RE: REEK, rhymes with what?

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: REEK, rhymes with what?

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 4:16:50 PM

witpqs

Posts: 26087
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A few little comments...

Nemo did not liken Greyjoy to a child in AE terms, he used the analogy of a child vs a one-armed adult male in physical combat to describe his AE skills to Rader's at game start. Pretty fair, really, and I don't think at all he intended the 'child' part of the analogy as any sort of jibe. Just a novice against an experienced player.

Deciding to run or throw what you have into battle - the double edged sword. Nemo points out one danger (getting pulled into fighting with too little and making matters worse by frittering away assets) and Greyjoy points out the other danger (giving up ground and time on the cheap and making matters worse by allowing the enemy to gain too much for too little). Is the opponent bluffing or drawing you in? Even if you know he's drawing you in, is his assessment correct or do you know better? Even if you know he's bluffing, is his assessment correct or do you know better? Definitely a major component of the human on human side of AE!

Stalingrad and Moscow - true the Russians drew a line in the mud and snow, but they were also very well prepared in both cases. They had many fresh divisions for the defense of Moscow leaving little chance of losing. At Stalingrad they husbanded enormous resources with only barely what was needed defending the city. In both cases they counter attacked when the time was right. I think the key here is that they made the call to stand when they had what they felt it took.

quote:

Don't have nor the experience nor the confidence to start an offensive right now.

Confidence comes from preparation and experience. Experience comes from - experience! Plan some offensives and go ahead with them. You have plenty of coaching around here to help with planning. Rader is hoping that you won't. He's hoping to keep you distracted with things like invading the Aleutians (which has not distracted you, of course). Time is on his side now. You must initiate.

(in reply to Smeulders)

Post #: 2551

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 4:22:14 PM

crsutton

Posts: 9590
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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

[
I agree here. Don't have nor the experience nor the confidence to start an offensive right now. I still need time to move my assets into the right positions. NW Oz isn't building as fast as i'd like and i'm sending in more reinforcements. In India i still have to decide what to do (he's sending more troops there...). The only place where i feel if not ready at least pretty close is the Solomons...but it's also the most obvious place...
But i also agree on the fact that i do feel i'm getting better over time. Don't feel confortable with the grand strategy yet, but operatively speaking i think i grabbed the basics.

Actually, the fact that you hold the entire Aleutians chain is a big thing and presents a serious threat to Rader. Bad weather is a factor but just ask Canoerebel about the benefits of the Aleutians. Without bases in the area it is difficult for Japan to keep an eye on your activity there.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 2552

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 4:54:49 PM

Canoerebel

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Yeah, the Aleutians are very important whether they ever serve as a springboard for further offensives or not.

The Aleutians strongly held by the Allies constitute a major threat to Japan that the Japanese player has to deal with.

Some of the Aluetians in Japanese hands lowers that threat considerably, buying Japan lots of time and lowering the asset commitment in the Kuriles and vicinity.

It's possible that GreyJoy can implement a nice maskirovka now. Just follow rader's disaster in the Aluetians by ramping up Allied activity there - more ships going in, some long-range patrols flying recon, perhaps a few 4EB flying offensive missions, etc. Rader has to pay attention to such hostile appearances anyway, but he's more likely to have some level of paranoia now.

Each IJN unit tied down in NoPac means one less that GreyJoy will face wherever he actually goes.

And NoPac is always a possibility for a titanic Allied offensive as the war draws on. Eventually, the Allies may get so strong (and Japan weak enough) that the Allies can bypass the Kuriles, if they appear to strong, and go right for Hokkaido or Sikhalin Island. :)

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 2553

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 5:17:02 PM

GreyJoy

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Guys, first of all thanks again!

Secondly i'd like you to refrain from using terms like "arrogance" related to Rader's style of play. It's not fair, even if it's just a "word". Rader has always been a very good and sportman opponent and his gentlemanship has been shown to me in several occasions. The fact that he tried to push me out of the map

is just part of the "role-game" we're playing!

And i perfectly understood what Nemo meant with the term "child". When the game started i was like a child in front of a mature and strong man. Now my testicles are "coming down" and the first couple of reddish curly hairs are starting to spring in little horrible circles beside my member. Not a man yet, but i'm growing up fast and soon i'll ask my desk-friend-mate to come out with me to buy an icecream during a saturday afternoon

.

I think the whole "Aleutinas disaster" was generated when i started, 2 months ago, to send recon PBYs from there to recon the Kuriles...Rader's activity in the area has soon become more intense...then he made a little CV raid...and now this failed invasion....if i have to bet, i'd say that Rader has already become a little paranoid about the northern threat...

Drawing the line and decide which is the right time to start an offensive...it's difficult. But i have more or less an idea. October/November will be my months...wanna start a multi-front offensive and so i need to organize many things in the right way (right number of ships, troops in the right location, squadrons ready when needed etc etc.
The plan is more or less clear in my mind...

First of all i need to understand what he has at Thousands Ships Bay... i have 4 divisions prepped for that target, plus 4 tank regiments an 2 eng BNs...gotta check what he has there!

(in reply to Canoerebel)

Post #: 2554

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 6:23:21 PM

jeffk3510

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I'm not even going to comment on the second paragraph....

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Currently chasing three kids around the Midwest.

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 2555

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 6:29:42 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

And NoPac is always a possibility for a titanic Allied offensive as the war draws on.� Eventually, the Allies may get so strong (and Japan weak enough) that the Allies can bypass the Kuriles, if they appear to strong, and go right for Hokkaido or Sikhalin Island.� :)

Still showin' that NorPac love, CR!!!

One strong proviso I would offer, from bitter recent experience, is that going north carries with it early kami activation. I did it in order to take Sakhalin I. for early strat bombing, and I'd do it agian, but my losses to multi-engine kamis run to at least six sceens in the Sunk Ships list, and I'm only at 1/5/45. I also did/am doing a parallel campaign to take the western spine of Sumatra, islands first, and the kami losses there from the huge bases on the Malay Penn. have been massive as well. Many, many AKA, APA losses, lots of CVEs, etc.

Scen 2 gives the Japanese player enouigh aircraft to really keep the kamis coming, and a 35-trained pilot can still ram like a mo fo. A lot of the bigger landing ships survive one multi-engine hit with 45-60 mixed damage, but they're out for months. My damage losses have been about 400% of my sinkings. Call it 15-20 screens-worth of cripples. The Allies can take those losses and keep moving, but man, it hurts.

Go north, but go understanding what could happen.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to Canoerebel)

Post #: 2556

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 6:39:51 PM

Canoerebel

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Well, you gotta close on Japan eventually.� One way or another, the Allies are going to activate kamikazees.� As far as I'm concerned, the sooner and closer, the better.�

Not, that is, that a nuisance�invasion with no hope of lasting success against�Onnekotan Jima in March 1942 is worth it, but a major Allied operation that succeeds in taking multiple bases with big airfield potential?� You bet it is!� While I'm dealing with kamikazes, my opponent will be dealing with 4EB hitting the Home Islands.� I want to be securely in that position as soon as possible.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 2557

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 7:08:25 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy
First of all i need to understand what he has at Thousands Ships Bay... i have 4 divisions prepped for that target, plus 4 tank regiments an 2 eng BNs...gotta check what he has there!

Hey, GJ. Long time, no post.

Just stopping by to mention two things which have occured to me reading here. I'm not going to give you any real advice, since I agree with Nemo and others that you get (probably) too much already, some of it bad, a lot of it good, but contradictory. You have to do what you have to do. I just want to mention two things. Maybe they're on your mind already, and maybe they're in the AAR and I missed them. I have not closely read every page.

1. Time. The Solomons were the right thing to do at the time. They were "safe", they got a reaction, they allowed you to attrit, they took some pressure off India, etc., etc. But now you're FAR behind any historical timeline. You're futzing with Tulagi still in late summer 1943. You say you have a large move planned for the mid- to late-autumn. I would just caution you to be sensitive to how long it will take you to get going in 1944, even with the toys you get then. The situation in India/Burma/SE Asia has been static for what? 8-9 months? You have a really massive pile of AV sitting in Karachi playing poker. Aden has been "open" for over two months, and you haven't, as far as I have read, done anything with this.

I think that the off-map mechanics are not well-used by most Allied players. We're trained by boardgames from childhood to "see" what's in front of us. Chess would be far different (3D chess?) if the queen could exit the back row and re-appear behind the opposing king without warning. I think many Japanese-only AE players fail to appreciate how different the board looks to the Allies due to off-map mechanics. They're playing chess. You aren't.

That said, let me offer a modest proposal. Not in Swiftian terms (and no cannibalized babies to decrease the surplus population), but literally a modest proposal, since I don't know what you know about the game flow. It's this:

2. Abandon Karachi. Its utility pre-Aden-opening is clear--it prevents Auto-Vic by ensuring that massive stack of LCUs does not go POW. But now, why invest what? 9000 AV there? You've seen how hard it will be to march your force out due to road infrastructure, desert, and huge LBA opposition. So why try? Karachi's organic VPs are neither here nor there. As a base it's of low value in itself. And now, with Aden open, that huge telephone pole has far more strategic value out of India, both for real fighting and as a force in being, both out-of-sight, and unsightable.

I suggest this: do a Dunkirk out of Karachi, direct to Aden. Phase it by first overwhelming Socotra with massive force, and get some P-38s in there to LRCAP Karachi. Speed is essential. In parallel, shoot fast, nimble DD/CL TFs down and south of Karachi to establish an ASW cordon and early-warning line. I'm talking no more than four days before the transports jump out of the wormhole, sprint to Karachi under LRCAP, and load troops only (leave the supplies), infantry and tanks only if necessary, then jump back in for Aden. I haven't seen a map in awhile, but I don't think he could get ground forces there before you have the majority evaced. Leave the arty and engineers if you have to; you get plenty in 1944. But get the infantry and tanks out before he can react. The planes can evac at the last through Socotra.

You then leave him holding an empty sack with his own massive army far out of position. He takes Karachi (Yay him!), and then . . . What? Yes, he can redeploy that army elsewhere, but where? The magic is HE DOESN'T KNOW WHERE YOUR ARMY WENT. The magic of off-map.

You could leave them in Aden, reconstitute, upgrade, and prep for an Asian target. I have been convinced by Nemo and my own endeavors in my game that Sumatra is perhaps the "best" ground to fight on in that map sector, and has many ways into the land mass.

But, and this is what I've been noodling, what if you used shipless off-map mechanics to take all or most of that 9000 AV to the EC, train them to SF or Seattle, and spring them all, en masse, unseen and undetected until the last, on NorPac, or the Marianas, or elsewhere with real strategic game-changing power (NB not the Solomons) in mid-1944?

Aden to CT is also a shipless option, and CT is perfect for a Sumatra campaign base. You decide. But the shipless movement mechanism is an incredible force multiplier, with zero risk of loss, no fuel worries, and undetectible through game intel if you do things right. Give NO hint by e-mail, and he will forevermore need to guard India from a counter-invasion. He might not even think of the Indian Army attacking Sakhalin Island, but if he does he STILL has to defend everywhere when a massive, 9000 AV army can pop up on the other side of the world without warning.

Anyway, just some thoughts. Even if you don't do the off-map radical stuff, maybe you ought to really look at what the Karachi situaiton is getting you. Anything? Or has it passed its freshness date?

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 2558

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 7:16:33 PM

Canoerebel

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Durn, there's some good thinking for you. I personally would pay attention to such clever advice, but since Bullwinkle is a AI player it really can't be good....can it?

P.S. A move on this scale would throw an opponent into total confusion and could possibly wrest the entire strategic advantage away from Japan. If you had enough transports to handle a truly massive army, the mind boggles at the possibilities. Sikhalin Island, Hokkaido, Formosa, and Luzon seem like the most interesting targets. But, ah, as the Moose says, I'll leave the decision making to you!

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 2559

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 7:18:45 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Well, you gotta close on Japan eventually.� One way or another, the Allies are going to activate kamikazees.� As far as I'm concerned, the sooner and closer, the better.�

Not, that is, that a nuisance�invasion with no hope of lasting success against�Onnekotan Jima in March 1942 is worth it, but a major Allied operation that succeeds in taking multiple bases with big airfield potential?� You bet it is!� While I'm dealing with kamikazes, my opponent will be dealing with 4EB hitting the Home Islands.� I want to be securely in that position as soon as possible.

I agree, somewhat.

The issue I did not fully appreciate is that the early kami date is 1/1/44, and you have no B-29s then. Also, kamis activate everywhere, not just in NorPac. I took most of my very high losses near Sumatra, Pelileu, Rangoon/Akyab, etc. not in the Sakhalin operations. January 1944 is a LOT tougher to kami-defend than autumn 1944 would be, but it's a binary switch on kami activation.

From the twin big bases on Sakhalin I. there's fewer goodies in range pre-B-29 than you might like. Your fighters are hopeless for the most part until you have enough P-39s to spare, and of course P-51s. I've experimented a lot with hitting armament point generators in Korea, and leaving the HI largely alone. Korea is a grazing pasture for B-29s from Sakhalin. A lot less fatigue management than trying to bomb from the Marianas. I figure that engine and aircraft factory bombing by now, in Scen 2, is closing the barn door after the horse already stocked the barn with airframes, while attriting armament stocks lets me leverage Chinese LCUs which can really whomp the Japanese in 1944 once they get some supplies in from Ledo and get some experience. I've taken an almost exclusive armament-point-denial tact in my strat bombing, and it's paying off in early 1945. I get lots of 1:1 set-piece battles in China with 2000-4000 Japanese casualties.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to Canoerebel)

Post #: 2560

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 7:35:49 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Durn, there's some good thinking for you.� I personally would pay attention to such clever advice, but since Bullwinkle is a AI player it really can't be good....can it?

Yeahbut, it would take one you you PBEM geniuses to think to get the Gurkhas some winter coats!

(What's the freezing point of curry?)

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to Canoerebel)

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 7:51:14 PM

Nemo121

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Again this obsession with hair... Hmm, does male pattern baldness run in the family? One wonders about a reaction-formation

As to the child thing. It was a metaphor as witpqs said, not an insult.

_____________________________

John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 8:09:51 PM

Wirraway_Ace

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From: Austin / Brisbane
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Durn, there's some good thinking for you.� I personally would pay attention to such clever advice, but since Bullwinkle is a AI player it really can't be good....can it?

Yeahbut, it would take one you you PBEM geniuses to think to get the Gurkhas some winter coats!

(What's the freezing point of curry?)

I may have missed the discussion, but how much of the 9000AV at Karachi is currently unrestricted?

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 2563

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 8:22:19 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace

I may have missed the discussion, but how much of the 9000AV at Karachi is currently unrestricted?

Good Q. which GJ would have to answer. The LOD package is, the British are, the Aussies are (if any), and a look into my 1945 game shows that the numbered Corps in the IA are, and most of the "direction" (Southern, etc.) HQ infantry is yellow (R). The majority of the engineers aren't going anywhere though. Don't know his PP sit., so it might be a triage. I'd think he could get 60-70% out, depending on if there are Aussies in there. Maybe more if he's fat on PPs.

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The Moose

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 8:37:41 PM

DOCUP

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Dang Bull what an idea. That would def mess with anyone. It also opens up all those possibilities. Scary

doc

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 10:11:42 PM

desicat

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Durn, there's some good thinking for you.� I personally would pay attention to such clever advice, but since Bullwinkle is a AI player it really can't be good....can it?

P.S.� A move on this scale would throw an opponent into total confusion and could possibly wrest the entire strategic advantage away from Japan.� If you had enough transports to handle a truly massive army, the mind boggles at the possibilities.� Sikhalin Island, Hokkaido, Formosa, and Luzon seem like the most interesting targets.� But, ah, as the Moose says, I'll leave the decision making to you!

Agreed. Any units Japan has that aren't defending against an advance on the HI are just sucking supply or are investing in self guarding POW camps. If you come from the north his units in India/Burma are of no value at best and negative assets at worse. If he can mobilize the shipping to evacuate then great for him and you can advance uncontested - the downside for him is that he has to waste precious assets that he may need to counter the pressure you apply from the north and from the Solomons.

(in reply to Canoerebel)

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 10:29:03 PM

JeffroK

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Interesting change of approach, If you move to CapeTown another option is to send them to Perth and the up through Timor, Ambon which you already have some thought on.

I would keep the pressure up on the Solomons, enough to keep his interest, then hit him hard somewhere else.

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 10:31:14 PM

JohnDillworth

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Bull, It's 1943 and one can plan for the future but by the time he has the shipping available to do anything with all these troops Raeder may have pulled his massive army out of India. As one AI player to another (do they have 12 step programs for us?)shortage of Allied land combat units is never an issue. I wouldn't know what to do with another 5,000 AV if I had them. It's all about logistics as they say. But dang this is an interesting idea. Good to see your antlers back this way. Course hunting season is upon us so I expect you'll scatter soon enough

_____________________________

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(in reply to desicat)

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 10:45:02 PM

Alfred

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

Bull, It's 1943 and one can plan for the future but by the time he has the shipping available to do anything with all these troops Raeder may have pulled his massive army out of India. As one AI player to another (do they have 12 step programs for us?)shortage of Allied land combat units is never an issue. I wouldn't know what to do with another 5,000 AV if I had them. It's all about logistics as they say. But dang this is an interesting idea. Good to see your antlers back this way. Course hunting season is upon us so I expect you'll scatter soon enough

The opponent doing so creates quite a few very unpleasant outcomes.

a significant loss of VPs on a daily basis
the loss of a significant amount of industry due to the LOC damage sustained
makes an Allied reconquest very easy and quick which then brings into range of Allied attack his raw material/industrial facilities in the SRA

As it is, if rader just holds his current possition he will gain a decisive Japanese victory on 1 January 1944.

Alfred

(in reply to JohnDillworth)

Post #: 2569

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/23/2011 11:11:14 PM

Bullwinkle58

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

As it is, if rader just holds his current possition he will gain a decisive Japanese victory on 1 January 1944.

Alfred

An element I had not considered.

GJ, when you read this, pay CAREFUL attention to Alfred's statement here. I am as sure as I am of anything that he's done the math. October-November 1943 might be too little, too late for th estart of a counter-offensive series.

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 12:50:33 AM

GreyJoy

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Wow guys...BW, Alfred, CR, johnDill, Desicat,Jeffk...and all the others who just posted these suggestions...thanks!!!! for the time it took you

Anyway, first of all, we expressfully agree not to play for VPs...so we're not even looking at them. So let's not think about 1.1.1944 or whatever other date.

Secondly, this is scen 2 so i think it's pretty normal that i'm well beyond the RL scheldue. I don't wanna hurry. 1946 is far away and i have time to advance. For sure, sooner or later, i'll have to start...i know...and that's exactly what i'm planning to do. I have started my advance on 1.01.1943... with the invasion of PM and of the Solomons....but he reacted and pushed me out of PM, while he managed to statlemate me at Tulagi...

The idea of moving those 9000 AVs out is really really tempting. But Rader will surely move to conquer Karachi and he has already shown me how fast he can move large masses of troops from India to whereever he wants...he can use internal lines, while i cannot. The other problem is that, as JohnDill says, i don't have the shippings for all those AVs to be used at once...cannot think to invade with xAKs or xAPs...and for sure i don't have enough of them to do that scale of multi-theatre invasion...

I think that as long as Rader keeps all those Divisions in India...they're not guarding something else. I like the idea of an advance from NW-OZ while all his main units are in India...but to keep them there i need to keep the pressure high in India.
I didn't simply sit there for 9 months BW...2 months ago i advanced with 7000 AVs and this move forced Rader to move back all his divisions from the Solomons back to India...already something...now i need to keep them stuck there.

So my plan is to mass a 10,000 AVs Army and start to march again back to Multan....even if we end up in a trench-war he will be forced to keep lots of forces in India (he has at least 70 AA units there....AA units that won't be sitting in the Mariannas, Solomons or whereever else for example).

I say (and i know i may be wrong but i really feel it): let's be patient. We're massing up our forces. We're dividing them for the different theatres and we have managed to win the last two tactical campaigns (Tulagi and Shamrya Isl.). He has estabilished a HUGE perimeter...but India and the Solomons are sucking up his mobile reserves...if i manage to break his perimeter in a spot, he won't have enough mobile reserves to push me out fast and easy (as he did at PM). So the Indian statlemate may become usefull under a certain POV...

And our CVs are getting ready....

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 12:51:52 AM

JohnDillworth

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quote:

As it is, if rader just holds his current possition he will gain a decisive Japanese victory on 1 January 1944.

Yikes! Is this true? How could we have been this stupid? Points! We need points!

_____________________________

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Post #: 2572

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 12:53:26 AM

GreyJoy

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However VPs are now near to 2-1 in his favour....is that enough to win?

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 1:44:13 AM

Dan Nichols

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No, 2 to 1 wins in 1945. He needs 3 to 1 for an auto victory in 1944.

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RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 11:25:16 AM

obvert

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Even if you are waiting until all of your ducks (er, DIVS) are in a row before you get started, that doesn't mean you can't use the Allied material advantage for strategic preparation and to mess with his defensive preparations.

What about the idea of some false invasions? Or minor ones? Do you hold Cocos or Christmas Island near Java? Those would be nice as a springboard for the DEI. Or the islands off of Sumatra. Or possibly one of the dot Nicobars. You could swoop in with a few APDs (LR CAPed by distant CVs or not) and grab a few small things there. Not because you think you can keep them, but because you want to throw him off balance and make him wonder where you are going to strike. A marine Raider unit or the like.

You could even just get close enough for him to see you, then run away again, but maybe in a place you're not planning to go next.

A few DD stinger sorties into the heart of the supply lines would be a fun escapade as well. Maybe Central Pacific? (Or just have a read of CR v Q-Ball and try a raid of the Home Islands!)

Even while you're sitting, planing, keep him off balance. I used to play chess against a friend who NEVER stopped making me react. Every move threatened something. Even in a defensive position. It's a simple shift in thinking. Instead of just planning where to attack, plan how to mess with his mind.

(in reply to Dan Nichols)

Post #: 2575

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 11:54:41 AM

paulkenny

Posts: 178
Joined: 5/7/2003
Status: offline

"And our CVs are getting ready.... "

A George McClellan quote if I have ever heard one!

Use em or lose em my good man.

Hopefully you are taking this in the good humor it is meant. Really enjoying your AAR and especially appreciate your good sportsmanship and patience with all the monday morning admirals around here.

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 2576

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 12:50:45 PM

JohnDillworth

Posts: 3100
Joined: 3/19/2009
Status: offline

quote:

"And our CVs are getting ready.... "

A George McClellan quote if I have ever heard one!

+1 There is definitely some McClellan in many of the Allied AAR's and one could see some Lincoln in FDR. Imagine him in the Warm Springs GA, (perhaps with some of CR's relatives) saying "I have given him everything, and yet he does not attack"

_____________________________

(in reply to paulkenny)

Post #: 2577

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 2:33:53 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Even if you are waiting until all of your ducks (er, DIVS) are in a row before you get started, that doesn't mean you can't use the Allied material advantage for strategic preparation and to mess with his defensive preparations.

What about the idea of some false invasions? Or minor ones? Do you hold Cocos or Christmas Island near Java? Those would be nice as a springboard for the DEI. Or the islands off of Sumatra. Or possibly one of the dot Nicobars. You could swoop in with a few APDs (LR CAPed by distant CVs or not) and grab a few small things there. Not because you think you can keep them, but because you want to throw him off balance and make him wonder where you are going to strike. A marine Raider unit or the like.

You could even just get close enough for him to see you, then run away again, but maybe in a place you're not planning to go next.

A few DD stinger sorties into the heart of the supply lines would be a fun escapade as well. Maybe Central Pacific? (Or just have a read of CR v Q-Ball and try a raid of the Home Islands!)

Even while you're sitting, planing, keep him off balance. I used to play chess against a friend who NEVER stopped making me react. Every move threatened something. Even in a defensive position. It's a simple shift in thinking. Instead of just planning where to attack, plan how to mess with his mind.

Obvert,
we have already tried that kind of "bluffs" in the past and all of them ended up simply in a material loss for the allies, with Rader that didn't "overreact" nor lost his mind. We tried two different invasions in CENTPAC (Tarawa and Marcus-Wake-Iwo) when Rader was fully committed with his Indian gamble. We found well prepared oppositions, with enough troops dug in to repulse a not overwhelming allied effort.

As you can see from the map i attached, Rader has garrisoned The Adamans, Diego, Scoodra, southern DEI, The Mariannas, Kuriles and Marcus/Wake since their conquests.
He also has regiments sitting in Cocos and Christmas.
He knows which are the "hot spots" for an allied counteroffensive and he has devoted assets and energies to occupy them and garrison them with just enough troops to avoid an "easy conquest", so to give him space and time to mount a counteroffensive.

He has a very extended perimeter which is well guarded in the most obvious landing places. My only solution to try something that really umbalances him is to by-pass his outer perimetral outposts and go diretcly to the inner perimeter (which, as far as i can tell, isn't that guarded). So to say i cannot hope to get to Diego, Cocos or Christmas first in order to get a mid-term base for my next major offensive against Sumatra/Adamans/Java...His disposition forces me to get directly there or not to go all the same (if i want to achieve at least a bit of strategical surprise).

About McEllan's quote...if i get it right you're talking about the Civil War Union General right? Well...so true...i'm not bold (while i'm bald

) enough probably...i know...but i think it's more stupid the one who believes to be as smart and Meinstein and loses the war in a single shot than the one who admits to be not a new Alexander the Great, accepts it, and tries to win the war (or not to lose it) with the means the Good Lord has gratefully given him

Transalting it from GreyJoy's well known life methaphores... i'm already in a bad position strategically speaking. Lost India and China and nearly lost the war few months ago... i won't risk everything in a Heil Mary Shot because i know my limits....i don't have the abilities (yet) to mount a smart and perfect strategic plan that brings me back to a position like the allies were in RL in mid 1943...better to be methodic and cautious, but stiff and "stone-headed" like Montgomery.

Attachment (1)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 2578

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 2:39:19 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
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Jul 26,27, 28 and 29 1943

Sleepy turns.

my 4Es pounded Auki again, while my BBs bombed Thousands.
His BBs moved to Shortland while his SWPAC CVs moved from Rabaul to Truk (joining the other CVs that partecipated to the NOPAC gamble maybe???)

moving lots of troops, planes and resources all around...it take lot of time and energies to prepare all the assets in the different theatres...

Upgrading some ships that still need to take their april 43 upgrades...

My subs keep getting unlucky...2 big convoys spotted (near Colombo and near Tokyo) and attacked....3 duds...and some damages eaten back

Tomorrow we'll try to bomb Rekata Bay again, where he has moved back his fighters....let's see what happens....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Thousand Ships Bay at 114,136 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

114 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Allied Ships
BB Massachusetts
CA Hawkins
CA Wichita, Shell hits 1
CL Santa Fe
CL Montpelier
CL Columbia
CL Boise

Japanese ground losses:
49 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Airbase hits 12
Airbase supply hits 6
Runway hits 42
Port hits 20
Port supply hits 3

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 2579

RE: REEK, rhymes with what? - 9/24/2011 2:44:44 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Well, you gotta close on Japan eventually.� One way or another, the Allies are going to activate kamikazees.� As far as I'm concerned, the sooner and closer, the better.�

Not, that is, that a nuisance�invasion with no hope of lasting success against�Onnekotan Jima in March 1942 is worth it, but a major Allied operation that succeeds in taking multiple bases with big airfield potential?� You bet it is!� While I'm dealing with kamikazes, my opponent will be dealing with 4EB hitting the Home Islands.� I want to be securely in that position as soon as possible.

I agree, somewhat.

The issue I did not fully appreciate is that the early kami date is 1/1/44, and you have no B-29s then. Also, kamis activate everywhere, not just in NorPac. I took most of my very high losses near Sumatra, Pelileu, Rangoon/Akyab, etc. not in the Sakhalin operations. January 1944 is a LOT tougher to kami-defend than autumn 1944 would be, but it's a binary switch on kami activation.

From the twin big bases on Sakhalin I. there's fewer goodies in range pre-B-29 than you might like. Your fighters are hopeless for the most part until you have enough P-39s to spare, and of course P-51s. I've experimented a lot with hitting armament point generators in Korea, and leaving the HI largely alone. Korea is a grazing pasture for B-29s from Sakhalin. A lot less fatigue management than trying to bomb from the Marianas. I figure that engine and aircraft factory bombing by now, in Scen 2, is closing the barn door after the horse already stocked the barn with airframes, while attriting armament stocks lets me leverage Chinese LCUs which can really whomp the Japanese in 1944 once they get some supplies in from Ledo and get some experience. I've taken an almost exclusive armament-point-denial tact in my strat bombing, and it's paying off in early 1945. I get lots of 1:1 set-piece battles in China with 2000-4000 Japanese casualties.

unfortunately in my case China is likely to remain a japanese colonial province for the rest of the war...he has moved nearly every japanese division out of china by now...and my chinese corps are stuck at Chunking with 0 supplies, sieged by a 1000 japanese AVs that are enough to keep them there like in a big POW camp forever

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)

Post #: 2580