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What use for German RHG units?

 
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What use for German RHG units? - 8/18/2011 9:24:32 PM   
WingedIncubus


Posts: 512
Joined: 10/3/2007
Status: offline 		Started "Road to Leningrad" to practice a bit as the Germans, and I get a HQ with three SEC regiment under the names "RHG command".

What's the use of these units, for this newbie to learn?

Thanks!

< Message edited by Drakken -- 8/18/2011 9:26:09 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/18/2011 9:38:25 PM   
Balou


Posts: 841
Joined: 7/24/2009
Status: offline 		Lots of people disband SEC-HQ. It frees people=replacements for other units losses, and spares supplies these HQs would need. The SECs will then be attached - automatically - to OKH. This goes for GCs, but hopefully for scenarios too.

(in reply to WingedIncubus)
Post #: 2
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/18/2011 9:39:31 PM   
WingedIncubus


Posts: 512
Joined: 10/3/2007
Status: offline 		Still doesn't answer the use of these SEC units for Germany. The only one I can see is to defend city hexes.

(in reply to Balou)
Post #: 3
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/18/2011 9:40:54 PM   
Uedel


Posts: 41
Joined: 11/21/2000
From: Bergtheim, Germany
Status: offline 		They are for City Hexes and anti Parisan use, but u dont need that HQ realy

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Post #: 4
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/18/2011 9:49:51 PM   
kirkgregerson

 

Posts: 497
Joined: 4/9/2008
Status: offline 		best use.... ummm

disband the HQs for manpower

< Message edited by kirkgregerson -- 8/18/2011 9:50:09 PM >

(in reply to Uedel)
Post #: 5
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/18/2011 10:09:00 PM   
Gargoil

 

Posts: 389
Joined: 1/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Uedel

They are for City Hexes and anti Parisan use, but u dont need that HQ realy


SEC units count as double their number toward the garrison of cities. They can breakdown into regiments, so you can spread them around many cities. Then when a partisan does show up, find a SEC that has enough MPs to run and pop it, and run back. Use trains where necessary.

(in reply to Uedel)
Post #: 6
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/18/2011 11:41:18 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		The Divisions are useful; the HQ's are NOT.

Divisions are necessary for Garrison Duty; otherwise, you develop a partisan problem. Or a more severe one.

Late in the GC game, as you have fewer cities to Garrison and really need the Manpower, I can see disbanding Security Units. But not before then.

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RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/19/2011 1:10:01 AM   
PeeDeeAitch


Posts: 1276
Joined: 1/1/2007
From: Laramie, Wyoming
Status: offline 		SEC units are the lifeblood of the rear areas, a regiment can keep a city at 100%, two can garrison a light urban hex. This can be seen when clicking on the city hex and the percentage appears in the upper right of the display. Also, these units sit rested in their garrisons and often have 12-16 movement points for running out and whacking partisans before returning to their town.

As mentioned, the HQs are candyfloss, and can be converted into willing cannon fodder for the Germans.

_____________________________

"The torment of precautions often exceeds the dangers to be avoided. It is sometimes better to abandon one's self to destiny."

- Call me PDH

- WitE noob tester

(in reply to Q-Ball)
Post #: 8
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/19/2011 9:24:18 PM   
Harovan


Posts: 78
Joined: 1/25/2011
From: Germany
Status: offline 		The RHG commands were responsible for the administration of the first couple of hundred km behind the front. RHG means "Rückwärtiges Heeresgebiet" (rear military area). They had the security divisions attached, but sometimes also regular divisions, which is impossible in the game, and "Oberfeldkommandanturen" (higher field administrations), which aren't represented at all. In the areas farther back were built civil administrations.

A lot of people just disband them, enjoying 2 divisions worth of manpower, which IMO shouldn't happen. Since these commands don't serve any practical purpose, they shouldn't be in the game in the first place.


(in reply to PeeDeeAitch)
Post #: 9
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/19/2011 9:32:26 PM   
Gargoil

 

Posts: 389
Joined: 1/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Harovan

The RHG commands were responsible for the administration of the first couple of hundred km behind the front. RHG means "Rückwärtiges Heeresgebiet" (rear military area). They had the security divisions attached, but sometimes also regular divisions, which is impossible in the game, and "Oberfeldkommandanturen" (higher field administrations), which aren't represented at all. In the areas farther back were built civil administrations.

A lot of people just disband them, enjoying 2 divisions worth of manpower, which IMO shouldn't happen. Since these commands don't serve any practical purpose, they shouldn't be in the game in the first place.



I am not sure if they serve no purpose. Last night I disbanded the 2 RHG HQs I had (this in 9/42) after I read this thread. The next turn, 6 cities which were blue (shift-K) 100%+ covered before, where now yellow, less than 100% covered. Now I noticed that many SEC units underwent a 42 TOE upgrade just then also. I had to use 2 real wehrmacht divisions broke down into regiments to boost the garrison.

So what did that? The elimination of the RHG HQs, the TOE upgrade, or just the natural attrition all hitting the SEC just below their Manpower needs to fully garrison?

< Message edited by Gargoil -- 8/19/2011 9:33:47 PM >

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Post #: 10
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/19/2011 10:10:37 PM   
marcpennington

 

Posts: 335
Joined: 1/31/2011
Status: offline 		I gotta admit I'm still baffled by how railroad construction SUs (as opposed to FBDs) operate, but I have thought to use the RHG HQs to concentrate these to get them to work on specific areas. In practice, though...


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Post #: 11
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/20/2011 12:11:15 AM   
Kronolog

 

Posts: 139
Joined: 3/23/2011
From: Sweden
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Harovan

A lot of people just disband them, enjoying 2 divisions worth of manpower, which IMO shouldn't happen. Since these commands don't serve any practical purpose, they shouldn't be in the game in the first place.


Perhaps all units (or just the sec. divs) under their command should enjoy a bonus to their garrison modifier? Then they wouldn't be completely redundant and the choice to disband them for manpower wouldn't be so obvious.

< Message edited by Kronolog -- 8/20/2011 12:12:22 AM >

(in reply to Harovan)
Post #: 12
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/20/2011 12:34:05 AM   
JAMiAM

 

Posts: 6165
Joined: 2/8/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: map66

I gotta admit I'm still baffled by how railroad construction SUs (as opposed to FBDs) operate, but I have thought to use the RHG HQs to concentrate these to get them to work on specific areas. In practice, though...



A nice thought, but not possible in WitE. Unfortunately, you cannot attach SUs to the RHG HQs. The computer can, if you let it (mis)handle SU attachments, but as a player, they simply don't show up as available HQs when you try to assign SUs to them.

(in reply to marcpennington)
Post #: 13
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/20/2011 5:05:17 AM   
Jakerson

 

Posts: 565
Joined: 8/15/2006
Status: offline 		I use those sec units rear area clear up isolated soviet units in pockets that are too small to leave full German divisions behind clearing them. They are great antipartisan garrisons but I also use them garrison less important part of the frontline especially 41 so I can free up more troops to support my offensive.

Sec units are pretty weak but still if they are able to fortify they can garrison front line.

(in reply to JAMiAM)
Post #: 14
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/20/2011 5:36:55 AM   
marcpennington

 

Posts: 335
Joined: 1/31/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM


quote:

ORIGINAL: map66

I gotta admit I'm still baffled by how railroad construction SUs (as opposed to FBDs) operate, but I have thought to use the RHG HQs to concentrate these to get them to work on specific areas. In practice, though...



A nice thought, but not possible in WitE. Unfortunately, you cannot attach SUs to the RHG HQs. The computer can, if you let it (mis)handle SU attachments, but as a player, they simply don't show up as available HQs when you try to assign SUs to them.


Actually, the RHG HQ can "pull in" SU---- use the assign SU from within the HQ page, and one can bring in railroad construction battalions from OKH or any higher HQ for that matter. That said, I've never have had much luck on prioritizing rail repair based on HQ locations, but it might be worth a shot if someone understands how the system works better then I.




< Message edited by map66 -- 8/20/2011 5:39:08 AM >

(in reply to JAMiAM)
Post #: 15
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/20/2011 6:48:18 AM   
JAMiAM

 

Posts: 6165
Joined: 2/8/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: map66

quote:

ORIGINAL: JAMiAM


quote:

ORIGINAL: map66

I gotta admit I'm still baffled by how railroad construction SUs (as opposed to FBDs) operate, but I have thought to use the RHG HQs to concentrate these to get them to work on specific areas. In practice, though...



A nice thought, but not possible in WitE. Unfortunately, you cannot attach SUs to the RHG HQs. The computer can, if you let it (mis)handle SU attachments, but as a player, they simply don't show up as available HQs when you try to assign SUs to them.


Actually, the RHG HQ can "pull in" SU---- use the assign SU from within the HQ page, and one can bring in railroad construction battalions from OKH or any higher HQ for that matter. That said, I've never have had much luck on prioritizing rail repair based on HQ locations, but it might be worth a shot if someone understands how the system works better then I.




Thanks for the tip! I guess I'm just a "pushy" kind of fellow and didn't think to check it from the other direction...

(in reply to marcpennington)
Post #: 16
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/20/2011 2:16:03 PM   
carnifex


Posts: 1295
Joined: 7/1/2002
From: Latitude 40° 48' 43N Longtitude 74° 7' 29W
Status: offline 		Yeah those HQs are totally useless in pure gameplay terms. Plus the units they command are totally spread out anyway, outside of any real command range.

I would like to see a range to those HQs which provides an additional security benefit to attached units and I would like to be able to attach other units to them.

(in reply to JAMiAM)
Post #: 17
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/23/2011 11:54:02 AM   
Aussiematto

 

Posts: 344
Joined: 2/13/2011
From: Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: carnifex

Yeah those HQs are totally useless in pure gameplay terms. Plus the units they command are totally spread out anyway, outside of any real command range.



Not quite. As soon as you are just using security divisions broken into Regts for rear area security in 1941 then yes, disband the HQs (though irritatingly the bad leaders then start being assigned to your corps HQS from time to time). However, until around Turn 14 you don't have a major security problem with partisans (and even later dependnig on quality of Sov opponent). I use the security divisions for the occasional clean up of isolated Sovs, and also for defensive purposes while the real hardcore troops go east (eg security troops holding western edge of salient). In these situations, you need the combat advantage of having the troops properly commanded. I try to get the SUs out of the HQs of course, set to zero, or transfer SUs out, but you still need that HQ or your attacking value will be less than optimally available. (AFAIK... but it does seem to be the same for Security troops as others).



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Post #: 18
RE: What use for German RHG units? - 8/23/2011 12:29:27 PM   
delatbabel


Posts: 1252
Joined: 7/30/2006
From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline 		I played a 1942 GC vs a German opponent who disbanded all of his security units for the manpower.  He'd failed to read the manual about cities and garrisons.

The result was almost all of AGN being cut out of supply by partisans.  Catastrophe.



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(in reply to Aussiematto)
Post #: 19
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