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RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available!

 
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RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 3:48:49 PM   
Locarnus


Posts: 287
Joined: 5/30/2010
From: Earth, Sol
Status: offline 		@Bingeling: I dont see how larger fuel capacity is a problem for the experience of larger galaxies.

The distance is still longer, it still takes a long time for the ships from A to B.
Realistically what would happen, is the introduction of long range freighters.
So you would have 4 freighter classes. The normal 3 for the standard trade and a long range freighter (with small cargo volume) for the long range flights for rare luxury goods.
The AI would just need to understand that the freighters are for different purposes and not send a short range bulk freighter from one edge to the other for 35 zentabia fluid...

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Post #: 61
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 4:07:34 PM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		I think there is a way to lower hyper space speed (some settings file...).

The core problem is the small freighter going across the galaxy for 35 zentiba fluids. In the much better private sector, the freighters have a max range, and your zentiba source may be outside of that one on a larger galaxy. In that case you should cure this by building a starbase (or more) midway. Or a colon where maybe a spaceport is required. Then some freighters would run full loads of zentiba fluid from the source to the starbase. Others would run full loads of zentiba fluid to the closest spaceports in your own yard, and smaller freighters would distribute the fluid to the single colonies.

In this much better world, the zentiba source may want fuel and building materials not found on the planet itself. Notice there are large freighters running empty to this planet. So large freighters run from your close core colonies to the starbase with building materials and fuel, they return with zentiba fluid. Other large freighters run from the starbase to the zentiba world bringing fuel and materials, and bring the golden fluid back to the spaceport.

The main trade network that is wishlisted at work. In this case with a starbase working as a hub. That starbase could also be a main trading port from AI empires in the region. Imagine a starbase the size of a large spaceport sitting in a hydrogen cloud surrounded by 3 defensive bases. Hordes of freighters and passenger ships flying inn from all directions, but most along the main trade route of your empire. And no local consumers of anything...

(in reply to Locarnus)
Post #: 62
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 4:24:56 PM   
Locarnus


Posts: 287
Joined: 5/30/2010
From: Earth, Sol
Status: offline 		@Bingeling: Subconsciously I was thinking in terms of such a trade network. This is one of the reasons I try to have a colony/starbase in the center of the galaxy, if I start at the edge, to act as a redistribution hub (the second reason is of course to have a fuel base for military interventions). The problem currently is, that even the center is outside the reach of the early (unaltered) freighters.

I really like your trade network idea, but even there a (additional) long range freighter is necessary. For example you are on one edge, your trading partner, who has spice, is on the other edge. You only need small quantities, but due to the large influence zones in current version, there are no free spots anymore in the galaxy center to build spaceports. So with the current 3 freigher version, even your trade network would produce crawling freighters.

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(in reply to Bingeling)
Post #: 63
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 4:25:32 PM   
J HG T


Posts: 1093
Joined: 5/14/2010
From: Kiadia Prime
Status: offline 		Update on lag:
- Started new game with 1.7.0.2: No lag, works perfectly fine. Saved the interesting start for future use.
- Quit to menu, loads 1.7.0.1 save game: Horrendous lag.
- Quit to menu, loads the saved 1.7.0.2 start: Horrendous lag even with minimal amount of stuff on screen. Lag seemingly transfers to loaded 1.7.0.2 game.
- Quit DW: Legends, Restart, loads 1.7.0.2 start: Works great once again, continues to play the 1.7.0.2 start.

Go figure.
Too bad about the great 1.7.0.1 game with Zenox but The Vektus Corporation (Haakonish) shall reign supreme!


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"And they hurled themselves into the void of space with no fear."

(in reply to Bingeling)
Post #: 64
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 5:06:21 PM   
Webbco


Posts: 682
Joined: 2/6/2010
Status: offline 		So the lag issues are only when loading v1.7.0.1 or v1.7.0.2 games in v1.7.0.2? 

(in reply to J HG T)
Post #: 65
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 5:21:49 PM   
J HG T


Posts: 1093
Joined: 5/14/2010
From: Kiadia Prime
Status: offline 		1.7.0.2 savegame lags only if I try to play the laggy 1.7.0.1 savegame first. But if I load the 1.7.0.2 savegame right away when starting the game (or start new 1.7.0.2 game) there's no performance issues at all. 1.7.0.1 savegame seems to "infect" the 1.7.0.2 savegames with its lagginess.
Yeah, It's kinda odd.


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Post #: 66
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 5:25:11 PM   
Fideach

 

Posts: 175
Joined: 3/30/2010
Status: offline 		I'm seeing lag from what seems to be a memory leak myself.

Two others have mentioned issues with it as well in this tread:
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2964953

(in reply to J HG T)
Post #: 67
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 5:44:41 PM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		I have bad, bad lag on my 1.7.0.1 save. But I do nasty stuff like speak on skype and type this message on the other screen.

So no reload done in this one, but it sat idle for a very long time. I will try a new game as I want to look at the 400 size cruiser fix :)

(in reply to Fideach)
Post #: 68
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 5:51:14 PM   
Webbco


Posts: 682
Joined: 2/6/2010
Status: offline 		I just loaded up my 1.7.0.1 game in the 1.7.0.2 patched version and there is certainly issues with lag. It got VERY bad when opening up the editor about 5 years into the game - had to wait for at least 30 secs.

(in reply to Fideach)
Post #: 69
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 6:54:34 PM   
Baleur


Posts: 372
Joined: 1/18/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel
It is so bad here that late game I can hardly stand it. Scrolling is a pain even when there isn't much on the screen.

I'm sorry to say that is the way the game has always been. I made some threads about it but most people (even the devs) were like "??? what lag ???". It seems they all are so used to it they don't even think about it. But yes, it does run extremely slow and sluggish lategame, scrolling, zooming, it is all a chore.

You pretty much just have to decide if you love the gameplay enough to deal with it. I learnt to deal with it, but i agree with you.
I very much hope that whatever sequel Distant Worlds get, will have a proper graphics engine that at the very least can handle 2d graphics and zooming in or out without any stutter, as in pretty much every other game ever created (spaz, gsb, galciv2, eu3, v2, etc etc etc).

edit: ah there was a specific 1.7.0.1 issue you were talking about.


Ontopic, requested change;
You know in the Colony screen (also in the Ships & Bases screen i think), when you check out the resources, cargo and some other screens, half of the space below the category tabs is empty. All that empty grey space on the right side could very well be used to display info about the currently selected item!

For instance, if you select Casion in the cargo or resources tab of a ship, station or planet, the empty gray side to the right could display the same info you get in the design screen or popup screen when clicking "component detail" in the ship design window. Or even more, for instance sotspedia info in compressed format, like what components require that resource or what ship designs you currently use that require it.
Same for components, if you select a Standard Fuel Cell in the component list OR cargo list, the right side could show simple info about it, how much fuel it holds, build cost in resources or simply size.

I find it is odd that such a big space in the UI is completely empty, especially considering those windows are chock full of information, as it is the very purpose of them! :)
It would be so handy to just quickly see "ah, this ship is transporting iridium, which *looks to the right side* is used in greatest quantity for my new shields"
Or even better! A simple and small "Empire-wide resource stock" and "Empire-wide resource demand" section if a resource is selected.

< Message edited by Baleur -- 11/30/2011 6:57:53 PM >

(in reply to Missouri_Rebel)
Post #: 70
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 7:00:29 PM   
Gelatinous Cube


Posts: 696
Joined: 10/26/2011
Status: offline 		No, the lag in this beta patch is definitely something new. Everything else in it is spectacular, but the lag is incredible even on my machine, which has 8gb of RAM, an i5 Quad 3.3, and an Nvidia GT520. I rarely had any lag before the patch, except in totally extreme scenarios (which got much better after Legends).

Everything else in the patch is just fantastic though. I especially like the improvements to AI Ship Design. I used to have to wait a long time before my AI minions would design me some cruisers, but now they do it very soon. Completely changes the feel of the early-mid game. And the newer, bigger borders are just perfect. Spot on.

Really, just fix whatever caused the lag to jump up and this is just unbelievably awesome.

(in reply to Baleur)
Post #: 71
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 7:49:45 PM   
Janster

 

Posts: 54
Joined: 2/19/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: J HG T

Update on lag:
- Started new game with 1.7.0.2: No lag, works perfectly fine. Saved the interesting start for future use.
- Quit to menu, loads 1.7.0.1 save game: Horrendous lag.
- Quit to menu, loads the saved 1.7.0.2 start: Horrendous lag even with minimal amount of stuff on screen. Lag seemingly transfers to loaded 1.7.0.2 game.
- Quit DW: Legends, Restart, loads 1.7.0.2 start: Works great once again, continues to play the 1.7.0.2 start.

Go figure.
Too bad about the great 1.7.0.1 game with Zenox but The Vektus Corporation (Haakonish) shall reign supreme!



It doesn't work fine, you just can't start a new game and declare it ok like that. Start a new game, play it for 30 + minutes and you will see that it isn't a savegame issue at all.

Memory leak feels right here, but I know nothing about that kinda stuff.


(in reply to J HG T)
Post #: 72
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 8:13:08 PM   
J HG T


Posts: 1093
Joined: 5/14/2010
From: Kiadia Prime
Status: offline 		@Janster
I played the 1.7.0.2 save over hour and a half without any major performance drops. Should have mentioned that.
There's been memory leaks in DW but they have been fixed. Don't know about this case though. We'll see.



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"And they hurled themselves into the void of space with no fear."

(in reply to Janster)
Post #: 73
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 8:15:48 PM   
Locarnus


Posts: 287
Joined: 5/30/2010
From: Earth, Sol
Status: offline 		I dont have a major speed issue (but I rarely play with more than 400 stars).

Another thing: I just experienced, what was stated somewhere else, that contructors try to build the wrong research base.

Eg if the planet gives 20% Energy bonus, they want to build a weapons research there.
Normally now I obsolete my research base designs if I dont want to build a base manually, to avoid the research spam, but somehow I forgot this time and it wanted to build the wrong one automatically.

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Post #: 74
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 11/30/2011 9:17:49 PM   
ASHBERY76


Posts: 2136
Joined: 10/10/2001
From: England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Locarnus

I dont have a major speed issue (but I rarely play with more than 400 stars).

Another thing: I just experienced, what was stated somewhere else, that contructors try to build the wrong research base.

Eg if the planet gives 20% Energy bonus, they want to build a weapons research there.
Normally now I obsolete my research base designs if I dont want to build a base manually, to avoid the research spam, but somehow I forgot this time and it wanted to build the wrong one automatically.


This was reported on the tech forum at launch but must have been missed by Elliot.

_____________________________


(in reply to Locarnus)
Post #: 75
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 12:25:25 AM   
Nalim27

 

Posts: 39
Joined: 12/16/2010
Status: offline 		Hello Erik,
  except lagging during zoom game 1.7.2 is running fine for me.    I created some memory allocation report for you - it is looks that memory leak is not that big (and more physical memory allocation can be explained by more ships and bases that I (and AI empires) builds).
You can download report here: http://www.fileserve.com/file/2qf4Cex/Distant Worlds Memory 1.7.2.zip
  
   I must say I love that fast patching that you guys doing.


_____________________________

Nalim27, gamer

(in reply to Locarnus)
Post #: 76
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 12:57:38 AM   
PaulWRoberts

 

Posts: 897
Joined: 4/22/2001
Status: offline 		I have finally dived in, and I am loving everything I see of this game!

However (and I bring it up here because the patch notes mention crashes), I get a crash every time I try to load a prior save game.  The game will load up and I'm looking at the map, but I can see my desktop "through the game" where the various information displays should be (top of screen, lower-left and lower-right blocks).  I can move the map around, but most commands are non-responsive, and in a few seconds I get "This program has stopped responding."


EDIT: A reboot seemed to clear this up, but I still see lag from time to time.


< Message edited by Paul Roberts -- 12/1/2011 4:49:54 AM >

(in reply to Nalim27)
Post #: 77
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 1:12:46 AM   
Fideach

 

Posts: 175
Joined: 3/30/2010
Status: offline 		I have lag, from what appears to be a memory leak on new games. Not from loaded games from previous versions.

(in reply to PaulWRoberts)
Post #: 78
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 1:39:56 AM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		Hi guys,

If you are having issues with 1.7.0.2, feel free to go back to 1.7.0.1 or 1.7.0.0 until we release the next public beta update (should be this Friday).

Regards,

- Erik

_____________________________

Erik Rutins
CEO, Matrix Games LLC



For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

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(in reply to Fideach)
Post #: 79
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 2:10:45 AM   
adamsolo


Posts: 144
Joined: 12/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76

I also think migration to new colonies needed a massive boost for passenger ship space as it takes to long to make new colonies relevant..Hopefully next.


I second this. It takes TOO long to develop colonies. It's like the game ends before many colonies reach decent population numbers. This should be tweaked.


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(in reply to ASHBERY76)
Post #: 80
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 2:21:09 AM   
WoodMan


Posts: 1345
Joined: 6/2/2010
From: Ol' Blighty
Status: offline
quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76

I also think migration to new colonies needed a massive boost for passenger ship space as it takes to long to make new colonies relevant..Hopefully next.


I second this. It takes TOO long to develop colonies. It's like the game ends before many colonies reach decent population numbers. This should be tweaked.


I like it how it is, I play with everything set to as slow and low as possible.  Please don't tweak this.  If you must, give us an option, but don't tweak it without giving us an option in the new game screen.  Population growth is already outpacing everything else at the slowest speeds, making it faster would ruin things for me.

They already boosted this in the past AND in Legends the races pop growth was boosted again.  Please no change without an option.


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(in reply to adamsolo)
Post #: 81
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 2:29:55 AM   
solops

 

Posts: 814
Joined: 1/31/2002
From: Central Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WoodMan

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76

I also think migration to new colonies needed a massive boost for passenger ship space as it takes to long to make new colonies relevant..Hopefully next.


I second this. It takes TOO long to develop colonies. It's like the game ends before many colonies reach decent population numbers. This should be tweaked.


I like it how it is, I play with everything set to as slow and low as possible.  Please don't tweak this.  If you must, give us an option, but don't tweak it without giving us an option in the new game screen.  Population growth is already outpacing everything else at the slowest speeds, making it faster would ruin things for me.

They already boosted this in the past AND in Legends the races pop growth was boosted again.  Please no change without an option.



I agree with Woodman.

_____________________________

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.-Edmund Burke
Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; if it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it.-Judge Learned Hand

(in reply to WoodMan)
Post #: 82
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 2:31:42 AM   
feelotraveller


Posts: 1040
Joined: 9/12/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: solops


quote:

ORIGINAL: WoodMan

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76

I also think migration to new colonies needed a massive boost for passenger ship space as it takes to long to make new colonies relevant..Hopefully next.


I second this. It takes TOO long to develop colonies. It's like the game ends before many colonies reach decent population numbers. This should be tweaked.


I like it how it is, I play with everything set to as slow and low as possible.  Please don't tweak this.  If you must, give us an option, but don't tweak it without giving us an option in the new game screen.  Population growth is already outpacing everything else at the slowest speeds, making it faster would ruin things for me.

They already boosted this in the past AND in Legends the races pop growth was boosted again.  Please no change without an option.



I agree with Woodman.


I think that it has already been done. I have way more passenger ships in my most recent game (first 1702).

(in reply to solops)
Post #: 83
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 2:43:18 AM   
adamsolo


Posts: 144
Joined: 12/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WoodMan

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76

I also think migration to new colonies needed a massive boost for passenger ship space as it takes to long to make new colonies relevant..Hopefully next.


I second this. It takes TOO long to develop colonies. It's like the game ends before many colonies reach decent population numbers. This should be tweaked.


I like it how it is, I play with everything set to as slow and low as possible.  Please don't tweak this.  If you must, give us an option, but don't tweak it without giving us an option in the new game screen.  Population growth is already outpacing everything else at the slowest speeds, making it faster would ruin things for me.

They already boosted this in the past AND in Legends the races pop growth was boosted again.  Please no change without an option.



So, I guess you like to play with colonies never reaching billions of citizens hum? In my games the capital supports almost 95/99% of the game total income through the all game. Even at late bigger games new colonies only provide residual income through taxes. Is this fun? I play more than half my games with 0% taxes everywhere in the hope of colonies developing faster but they are too slow.

If there would be an option great (like a migration policy incentive increase/decrese). Maybe if I design bigger passenger ships (with more passenger compartments) maybe that can boost migration and population boost.


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(in reply to WoodMan)
Post #: 84
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 2:52:17 AM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		Hi everyone,

Some good news. Elliot found and fixed the issue that was creating the decreased performance in 1.7.0.2, so the next build should have even better performance than 1.7.0.1, as intended.

Regards,

- Erik

_____________________________

Erik Rutins
CEO, Matrix Games LLC



For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.

(in reply to adamsolo)
Post #: 85
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 2:55:46 AM   
adamsolo


Posts: 144
Joined: 12/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: feelotraveller


quote:

ORIGINAL: solops


quote:

ORIGINAL: WoodMan

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76

I also think migration to new colonies needed a massive boost for passenger ship space as it takes to long to make new colonies relevant..Hopefully next.


I second this. It takes TOO long to develop colonies. It's like the game ends before many colonies reach decent population numbers. This should be tweaked.


I like it how it is, I play with everything set to as slow and low as possible.  Please don't tweak this.  If you must, give us an option, but don't tweak it without giving us an option in the new game screen.  Population growth is already outpacing everything else at the slowest speeds, making it faster would ruin things for me.

They already boosted this in the past AND in Legends the races pop growth was boosted again.  Please no change without an option.



I agree with Woodman.


I think that it has already been done. I have way more passenger ships in my most recent game (first 1702).


So, you mean that passenger boosting was already done in 1.7.0.2? I'm playing 1.7.0.0


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(in reply to feelotraveller)
Post #: 86
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 3:00:29 AM   
solops

 

Posts: 814
Joined: 1/31/2002
From: Central Texas
Status: offline 		Good work and quick, too!

_____________________________

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.-Edmund Burke
Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; if it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it.-Judge Learned Hand

(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 87
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 3:01:24 AM   
feelotraveller


Posts: 1040
Joined: 9/12/2011
Status: offline 		Yes Adam, if I have it correct.

Previously I have always started with only one passenger ship. (I play starting galaxy and player expansion - the single colony.) This game I had two. I have never had more than one passenger ship per colony in the early game and although my 1702 game is in its first year with a second colony I now have 4 passenger ships. That is enough to make me think that the number of passenger ships built has been substantially increased. Note that this should, hopefully, increase the growth of smaller colonies whilst not increasing overall growth rate.

You know that low taxes and high development, particularly on newish colonies attracts migrants?

(in reply to adamsolo)
Post #: 88
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 3:18:16 AM   
adamsolo


Posts: 144
Joined: 12/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: feelotraveller

Yes Adam, if I have it correct.

Previously I have always started with only one passenger ship. (I play starting galaxy and player expansion - the single colony.) This game I had two. I have never had more than one passenger ship per colony in the early game and although my 1702 game is in its first year with a second colony I now have 4 passenger ships. That is enough to make me think that the number of passenger ships built has been substantially increased. Note that this should, hopefully, increase the growth of smaller colonies whilst not increasing overall growth rate.

You know that low taxes and high development, particularly on newish colonies attracts migrants?


I have 4 passenger ships in my game with about 8 colonies. I'm on 1.7.0.0


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Post #: 89
RE: New DW: Legends Public Beta v1.7.0.2 Available! - 12/1/2011 3:53:07 AM   
solops

 

Posts: 814
Joined: 1/31/2002
From: Central Texas
Status: offline 		In my 1701/1702 game I have 85 colonies and 150 passenger ships.

_____________________________

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.-Edmund Burke
Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; if it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it.-Judge Learned Hand

(in reply to adamsolo)
Post #: 90
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