen if you put 50 good fighters on a Level 1 Air Field? Well, for one, IJN bombardment TFs can start to happily sail in, LR Capped by Zeros, and close your Air Field. Then, when your air field is closed, long range Bettys and Nells can start to have target practice on your troops, grounded air planes, emergency supply TFs, and so on.

Does this sound far-fetched? It doesn't to one of my Allied pbem opponents who happily invaded Tarawa in mid-42...

He now has some very good troops stuck on an atoll-prison... and this means that they aren't attacking somewhere else that is more useful to the Allies...

Take some time to think through what you would do in your opponent's place, and how you could take advantage of mistakes like this...

Good luck.

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 600
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