RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR)

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 8:24:15 PM

composer99

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Just have the US take over Plymouth (seeing as it already has Belfast) and have the RN forces base out of Liverpool, Scapa Flow and London.

_____________________________

~ Composer99

(in reply to composer99)

Post #: 2101

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 8:27:34 PM

Red Prince

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From: Bangor, Maine, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: composer99

Just have the US take over Plymouth (seeing as it already has Belfast) and have the RN forces base out of Liverpool, Scapa Flow and London.

It's not so much the ports I want (though that's nice), but the space to stack units and air power. Both the CW and the USA are going to end up with a lot of these, and the Southeast UK is already starting to get crowded.

_____________________________

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it!
-Lazarus Long, RAH

(in reply to composer99)

Post #: 2102

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 8:33:33 PM

Centuur

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From: Hoorn (NED).
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On Moscow: there is a Stuka nearby. This means that the Russian airforce must leave Moscow, otherwise they risk getting killed on the ground. It doesn't matter if you leave one or two units, a fast calculation gives the Germans a 4-1 attack on Moscow when the two corps stay there, giving it a 80% opportunity of taking the hex if the ground strikes of the Stuka succeeds, with a 50% chanche of disorganisation. I would go for this attack with the Germans. Now: there are two possibilities:

- Ground Strike Mannerheim with the TB-3 under escort of the FTR. If the Ground strike succeeds, the German northern front comes to a halt. Desperate times means desperate measures. Also: almost the whole USSR airforce is now too close to the frontlines. If the turn is really going to be a long one, the lack of USSR forces means that they are likely to get overrun twice this turn. Especially the FTR's are short on range. It is better to use the airforce at Moscow now.
Or:
- Rebase the airforce in Moscow. This however also means that in the center one of the air units will be overrun and it than must rebase and might be overtaken later in the turn by the Germans...
In both cases I think the Moscow MIL stays in the city, I would withdraw the other units to the east.

If Mannerheim is ground struck, this will still mean the loss of Moscow, however, all other units can simply withdraw out of German supply range to a position where they can't be attacked without disorganising German units. They can even put more distance between the German forces and them by continuing to withdraw, making it more difficult for the German HQ's to catch up next turn.

I think I would do this. It isn't nice and it might end up with disaster, but the USSR is going to loose a FTR after all, since I don't think the USSR can withdraw all air units from the front this impulse...

_____________________________

Peter

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 2103

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 8:39:20 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

And here's what's going down in Persia:

Well, we try the ground strike on Guderian, that's for sure.

There are only 2 dangers here:
1 - Guderian reorganizes units which then attack;
2 - the Germans end the turn and then go first again (!) next turn - with good weather of course.

#1 takes 2 impulses for the Axis to achieve, so we have another impulse to tweak the line for that possibility. But #2 needs to be dealt with immediately.

I haven't read Composer99's suggestion in detail, but I agree with it's primary thrust: shift the weight of the line to the east. From west to east I would put the following in the 4 hexes: 3-4 + 1-4; 8-5-4; 7-3 + 3-2; 4-3 + 5-3.

You'll notice that 2 of these units will be disorganized at the end of their movement. Zhukov is going to reorganize everyone in this theater at the end of this impulse and then be reorganized himself using the O-Chit during the next Allied impulse. Of course if the turn ends before then, so much the better.

The left side is now weak, but there's not much that can be done about that. Indeed, the whole line isn't as strong as we would like it to be.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2104

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 8:50:33 PM

Lothrim

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All this is "fantasy" since I have no idea how many hexes in persia the axis controls, and how supply is traced by the axis there. I am just guessing that a well placed russian unit could wreck havoc with the supply.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince
I just counted it out, and there are no hexes in Persia that the ATR can reach for an Air Transport (by the way, it's 2 x 11 hexes, not 3 x 11 hexes. The first stretch is for the "pickup" and the 2nd is the return to base.

If the para starts stacked with the ATR it can move with the ATR to the "pickup site" then again to the "target hex" and again to the "return to base hex". Yes... the rules are weird :-)

I was not thinking about this turn, but the turn after that. The Moscow bomber would rebase to krasnodar, and the ATR in krasnodar would rebase to a hex in persia (baku perhaps).
Next turn you could air-transport the para from krasnodar to Baku with ATR1 and then from Baku to the hex NE of the iraqi cav unit (providing it is still russian controlled) with ATR2. This would put the entire axis force OOS.... perhaps, or does it also trace supply through the rail from baghdad?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince
Yes, they are relying on the Japanese for supply, and even though they did a lot of damage last impulse, it's unlikely the Allies can clear the Arabian Sea (but they'll try).

I'm not sure what you mean by Germany leaving its HQ's behind. Unless the Soviets retreat 5-6 hexes each, the HQs of Germany are able to be right on the front lines, or just behind it.

"von Leeb" and "von Bock" are far enough behind the front to be able to react to any dangerous paradrop by the russians.

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2105

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 8:51:49 PM

Centuur

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From: Hoorn (NED).
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

quote:

ORIGINAL: composer99

Just have the US take over Plymouth (seeing as it already has Belfast) and have the RN forces base out of Liverpool, Scapa Flow and London.

It's not so much the ports I want (though that's nice), but the space to stack units and air power. Both the CW and the USA are going to end up with a lot of these, and the Southeast UK is already starting to get crowded.

Crowded? Have you counted out the number of units you can put there? The US MIL and a HQ have to leave for the USSR this turn, so a couple of land units are leaving already. You can stack the complete US fleet in Plymouth and Belfast and the UK fleet in Liverpool. You have four minor ports in the area to put land units in too. That means a total of 14 corps/HQ's and 7 division in ports and more than 20 air units in ports alone. Ireland is a nuisance and it needs a garrison. I wouldn't bother. It is all about putting together good logistics in the UK/Northern Ireland.
Also: the Wallies need to be aggressive, to withdraw units from the frontlines in the USSR. Is the invasion force assembled in the UK? If so: start looking for doing nasty things to the Germans. How are the defenses of mainland Europe this moment?

_____________________________

Peter

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2106

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 9:14:26 PM

Red Prince

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From: Bangor, Maine, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lothrim

All this is "fantasy" since I have no idea how many hexes in persia the axis controls, and how supply is traced by the axis there. I am just guessing that a well placed russian unit could wreck havoc with the supply.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince
I just counted it out, and there are no hexes in Persia that the ATR can reach for an Air Transport (by the way, it's 2 x 11 hexes, not 3 x 11 hexes. The first stretch is for the "pickup" and the 2nd is the return to base.

If the para starts stacked with the ATR it can move with the ATR to the "pickup site" then again to the "target hex" and again to the "return to base hex". Yes... the rules are weird :-)

I was not thinking about this turn, but the turn after that. The Moscow bomber would rebase to krasnodar, and the ATR in krasnodar would rebase to a hex in persia (baku perhaps).
Next turn you could air-transport the para from krasnodar to Baku with ATR1 and then from Baku to the hex NE of the iraqi cav unit (providing it is still russian controlled) with ATR2. This would put the entire axis force OOS.... perhaps, or does it also trace supply through the rail from baghdad?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince
Yes, they are relying on the Japanese for supply, and even though they did a lot of damage last impulse, it's unlikely the Allies can clear the Arabian Sea (but they'll try).

I'm not sure what you mean by Germany leaving its HQ's behind. Unless the Soviets retreat 5-6 hexes each, the HQs of Germany are able to be right on the front lines, or just behind it.

"von Leeb" and "von Bock" are far enough behind the front to be able to react to any dangerous paradrop by the russians.

Two things:

1. I'm going to have to check to see that the Air Transport works correctly for this. I'm wondering if we've skipped the middle step, because I rarely use Air Transport, and when I do it is usually starting with the unit I want to transport.

2. By next turn, Persia will be liberated by Italy in all likelyhood, so there will be no Soviet controlled hexes available to do this. A Paradrop is a different story.

_____________________________

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it!
-Lazarus Long, RAH

(in reply to Lothrim)

Post #: 2107

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 9:19:02 PM

Red Prince

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

quote:

ORIGINAL: composer99

Just have the US take over Plymouth (seeing as it already has Belfast) and have the RN forces base out of Liverpool, Scapa Flow and London.

It's not so much the ports I want (though that's nice), but the space to stack units and air power. Both the CW and the USA are going to end up with a lot of these, and the Southeast UK is already starting to get crowded.

Crowded? Have you counted out the number of units you can put there? The US MIL and a HQ have to leave for the USSR this turn, so a couple of land units are leaving already. You can stack the complete US fleet in Plymouth and Belfast and the UK fleet in Liverpool. You have four minor ports in the area to put land units in too. That means a total of 14 corps/HQ's and 7 division in ports and more than 20 air units in ports alone. Ireland is a nuisance and it needs a garrison. I wouldn't bother. It is all about putting together good logistics in the UK/Northern Ireland.
Also: the Wallies need to be aggressive, to withdraw units from the frontlines in the USSR. Is the invasion force assembled in the UK? If so: start looking for doing nasty things to the Germans. How are the defenses of mainland Europe this moment?

I need to remind you of two things here. Only the HQ is going to get to either Archangel or Murmansk this turn. The MIL can't get there. That's the first. The second is that a minor invasion force is assembled, but I can't create a "real" invasion force until next turn. Germans aren't coming off the lines this turn.

The Wallies are going to have many more than 20 air units not too long from now. They already have half that, at that doesn't include units still rebasing from the USA. I also have to leave room in some of these ports for CW CVP that need to come in and/or switch out from their CVs.
-----
Edit: Not to mention that air unit range is also a factor here.

_____________________________

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it!
-Lazarus Long, RAH

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 2108

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 9:26:35 PM

Red Prince

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The CW attempted 2 more Strat Bombing missions this impulse. The Germans aborted the first, but the second took out 1 Production Point.

As for the last chance attempt on Guderian . . . it looks like the Russians are going to have to deal with a revitalized German line in Persia.

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it!
-Lazarus Long, RAH

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2109

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 9:32:26 PM

composer99

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Not hitting Guderian isn't a big concern right now; turn ending rolls are starting so the Germans might not get a chance to use those units once Guderian reorganizes them.

_____________________________

~ Composer99

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2110

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 9:41:42 PM

Red Prince

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From: Bangor, Maine, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

quote:

ORIGINAL: composer99

In my opinion:
- Every land unit in Moscow stays where it is & fights to the death.
- The stack south of Moscow should stick together and move to the Oka bend.
- The stack southwest of Ryazan should stick together and move to the hex the AA can reach
- The blitz stack in front of Voronezh moves to the forest hex just south of the Don, southeast of Voronezh
- HQ Koniev moves straigt back 3 hexes (to stay on the rail line).
- The 2 blitz units in the Don basin move to the hex 2 hexes east of Rostov behind the join of the Don & West Manych rivers

As for air units:
- the LND4 in Moscow rebases to just in front of Penza, where it can ground support both Moscow & Rostov as required
- the LND3 rebases either east to help form up a Volga/Ural front or south to help form up the Caucasus front
- likewise with the FTR2 near Voronezh

It won't work. Neither of our thoughts. The Stack with the AA needs to go into Voronezh (including the AA). Anything else it does is likely to leave it out of supply.

It's too bad that Zhukov is stacked with a Corps and not the MTN Division. If Moscow is going to fall, that means the Moscow MIL is going to be gone for good. It would have been nice to rail it to the Persian Front.

Looks like I can save 1 more factory. Maybe I should rail the Moscow MIL to Baku, so that Zhukov can reorganize 3 land units and a LND (so as not to "waste" any of his points. I don't know. Or, if I'm going to use the O-chit to reorg all HQs next impulse, I might as well Rail Koniev to a better (or at least different) position . . . perhaps.

_____________________________

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it!
-Lazarus Long, RAH

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2111

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 9:46:46 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

Here's the main front, with flyouts. I haven't actually examined it yet for potential Soviet moves, so I'm not going to speculate at the moment.

Well, here's my idea:

The DB-3 flies at extended range for a ground strike on Mannerheim. The bomber returns to the forested rail hex under the T and U of Soviet Union on the map. Koniev reorganizes the bomber.

The DB-3F flies at extended range to ground strike von Leeb. It returns to base 10 hexes due east, where Koniev reorganizes it.

The 4-2 in Yaroslavl retreats 4 hexes due east.

The 2-6 MECH in Moscow retreats 4 hexes due east; it is joined by the 6-4 Siberian near Ryazan.

The other 2 land units in Moscow stay there.

The 2nd MECH moves 3 hexes east and 1 hex SE; it is joined by the 4th MECH coming up from Voronezh.

The AA moves to the fighter's hex. He is issued a set of prayer beads. When he dies, the fighter (if it hasn't flown a mission) will flee east. Regardless of whether he flies a mission or is overrun, he stays within range of Koniev, who reorganizes him.

The 2 Inf retreat 3 hexes east and 1 hex SE where they are joined by the 2-5 MECH. Koniev moves 2 hexes east and 1 NE (behind the Inf).

The Kharkov Mil moves one hex east. He is reorganized by Koniev.

The 7-6 armor retreats 1 hex east and 2 hexes SE and 1 hex east, where it is joined by the 1st MECH. The 8-5 moves to the hex 2 hexes east of Rostov.

The O-Chit reorganizes all 4 HQ's next Allied impulse if the turn lasts that long.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2112

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 9:51:14 PM

Red Prince

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

Here's the main front, with flyouts. I haven't actually examined it yet for potential Soviet moves, so I'm not going to speculate at the moment.

Well, here's my idea:

The DB-3 flies at extended range for a ground strike on Mannerheim. The bomber returns to the forested rail hex under the T and U of Soviet Union on the map. Koniev reorganizes the bomber.

The DB-3F flies at extended range to ground strike von Leeb. It returns to base 10 hexes due east, where Koniev reorganizes it.

The 4-2 in Yaroslavl retreats 4 hexes due east.

The 2-6 MECH in Moscow retreats 4 hexes due east; it is joined by the 6-4 Siberian near Ryazan.

The other 2 land units in Moscow stay there.

The 2nd MECH moves 3 hexes east and 1 hex SE; it is joined by the 4th MECH coming up from Voronezh.

The AA moves to the fighter's hex. He is issued a set of prayer beads. When he dies, the fighter (if it hasn't flown a mission) will flee east. Regardless of whether he flies a mission or is overrun, he stays within range of Koniev, who reorganizes him.

The 2 Inf retreat 3 hexes east and 1 hex SE where they are joined by the 2-5 MECH. Koniev moves 2 hexes east and 1 NE (behind the Inf).

The Kharkov Mil moves one hex east. He is reorganized by Koniev.

The 7-6 armor retreats 1 hex east and 2 hexes SE and 1 hex east, where it is joined by the 1st MECH. The 8-5 moves to the hex 2 hexes east of Rostov.

The O-Chit reorganizes all 4 HQ's next Allied impulse if the turn lasts that long.

Steve, you have Koniev reorganizing 7 points of units (6 for 3 air units, and 1 for the MIL)

_____________________________

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it!
-Lazarus Long, RAH

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 2113

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 10:24:57 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

Here's the main front, with flyouts. I haven't actually examined it yet for potential Soviet moves, so I'm not going to speculate at the moment.

Well, here's my idea:

The DB-3 flies at extended range for a ground strike on Mannerheim. The bomber returns to the forested rail hex under the T and U of Soviet Union on the map. Koniev reorganizes the bomber.

The DB-3F flies at extended range to ground strike von Leeb. It returns to base 10 hexes due east, where Koniev reorganizes it.

The 4-2 in Yaroslavl retreats 4 hexes due east.

The 2-6 MECH in Moscow retreats 4 hexes due east; it is joined by the 6-4 Siberian near Ryazan.

The other 2 land units in Moscow stay there.

The 2nd MECH moves 3 hexes east and 1 hex SE; it is joined by the 4th MECH coming up from Voronezh.

The AA moves to the fighter's hex. He is issued a set of prayer beads. When he dies, the fighter (if it hasn't flown a mission) will flee east. Regardless of whether he flies a mission or is overrun, he stays within range of Koniev, who reorganizes him.

The 2 Inf retreat 3 hexes east and 1 hex SE where they are joined by the 2-5 MECH. Koniev moves 2 hexes east and 1 NE (behind the Inf).

The Kharkov Mil moves one hex east. He is reorganized by Koniev.

The 7-6 armor retreats 1 hex east and 2 hexes SE and 1 hex east, where it is joined by the 1st MECH. The 8-5 moves to the hex 2 hexes east of Rostov.

The O-Chit reorganizes all 4 HQ's next Allied impulse if the turn lasts that long.

Steve, you have Koniev reorganizing 7 points of units (6 for 3 air units, and 1 for the MIL)

He is suppose to earn his keep - the slacker. The just use the 3 point Tact (DB-3F) to hit Mannerheim and reorganize the Kharkov Mil. The fighter flees to Saratov when it is overrun (it shouldn't fly a mission if it can help it). The ATR in Moscow rebases to the forest hex east of Penza. The DB-3 is going to be overrun and he should flee a whole lot of hexes to the east, just in case the turn goes on and on and on.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2114

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 10:27:29 PM

Centuur

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Steve: this means that the planes in Moscow are probably going to get ground striked by the Stuka... If that happens, that TB-3 is a sitting duck...

I would suggest groundstriking Mannerheim with the TB-3 and use the DB-F3 as front bomber on this attack too. The ground strike is going to be intercepted by the German FTR, so the Russian FTR flies too.

Also: why the sacrifice of a good INF in Moscow. The Germans are going to grab the city anyway. If the ground strike succeeds, I would suggest leaving only the MIL in Moscow. If it doesn't succeed, you might go for the 4-1 attack on Moscow with the two units, hoping to disorganise the Germans. I wouldn't...

_____________________________

Peter

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2115

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 11:04:33 PM

Red Prince

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From: Bangor, Maine, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Steve: this means that the planes in Moscow are probably going to get ground striked by the Stuka... If that happens, that TB-3 is a sitting duck...

I would suggest groundstriking Mannerheim with the TB-3 and use the DB-F3 as front bomber on this attack too. The ground strike is going to be intercepted by the German FTR, so the Russian FTR flies too.

Also: why the sacrifice of a good INF in Moscow. The Germans are going to grab the city anyway. If the ground strike succeeds, I would suggest leaving only the MIL in Moscow. If it doesn't succeed, you might go for the 4-1 attack on Moscow with the two units, hoping to disorganise the Germans. I wouldn't...

If anything, it is the MIL that should flee. He can't be rebuilt once Moscow is taken.

_____________________________

Always listen to experts. They'll tell you what can't be done and why. Then do it!
-Lazarus Long, RAH

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 2116

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 11:44:53 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

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From: Honolulu, Hawaii
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Steve: this means that the planes in Moscow are probably going to get ground striked by the Stuka... If that happens, that TB-3 is a sitting duck...

I would suggest groundstriking Mannerheim with the TB-3 and use the DB-F3 as front bomber on this attack too. The ground strike is going to be intercepted by the German FTR, so the Russian FTR flies too.

Also: why the sacrifice of a good INF in Moscow. The Germans are going to grab the city anyway. If the ground strike succeeds, I would suggest leaving only the MIL in Moscow. If it doesn't succeed, you might go for the 4-1 attack on Moscow with the two units, hoping to disorganise the Germans. I wouldn't...

I hadn't seen the fighter.

But I would still go with this plan. If Mannerheim gets disorganized, then life in the north is a lot easier for the Russians. The Russian fighter can intercept the interceptor, and then RTB to Moscow. Who knows? The turn might end and it can be returned to the Air Reserve.

I only want to use 1 air unit on a ground strike. If it fails, next impulse we can use another bomber - when there aren't any nasty fighters around. I'm playing the odds here, since two separate attacks have a better chance of disorganizing a single unit.

I was worried about the ground strike on the ATR, which is why I recommended having it rebase to the rear: Penza is a better location than what I stated earlier.

As for saving the units in Moscow, I would rather force the Germans to attack those 13 strength points in the city. I am sure they can put a lot of units into that attack but they need to get to 65 to make it a 5:1. Even if they commit all the units nearby to the attack, the die can still come up 1, 2, or 3 which leaves a unit in the city and all the Germans disorganized. 4 and 5 aren't bad results either, since it disorganizes 65 strength points of Germans (free guaranteed ground strike on everyone!).

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 2117

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/3/2012 11:47:02 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
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From: Honolulu, Hawaii
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Steve: this means that the planes in Moscow are probably going to get ground striked by the Stuka... If that happens, that TB-3 is a sitting duck...

I would suggest groundstriking Mannerheim with the TB-3 and use the DB-F3 as front bomber on this attack too. The ground strike is going to be intercepted by the German FTR, so the Russian FTR flies too.

Also: why the sacrifice of a good INF in Moscow. The Germans are going to grab the city anyway. If the ground strike succeeds, I would suggest leaving only the MIL in Moscow. If it doesn't succeed, you might go for the 4-1 attack on Moscow with the two units, hoping to disorganise the Germans. I wouldn't...

If anything, it is the MIL that should flee. He can't be rebuilt once Moscow is taken.

I simply measure the length of the unit's legs. 3 or less and it digs a trench to both defend in be buried in. Hence the 2-6 may leave.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Red Prince)

Post #: 2118

RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 1:45:23 AM

Red Prince

Posts: 3686
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From: Bangor, Maine, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Steve: this means that the planes in Moscow are probably going to get ground striked by the Stuka... If that happens, that TB-3 is a sitting duck...

I would suggest groundstriking Mannerheim with the TB-3 and use the DB-F3 as front bomber on this attack too. The ground strike is going to be intercepted by the German FTR, so the Russian FTR flies too.

Also: why the sacrifice of a good INF in Moscow. The Germans are going to grab the city anyway. If the ground strike succeeds, I would suggest leaving only the MIL in Moscow. If it doesn't succeed, you might go for the 4-1 attack on Moscow with the two units, hoping to disorganise the Germans. I wouldn't...

I hadn't seen the fighter. But I would still go with this plan. If Mannerheim gets disorganized, then life in the north is a lot easier for the Russians. The Russian fighter can intercept the interceptor, and then RTB to Moscow. Who knows? The turn might end and it can be returned to the Air Reserve.

I only want to use 1 air unit on a ground strike. If it fails, next impulse we can use another bomber - when there aren't any nasty fighters around. I'm playing the odds here, since two separate attacks have a better chance of disorganizing a single unit.

I was worried about the ground strike on the ATR, which is why I recommended having it rebase to the rear: Penza is a better location than what I stated earlier.

As for saving the units in Moscow, I would rather force the Germans to attack those 13 strength points in the city. I am sure they can put a lot of units into that attack but they need to get to 65 to make it a 5:1. Even if they commit all the units nearby to the attack, the die can still come up 1, 2, or 3 which leaves a unit in the city and all the Germans disorganized. 4 and 5 aren't bad results either, since it disorganizes 65 strength points of Germans (free guaranteed ground strike on everyone!).

Depending on how I plan things for the Germans, I still have 3-4 other fighters that can rebase to the area, although that leaves something undefended, I think. If Germany fails to make significant headway, I can also reorganize some air power, though I doubt I will. Too expensive, really.

Anyway, I'll try to set all of this up sometime early early early tomoroow morning. Then I'll probably run through to the end of the impulse. That takes us to the Germans and their cronies, and the first shot at ending the turn (10%).

Have a good night/day/morning/evening/afternoon, everyone.

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 9:29:36 AM

Red Prince

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To my surprise, the LND got through at +3/-3 odds against him, but it didn't manage to disorganize Mannerheim. Now I've got to try to figure out exactly what I'm supposed to do with the land units. I'll be railing the Yaroslavl factory out to Akmolinsk, but the rest of it I have to gather from a post above.

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 10:08:04 AM

Red Prince

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The Americans invade!!!

East Timor and the Mashall Islands, but they do invade:

And the results:

Attack on Majuro: Assault, Roll = 5+1 = 6 = */2S
Attack on Dili: Assault, Roll = Automatic = */2S

This is purely a battle for ports that are closer to the primary target areas. They are not Major Ports, but they are a start . . . and a morale boost, too. The Green Giant wants its presence to be known!

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 10:28:13 AM

Red Prince

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The Soviet reorganization effort is shown below. I debated having Zhukov reorganize both LND and not the MIL, since it's a white-print unit, but it may need to move. I did spend his last point on the other LND, but I'm not sure how WiF works. Does that cut the reorg cost of that unit in half for later impulses? or is it lost if the unit isn't fully reorganized in a single impulse?

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 10:35:54 AM

Red Prince

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While I can't get the New York MIL to Murmansk this turn, I did figure out how to get another American unit from the United States to the UK -- this TRS isn't worth much as a transport or in an invasion, but it can reorganize a TRS that is worth something for that. The American naval units you see in the screenshot are in Derry, while the CW sealift is in Belfast. All I have to do is make sure to clear out the rest of the American navy from Belfast next impulse before sending this TRS to the E. Coast, and I should be able to pick up another USA unit -- an 8-5 white print MOT this time.

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 10:53:52 AM

Red Prince

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And now the turn starts to increase in its chance to end. Axis impulse #7 has a 10% chance. The Italians are counting on at least 1 more impulse to play with this turn, taking a Combined Action now, and the weather stays the same:

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 11:10:08 AM

Red Prince

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As expected, the Germans hit Moscow, and they did okay. The disorganized INF means that the Blitz Bonus -1 die roll modifier for a multi-stack factory city is negated.

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 1:18:33 PM

Red Prince

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lothrim

All this is "fantasy" since I have no idea how many hexes in persia the axis controls, and how supply is traced by the axis there. I am just guessing that a well placed russian unit could wreck havoc with the supply.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince
I just counted it out, and there are no hexes in Persia that the ATR can reach for an Air Transport (by the way, it's 2 x 11 hexes, not 3 x 11 hexes. The first stretch is for the "pickup" and the 2nd is the return to base.

If the para starts stacked with the ATR it can move with the ATR to the "pickup site" then again to the "target hex" and again to the "return to base hex". Yes... the rules are weird :-)

I was not thinking about this turn, but the turn after that. The Moscow bomber would rebase to krasnodar, and the ATR in krasnodar would rebase to a hex in persia (baku perhaps).
Next turn you could air-transport the para from krasnodar to Baku with ATR1 and then from Baku to the hex NE of the iraqi cav unit (providing it is still russian controlled) with ATR2. This would put the entire axis force OOS.... perhaps, or does it also trace supply through the rail from baghdad?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Red Prince
Yes, they are relying on the Japanese for supply, and even though they did a lot of damage last impulse, it's unlikely the Allies can clear the Arabian Sea (but they'll try).

I'm not sure what you mean by Germany leaving its HQ's behind. Unless the Soviets retreat 5-6 hexes each, the HQs of Germany are able to be right on the front lines, or just behind it.

"von Leeb" and "von Bock" are far enough behind the front to be able to react to any dangerous paradrop by the russians.

I'm afraid you are wrong about Air Transport Missions. I checked it in-game and in the Rules as Coded.

from RAC 11.12:

quote:

To fly an air transport mission:
1. your opponent flies combat air patrol to potential target hexes;
2. you fly your selected ATRs and escorting fighters to the target hexes;
3. pick up the units being transported. Alternatively, a unit may start with an ATR and fly with it to a target hex
(not to a hex-dot);
4. your opponent flies intercepting fighters to the target hexes;
5. you fly intercepting fighters to the target hexes;
6. fight any air-to-air combats;
7. AsA option 3: surviving ATRs suffer anti-aircraft fire (see 22.4.2);
8. surviving ATRs can unload their cargo at the target hexes;
9. return all remaining aircraft to base where they become disorganized;
10. your opponent flies intercepting fighters to the hexes where your ATRs returned to base;
11. you move intercepting fighters to the return-to-base hexes;
12. fight any air-to-air combats;
13. AsA option 3: surviving ATRs suffer anti-aircraft fire (see 22.4.2);
14. any cargo still on an ATR now unloads;
15. return all remaining intercepting fighters to base where they become disorganized.

The steps in Red are the first flight, and the steps in Blue are the second flight. There is no third flight.

Note that the word "Alternatively" means that the unit can start stacked with the ATR and not land at the target hex. It doesn't mean there is an added "pick-up" site. The target hex is both pick-up and drop-off.

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 1:55:45 PM

Red Prince

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I've settled on the German attacks. There will be 3 of them, as expected.

It took a little work to get the Moscow attack a shot at 7:1 odds, but with either a lucky HQ Support Roll or a lucky Fractional Odds Roll, it should be possible. I'm willing to let Mannerheim get disorganized for 2 reasons:

1. If the Germans don't add an odds level, there is a 50% chance he'll be disorganized anyway.
2. Rundstedt is moving toward the North and should be able to take over supply if the German attack on Moscow doesn't disorganize all of those units.

The Germans will be flying CAP to Moscow just in case the Soviets try to add a few more factors, and also as a free rebase mission (sort of). It's a twin-engine FTR, so the result is reduced by one level, but at +2/-2 odds, that still means only a 36% chance that the bomber will be cleared through for each round of Air-to-Air Combat.
-----
The Soviets won't be trying to add factors. The odds are pretty good that the Germans won't be able to get up to 7:1 anyway, and with a 70% chance of a 5:1 attack clearing the hex, Moscow isn't going to survive the turn no matter what the Russians do (unless they get lucky and the turn ends before the Germans get another land move). Even if they do get the factors through, Germany can still get lucky and move up to 7:1, so what's the point?
-----
The attack on the Kharkov MIL is not worth trying to add Ground Support. This can only be reduced to a 5:1 +1 Blitz, so any result will kill the defender. With that hungry 6-Factor FTR lurking Northeast of Kharkov, any attempt to provide support would be suicide.
-----
Other attacks this impulse include an Italian invasion of Cyprus and a Japanese Assault on Manila.

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 1:58:39 PM

Lothrim

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About airtransport:
Sorry, I guess we played it wrong all those years.
It will be nice to have the computer correct all the misunderstandings.

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 2:07:10 PM

Red Prince

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lothrim

About airtransport:
Sorry, I guess we played it wrong all those years.
It will be nice to have the computer correct all the misunderstandings.

I'm glad you brought it up, so thank you. These are the kind of "fine-tooth comb" rules checks that Steve has mentioned in the Monthly Reports. We try to find them all, but it's impossible with thousands of variations, so I think I can speak for the entire development team when I say we appreciate your help checking these things out.

While double-checking, I had to re-read these rules 3 times to be sure I was getting it right. After the 2nd time, I was about to submit a bug report on it. While I was doing that, I saw the problem. ADG has never been able to write things so that they can be easily understood.

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RE: MWiF Global War Hot-Seat (AAR) - 2/4/2012 2:32:33 PM

composer99

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In case it didn't come up earlier, extra reorganization points end up being wasted, so Zhukov was probably better off reorging both bombers and one land unit.

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