Matrix Games Forums

 Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A)

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3 4 5   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 6/26/2011 8:39:53 PM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline
rader told me that RL has greatly intruded. He hopes to back updating soon ...

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to krupp_88mm)
Post #: 31
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 6/28/2011 3:39:47 AM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		Yes very busy and the g/f was visiting this weekend. On top of that, I'm away all next week. It's all I can do to send back regular turns for my two ongoing games (and that takes priority).


quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


rader told me that RL has greatly intruded. He hopes to back updating soon ...


(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 32
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 6/28/2011 3:58:08 AM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		October 25, 1942.

Had a bit of time after a busy week so I thought I'd update.

Well, we triggered the allied reinforcements over a month ago but I'd say it's unlikely we will take India. Allied air strength hasn't been destroyed as fast as we needed, and I'm sure some of those troops are now in India (maybe all). There are allied transports unloading every turn. We've launched DD raids and some have gone very well, others not so much. Although very slowly and at high cost, we are still grinding down the allied fighters, and I do predict that we can win the war in the air. However, Karachi must have so many troops now (150+ units between Karachi and Hyderabad), and most likely level 9 forts in both by now). The problem is that Karachi simply cannot be blockaded, even with the KB unless the Japanese have total command of the skies. Unfortunately, without command of the skies, the KB is pretty useless for the task. The way the map is designed, allied TFs are in the off-map movement box until the very turn they are protected by the blanket of allied fighers. Even the KB parked outside must decide to either tangle with the allied fighters (and potentially bombers), or allow their quarry to pass unharmed. If there was more 'real' sea between Aden and Karachi, the situation would be totally different.

However, I believe that we can grind away the allied fighers trhough the rest of 1942 and the first half of 1943. This is unlikely to give me Karachi, however. In fact, it would be suicidal to stay in India past mid-1943 once the Aden channel is open and the Essexes come online anyway. Thus, I plan to abandon all of India sometime in the summer of 1943. But it sure is nice having all the heavy industry, oil, and supply production in the meantime, and being this far in India keeps the allies pretty well at bay in the west. So not a bad trade for some extra divisions, I would say. I never intended an autovictory, so if holding india for over a year helps me stay alive into 1946, so much the better. Nevertheless, I will try for Karachi in any event because I've got a large army with nothing much else to do. You never know - if, once the allied fighters are destroyed, a tight blockade becomes feasible, maybe Karachi will fall. Stranger things have happened.

My main priority at the moment is building up a solid "do not cross" line for the allies to break against. I'm considering trying to counterattack an allied landing at Guadalcanal, but I remember how that turned out in RL, and what's the point? I don't want that place, too far from my defenses and supplies anyway. However, I'm massing reinforcements at Rabaul and building up Buka just in case I feel like trying to squash Lunga - probably not worth the risk

Last month we put a torpedo in the Saratoga, thus we project that we have carrier superiority (she's probably repairing in Pearl or the WC). Thus the KB is raiding the Pacific. So far we managed to bag a few small AKs and APs... nothing to write the emperor about, but it feels good to at least kill something








Attachment (1)

(in reply to rader)
Post #: 33
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 6/28/2011 5:21:11 AM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rader

... The problem is that Karachi simply cannot be blockaded, even with the KB unless the Japanese have total command of the skies. Unfortunately, without command of the skies, the KB is pretty useless for the task. The way the map is designed, allied TFs are in the off-map movement box until the very turn they are protected by the blanket of allied fighers. Even the KB parked outside must decide to either tangle with the allied fighters (and potentially bombers), or allow their quarry to pass unharmed. If there was more 'real' sea between Aden and Karachi, the situation would be totally different...


Very interesting ... hadn't thought about this lack of space, but I can see your point now. Thanks for taking on the India invasion for all of us "arm chair" types!

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to rader)
Post #: 34
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 7/22/2011 4:16:01 PM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		Not giving away any intel, but from reading GJ's AAR, I have to ask what you are doing to get massive Tojo sweeps from a single base and why are your Helen ASW so effective?? I have a game in late Dec 42 and my Tojo fly as separate Sentai and not as a whole base.

What Beta are you using if you are playing with Beta patches?

_____________________________


(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 35
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 7/23/2011 4:01:30 AM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Not giving away any intel, but from reading GJ's AAR, I have to ask what you are doing to get massive Tojo sweeps from a single base and why are your Helen ASW so effective?? I have a game in late Dec 42 and my Tojo fly as separate Sentai and not as a whole base.

What Beta are you using if you are playing with Beta patches?



Tojo sweeps: I'm just putting them all in a level-9 airfield. No idea why they would or would not be coordinated. In fact, sometimes they aren't, but about 60% of the time they are. As far as I know, AF not being overstacked is the main factor in coordination. Maybe an air HQ or 3?

Helen ASW = 1000 ft, 70 ASW trained. I usually just set them to something like 40% ASW, 40% train, so they constantly improve.

We are using a pretty new one, from maybe a month ago?


(in reply to ny59giants)
Post #: 36
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 7/23/2011 4:10:19 AM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rader


quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

Not giving away any intel, but from reading GJ's AAR, I have to ask what you are doing to get massive Tojo sweeps from a single base and why are your Helen ASW so effective?? I have a game in late Dec 42 and my Tojo fly as separate Sentai and not as a whole base.

What Beta are you using if you are playing with Beta patches?



Tojo sweeps: I'm just putting them all in a level-9 airfield. No idea why they would or would not be coordinated. In fact, sometimes they aren't, but about 60% of the time they are. As far as I know, AF not being overstacked is the main factor in coordination. Maybe an air HQ or 3?

Helen ASW = 1000 ft, 70 ASW trained. I usually just set them to something like 40% ASW, 40% train, so they constantly improve.

We are using a pretty new one, from maybe a month ago?



Lvl 9 AF for fighters makes all the difference.

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to rader)
Post #: 37
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 7/23/2011 9:23:50 AM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Tojo sweeps: I'm just putting them all in a level-9 airfield. No idea why they would or would not be coordinated. In fact, sometimes they aren't, but about 60% of the time they are. As far as I know, AF not being overstacked is the main factor in coordination. Maybe an air HQ or 3?


Thanks!!

_____________________________


(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 38
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/9/2011 1:05:28 PM   
obvert


Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline 		Any updates from your end?

(in reply to ny59giants)
Post #: 39
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/9/2011 8:33:12 PM   
Xargun

 

Posts: 3690
Joined: 2/14/2004
From: Near Columbus, Ohio
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Any updates from your end?


Also interested. I have been following GreyJoy's AAR and just saw this one. Would be nice to see both sides of it -- especially if I can pick up some Jap Fanboy hints...

Xargun

(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 40
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/10/2011 4:17:48 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		Unfortunately, I'm too busy with RL at the moment (and 2 games of WITP) to manage a full GR, but feel free to ask questions or for information you want updated (or screenshots, whatever). We are in May 1943. At this point, I'm basically on the defensive, responding to his moves. The main theaters are around Guadalcanal and in india. I was planning to abandon India soon, but I actually think it will be hard for him to come back overland in indai from the Karachi area - I bet I can force an invasion along the coast (and the med will open very soon). I can probably make this pretty costly for him. No idea where his CVs are, but my best guess is that they are somewhere in the SoPac region supporting Lunga, or possibly in the Med preparing to invade india. He will get his Essexes soon, and I don't forsee any major moves until that point, but expect him to try something big after that.



< Message edited by rader -- 9/10/2011 4:19:02 PM >

(in reply to Xargun)
Post #: 41
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/12/2011 12:26:27 PM   
obvert


Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline 		Understandable. If you do have any time, it would be interesting to hear about your ideas of defense both in India and in the Solomons. Screen shots would be great. It's hard to imagine how you're going to keep the tension in India to the point as you say that he'll have to take heavy losses counter-invading.

What strong points are you planning etc? And how do you plan to get it all out without losing the lot sort of in the Q-Ball manner?

(in reply to rader)
Post #: 42
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/12/2011 7:40:20 PM   
Xargun

 

Posts: 3690
Joined: 2/14/2004
From: Near Columbus, Ohio
Status: offline 		I am wondering what aircraft - particularly fighters that you found were useful and a waste of resources. I noticed you built several fighters that I am thinking of skipping and was wondering why you built them and am I missing something

Thanks

Xargun

(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 43
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/12/2011 10:50:13 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun

I am wondering what aircraft - particularly fighters that you found were useful and a waste of resources. I noticed you built several fighters that I am thinking of skipping and was wondering why you built them and am I missing something

Thanks

Xargun



What a/c are you talking about??

(in reply to Xargun)
Post #: 44
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/12/2011 10:53:48 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Understandable. If you do have any time, it would be interesting to hear about your ideas of defense both in India and in the Solomons. Screen shots would be great. It's hard to imagine how you're going to keep the tension in India to the point as you say that he'll have to take heavy losses counter-invading.

What strong points are you planning etc? And how do you plan to get it all out without losing the lot sort of in the Q-Ball manner?



Well, this is a very different situation from Q-Ball... we are't even in contact. If he tries to come down the road/rail to Multan, he's going to be completely unsupported by aircraft along a long supply line, and I bet I can win that battle. If he manges to break Multan and starts fanning out, I'll go into full evac mode.

The crappiest thing so far is I've got about 2000 AV stuck at Tulagi. I should have put just a bit more in and I could have taken it. But I went for a half measure and it bit me in the backside

(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 45
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/13/2011 9:05:10 PM   
jonreb31


Posts: 714
Joined: 11/26/2006
From: Santa Cruz, California
Status: offline 		I'm curious how much the captured heavy industry in China and India has helped towards your war effort. Your management of Japan's air industry has been impressive to say the least.

_____________________________


(in reply to rader)
Post #: 46
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/14/2011 2:55:46 PM   
Saros

 

Posts: 454
Joined: 12/18/2010
Status: offline 		I'm curious what your pilot quality is like? Are you maintaining the 50xp 70skill standard?

(in reply to jonreb31)
Post #: 47
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/14/2011 5:51:10 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		To be honest, I'm not really sure. India does help a lot in terms of supplies and shipping. The army there pretty much feeds itself. I think the same is basically true of China. In terms of HI, I think it adds about 15% to my HI... enough to pay for maybe a hundred planes a month? (wild guess)

(in reply to jonreb31)
Post #: 48
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/14/2011 5:52:47 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Saros

I'm curious what your pilot quality is like? Are you maintaining the 50xp 70skill standard?




Nah, my goal is to produce lots of mediocre pilots rather than fewer really good ones so I can stay in the fight longer. I aim for 60+ relevant skills, and never even look at experience. My plans seem to get shot down in droves, so mybae this isn't a good idea, but it's amazing how fast you can train a pilot to 60 skill... less than a month I think.

(in reply to Saros)
Post #: 49
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/15/2011 4:33:13 AM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rader


quote:

ORIGINAL: Saros

I'm curious what your pilot quality is like? Are you maintaining the 50xp 70skill standard?




Nah, my goal is to produce lots of mediocre pilots rather than fewer really good ones so I can stay in the fight longer. I aim for 60+ relevant skills, and never even look at experience. My plans seem to get shot down in droves, so mybae this isn't a good idea, but it's amazing how fast you can train a pilot to 60 skill... less than a month I think.

I'm with you ... 60 skill and then they have to earn their exp the old fashioned way.

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to rader)
Post #: 50
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/15/2011 12:26:04 PM   
obvert


Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline
quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: rader


quote:

ORIGINAL: Saros

I'm curious what your pilot quality is like? Are you maintaining the 50xp 70skill standard?


Nah, my goal is to produce lots of mediocre pilots rather than fewer really good ones so I can stay in the fight longer. I aim for 60+ relevant skills, and never even look at experience. My plans seem to get shot down in droves, so mybae this isn't a good idea, but it's amazing how fast you can train a pilot to 60 skill... less than a month I think.

I'm with you ... 60 skill and then they have to earn their exp the old fashioned way.


Seems like this is a great idea with bomber pilots, recon, or any other except fighter pilots. The problem I've found here is that when you expend your mediocre pilots in sweeps against better trained and experienced pilots, it only makes them exponentially better.

So you send 20 planes 45 EXP - 60 AIR against a solid group of 20 at 55 EXP - 70 AIR and you lose 10 pilots, the other side 2. So not only did you lose 10, but his remaining 18 have gained EXP, AIR, and gotten kills. Now they are at 57 EXP 72 AIR, with 10 kills. Do that for 20 turns and the more experienced side might lose half their pilots, but the remaining 10 are all 75-80 EXP and 75-85 AIR with 5-10 kills.

I find this whenever I play against the AI. I have one squad with 324 kills, where nearly all of the pilots are 80 EXP - 85 AIR, and it's almost impossible to beat them even when I sweep distant bases, as the AI doesn't train pilots, and usually averages 45 EXP - 55 AIR.


(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 51
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/15/2011 1:12:44 PM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: rader


quote:

ORIGINAL: Saros

I'm curious what your pilot quality is like? Are you maintaining the 50xp 70skill standard?


Nah, my goal is to produce lots of mediocre pilots rather than fewer really good ones so I can stay in the fight longer. I aim for 60+ relevant skills, and never even look at experience. My plans seem to get shot down in droves, so mybae this isn't a good idea, but it's amazing how fast you can train a pilot to 60 skill... less than a month I think.

I'm with you ... 60 skill and then they have to earn their exp the old fashioned way.


Seems like this is a great idea with bomber pilots, recon, or any other except fighter pilots. The problem I've found here is that when you expend your mediocre pilots in sweeps against better trained and experienced pilots, it only makes them exponentially better.

So you send 20 planes 45 EXP - 60 AIR against a solid group of 20 at 55 EXP - 70 AIR and you lose 10 pilots, the other side 2. So not only did you lose 10, but his remaining 18 have gained EXP, AIR, and gotten kills. Now they are at 57 EXP 72 AIR, with 10 kills. Do that for 20 turns and the more experienced side might lose half their pilots, but the remaining 10 are all 75-80 EXP and 75-85 AIR with 5-10 kills.

I find this whenever I play against the AI. I have one squad with 324 kills, where nearly all of the pilots are 80 EXP - 85 AIR, and it's almost impossible to beat them even when I sweep distant bases, as the AI doesn't train pilots, and usually averages 45 EXP - 55 AIR.



Mmmmm Some good points here. I will have to think about this more and maybe reconsider my approach ...

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 52
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/15/2011 1:19:45 PM   
Miller


Posts: 2226
Joined: 9/14/2004
From: Ashington, England.
Status: offline 		I would have said that the Japs have enough training units to produce ample 50/70 skill pilots, but not at the rate they are being fed into the meatgrinder in this game!

PS> Rader, any chance of giving us a rough idea of your monthly a/c production figures?

(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 53
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/15/2011 7:24:53 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: rader


quote:

ORIGINAL: Saros

I'm curious what your pilot quality is like? Are you maintaining the 50xp 70skill standard?


Nah, my goal is to produce lots of mediocre pilots rather than fewer really good ones so I can stay in the fight longer. I aim for 60+ relevant skills, and never even look at experience. My plans seem to get shot down in droves, so mybae this isn't a good idea, but it's amazing how fast you can train a pilot to 60 skill... less than a month I think.

I'm with you ... 60 skill and then they have to earn their exp the old fashioned way.


Seems like this is a great idea with bomber pilots, recon, or any other except fighter pilots. The problem I've found here is that when you expend your mediocre pilots in sweeps against better trained and experienced pilots, it only makes them exponentially better.

So you send 20 planes 45 EXP - 60 AIR against a solid group of 20 at 55 EXP - 70 AIR and you lose 10 pilots, the other side 2. So not only did you lose 10, but his remaining 18 have gained EXP, AIR, and gotten kills. Now they are at 57 EXP 72 AIR, with 10 kills. Do that for 20 turns and the more experienced side might lose half their pilots, but the remaining 10 are all 75-80 EXP and 75-85 AIR with 5-10 kills.

I find this whenever I play against the AI. I have one squad with 324 kills, where nearly all of the pilots are 80 EXP - 85 AIR, and it's almost impossible to beat them even when I sweep distant bases, as the AI doesn't train pilots, and usually averages 45 EXP - 55 AIR.





Problem is that I can't train them fast enough on the offense... and declining pilots is probably why my offensive petered out (plus imprving allied pilots). But now on defense, if I manage to save most of my shot down pilots, I might be able to wait for 70 skill... we'll see.

(in reply to obvert)
Post #: 54
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 9/15/2011 7:26:55 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Miller

I would have said that the Japs have enough training units to produce ample 50/70 skill pilots, but not at the rate they are being fed into the meatgrinder in this game!

PS> Rader, any chance of giving us a rough idea of your monthly a/c production figures?



As I recall, its something like 200 Tojos, 150 George, 150 A6Ms, 150 Oscars (not currently building), 120 Judys, 80 Jills, 50 Bettys, 150 Helens. That's about the relevant stuff I think.

(in reply to Miller)
Post #: 55
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 12/3/2011 5:59:53 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		And the big news that probably everyone knows by now judging by the number of recent posts in Greyjoy's AAR is that a couple weeks ago game time, the Allies mounted a surprise invasion of Hokkaido and the Southern Kuriles. Boy, was that a bolt from the blue!

The allies now have a pretty firm lodgement (see map). The KB was out of position expecting an allied landing in the Solomons, and this was probably the one area where we were totally unprepared. I made a conscious effort to build up the bases in Hokkaido, with the activity elsewhere on the map, I never quite got around to adequately garrisoning here. I think an email I sent to Greyjoy sums up my view on this, so I'll paste it here (long):

////////////////////////////////////

"I certainly should have put more in Hokkaido/Kuriles, but I'm not convinced there is much I could have reasonably done to stop your invasion given the information I had. I am very concious of where you have "visible" activity like recon, and here I had none (intentionally, it seems). I could/should have made it more painful for you, but by this time in the game, an Allied invasion force of that size can take pretty much anything it wants. The Allies have to go somewhere, and unless it is exactly where Japan expects, they will almost certainly succeed by 1944. If I had less than 3-4 divisions in Hokkaido and less than a division in each of those Kurile islands (I had only 1 div plus a couple support units in Hokkaido), you still would have succeeded. I sort of think you ought to be able to move General defense forces to Hokkaido across the Ominato strait by rail/land move. Otherwise, it is completely undefended unless you put a lot of your discretionary forces. Only 1 division arrives there as a reinforcement until now (actually 2 more were slotted to arrive in the next month or so, so your timing was impecable).

And yes, I could have put more troops there, but then where do I leave empty? I have to put my units where I see your big armies (NG/Solomons/India) or else you will just cut through them like a knife through butter like you did here. Although it is true that the Allies cutting through Hokkaido is much worse than cutting through the Solomons. I just thought you were suffering from a bit of tunnel vision and were trying to fight your way gradually forward. This is what jzanes did - he never made a major cross-sea invasion and he still made tremendously rapid progress. I think in that game I was more wary of such a thing, so I defended the rear better. But all my rear defensive positions were a waste and I should have put more up front, especially in the DEI in that game. Turns out I was the one with tunnel vision.

I have pretty much come to the conclusion that with all the material the allies have by the second half of 1944 (and we aren't even there yet!), Japan is going to lose the war/game almost no matter what they do, unless the Allies are stupid enough to commit and lose their carriers early. Once the Allied CV/army/4E Death Stars are complete, the allies will win every encounter. The trick to playing Japan late is just to accept it and have fun while losing, and try to strike back where you can. The only chances a Japanese player has to win the game IMO are: 1. Autovictory, with Australia being by far the best path to this. But autovictory just seems silly to me. 2. Find yourself a really agressive opponent who wants to mount major allies offensives in 1942-1943 before the allies are really ready.

What this game really needs to represent the historical situation are better political rules. It's almost crazy that the game has such detail and well-developed naval/air/ground interactions and rules, but basically no political restrictions at all (appart from a neutral Soviet Union until a fixed date). It seems trivial to add some basic political rules that would set realistic objectives and dissencentives for the Allies to sit back and "do nothing" until 1944, represent army-air-national friction for both sides, etc. Maybe a "high water mark", or accumulation of victory points over time? Also, logistics are way too easy for both sides, and this makes the pace of operations at least double and probably more as fast as real life. This helps both sides, but works to the Allied benefit for a longer period of time in the endgame.

That being said, this is a fantastic game and so much fun. I want to play out both my current games. But it is such a time suck on real life and I feel like I've explored the potentials and possibilities sufficiently that I probably won't start a new game. Not only am I concerned by the time committment which is extreme (I spend an average of ~3 hours per day, which is currently around 20% of my waking time and almost all my discretionary time), but I would be concered about an opponent quitting after a major defeat. I've been incredibly lucky to find two opponents who are very reliable, committed, and fun to play with. I want to return the favour and play both games out, pretty much until the end or at least until they are satisfied with the outcome.

On the Multan bottleneck, that is probably true that I could have held out longer, but it is a very far forward exposed situation and you had a LOT of troops in a position to threaten the retreat path. All it would take is for you to bring a massive invasion (which considering events you obviously were capable of) to Burma and the Andaman islands, and I could have lost the whole army. If I lose those units it's game over, even more then now with Hokkaido. I have to play cautiously. I just wish I had been even more cautious and moved some of those troops back to Japan and the Kuriles sooner... now I definitely think falling back from Multan was the right thing to do. I probably waited too long if anything."

/////////////////////////////////////







Attachment (1)

(in reply to rader)
Post #: 56
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 12/3/2011 6:13:36 PM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline 		Wow.  Not reading his, only yours.  OUCH.  Bold stroke of his.  Guess I'll have to go back read his now to see how this developed.  Your attack into India was great ... this is a good game ...

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to rader)
Post #: 57
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 12/3/2011 6:26:09 PM   
rader


Posts: 1238
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		Additional thoughts on this.

This is very, very bad for Japan. He will be strat bombing Japan a year ahead of schedule - in fact, he's already started. However, it is still pretty early in 1944, and I don't think he has the capability to 'rubble' Japan quite yet with most of my fighter defenses in the area. The bad part is that once he does, he will be able to do so with a vengeance.

Greyjoy played this brilliantly. I definitely underestimated him (although, I must say, he is a VERY strong opponent). 'Innexperience': not any more - he is clearely a brilliant human being, and able to pick things up really quickly. I pegged himd for a US Grant (good and determined but direct), and he turned out to be a Robert E. Lee (brilliant and indirect, except on July 3, 1863). Greyjoy is constantly innovating, and always giving me nasty surprises. Some worse than others...

I am building up in Hokkaido and bringing troops home to Japan. I doubt I can ever get him out of Hokkaido, but at least I can prevent him from dumping those units in Honshu. And I can put pressure on his troops in Hokkaido and tie up his troops there. If he pulls troops out, I might be able to counterattack.

The only thing I realistically see that I can do to counter this is try to use up his supply and hit his lines of communication. At the very least, I can force him to devote effort to protecting this LOC. Subs, CV raids, and surface raids are all options, but I want to be very careful not to use up the IJN in a useless venture. IMO, Japan's job is the keep the fleet alive as long as possible. Even if outnumbered 4:1, it can still slaughter poorly planned and defended landings, and it forces the allies to be wary and advance on a single (or at most 2) axes. Supported by land-based air, I think the KB can remain an important factor for the entire game - if not stopping the allies, slowing them down by keeping them honest.

Greyjoy has already knocked out the closest R&D factory, and will likely try for more. We have moved most of the Japanese fighters to the home islands, but at least with the allied carriers still in the area, he is unlikely to mount any other invasions. I still can't be complacent (again), lest this lead to a collapse on other sectors.

Despite the situation being dismal, I do see some silver linings in this:

1. With the allied focus in the North, he probably can't do much elsewhere.
2. Hokkaido is an execellent place to reduce Japan from. But it isn't a great location from which to mount subsequent invasions of Japanese territory (Honshu excepted).
3. While fighting in the air over Japan, I get to take advantage of fighting on home ground (many pilots saved)
4. I get to use heavily built up air bases, including 3 level 10 airbases (Tokyo, Hiroshima/Osaka)
5. I get to use all the Japanese static base forces for eng/aviation support and all the home island restricted land and air units which otherwise would be sitting there useless.
6. I got the 10 or so depot division emergency reinforcements, providing enough free troops to defend Japan without having to move too many home.
7. (very minor) coastwatchers are now reporting Allied shipping activities in Hokkaido, reducing the need for recon/naval search.
8. With the fighting so close to home, this will be a massive boon to Japanese shipping (and thus fuel savings). No need to transport supplies and troops to far flung bases. Reinforcements arrive on site in Japan ready to fight.
9. I think my best chance for victory is that, because of this move, he will be delayed in other sectors enough that I might be able to end the war holding the Philippines, Singapore, part of the DEI, or something like that. This could be pretty useful points-wise.

So, while I definitely would not wish him to be in Hokkaido and this situation is bad for Japan, I don't think the situation is hopeless yet. And it should be fun for both of us for a while to come. But this move means that Japan will probably lose in the long run.




(in reply to rader)
Post #: 58
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 12/3/2011 6:45:19 PM   
desicat

 

Posts: 542
Joined: 5/25/2008
Status: offline 		This is why I can't ever see myself playing as the Japanese. No matter how successful one is in the first part of the war come 1944 the Allies can go anywhere they want.

All a far flung empire gets Japan is forces that become isolated and out of position when the hammer falls.

I liked your thoughts in Taming the Bear, it was an attempt to see if the inevitable was something that could be extended - too bad it didn't work.

That said you now find yourself in an interesting situation that should be fun to ponder and try to puzzle together a defense for a while.

(in reply to rader)
Post #: 59
RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) - 12/3/2011 7:18:14 PM   
pauk


Posts: 4162
Joined: 10/21/2001
From: Zagreb,Croatia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rader
IMO, Japan's job is the keep the fleet alive as long as possible. Even if outnumbered 4:1, it can still slaughter poorly planned and defended landings, and it forces the allies to be wary and advance on a single (or at most 2) axes. Supported by land-based air, I think the KB can remain an important factor for the entire game - if not stopping the allies, slowing them down by keeping them honest.



Hi, i was following GJ AAR simply because you didnt update yours. Your thougts about keeping fleets alive are correct. But, i have to repeat what i wrote at GJ's place , your's biggest mistake was using KB as active force. Hate to say, but im little bit suprised that one of the best Japs player (which you are!) didnt realise that HIDING KB is your most powerful weapon.

Even if he took the risk and conduct invasion via northern route (which i doubt) you would have well organised and ready KB for counterstrike.

But, thats doesnt matter now. Actually, you dont need a smart *ss now, so we have ask ourselves the one question: " do you feel....."

you are right, there is no reason to worry about other theatres. So you have to decide which theatres are secondary (all except southern Burma, DEI, Philipines, Marians) and move all available ground units to the Home islands.

then, using KB as harvester of GJ's transports to the occupied zone northern Japan if he will be reckless enough not to cover it with his CVs (he need to refuel and resupply them sooner or latter). If he is covering his supply TFs, then you could hit his recently occupied AFs in the northern Japan, acting together with naval bombardment.


Well, you played extremely well so far - conquering the India in Alied edition is exceptional!!!! But unfortunatly, you forgot the first 100 Japs rules for not loosing the game...

dont make a single, even a minor mistake!
dont make a single, even a minor mistake!
dont make a single, even a minor mistake!
....

but lets put in that way:

BANZAI!


_____________________________


(in reply to rader)
Post #: 60
Page:   <<   < prev  1 [2] 3 4 5   next >   >>
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Caging the Tiger~ Rader (J) vs. GreyJoy (A) Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3 4 5   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

1.266