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Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes

 
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Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/15/2012 12:20:29 AM   
henry1611

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline 		[Edit: Please speak up and show your interest. Given Matt's notes below, it looks to be great.]

I have enthusiastically followed the evolution of BabesLite and DBB from afar.

However, as I play the smaller scenarios, I have not been able to benefit from the awesome Babes improvements except for some minor modding I did using the ASW Changelog posted by JWE some time ago. (I saw immediate improvement in the Downfall scenario I was playing.)

I’d like to incorporate the rest of the Babe’s improvements into the smaller scenarios.

The problem is that, other than the ASW Changelog, I have no idea what other changes have been made by the Babes team. So, the only way I can think of getting the Babes improvements into the smaller scenarios is to copy/paste all of the database entries from the Babes scenario into the database for the other scenario saved to a new slot. I have two questions. (Actually, I have a bunch of questions but these are a good start.)

1. What database entries can I change without breaking the scenario itself?

If I use WITPLoad to copy/paste the “Devices,” “Ship Classes,” “Ships,” etc. entries in their entirety from Babes into the “Devices,” “Ship Classes,” “Ships,” etc. entries for the Guadalcanal scenario will I get the Babes database and the Guadalcanal scenario or will I just end up with a borked Guadalcanal scenario?

One potential problem is that the database ID numbers between Babes and the other scenario don’t match up. (Actually, I think that is what stopped me from trying this once before.)

2. What database entries should I copy from Babes?

I am pretty sure I need to copy the “Devices,” “Ship Classes” and “Ships” entries. Any others? (I haven’t seen anything to indicate that Babes addresses the “Aircraft” or “Air Groups” entries.)

One problem with copying the “Devices” entries in their entirety is that, in Babes, “LCU TO&Es and OOBs are highly modified, for both sides.” I would think that would screw up the design of the smaller scenario, no? Perhaps I should use the “Devices” from BabesLite as I understand from the Babes website that BabesLite does not have the LCU changes.

Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I’d be happy to make the modified smaller scenarios available, assuming JWE does not object and I don’t screw it up.

< Message edited by henry1611 -- 2/11/2012 6:29:51 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/16/2012 4:54:51 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		JWE would not object. Nor would anyone else in the group. We would all support the effort.

There are issues with the small scenarios. Scenarios 003, 004, 005 (Coral Sea, Guadalcanal, 1,000 Mile War) were designed by many different people using the original Witp database. This was long before the scenario data layout became somewhat standard, and long before WiTPAE game release. These scenarios are completely different from all the others and cannot be updated without a total change to almost every data file.

The campaign scenarios and small scenarios 011, 012, 013, 014 (Marianas, Marianas HI, Buccaneer, Downfall) use the WiTPAE layout for the data files and can be modded to BabesLite standards. I think it is practical to make a BabesLite version of AndyMac's scenario 002 and 008 (Hakko Ichiu, and its Quiet China analog). I mentioned this to JWE and he thinks it is a good idea.

For smaller scenarios, JWE was working on an updated Guadalcanal scenario for the group's use. I will check if that is worth doing into a release scenario that replaces 004. I am not certain, but from the cybernotes zipping past, the LCU layout may not be too far off and could be adjusted so the AI 004 data files work.

While doing this, will also compile John's notes into a document form. If I can get him to agree, it will include the math and background calculations for his tweaks. An AE Modders Vade Mecum, as it were. So stay tuned.

Matt

(in reply to henry1611)
Post #: 2
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/17/2012 4:16:33 PM   
henry1611

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline 		Thanks Matt. I look forward to hearing more on the subject, especially about the possibility of an updated Guadalcanal scenario that replaces 004. Let me know if I can assist in the process.

If pointed in the right direction, I'd be happy to take a stab at modding some of the other small scenarios that can be modded to the BabesLite standard.

quote:

ORIGINAL: US87891

There are issues with the small scenarios. Scenarios 003, 004, 005 (Coral Sea, Guadalcanal, 1,000 Mile War) were designed by many different people using the original Witp database. This was long before the scenario data layout became somewhat standard, and long before WiTPAE game release. These scenarios are completely different from all the others and cannot be updated without a total change to almost every data file.


This may explain why I was completely confused when trying to compare the "Devices" in Babes to the "Devices" in Scenario 004.

Standing by,

Henry

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 3
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/21/2012 9:33:35 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		We have a good Guadalcanal scenario coming using Babes Class, Ship, Device files. It will be an analog of stock Scen 004 and will use the same AI files. Can be played against the AI by either side.

The map is extended slightly Eastward to capture the Marshalls, because this area was within the purview of 4th Fleet and 6th Base Force. There are modifications to LCU files, but slot numbers don't change, so nothing that will effect the AI. Japanese Base Force units have become Naval HQs, as they were, and CD, AA, Inf, Eng, units are assigned to them, as are SC, PB, AMC ship units. A Base Force is now a collection of land/sea/air pieces that can be shuffled around (except for static units) as actually happened.

As much as possible, the actual ships, in their actual classes, have been represented in their actual starting locations and under actual command, as of August 1, 1942. The game starts on August 6, so we hope our efforts won't be subject to too many particularist complaints.

Japan is basically finished. John is polishing the Allies. Should be on the website in a 2-3 days.

Matt

(in reply to henry1611)
Post #: 4
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/21/2012 11:05:12 PM   
mikkey


Posts: 3142
Joined: 2/10/2008
From: Slovakia
Status: offline 		DaBabes Guadalcanal with extended map is excellent news Matt. Time frame is similar as stock Guadalcanal (6 August 1942 - 3 April 1943)?

_____________________________


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RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/23/2012 3:57:46 PM   
henry1611

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline 		Great! Really looking forward to a Babes Guadalcanal.

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 6
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/23/2012 7:02:22 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mikkey
DaBabes Guadalcanal with extended map is excellent news Matt. Time frame is similar as stock Guadalcanal (6 August 1942 - 3 April 1943)?

The Guadalcanal scenario uses a small piece of the main map, so it can be played with whatever map you have installed (stock or extended, there is no difference). The time frame is the same as Nikademus made it. The scenario number will be Scen034 and will use the Scen004 AI files and can be played against the AI by both sides.

The scenario map has been pushed out to the East and now includes the Marshalls. This was done to avoid the ordinary, everyday, New Guinea, New Caledonia, SE Australia expansion routes. Allies will have a sensitive Japanese flank open to counterattack in the East if Japan goes whole hog in the West. Also helps to spread out the area of coverage of the rump of the KB. In the absence of withdrawal mechanisms in the smaller scenarios, why not give your Striking Force a conundrum?

[ed] Also pushed the map a bit South to pick up the Allied staging areas in NZ North Island (Wellington, Aukland, etc..). Only North Island bases are active for the scenario, and no NZ units are included in the game.

Matt

< Message edited by US87891 -- 1/23/2012 9:49:57 PM >

(in reply to mikkey)
Post #: 7
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/23/2012 7:24:31 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		Got a cheat sheet from John, looking at all the different DDs and who went where and when. I am doing the land unit movements and the availability of transport ships and transportable units, in the right place, is very important. JWE makes the TFs and I load them.

Part of his cheat sheet is the disposition of DDs during the Guadalcanal campaign. They are divided into their corresponding DesRons and DesDivs and enter the game in dedicated TFs. Sharp, historical, players will see exactly how they are organized and pay some attention to HQ assignments. The cheat sheet is to allow historical players to keep like-with-like and use them how they were intended. Here's a sample.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 8
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/24/2012 4:54:29 PM   
packerpete

 

Posts: 129
Joined: 2/27/2010
Status: offline 		Is this the only small scenario that is being looked at?? I am drooling now. Thanks.

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 9
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/26/2012 1:29:35 AM   
JWE

 

Posts: 6580
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline 		Lookin at Christian's (Terminus') Thousand Mile War. But need to finish up Guadalcanal first. It takes time to do these things right and Mathias is the man to get 'er done. Patience is its own reward.

Ciao. John

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RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/26/2012 5:00:09 PM   
packerpete

 

Posts: 129
Joined: 2/27/2010
Status: offline 		Thank you all for the effort. I really do appreciate it. Quick question, are the camera devices on the F4F-3P going to be activated and are the F4F-7 incorporated?

(in reply to JWE)
Post #: 11
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/27/2012 6:11:12 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		Working through the land LCUs it is apparent that this was a regimental level conflict. Both Allies and Japanese are being restructured into a regimental level unit basis.

For example, the MarDiv has a DivHQ, 3x Inf Rgts, an Arty Rgt, broken down into a 105 Bn and 3x 75 Bns, an AmphTrac, Pioneer, SpecWeaps (AA), and Lt Tank Bn. And, of course, a Para Bn. Similar things are done for the US Army divisions, and for the Japanese.

Since Guadalcanal is a 2 hex island, and there will be a large number of units in each hex, it is incumbent on the player to rotate units (of both sides) through combat, reserve, resting postures.

A significant feature of the campaign, on the Allied side, is the steady decline in operational effectiveness of units and their replacement by reserves. This is modeled by compelling withdrawal of those units that did, indeed, withdraw.

It becomes palatable and necessary (for both sides) by a judicious allocation of % Support. Allies get less than necessary, so they will degrade through fatigue, disruption, and disablement. Japanese get much less, so their fatigue, disruption, disablement degradation slope is steeper.

Even the fatigued, disabled, and dying, eat supply, so when transporting, or fast transporting, supply/reinforcements in, might be worthwhile evacuating the dross out.

HQ support scale (and restriction) is very carefully calculated so that the first 2-3 months, of the 8 month scenario, are highly constrained. After that, things open up and possibilities present themselves.

Matt

(in reply to JWE)
Post #: 12
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/27/2012 6:44:20 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		We have a special map modification that we use for the Solomons. Slight displacements of Guadalcanal and Bougainville Islands allow Guadalcanal to span 3 hexes, Tassafaronga in the NW, Lunga in the center, and Taivu in the SE; the SE tip of Bougainville is expanded to span 2 hexes, Buin on the SE tip of Bougainville, and Shortlands right next door. It does tend to make things a little more interesting during the opening moves of 1942.

The Scen004 AI does not recognize these new bases, so this map mod will not work with respect to the AI, for a mod based on Scen004.

Very hard to decide what to do, here. John is working with Andrew to get the Solomons map/base mods incorporated into the Std Ext Map. But as it sits today, our map just isn’t compatible with a stock Scen. If our Solomons mods get incorporated, hopefully, some smart modder will adapt our Scen034 to the new bases. Once the initial unit placement research is done, it will not take much more effort.

Matt

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 13
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/27/2012 7:07:24 PM   
henry1611

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline 		Your first post today on this topic had me drooling with all of the detail you guys are working into this.

quote:

ORIGINAL: US87891

The Scen004 AI does not recognize these new bases, so this map mod will not work with respect to the AI, for a mod based on Scen004.



This post had me crying. I am one of those who, due to time constraints, has to play against the AI. Will there be no way to play Babes Scen034 against the Japanese AI? Perhaps, without the Solomons map mod?

If not, does the following mean that there is hope that Babes Scen034 can be modded such that it can be played against Japanese AI?

quote:

ORIGINAL: US87891

If our Solomons mods get incorporated, hopefully, some smart modder will adapt our Scen034 to the new bases.



I may not be a smart modder, but I will give it a shot if that is what it takes to make this playable against the AI.

Thanks for your work on the scenario either way.

Henry

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 14
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/27/2012 11:02:03 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: henry1611
This post had me crying. I am one of those who, due to time constraints, has to play against the AI. Will there be no way to play Babes Scen034 against the Japanese AI? Perhaps, without the Solomons map mod?

If not, does the following mean that there is hope that Babes Scen034 can be modded such that it can be played against Japanese AI?

The Babes Scen034 scenario will be playable against the AI (both sides) just like stock Scen004. Nothing to cry or worry about. It will work just like the stock Scen, with the stock AI, and the stock exe.

The map and other special tweaks are for Babes people; nothing for Matrix forum people to concern themselves about.

Matt

(in reply to henry1611)
Post #: 15
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/27/2012 11:26:13 PM   
henry1611

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: US87891

Nothing to cry or worry about.


Please forgive the hyperbole. I just did not want to miss out.

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 16
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/28/2012 4:05:14 PM   
Mac Linehan

 

Posts: 1484
Joined: 12/19/2004
From: Denver Colorado
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: US87891

We have a good Guadalcanal scenario coming using Babes Class, Ship, Device files. It will be an analog of stock Scen 004 and will use the same AI files. Can be played against the AI by either side.

The map is extended slightly Eastward to capture the Marshalls, because this area was within the purview of 4th Fleet and 6th Base Force. There are modifications to LCU files, but slot numbers don't change, so nothing that will effect the AI. Japanese Base Force units have become Naval HQs, as they were, and CD, AA, Inf, Eng, units are assigned to them, as are SC, PB, AMC ship units. A Base Force is now a collection of land/sea/air pieces that can be shuffled around (except for static units) as actually happened.

As much as possible, the actual ships, in their actual classes, have been represented in their actual starting locations and under actual command, as of August 1, 1942. The game starts on August 6, so we hope our efforts won't be subject to too many particularist complaints.

Japan is basically finished. John is polishing the Allies. Should be on the website in a 2-3 days.

Matt


US87891, JWE -

What a thrill to read about your upcoming Guad release! I am so pleased that the Babes Team is alive and well - and hard at it.

These smaller scenarios are not only fun to play over a weekend, but are also an opportunity for our fellow AE players to take on a Babes scenario and experience the awesome level of authenticity, realism and unique approaches TM Babes that are so addictive once one has had a taste of the Real Deal.

henry1611 - I very much appreciate your inquisitiveness, this thread has made my day!

And to the Babes Team: Keep on it Gents! Your audience awaits!

Loyalist Mac

< Message edited by Mac Linehan -- 1/28/2012 4:13:22 PM >

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RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/29/2012 6:34:30 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		Thank you, Mr Linehan.

The scenario is on track but John keeps throwing curve balls. So far everything still tests out with the AI. Should be interresting.

Would not worry about the map. Should not have said anything about it. It just makes people worry. But having done so, the map thing is a special modification that is used in CPX games where units are cut down to regimental/battalion level. Because it will not work for Matrix style games without rewriting everything, it is not part of the new Guad scenario.

Matt

(in reply to Mac Linehan)
Post #: 18
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 1/31/2012 6:14:56 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		But now John threw a fast ball right down the middle. In a small scenario like this, every unit and unit slot is important for the AI. However, we have added and changed a few things, thereby going out of scope with the AI scripts. John looked at the Scen004 AI files and found they are not that hard to modify. Just requires a match-and-replace for units, TFs, ships.

The new marching orders are to make this scenario as grainy and realistic as humanly possible and John will deal with Mr AI.

Because we aren't limited by slots anymore, the Scen034 will get done to BigBabes standards; BigBabes Devices, TO&Es, and everything. It will take a few more days than expected, and then John has to adapt the AI to the scenario. This will be the first, fully AI capable, BigBabes scenario. I am excited about seeing this come to fruition. There is a lot of work going on in many different areas, so your patience is appreciated and will be rewarded.

Please bear with us. Matt

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 19
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/6/2012 9:53:06 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		The latest. John's white paper for the Allied side.

Guadalcanal scenario – BigBabes – Allied Notes

HQ Units

The HQ situation is changed. HQs no longer provide huge amounts of support. They are now the commander, the staff, and an extremely limited number of support elements. HQs now provide game-type force multipliers and operational restrictions and nothing more.

There is Australia Command. Under this is Aus 1st Army(R) and RAAF Command(R). Each of these has unrestricted subordinate units. All ground and air units will fall under one of these and may, themselves, be restricted or unrestricted.

Australian 1st Army was charged with defense of Queensland and northern New South Wales (i.e., serendipitously, the Aus map area). Aus 1st Army is a restricted HQ. CMF brigades in 1st Army area are assigned to 1st Army and are flagged as individually restricted units. They cannot go anywhere except (on-map) continental Australia. They cannot be purchased out.

Those CMF brigades that qualified for ‘overseas’ service also belong to 1st Army, but are not additionally restricted so these units may be purchased out to an unrestricted HQ (Aus 1st Corps, Milne Force, SWPac, etc.) in order to be loaded on transports to New Guinea, or wherever.

Combat Units

Since this campaign period was at the regiment/brigade level, units may no longer recombine into 900lb division gorillas. The largest unit allowed is the regiment/brigade as that is how they were deployed. Some (few) divisions have a DivHQ – very little support, but a good commander as a force multiplier. Divisions/brigades can be assigned thereto, willy-nilly, as was done.

Regiments/brigades are at their authorized TO&Es. Everything else is stripped out except for an allocation of the divisional engineers and an allocation of the MG Bn for certain Aus/NZ units. Artillery is in separate Bns.

Base Forces

There are a very few (static) Allied Base Forces. They are primarily support units and are minimally capable and depend on combat units for defense. There are no Base Forces for any conquered bases. Conquered bases need to be populated/developed by air base sqdns/engineers/naval port bns/air and port maintenance bns. Any Base Forces that came into being in these locations, did so long after the scenario time period.

Air squadrons have a corresponding base sqdn. The base sqdn will have a bit less AvSup than the air sqdn has planes. One must position a base sqdn in order for the air sqdn to function. There are no other sources of AvSup except way back in the rear areas. There ain’t no such thing as a free lunch. It’s supposed to hurt.

Japanese base forces are slightly different. They are also marginally capable and depend on attached NavGuard, CD, Sub-base, NAG units, but they are (static) naval HQs. Japanese air is just like Allied air; sqdn units, but with smaller % of AvSup per plane than equivalent Allied units. Japanese HQs have a smaller % of support than equivalent Allied HQs.

Support (of any kind) is at a premium. Combat/Air units do not have enough, and the Japanese have even less. Deploying all your assets will cause them all to deplete to nothing very quickly. One must be very judicious about rotating troops/planes in and out of action and in and out of the front lines. The (static) rear areas are the only places with the support necessary to recover fatigue/disruption.

Ships

Problem with small scenario ships is once they are in-game, they can’t be withdrawn. Answer is to severely limit what is there. There are an actual number of Aus/Dutch ships available. A player will immediately see which are the most valuable and do their best to conserve them and utilize them properly.

There are a few US APs and AKs that did stay in theater and were used to move US troops from Fiji, Samoa, NZ, to the combat area. Therefore, US Army forces appear in Fiji, Tonga, NZ, in order to force the player to use these vessels to hump troops. There are very few US cargo ships in theater. Fiji/Tonga get “convoys” of supply/fuel and the US cargo vessels in the area are sufficient only to move beans and gas from Fiji/Tonga to Noumea/Espiritu Santo.

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 20
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/7/2012 7:38:30 PM   
US87891

 

Posts: 422
Joined: 1/2/2011
Status: offline 		Given the lack of interest, scenario work has been suspended.

(in reply to US87891)
Post #: 21
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/7/2012 8:06:02 PM   
henry1611

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: US87891

Given the lack of interest, scenario work has been suspended.


I am sorry to hear this, as I was most interested in this scenario. I am sure I am not the only one. Although only a few people have posted on this topic, those who have have expressed a keen interest. And the topic has had a respectable number of hits.

Your recent posts concerning the development of the scenario were very interesting. The attention to detail is impressive. I was looking forward to the new Combat Unit organization and the Ships reorganization in particular. The challenge that the Ships reorganization would present would greatly change the scenario, I believe, from the previous versions I have played where I was not as concerned with losing a ship or two.

Realizing that this is your avocation rather than vocation, I am one who is loathe to show interest by asking "When will it be ready?". I was taking the "your patience is appreciated and will be rewarded" approach you counseled.

In short, I hope the Babes team will reconsider. If not, will it consider providing me with the tools to continue the work that has been done to date?

TO EVERYONE ELSE: Please speak up and show your interest so that we can perhaps see this scenario realized.

< Message edited by henry1611 -- 2/7/2012 9:52:21 PM >

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Post #: 22
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/7/2012 9:06:01 PM   
mikkey


Posts: 3142
Joined: 2/10/2008
From: Slovakia
Status: offline 		DaBabes Guadalcanal seemed promising

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Post #: 23
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/8/2012 5:00:34 PM   
JWE

 

Posts: 6580
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline 		Matt’s just discouraged. He found where the HQ stuff doesn’t work like it’s supposed to and the scen don’t progress like it should and makes the AI barf. So we got to fix that. He has the TOEs and OOB stuff done (most of you will like it) so all I gotta do is tweak the HQ things and make sure nobody has enough transport ships.

So apologies to them of you from OZ out there, but the command structure is gonna be a bit strained. It’s set up to work within the constraints set up for the scenario, not follow some technical, historical, block diagram. Form, fit, feel, and function should work.

Matt is used to a different environment. The Title has a number of healthy and involved groups of players that interact outside the Matrix Forum. But I realise that the Forum is a valuable resource for people who lurk and wish to learn, but who don’t wish to post-and-play in the wargamer environment. So I understand the lack of response.

Having put forth Don Bowen’s Babes thing (and yes, Don is the Jove of Babes), there is an incumbency to support folks like Sarduakar, and others, who do so well in presenting it to the wider community. I would be remiss in failing to provide support to those silent battalions who wish only to play and learn.

Guadalcanal-Babes is coming: to a screen near you, soon.


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Post #: 24
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/10/2012 4:36:37 PM   
henry1611

 

Posts: 66
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline 		Your efforts are much appreciated. Looking forward to the scenario.

(in reply to JWE)
Post #: 25
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/10/2012 9:13:13 PM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline 		Same here.

And thanks for the kind words, JWE!

I am sure this scenario will be good, if not great. Lot of people do not get that there are limitations in AE that we just have to live with.
I have played WitP since 2004 and AE since it was published..and I'd not even dream of trying to make a mod, much less AI script.

I am more into group like Alfred or LoBaron etc., who try to help other players to understand the game better..and thus making it more playable for other players. And when I found DaBabes, I'd find it very difficult to switch back to stock.

Keep up the good work, it is appreciated by those who know.

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RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/11/2012 1:42:25 AM   
berto


Posts: 20708
Joined: 3/13/2002
From: metro Chicago, Illinois, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: henry1611

Looking forward to the scenario.

+1

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(in reply to henry1611)
Post #: 27
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/12/2012 3:51:43 AM   
gabeeg

 

Posts: 292
Joined: 11/18/2009
Status: offline 		I am one of the silent ones (at least in this forum)...I am in the background...silently but enthusiastically waiting for Guad! thanks all for your hard work!

(in reply to berto)
Post #: 28
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/12/2012 7:01:10 PM   
JWE

 

Posts: 6580
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline 		Okey doke, then, for all ya'll background folks, turned up a diary by a young Lieutenant, Inui, Genjirou, who was there, that sheds a lot of light on wtfo with 28th IR, Ichiki, Kuma, Mizuno, etc..

Ok, 28 IR is on Guam, Ichiki gets orders and gallops off to Truk with II/28th and the regimental support companies. He gets there on 08/13 and right away splits the force, taking half of each inf coy, the Bn MMG coy, a couple Bn guns, and some engineers, on his hare-brained conquest of Guad from 1st MarDiv.

Thinking rationally, Ichiki would have been aware of the limited carying ability of the 6 DDs, so structured his conquistadores to fit and sprints to his goal, while the rest of his advance force (in Boston, Daifuku, and Idunno Maru) wallows in his wake. Inui doesn't say how he split up the company elements, and your guess is as good as mine.

What Inui does say is that he was part of the 2d echelon, that included;
The "rest" of "HQ" and the "rest" of no 1 - 4 inf coys; the AT gun coy, the 8th Indep AT gun coy, the rgt gun coy, and another constr eng coy.

And those vestiges became the Kuma Bn. The HQ and inf folks became No.1 and No.2 company; the weaps folks stayed the same; and everybody got sucked into Kawaguchi's 35th Brigade.

So what became of the I/28th and III/28th? Inui's diary references meeting an aquaintence from III/28th. Since the 28th IR support units were assigned to Kawaguchi, and he burned them unmercifully, there was nothing left on which to hang the poor dumb sumbitches of I/28 and III/28. Seems they all went into the pool to flesh out operational units and simply disapeared from our charts.

So what's the point of trying to squeeze Ichiki or his 2d echelon into the OOB? I mean, 400 infantrymen assaulting 1st MarDiv? Wtfo? Game doesn't, and can't, accommodate that degree of graininess, so what's the point, except to be 'oh, so historical'. So we got a little bit creative. Hope ya'll appreciate it.

Ciao. John




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(in reply to gabeeg)
Post #: 29
RE: Modding Smaller Scenarios using DaBabes - 2/17/2012 10:07:53 PM   
JWE

 

Posts: 6580
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline 		Matt's people received a preview copy of the latest translations of Japanese South Pacific Operations of 3 more volumes of Senshi Sosho. Given the people who are doing this, it is likely it will become available through the National Institute for Defese Studies, Tokyo and The Japan Foundation, Sydney very shortly. It looks to be the companion set for the Solomons region to IJA SoPac Ops, New Britain/Papua 1942-43, already published by NIDS/AJF.

Very cool stuff, since it details the composition of various IJN land "forces" in the 1942-43 period. I'm sure everyone knows that a Base, SNLF, or Guard, Force was pretty much the same thing in Japanese thinking. SNLFs became Base or Guard units, through renaming/redesignation, all the time. Difference was a Base unit had various admin, commo, transport, support units, attached at a HQ level, that the others didn't. Guard and SNLF units were fungible to the extent that (1939 style) SNLF units would lose infantry and replace it with AA and Hy (CD) gun companies. Certain Guard units had very little of separate infantry components. Similarly, certain SNLF units had little of AA and CD gun composition. And a Base Force could be designated from units at either end of the spectrum, by simply saying so and adding some HQ stuff.

So every single one is different. And it does go a long way towards explaining the profusion of platoon and company sized Landing Partys, from 2 or 3 different Guard units or SNLFs, that get redesignated into something else.

In game terms, it means we must parse the TO&Es very carefully; pull AA and CD units into separate entities, and allow for some separate, and mobile, infantry components, for both SNLF and Guard forces. This latest Senshi Sosho translation has given us a big leg-up on the actual TO&Es of many units and allows us to get creative within their actual historical deployment/utilization.

Game doesn't work too well with a gazillion different company (platoon) size units combining for an op. And thinking rationally, one does not expect a battalion to be assaulting a brigade or a division, so some of the finely divided Japanese OOBs are concatenated in order to present a more robust structure. Matt's choice, with which I concur completely.

Think you all will like the allocation division of the IJN land units into their various operational components. We do.

Ciao. John

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(in reply to JWE)
Post #: 30
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