’42 Axis spring offensive. What next?

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East Series >> The War Room >> ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next?

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’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/5/2011 8:11:17 AM

coolts

Posts: 391
Joined: 2/1/2011
From: Auf Wiedersehen, Pet
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All through the horrible first winter I planned my objectives, assuming I survived. I had taken Leningrad, Kharkov & Kursk, neared Moscow and suffered a terrifying soviet counterattack and breakout from the Crimea which pushed me back to the Dnepr.

My order of business was;

1. Push the enemy back into the Crimean peninsula, break the bridge defences and take Sevastopol. Form defences at Kerch to withstand Russian winter ’42 offensive.
2. Push AGS east and take Stalino then Rostov (& suburbs), trigger split of AGS to ease admin burden
3. Dislodge entire southern Russian defensive line from high entrenchments using panzers and threat of encirclements
4. Take Moscow
5. After that, inflict maximum unsustainable casualties on the enemy armed forces.
6. Reduce their access to vital resources

As you can see from the images, I have them on the back foot in the south. I have achieved objectives 1-3, (although the Crimean success was due to the AI evacuating the area last turn, presumably in reaction to my bringing 2 x panzer corps to Rostov and obliterating their containment line.

My possible revised plan may be.

• Link forces along the east coast of the Azov Sea. This will draw away reinforcements from the north but I can’t see the strategic value unless I plan to cut the railroads heading north and the supplies to the enemy.
• Head to the Volga, take Stalingrad and cut the main north/south railroads. Would that cut all Georgian resources from the enemy supply grid? If so it’s worth it, but there is a railroad in the far far east from Guriev running north. Can the enemy still ship resources across the Caspain sea to this line into his grid? If so, then Stalingrad is worthless apart from the manpower, etc.
• Maintain a static line in the South and turn over reserves to AGC for……
• The creation of a huge pocket around Moscow. He isn’t retreating here so this is doable but I need more forces from the south to do it.
• Once taken, I am tempted to push north as there is a huge Russian army up there threatening the Finnish lines. Not ideal tank country but if I used HQ build-up I reckon I could trap a lot. It would make winter ’42 look a whole lot rosier up north.

Thoughts?

This is the furthest I have ever got in a GC and I am not willing to go on the defensive unless I have to. Its late July and there is a whole summer of offensive possibilities in front of me.

What to do in ’42?

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< Message edited by coolts -- 7/5/2011 10:48:09 AM >

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"Gauls! We have nothing to fear; except perhaps that the sky may fall on our heads tomorrow. But as we all know, tomorrow never comes!!" - Chief Vitalstatistix

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/5/2011 3:16:20 PM

Q-Ball

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From: Chicago, Illinois
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You are in good shape. The Red Army looks small compared to yours, and it appears you already have the makings of a breakout south of Rostov.

I would definitely pinch Moscow as you plan. The worst that can happen is that you take Moscow. The best that can happen is that you do that, PLUS pocket all those units.

Once that happens, though, plan on moving all those Panzers SOUTH, unless he is so weak in front of Moscow that you can't stop. But the terrain there favors the Reds.

That looks like a nice breakout in the South.

You don't need to attack with the Finns, unless you feel you need to pin all those units up there. He has alot up there, not sure why. Careful with running the Finns to dust, they don't get many replacements.

Sevastopol isn't that important; you could just part some units there to dig-in and keep an eye on things, while you push into the Caucausus; that's more important.

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/5/2011 3:28:06 PM

coolts

Posts: 391
Joined: 2/1/2011
From: Auf Wiedersehen, Pet
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Cheers Q-ball.

The northern idea was purely to bag all those reds pressing against the Finns. His unit’s aren’t strong; there are just loads of them. I will have 2 deep lvl 4 forts up there by winter if I stay put.

I think he plans a major winter assault up there.

I’m just not sure where to prioritise now. A southern breakout where? Case Blau w/Stalingrad then a march to Baku & the Caspian Sea? That will stretch the front a lot IMO.

I want to shorten my lines but the north definitely isn’t Panzer friendly. The centre can be broken but I don’t see many juicy targets. I may batter him back to the Don and setup defensive lines there and concentrate on the Caucasus.

Or hang around Moscow and keep massacring al the reinforcements he send there to recapture it.

< Message edited by coolts -- 7/5/2011 3:29:59 PM >

_____________________________

"Gauls! We have nothing to fear; except perhaps that the sky may fall on our heads tomorrow. But as we all know, tomorrow never comes!!" - Chief Vitalstatistix

(in reply to Q-Ball)

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/6/2011 12:58:51 AM

achillesdave

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Joined: 6/22/2011
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Your situation looks full of possibilties. I just went through my first blizzard and things were looking grim for the wehrmacht in the beginning of March. The bolsheviks had found a weak spot between the 4th and 6th armies which they were able to widen and their armies poured through the breach. Sixth army held the shoulder and its front under tremendous pressure waiting for the blizzard to break so the panzers could counter attack.

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< Message edited by achillesdave -- 7/6/2011 1:32:33 AM >

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/6/2011 1:05:15 AM

achillesdave

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The weather cleared and a long awaited counter attack was launched. Over 100 Russian formations were caught and destroyed in the Chernigov pocket.

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/6/2011 1:28:20 AM

achillesdave

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17th army was able to hold Zaporozhye and Dnepropetrovsk but I did have one division surrounded and annihilated. It was time for some payback. Operation sickle stroke bagged another 60+ formations.

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/6/2011 11:21:28 AM

coolts

Posts: 391
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From: Auf Wiedersehen, Pet
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Wow. You got him well there!

I have decided that of the 4 Panzer Armies, I am sending 2 of them to form the pincers around Moscow, and the other two to army groups south A & B. AGS-A will take Stalingrad and form an E-W perimeter defence for AGS-B which will head into the Caucasus and take all the oil fields and ports from the Russians. I will halt attacks and even retreat a few hexes In the centre to reduce attrition on those forces not involved in offensives.

I am moving all Axis Allied tank divisions to the German Panzer armies. They may benefit from better command structures and they are mainly for pocket sealing anyway so mobility is key. There are too many infantry divisions in the Panzer groups IMO.

< Message edited by coolts -- 7/6/2011 11:22:17 AM >

_____________________________

"Gauls! We have nothing to fear; except perhaps that the sky may fall on our heads tomorrow. But as we all know, tomorrow never comes!!" - Chief Vitalstatistix

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/6/2011 6:13:38 PM

Encircled

Posts: 2024
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From: Northern England
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Was that against a Human or the AI?

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/6/2011 6:37:36 PM

DTurtle

Posts: 443
Joined: 4/26/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: coolts

• Head to the Volga, take Stalingrad and cut the main north/south railroads. Would that cut all Georgian resources from the enemy supply grid? If so it’s worth it, but there is a railroad in the far far east from Guriev running north. Can the enemy still ship resources across the Caspain sea to this line into his grid? If so, then Stalingrad is worthless apart from the manpower, etc.

Baku is one of the two Soviet supply sources. Cutting the railroads does nothing except hinder troop movement south. It has no influence at all on resources or supplies.

(in reply to coolts)

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/7/2011 9:31:28 AM

davetheroad

Posts: 73
Joined: 8/10/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DTurtle

quote:

ORIGINAL: coolts

• Head to the Volga, take Stalingrad and cut the main north/south railroads. Would that cut all Georgian resources from the enemy supply grid? If so it’s worth it, but there is a railroad in the far far east from Guriev running north. Can the enemy still ship resources across the Caspain sea to this line into his grid? If so, then Stalingrad is worthless apart from the manpower, etc.

Baku is one of the two Soviet supply sources. Cutting the railroads does nothing except hinder troop movement south. It has no influence at all on resources or supplies.

In reality cutting the north south rail line would have reduced the supply of oil northwards, at least until the russians put in place alternative routes and even then there would probably have been some permanent reduction.

the designers need to cheat here and pot some of the russin oil wells on the Baku-Astrakhan line so the germans can destroy them or force the russians to move them. Yes, you can move a oilfield as you are capping or destroying the wells and moving the equipment and technicians.

(in reply to DTurtle)

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RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/7/2011 2:46:39 PM

pat.casey

Posts: 393
Joined: 9/10/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: davetheroad

quote:

ORIGINAL: DTurtle

quote:

ORIGINAL: coolts

• Head to the Volga, take Stalingrad and cut the main north/south railroads. Would that cut all Georgian resources from the enemy supply grid? If so it’s worth it, but there is a railroad in the far far east from Guriev running north. Can the enemy still ship resources across the Caspain sea to this line into his grid? If so, then Stalingrad is worthless apart from the manpower, etc.

Baku is one of the two Soviet supply sources. Cutting the railroads does nothing except hinder troop movement south. It has no influence at all on resources or supplies.

In reality cutting the north south rail line would have reduced the supply of oil northwards, at least until the russians put in place alternative routes and even then there would probably have been some permanent reduction.

the designers need to cheat here and pot some of the russin oil wells on the Baku-Astrakhan line so the germans can destroy them or force the russians to move them. Yes, you can move a oilfield as you are capping or destroying the wells and moving the equipment and technicians.

Worth pointing out that I don't think the Baku-Astrakan line was even built until the winter of 41->42. I think pre-war all that oil came up through Rostov or the line jsut east of it so 1941 at least just taking Rostov and cutting the rail east of it would have cut off the rest of the SU from the majority of the oil in the caucuses.

(in reply to davetheroad)

Post #: 11

RE: ’42 Axis spring offensive. What next? - 7/7/2011 3:26:48 PM

davetheroad

Posts: 73
Joined: 8/10/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: pat.casey

quote:

ORIGINAL: davetheroad

quote:

ORIGINAL: DTurtle

quote:

ORIGINAL: coolts

• Head to the Volga, take Stalingrad and cut the main north/south railroads. Would that cut all Georgian resources from the enemy supply grid? If so it’s worth it, but there is a railroad in the far far east from Guriev running north. Can the enemy still ship resources across the Caspain sea to this line into his grid? If so, then Stalingrad is worthless apart from the manpower, etc.

Baku is one of the two Soviet supply sources. Cutting the railroads does nothing except hinder troop movement south. It has no influence at all on resources or supplies.

In reality cutting the north south rail line would have reduced the supply of oil northwards, at least until the russians put in place alternative routes and even then there would probably have been some permanent reduction.

the designers need to cheat here and pot some of the russin oil wells on the Baku-Astrakhan line so the germans can destroy them or force the russians to move them. Yes, you can move a oilfield as you are capping or destroying the wells and moving the equipment and technicians.

Worth pointing out that I don't think the Baku-Astrakan line was even built until the winter of 41->42. I think pre-war all that oil came up through Rostov or the line jsut east of it so 1941 at least just taking Rostov and cutting the rail east of it would have cut off the rest of the SU from the majority of the oil in the caucuses.

True. I can't find out precisely when the russians decided they needed the new line, when they started construction and how long it took to build. Maybe the game should have oil wells that can be bumped like airfields and HQ's. Stack a bunch of them east of Rostov and if the germans bump them they move east and don't produce for a few weeks.
It goes like this.
germans approach the rostov rail links
the game starts building the Caspain line which is simulated by gradually transferring the 'wells' to the new rail line. If they get bumped in their original location they stop producing for a while
By summer 42 they have all transferred to the caspain rail line.
If the germans bump them again they relocate to the Urals.
All this nonsense would not be needed if the game had got it right from the start.

(in reply to pat.casey)

Post #: 12