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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids)

 
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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/5/2011 8:34:38 AM   
76mm


Posts: 4688
Joined: 5/2/2004
From: Washington, DC
Status: offline 		In 1942 for the Sovs there is only one rule: do everything possible to avoid large encirclements (or lots of small ones). I'm generally surprised how many Sov players try to hold exposed salients in 1942, and end up paying the price.

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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/7/2011 8:02:22 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Turn 70. October 15 1942.

The joys and dangers of random weather! Snow over most of the front, with mud only in the south. I was expecting mud, so when I opened up the turn and saw all white, I thought I had opened up a file from my game with Q-Ball by mistake!




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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/7/2011 8:08:06 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		The reds seem to be intent on creating trouble in the Tambov area! I will refuse to be deflected from may aim. 2d army will have to handle that by themselves.




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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/7/2011 8:40:43 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Not much happening due to the weather and poor supply situation. Both Stalingrad and Rostov hold out. The Voroshilovgrad pocket is slowly being reduced.

Map after Axis moves.




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(in reply to Tarhunnas)
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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/7/2011 8:49:35 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Destroyed units after turn 70.




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Post #: 305
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/8/2011 12:06:06 AM   
DTurtle

 

Posts: 443
Joined: 4/26/2010
Status: offline 		Wow, thats a lot of Soviet units killed - the equivalent of close to 600 divisions.

Whats your plan after clearing out the pockets? Sit tight for the winter? Or are you going to try to exploit as far as possible towards Baku (or maybe try and cut off the Crimean Peninsula)?

(in reply to Tarhunnas)
Post #: 306
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/11/2011 6:36:04 PM   
Tarhunnas


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DTurtle

Wow, thats a lot of Soviet units killed - the equivalent of close to 600 divisions.

Whats your plan after clearing out the pockets? Sit tight for the winter? Or are you going to try to exploit as far as possible towards Baku (or maybe try and cut off the Crimean Peninsula)?



I am happy to take Stalingrad and Rostov an then settle down for winter. Then I'll see how the force levels seem for 1943, if there appears to be any chance of a final offensive pushing the Soviets out of the war.

(in reply to DTurtle)
Post #: 307
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/11/2011 6:39:45 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Turn 71. Mud over the whole front.

I have some supply problems at Stalingrad. Sheer distance to the railheads are causing my units to be isolated. I don't want to give up the siege of Stalingrad and pull back, so I stick it out. This is caused by the Soviet attacks on my northern flank, you can see the point where the Soviets are stopping rail traffic, just at the northern edge of the picture. Rail construction is progresssing north of Rostov however, and this temprary supply bottleneck should be just a bad memory in a turn or two. Map after Axis moves turn 71.




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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/11/2011 7:25:05 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		414 Rifle Divisions? Not to mention 154 Artillery Regiments. That is staggering unit carnage, about 560 Divisions. And you haven't even cleaned-up the Voroshilovgrad pocket yet!


Well done, at a minimum he isn't getting to Berlin, but a 1943 offensive is realistic here, particularly once you liquidate the Voroshilovgrad pocket and move those units up.

He probably is running on EMPTY as far as APs; this is his biggest problem I bet. He might have plenty of men and Arm points in pool, but he can't use them without units.

If every unit you hit appears full-strength, I bet he is out of APs, and is simply topping-off every unit he has because he has no choice. That would also be why you have seen so few Corps, apparently.

If that is the case, then keep going on unit destruction, because you have destroyed so many counters, he could be screwed. It looks like you have destroyed about 210-230 divisions in 1942; it takes 2,100-2,300 APs or so to re-build that. He probably needs to spend APs on that, and NOT on Corps or Artillery Divisions or the other stuff that he needs to fight back.


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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/12/2011 8:06:27 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Turn 72. October 29 1942. Mud.

Rostov falls to a concerted assault. Otherwise not much happening due to the mud. The supply situation is still precarious at Stalingrad.




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(in reply to Q-Ball)
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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/13/2011 9:20:22 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Turn 73. Snow at Stalingrad. However, despite an energetic assault, the city is still holding out!

Map of northern flank from Stalingrad to Tula. The situation at Tambov is being contained, but it has absorbed some reinforcements.




Comment: The situation is remarkably like the real Stalingrad situation. Everything is going fine until Stalingrad, then stalemate and exposed flanks. It is my luck that the Soviets have no large reserves to attack my flanks (I think).

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< Message edited by Tarhunnas -- 7/13/2011 9:44:40 PM >

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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/14/2011 3:15:31 AM   
jonreb31


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tarhunnas
It is my luck that the Soviets have no large reserves to attack my flanks (I think).


Hitler thought the same thing!

But I think you might be right. The Red Army is a shell of it's historical equivalent with the beating you have given it.


< Message edited by JonReb -- 7/14/2011 4:47:02 AM >

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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/14/2011 4:28:55 AM   
PeeDeeAitch


Posts: 1276
Joined: 1/1/2007
From: Laramie, Wyoming
Status: offline 		You need more Romanians on your flanks.

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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/14/2011 4:37:57 AM   
Klydon


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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeeDeeAitch

You need more Romanians on your flanks.


Don't forget the Italians!

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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/14/2011 7:06:45 PM   
Q-Ball


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Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		I think you have to finish-off Stalingrad; after that, what are your strategic plans?

That is a mighty-long front. I wonder if a strategic pullback to the Don/Donets/Kalitva river line might be a good idea come spring. It's pointless to do it now since they are frozen solid. Unless you are going for Auto-Victory. You must be close.

How close are you to Auto-Victory?

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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 5:02:04 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

I think you have to finish-off Stalingrad; after that, what are your strategic plans?

That is a mighty-long front. I wonder if a strategic pullback to the Don/Donets/Kalitva river line might be a good idea come spring. It's pointless to do it now since they are frozen solid. Unless you are going for Auto-Victory. You must be close.

How close are you to Auto-Victory?


I need another 35 VPs for auto victory, so it will not be coming easy.

I might fall back, my front is longer than I can really defend with adequate reserves.




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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 5:04:09 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Turn 74. November 12 1942. Snow.

The pesky Soviets have dug up some tank corps somewhere and launched an offensive to relieve Stalingrad! And they have succeeded to push a corridor to the city!

Map before Axis moves.




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(in reply to Tarhunnas)
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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 5:39:49 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		The south after Axis moves. Encirclement of Stalingrad is reestablished, but it is still vulnerable to counterattacks. The Vorozhilovgrad pocket is finally mopped up, which will release troops for shoring up the northern flank and reinforce the siege of Stalingrad.




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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 5:42:22 PM   
Flaviusx


Posts: 7750
Joined: 9/9/2009
From: Southern California
Status: offline 		Forget the autowin. Fall back, fight a mobile battle, chew up the Red Army some more.

Maybe go for the autowin in summer of 43. But it's really not necessary here, you can win the game on points and run out the clock.

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(in reply to Tarhunnas)
Post #: 319
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 5:53:45 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		I think you are right. It is very apparent that as soon as the Germans run out of steam and get too stretched, the amount of "negative front" becomes a problem. And I don't think I will be achieving much more at Stalingrad.

If the Soviets had had adequate forces for a counterattack I would be at severe risk.

(in reply to Flaviusx)
Post #: 320
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 6:15:07 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		Keep attacking at Stalingrad. What's the worst that can happen?

Seriously, I would finish what you can and pull-back, but slowly. Maybe you can lull him into putting a couple Tank Corps forward where they can be mauled.

I would have the objective of being on the Don/Donets/Kalitva line when spring MUD hits, with fall-back lines of course behind that.

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Post #: 321
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 7:33:15 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Turn 75. November 19 1942. Snow.

The Soviets have launched a nasty little offensive at Tambov, encircling four divisions! Apparently, there is still some oomph left in the Soviet army!

In addition, they have once again reopened a supply line to Stalingrad!

Comment: Interesting, the Tambov area in this game corresponds more or less to Stalingrad in the historical campaign, being in the middle of an extenden flank, and the Soviets have skillfully surprised me and made a mini-Stalingrad at Tambov.






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< Message edited by Tarhunnas -- 7/15/2011 7:34:38 PM >

(in reply to Q-Ball)
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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 9:53:22 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		I have started to retreat from Stalingrad, it is costing too much. I will establish a line on the Don, and then build up for an offensive in 1943.

Tambov has been temporarily relived, but I have to divert a lot of reinforcements to the area.




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(in reply to Tarhunnas)
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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 9:54:49 PM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		OOB and losses, as it was some time since I posted them.




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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/15/2011 10:12:41 PM   
Klydon


Posts: 2251
Joined: 11/28/2010
Status: offline 		Have you gotten far enough past Rostov to activate AG A and B? You are very close there and certainly worth your time to trigger the activation in order to help get your army group commands off overload. You would get them no matter what at some point in 43, but I think its worth it to get early if you can. 

(in reply to Tarhunnas)
Post #: 325
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/16/2011 7:27:23 AM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Klydon

Have you gotten far enough past Rostov to activate AG A and B? You are very close there and certainly worth your time to trigger the activation in order to help get your army group commands off overload. You would get them no matter what at some point in 43, but I think its worth it to get early if you can. 


It was done about six weeks ago.

(in reply to Klydon)
Post #: 326
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/16/2011 7:31:27 AM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Turn 76. November 26 1942. Snow.

The Soviets have made another breakthrough at Tambov, and now the situation is worse than before. Amazing how the Red Army can regenerate. The Soviets are seemingly growing guards divisions and tank corps from the ground, despite the beating they have endured! I am in trouble in some spots and I have to rebalance my forces.

Map before German moves.




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(in reply to Tarhunnas)
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RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/16/2011 7:37:00 AM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		The situation is stabilised at Tambov with a massive inflow of reinforcements, including a panzer corps from 4th Panzer Army. As can be seen, my command structure is a mess! This is due to the rapid shifting of reinforcements to troublespots, and the AP drain of reorganising after the army group A and B divide, as well as the repercussions of 11th Army being withdrawn.

Map of Tambov area after Axis moves. Two Soviet tank corps are themselves encircled and the hungarians are arriving to bolster the front after having finished reducing the Vorozhilovgrad pocket.




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(in reply to Tarhunnas)
Post #: 328
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/17/2011 7:24:36 AM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		Turn 77. December 3 1942. Snow.

Strike and counterstrike at Tambov. The Soviets have freed their two tank corps, and have once again surrounded Tambov. Note also how partisans are creating trouble, almost like they were supporting the Soviet attacks. I suppose there is no such functionality... or? Map before Axis moves.




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< Message edited by Tarhunnas -- 7/17/2011 7:26:00 AM >

(in reply to Tarhunnas)
Post #: 329
RE: 1.04 The Wolf and the Bear (no Gids) - 7/17/2011 7:29:10 AM   
Tarhunnas


Posts: 3152
Joined: 1/27/2011
From: Hex X37, Y15
Status: offline 		After Axis moves. 2d Panzer Army is being railed to the area. If the Soviets continue to be persistent, there might be an opportunity to cut off some of their best units in a larger counterstroke. Meanwhile, the Hungarian armored division has discovered a weakness further east. It is apparent that the Soviets are throwing everything into their offensive efforts at Tambov, and are leaving their flanks weak...




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