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RE: Matrix pricing - 10/11/2011 10:57:33 PM

Hertston

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TedG

p.p.s. I purchased Heart Of Iron 3 on the recommendation of a friend. What a hideous train wreck of a game. Promptly uninstalled and shelved. Although the Paradox offering "Mount & Blade" is awesome....and who wouldn't support a husband/wife games studio to boot!

I just wonder how many people are buying Paradox stuff on release any more? It all seems to get discounted very quickly and, in the case of the last two Steam sales they were almost giving it away.

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Post #: 31

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/11/2011 11:07:59 PM

Hertston

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TedG

I compare this with my recent impulse purchase of Deux Ex: Human Revolution which while looking lovely has pretty much zero replay value for your average grognard and is pretty damn short for what it actually costs.

Hmmm... first playthrough took me 30 hours or so, which is hardly 'short' these days. I dread to think how long the on-and-off second will finally take as I'm trying for 'Legend', 'Pacifist' and 'Foxiest of the Hounds'. It's a totally different game played that way.

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Post #: 32

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 12:09:59 AM

Gilmer

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You just have to get used to the Matrix pricing and if you think want the game, then you must weigh how much it costs. I'm kind of waiting on the Christmas sale to get some of the "Battles In" games and the Disaster on the Donets games.

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Post #: 33

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 12:24:27 AM

Perturabo

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To be honest, I'm always perplexed when I see westerners complaining about prices like 40GBP or 50$. It's less than 7 hours of minimal wage work for tens or in case of wargames hundreds of hours of fun.
Or maybe my countrymen just have insane spending habits with buying new AAA games for about 100-120PLN (30-40USD) each (15,5-18,5 minimal hourly wages).

< Message edited by Perturabo -- 10/12/2011 12:25:04 AM >

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Post #: 34

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 1:46:39 AM

parusski

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sabre1

I'm on the side of buy or don't buy. A company has the right (at least for the moment) to charge whatever they want, and we can decide to buy or not to buy.

I never bought War in the East or Battles for the Bulge due to prices. My choice. They are great games without a doubt, but I draw the line on some things that are nonessentials.

OT: I also will not buy games with DRM schemes. Matrix's scheme is as much as I will stand for, but just barely.

I get to read more that way.

Amen Sabre. Look at how much(LITTLE) WitE cost. Yet more than a handful must have been sold.

It's up to any company to maximize profit by finding the maximum price point the market will bear.

Panzer Corps is a sweet point as far as I am concerned and the DLC is even better.

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Post #: 35

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 2:37:33 AM

jomni

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Paradox is profitable because they charge $$$ for patches.
Matrix rarely does that but it happened to some titles (ducks and runs for cover

).

< Message edited by jomni -- 10/12/2011 2:38:39 AM >

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Post #: 36

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 4:05:29 AM

Phatguy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Perturabo

To be honest, I'm always perplexed when I see westerners complaining about prices like 40GBP or 50$. It's less than 7 hours of minimal wage work for tens or in case of wargames hundreds of hours of fun.
Or maybe my countrymen just have insane spending habits with buying new AAA games for about 100-120PLN (30-40USD) each (15,5-18,5 minimal hourly wages).

Well, The most expensive title I saw at Empik this summer was for 99PLN for IL-2 Wings of Dover. Everything else seemed to hover in the 50-60PLN range with the cheap titles hitting 20-40PLN range......

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Post #: 37

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 4:07:33 AM

Phatguy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: parusski

quote:

ORIGINAL: sabre1

I'm on the side of buy or don't buy. A company has the right (at least for the moment) to charge whatever they want, and we can decide to buy or not to buy.

I never bought War in the East or Battles for the Bulge due to prices. My choice. They are great games without a doubt, but I draw the line on some things that are nonessentials.

OT: I also will not buy games with DRM schemes. Matrix's scheme is as much as I will stand for, but just barely.

I get to read more that way.

Amen Sabre. Look at how much(LITTLE) WitE cost. Yet more than a handful must have been sold.

It's up to any company to maximize profit by finding the maximum price point the market will bear.

Panzer Corps is a sweet point as far as I am concerned and the DLC is even better.

DLC ........ugh......
Never would have believed Matrix would enter the realms of DLC....

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Post #: 38

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 4:37:22 AM

jomni

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I see DLCs as little donations to the developers we love.

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Post #: 39

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 5:34:48 AM

Phatguy

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What about the ones that are full of overkill? Train simulator 2012 perhaps?....LOL, I think they are up to 700+ DLC's , or so it seems

Do we have to love them?

< Message edited by apathetic lurker -- 10/12/2011 5:35:14 AM >

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Post #: 40

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 7:31:36 AM

JudgeDredd

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DLCs are alright as long as they have not taken away from the main game and as long as they're priced right.

If the content isn't what I want, then I'll leave it (sprite packs for HoI). If it's too pricey, I'll leave it (FPS DLC packs at over �10 for a few online maps)

What I dislike more is standard game on sale and deluxe games. I didn't mind deluxe games when the purchaser got certain external things (figure, t-shirt or whatever), but getting equipment in game up front that other people either won't get or have to work through levels to get - I don't like those deluxe versions!

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Post #: 41

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 8:06:27 AM

wodin

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Perturabo

To be honest, I'm always perplexed when I see westerners complaining about prices like 40GBP or 50$. It's less than 7 hours of minimal wage work for tens or in case of wargames hundreds of hours of fun.
Or maybe my countrymen just have insane spending habits with buying new AAA games for about 100-120PLN (30-40USD) each (15,5-18,5 minimal hourly wages).

Well �40 is more like $65. Also in the UK we are taxed beyond belief our fuel bills are sky high as is petrol so we are left with very little at the end of the day especially if you have kids to look after, which I presume you don't. If not just wait and see.

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Post #: 42

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 11:07:59 AM

parusski

Posts: 4804
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From: Jackson Tn
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quote:

ORIGINAL: apathetic lurker

quote:

ORIGINAL: parusski

quote:

ORIGINAL: sabre1

I'm on the side of buy or don't buy. A company has the right (at least for the moment) to charge whatever they want, and we can decide to buy or not to buy.

I never bought War in the East or Battles for the Bulge due to prices. My choice. They are great games without a doubt, but I draw the line on some things that are nonessentials.

OT: I also will not buy games with DRM schemes. Matrix's scheme is as much as I will stand for, but just barely.

I get to read more that way.

Amen Sabre. Look at how much(LITTLE) WitE cost. Yet more than a handful must have been sold.

It's up to any company to maximize profit by finding the maximum price point the market will bear.

Panzer Corps is a sweet point as far as I am concerned and the DLC is even better.

DLC ........ugh......
Never would have believed Matrix would enter the realms of DLC....

har, har, hardy, har har

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Post #: 43

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 12:55:03 PM

tgold

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hertston

quote:

ORIGINAL: TedG

I compare this with my recent impulse purchase of Deux Ex: Human Revolution which while looking lovely has pretty much zero replay value for your average grognard and is pretty damn short for what it actually costs.

Hmmm... first playthrough took me 30 hours or so, which is hardly 'short' these days. I dread to think how long the on-and-off second will finally take as I'm trying for 'Legend', 'Pacifist' and 'Foxiest of the Hounds'. It's a totally different game played that way.

I just don't care about "achievements" and while the levels themselves are quite large there is not much to do within them. For example the first level really only has 7-ish "quests" of which at least three are FEDEX/find the market/"bribe drunk snitch to get secret stash of stuff" affairs.

Ahhh the rose-tinted glasses of the original. Don't get me wrong...its a fairly visually stunning game but chucking out 30 quid for this title compared to what you get with Matrix titles is a total hamburger-v-prime rib comparison.

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Post #: 44

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 12:57:07 PM

Perturabo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: apathetic lurker

quote:

ORIGINAL: Perturabo

To be honest, I'm always perplexed when I see westerners complaining about prices like 40GBP or 50$. It's less than 7 hours of minimal wage work for tens or in case of wargames hundreds of hours of fun.
Or maybe my countrymen just have insane spending habits with buying new AAA games for about 100-120PLN (30-40USD) each (15,5-18,5 minimal hourly wages).

Well, The most expensive title I saw at Empik this summer was for 99PLN for IL-2 Wings of Dover. Everything else seemed to hover in the 50-60PLN range with the cheap titles hitting 20-40PLN range......

I checked the Empik page before posting this and it's 99-120PLN for new titles. The 50-70PLN range is older games in GOTY edition and 20-40PLN range is very old games. The prices for new games are a bit smaller in $/Euro than the western editions but it's still like paying 99-120$/Euro for a new game, taking in account minimal wages and like paying 50-70$/Euro for GoTY games and 20-40$/Euro for very old games.

quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Perturabo

To be honest, I'm always perplexed when I see westerners complaining about prices like 40GBP or 50$. It's less than 7 hours of minimal wage work for tens or in case of wargames hundreds of hours of fun.
Or maybe my countrymen just have insane spending habits with buying new AAA games for about 100-120PLN (30-40USD) each (15,5-18,5 minimal hourly wages).

Well �40 is more like $65. Also in the UK we are taxed beyond belief our fuel bills are sky high as is petrol so we are left with very little at the end of the day especially if you have kids to look after, which I presume you don't. If not just wait and see.

It's the same in Poland. Actually from what my uncle which lives in London tells me, the taxes (especially the social security tax) are even higher in Poland. Except that our work is somehow counted as worth 4.5 times less than in UK, so we're left with even less. As for the prices in GBP and USD, I was talking about general amounts of money, not, about a price of a specific game.

As for situational stuff. Right now I have to pay for my studies and I don't have any money left for games, movies, books, etc. Like in 0PLN per month. Technically, when it comes to entertainment in itself it isn't a problem as there are several well stocked libraries in my city and I can legally download movies, music and books and I'm stocked up with tens of older games, but it obviously isn't the same as the real thing. It doesn't give that driving force to work that the ability to buy something gives. It's just working to work some more.

So, I guess it would probably be insane spending habits here, then?

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

DLCs are alright as long as they have not taken away from the main game and as long as they're priced right.

If the content isn't what I want, then I'll leave it (sprite packs for HoI). If it's too pricey, I'll leave it (FPS DLC packs at over �10 for a few online maps)

What I dislike more is standard game on sale and deluxe games. I didn't mind deluxe games when the purchaser got certain external things (figure, t-shirt or whatever), but getting equipment in game up front that other people either won't get or have to work through levels to get - I don't like those deluxe versions!

I have more problems with the concept of grinding for exp and equipment itself than with people bypassing it by buying equipment.
Imagine a wargame where you have to grind for a Tiger or for M1 Abrams or for a squad of Marines.

< Message edited by Perturabo -- 10/12/2011 12:58:56 PM >

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Post #: 45

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 5:21:53 PM

Phatguy

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Grinding for tanks? Marines? Sounds like every damn RTS out there....

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Post #: 46

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 5:31:57 PM

Perturabo

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Well, at least it usually doesn't take as much time as in cRPGs/MMORPGs. Also, usually it's just building a base and making sure that the spice flows, not killing hundreds of enemy units for exp/randomly dropped loot.

< Message edited by Perturabo -- 10/12/2011 5:33:13 PM >

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Post #: 47

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 10:02:21 PM

wodin

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Funny enough alot of the Polish migrants went back to Poland as they realised they had a better lifestyle over there than here. So that says it all.

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Post #: 48

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 10:15:39 PM

Hertston

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TedG

I just don't care about "achievements"..

Neither do I, in the sense of collecting little icons on Steam. Those particular three, though, involve playing through on maximum difficulty, without killing anybody and without being spotted by any alarm system. Try that on a couple of missions and you will understand why it's worth playing through again.

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Post #: 49

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/12/2011 10:30:41 PM

Perturabo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

Funny enough alot of the Polish migrants went back to Poland as they realised they had a better lifestyle over there than here. So that says it all.

Generally, it's more comfortable emotionally to live in ones own country with an organic support network of friends and family if that country doesn't have a famine or some social unrest/tyranny or some other life-threatening problems. My uncle had to emigrate to London because in Poland, he was jobless almost all the time and often didn't have money for food.
Also, lots of Polish migrants moved from England to Scandinavian countries, not from England to Poland.
Those who return usually have to settle for a lower level of life but still return because they want to work in their own trade, not to work in a hypermarket or washing dishes. They didn't return here to be simple workers like in England but to be workers with higher education and to a cheap government-owned flat - often renting a flat from the government costs the same as renting a room from a private person.
Also, they have nor reason to care about stuff like how many games they can buy if they can download them illegally, so it's hardly relevant to the discussion.

Personally, I went to London for two months in 2006 but I couldn't get any work despite going to a Jobcentre+ every day, so I had to return. Generally, my observations were that good quality food was much more expensive than here but much less than here in work, games, movies and music were very cheap in work, renting a room many times more expensive in money than in Poland but costs the same as in work. In general, it offered me much higher life level than living in Poland.
Since I rented a big room in the same flat as my uncle, I didn't risk having noisy/degenerate neighbours. And I lived with my uncle so, I had family in a room next to my room - it's a comfort that many people don't have.

Generally, Poles tend to get involved into weird deals where several people live in one room and they live cheaply to save much money as they can send it to their families/buy a house/start a business in Poland, so basically not living on the higher level typical for western countries is their own choice.

< Message edited by Perturabo -- 10/12/2011 11:02:23 PM >

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RE: Matrix pricing - 10/13/2011 12:21:37 AM

Arctic Blast

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quote:

ORIGINAL: apathetic lurker

What about the ones that are full of overkill? Train simulator 2012 perhaps?....LOL, I think they are up to 700+ DLC's , or so it seems

Do we have to love them?

It's just extra content. Don't want it? Don't buy it...you still have a game that you can play just fine without it. Looking for a little more? Pick it up.

It's really no different than expansions (and some DLC ARE outright expansions under a different name), just in smaller chunks. There were absolute dog expansions that were overpriced, too.

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Post #: 51

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/13/2011 1:54:21 AM

jomni

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Tanks? Grinding? Then it's got to be World of Tanks!!! But that's free... if you don't mind the grinding.

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Post #: 52

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/14/2011 1:07:21 PM

Gilmer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hertston

quote:

ORIGINAL: TedG

p.p.s. I purchased Heart Of Iron 3 on the recommendation of a friend. What a hideous train wreck of a game. Promptly uninstalled and shelved. Although the Paradox offering "Mount & Blade" is awesome....and who wouldn't support a husband/wife games studio to boot!

I just wonder how many people are buying Paradox stuff on release any more? It all seems to get discounted very quickly and, in the case of the last two Steam sales they were almost giving it away.

I think a lot do and mostly because their prices even at the outset are usually lower. Their Sengoku game and their Pirate game seem to have had a lot of initial buyers and probably because I think they priced them both for less than 30 USD.

I bought Pride of Nations at release. Partly because of price, mostly because it is an AEGOD game. Although, personally, I have not enjoyed it as much as some of their other titles, I see the lure of a game like that.

< Message edited by H Gilmer -- 10/14/2011 1:08:28 PM >

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Post #: 53

RE: Matrix pricing - 10/14/2011 8:49:49 PM

parusski

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