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RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 2:59:07 AM   
Mynok


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I love the ebooks for reference materials and the cheap, read-once-and-pitch kind of stuff that's great for airplane trips. But I also have a nice leatherbound collection of the classics that they will pry from my cold dead hands.



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Post #: 31
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 4:09:57 AM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3611
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
Status: offline 		Bullwinkle58, I have to ask, where are the first 57 Bullwinkles?

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After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

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Post #: 32
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 4:16:19 AM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ilovestrategy

Bullwinkle58, I have to ask, where are the first 57 Bullwinkles?


Shallow graves outside Frostbite Falls.

Take the guns, leave the lutefisk.

< Message edited by Bullwinkle58 -- 7/21/2011 4:19:19 AM >

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The Moose

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Post #: 33
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 5:38:16 AM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		I am not a technophobe by any means. I am the first person I knew that had an email address. (Compuserve anyone?) But I still want to get up in the morning and read the paper at the table while ignoring my wife's conversation. And in the evening after doing my AE turn, I want a real book in my hand. I don't think that will ever change for me. I will get a pad soon and use it as a reader perhaps when traveling, but that is about it.

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Post #: 34
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 4:20:04 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mynok


I love the ebooks for reference materials and the cheap, read-once-and-pitch kind of stuff that's great for airplane trips. But I also have a nice leatherbound collection of the classics that they will pry from my cold dead hands.




There will always be a niche market for classic publications, even if they get a parraell eFormat. A friend of mine just recently bought an entire 14 book original land of Oz collection printed in the early 1900's from a local used book store here in Seattle. She was so exstatic it was infectious. While i'm not a fan of the works, i appreciated the antiquity of said books.....they were in remarkably good condition for being so old. No highlighters for these!

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Post #: 35
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 4:26:49 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CaptDave

I'm a book lover and always will be, but I'm not particularly saddened about Borders going away.  While the main reason for their liquidation is their failure to adapt their business model to accommodate electronic publishing, a not-insignificant part is also their model of trying to be the low-price leader in books.  That meant I couldn't find durable, high-quality (physical, not content) non-fiction books.  Their World War II selections, for example, were 97-98% soft cover of some sort, and those just don't hold up over time.

I might be more interested in electronic publications when (1) the readers can accommodate, in a user-friendly manner, multiple simultaneous bookmarks for easy jumping back and forth, and (2) the proprietary formats go away.  Books can be read by any standard-issue eyeball, but those published specifically for Kindle can't be read on Nook and vice versa.  Note to manufcaturers: I don't do "proprietary" anything unless I absolutely have no choice.



The Kindle does a pretty good job in regards notes, highlights and bookmarks. The DX version is large enough to substitute for most Hardcover books and is also big enough for it's QWERTY style keyboard to be used quickly for said note taking. There are still some bugs of course. For some reason, "Shattered Sword"'s conversion for example causes problems when browsing your self made notes.......24 pages of scrolling through them causes the device to freeze and reboot. Amazon had to open a ticket for me on that. Initially we thought it was a fault in the device itself but the problem is specific only to this downloaded book. Interesting.

I'd like to see improvements in parsing through one's notes in future Kindle firmware releases but other than that i've been happy with it. (SS alone had something like 190 pages of "notes and highlights" i'd taken. The ability to scroll/parse through these on seperate "e-pages" cuts down on the need to write as many actual notes vs. highlights as the summary screen makes it pretty clear the reason behind said highlight.

The improved e-Ink screen is a beauty. No glare as with LCD devices like iPad, Nook or Android. Easy on the eyes. I have no need for "color" as i don't do magazines and most war era books have only BW photos anyway. The Kindle displays photos very well. With this device i can focus my "book" collecting on the larger technical references that arn't available in Kindle format anyway.

Biggest problem now is getting the publishers to convert older works into eFormat.


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Post #: 36
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 6:36:40 PM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		Actually, the kindle or pad is perfect for college text books. Especially for underlining highlighting and note taking. I pretty much destroyed any book that I ever had with my highlighter. But I wonder if they will do it as college texts books are such a racket for generating revenue.

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Post #: 37
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 7:13:05 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		as a recent college student....i can hardily agree....both from the viewpoint of my wallet as well as that of my lower back (those textbooks are BIG and HEAVY)

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Post #: 38
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 7:19:35 PM   
Sredni

 

Posts: 705
Joined: 9/30/2004
From: Canada
Status: offline 		I wonder how the resale of e-books works. A lot of textbooks get resold the next year but I don't really see any infrastructure in place to do so with e-books. Then again it's been years since I was in a university, the kids these days might have e-book sales websites or something.

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Post #: 39
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 7:37:34 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		they could use a system similar to what my local library is now doing, whereby you can "check out" books on your eReader like a Kindle. You could 'rent' the needed textbook for a fee then delete it when your done. More likely they'll do it the old fashioned way....you buy it....you own it......and wait for the next revision to come out.


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Post #: 40
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 7:56:35 PM   
kaleun

 

Posts: 5145
Joined: 5/29/2002
From: Colorado
Status: offline 		They already have a system for renting textbooks in amazon.

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Post #: 41
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 9:15:10 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nikademus

There will always be a niche market for classic publications, even if they get a parraell eFormat. A friend of mine just recently bought an entire 14 book original land of Oz collection printed in the early 1900's from a local used book store here in Seattle. She was so exstatic it was infectious. While i'm not a fan of the works, i appreciated the antiquity of said books.....they were in remarkably good condition for being so old. No highlighters for these!


The e-book my wife d/led at the McDs in Bismark was "The Wizard of Oz." Not a classic hold-in-your-hand volume with the smell of a century, but OTOH it was free, and took less than a minute to acquire from the booth while eating fries.

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The Moose

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Post #: 42
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 9:17:31 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mynok


I love the ebooks for reference materials and the cheap, read-once-and-pitch kind of stuff that's great for airplane trips. But I also have a nice leatherbound collection of the classics that they will pry from my cold dead hands.


Like at the the beginning of Young Frankenstein?

(in reply to Mynok)
Post #: 43
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 10:50:01 PM   
Mynok


Posts: 12108
Joined: 11/30/2002
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I wouldn't know.

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Post #: 44
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 10:56:02 PM   
warspite1


Posts: 41353
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

But I still want to get up in the morning and read the paper at the table while ignoring my wife's conversation.
Warspite1



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Post #: 45
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/21/2011 11:54:48 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mynok


I wouldn't know.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sPTqn66I0M

About 4mins 15sec in.

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Post #: 46
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/22/2011 1:42:10 AM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3611
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

But I still want to get up in the morning and read the paper at the table while ignoring my wife's conversation.



This is me while reading PC Gamer.

_____________________________

After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 47
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/22/2011 7:25:36 PM   
zuluhour


Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		Every book will be a collectors item. It took all night to burn a couple a thousand editions in Germany one night, wait till someone can do it with a keystroke.

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Post #: 48
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/23/2011 2:37:14 AM   
usersatch

 

Posts: 400
Joined: 6/1/2005
Status: offline 		Gonna check them out tomorrow. Hopefully, I can help them clean out their WW2 section at a discount 

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Post #: 49
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/23/2011 3:20:00 AM   
BrucePowers


Posts: 12094
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I'd be surprised if there isn't always a place for "real" books.  A certain percentage of the population puts a premium on honest-to-goodness print publications, so you'll always find them - newspapers, magazines and books.

It might be the same thing with games.  They've gone predominantly electronic, but companies still sell alot of the old-fashioned kind - from Monopoly to Trivail Pursuit to Scruples.

The "old-fashioned" might become a niche market, but I think it will be a sizeable niche.  I'll be one of the people populating the niche.  I still read all three the old-fashioned way and will do so as long as they are available.


I was in a game shop last week. I remember back in the 90's hearing that the computer would be the death of the board game. WEll I saw more titles than I can mention. The Settler's of Catalan, a dozen Axis and Allied variants, railroad empire building games, a high quality WWI air combat game, airline building games, and some very complex wargames from all eras.

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Post #: 50
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/23/2011 4:07:34 AM   
Ketza


Posts: 2227
Joined: 1/14/2007
From: Columbia, Maryland
Status: offline 		I will miss my days at the Borders in Columbia, Maryland. I would play hookey from work, grab a bunch of military history magazines from the rack, get a piece of carrot cake and an orange soda and settle in one of those big cumfy leather chairs and read without a care in the world for hours. I did this once a month or so for over 5 years.

When I heard they were closing I went down there on Thursday and as fate would have it, I BOUGHT THE VERY LAST PIECE OF CARROT CAKE TO EVER BE SOLD AT THAT BORDERS.

My girl behind the counter who had so ably served me for years was just about in tears. They were running out of stuff in the coffee bar and there was never going to be a resupply. The little case that had always held so many delicious baked goods was almost empty.

I suppose I will get over it and head to the Barnes and Noble which is a few miles further away.

(in reply to CV 2)
Post #: 51
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/23/2011 5:21:44 PM   
Chijohnaok2


Posts: 628
Joined: 7/29/2002
From: Florida, USA (formerly Chicago)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CV 2

Actually, the beginning of the end of Boarders began when they were bought out by K Mart back in the early 90s.

I know Im in the minority on this, but I would rarely if ever buy a book on line. If I want a book, I want it now. I also want to be able to leaf through it to make sure it is really what I want.


I have a Barnes & Noble Nook (the older, 3G version). You can walk into any B&N bookstore and spend up to an hour per visit reading any book (even ones you have not purchased). This should allow you enough time to determine if you wish to purchase or not.

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Feel free to drop by and chat about whatever is on your mind.

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Post #: 52
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/23/2011 6:31:33 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline 		Amazon also lets you download "samples" of it's books online before you purchase. One thing i'm liking about the e-versions, they tend to be far cheaper.

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Post #: 53
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/23/2011 6:51:55 PM   
Mynok


Posts: 12108
Joined: 11/30/2002
Status: offline
Yes. Except when there's no ebook version.


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Post #: 54
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/23/2011 8:23:58 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Edited as a quality-control measure.

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 7/23/2011 8:35:50 PM >

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Post #: 55
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/23/2011 9:16:25 PM   
tblersch

 

Posts: 77
Joined: 8/4/2004
Status: offline 		Little known fact: Borders was the first into the e-reader market, partnering with Sony and selling Sony's e-readers.

Why is this a little-known fact? Because, aside from Sony's early e-readers being crap, Borders had positively no clue how to market them (they were usually placed in a revolving wire rack in some corner near the registers - as though a $300 device is an impulse buy for most people), and even if they did they had no internet presence to leverage them, seeing how they handed over their entire internet presence to Amazon very early on.

That, in a nutshell, demonstrates just how poorly managed Borders was at the strategic level. I'm going to miss the stores (every one around me had a very good military history section with excellent variety - also not a good business model in a mass-sales, thin-margin business), but the company was so badly managed it deserves to be liquidated.

(in reply to Mynok)
Post #: 56
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/24/2011 8:25:31 PM   
Nikademus


Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mynok


Yes. Except when there's no ebook version.




point.....you can imagine how much of late i've been bugging Amazon's servers by continually pressing the button for "LET THE PUBLISHER KNOW YOU WANT THIS BOOK IN KINDLE VESION!!"

click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click
click click click click click click click


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Post #: 57
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/24/2011 8:59:21 PM   
ilovestrategy


Posts: 3611
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mynok


Yes. Except when there's no ebook version.



Amen! I haven't bought an E book yet because I can't find anyone that has an E book version of my favorite series, David Eddings "The Belgariad"

_____________________________

After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

(in reply to Mynok)
Post #: 58
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/25/2011 7:30:59 AM   
CaptBeefheart


Posts: 2301
Joined: 7/4/2003
From: Seoul, Korea
Status: offline 		A friend of mine here in Korea used to work in "public relations" for Borders in Michigan, which means he took the highest level of complaints (i.e. the real doozies would filter all the way to him). He has some excellent stories. You wouldn't believe some of the things people would do to steal a few bucks from the system--actually, sadly, you might believe it. Anyway, he said the CEO was completely clueless and hamfisted and had no idea how to take on Amazon. So, I wouldn't cry for Borders, Argentina.

Cheers,
CC

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Beer, because barley makes lousy bread.

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Post #: 59
RE: OT - End of an era Borders Closes - 7/25/2011 10:38:10 AM   
wild_Willie2


Posts: 2934
Joined: 10/8/2004
From: Arnhem (holland) yes a bridge to far...
Status: offline 		@Ilovestrategy

If you want the ebook version of the "The Belgariad", you can simply download an illegal copy from the web in Epub (found it easy enough) and send a few $ to the author as compensation...

W.

< Message edited by wild_Willie2 -- 7/25/2011 10:39:53 AM >

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In vinum illic est sapientia , in matera illic est vires , in aqua illic es bacteria.

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Post #: 60
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