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Printable Map - 2/17/2012 6:33:47 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

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From: Honolulu, Hawaii
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Here is a draft of what I am thinking should be included as a printed reference map. It's a little sloppy in the overlap (in the Atlantic). Probably this would be about 8 1/2 by 11 inches.

The red/pink hexes are victory/objective hexes.

Comments? Opinions?

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Shannon V. OKeets -- 2/17/2012 6:34:36 PM >

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Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

Post #: 1

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 7:10:25 PM

paulderynck

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Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
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I've played around with this and based on what I did, I think you need to go 11"x 14" (legal size). I'm sure the aspect ratio is a much better match.

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Paul

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 2

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 7:52:47 PM

Jimm

Posts: 607
Joined: 7/27/2006
From: York, UK
Status: offline

Looks good. Can we show resources/oil/factories? I'm thinking in terms of usefulness for convoy planning.

Wondering if really need to distinguish relief at this scale- although it gives the map some "texture" I would value more information instead- the above is likely to get lost in the clutter otherwise?

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 3

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 7:57:47 PM

Centuur

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From: Hoorn (NED).
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I have troubles with the suggested colours. The sea and mountains are looking the same to me on this map. Especially the Pacific and the Med are giving me problems (being colourblind. However: this could be solved by drawing a white line along the coastlines).
For size: the size Steve is suggesting is A4. That is a common size used in the world. Legal size, I'm afraid, isn't used a lot around mainland Europe. That's why I would prefer A4. It is impossible to store an "legal size" paper in an A4 folder. The opposite is however good possible, since the legal papers are a little larger. The "A" types of paper are standard in Europe and storage space for papers are based on those.

< Message edited by Centuur -- 2/17/2012 7:58:08 PM >

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Peter

(in reply to paulderynck)

Post #: 4

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 8:23:06 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jimm

Looks good. Can we show resources/oil/factories? I'm thinking in terms of usefulness for convoy planning.

Wondering if really need to distinguish relief at this scale- although it gives the map some "texture" I would value more information instead- the above is likely to get lost in the clutter otherwise?

This isn't showing elevations; it is showing terrain types.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Jimm)

Post #: 5

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 8:25:39 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

I have troubles with the suggested colours. The sea and mountains are looking the same to me on this map. Especially the Pacific and the Med are giving me problems (being colourblind. However: this could be solved by drawing a white line along the coastlines).
For size: the size Steve is suggesting is A4. That is a common size used in the world. Legal size, I'm afraid, isn't used a lot around mainland Europe. That's why I would prefer A4. It is impossible to store an "legal size" paper in an A4 folder. The opposite is however good possible, since the legal papers are a little larger. The "A" types of paper are standard in Europe and storage space for papers are based on those.

Hmmm. I have to think about this.

My initial response is that maybe the mountain color should be changed. If that change is made, would there still be problems?

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 6

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 9:27:29 PM

Jimm

Posts: 607
Joined: 7/27/2006
From: York, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jimm

Looks good. Can we show resources/oil/factories? I'm thinking in terms of usefulness for convoy planning.

Wondering if really need to distinguish relief at this scale- although it gives the map some "texture" I would value more information instead- the above is likely to get lost in the clutter otherwise?

This isn't showing elevations; it is showing terrain types.

Ok Steve I didnt literally mean elevations, I meant differentiation of the terrain types. My point remains.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 7

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 9:28:50 PM

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Steve wont this map be available in game?

Bo

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 8

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 10:27:25 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bo

Steve wont this map be available in game?

Bo

Yes. But, ...

What we're considering is including a nice map that you can hold in your hand for reference - like the combat result tables that come with the board game.

While the maps and CRTs are accessible on screen during game play, and will be included in a PDF of the Players Manual as part of the download (and in the printed copy of the Players Manual if you buy the boxed version), having a separate map (piece of paper) that you can examine at your leisure seems like a good idea.

The size of 8 1/2 by 11 would leave room above/below for text. Perhaps a legend for what the colors mean. There would also be a reverse side. Perhaps the resources and factories against a white background.

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to bo)

Post #: 9

RE: Printable Map - 2/17/2012 10:29:02 PM

paulderynck

Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

I have troubles with the suggested colours. The sea and mountains are looking the same to me on this map. Especially the Pacific and the Med are giving me problems (being colourblind. However: this could be solved by drawing a white line along the coastlines).
For size: the size Steve is suggesting is A4. That is a common size used in the world. Legal size, I'm afraid, isn't used a lot around mainland Europe. That's why I would prefer A4. It is impossible to store an "legal size" paper in an A4 folder. The opposite is however good possible, since the legal papers are a little larger. The "A" types of paper are standard in Europe and storage space for papers are based on those.

On my screen the map is about 8.5" x 18". So maybe two sheets of A4. To go landscape on 8.5" x 11" paper, the map would only be 5.2" high, to preserve the same aspect ratio.

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Paul

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 10

RE: Printable Map - 2/18/2012 12:28:00 PM

Jimm

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From: York, UK
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Is it worth having two maps back to back, with a decent overlap- say one centred on Africa with Atlantic and Indian Ocean complete (more or less as shown) and the other Pacific centred (scope maybe Africa to US West Coast?)

Just a thought.

Also be good to distinguish oil resources.

(in reply to paulderynck)

Post #: 11

RE: Printable Map - 2/18/2012 1:34:29 PM

Centuur

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From: Hoorn (NED).
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

I have troubles with the suggested colours. The sea and mountains are looking the same to me on this map. Especially the Pacific and the Med are giving me problems (being colourblind. However: this could be solved by drawing a white line along the coastlines).
For size: the size Steve is suggesting is A4. That is a common size used in the world. Legal size, I'm afraid, isn't used a lot around mainland Europe. That's why I would prefer A4. It is impossible to store an "legal size" paper in an A4 folder. The opposite is however good possible, since the legal papers are a little larger. The "A" types of paper are standard in Europe and storage space for papers are based on those.

Hmmm. I have to think about this.

My initial response is that maybe the mountain color should be changed. If that change is made, would there still be problems?

That is a difficult question for me, since it depends on the color used to do so. Also: if something is going to get printed on paper, it will look different for me as compared to something I see on a monitor (strange as it will sound to someone who hasn't got this problem).
In maps as the one you are going to get printed, it is always difficult for me to get through to the details. This is due to the fact that my eyes registrate a lot of cluttering in colors. If I look at the Med, the cluttering is simply so large, that I am not able to see the individual victory hexes in and around Italy. For colorblind, that means that there is too much information on this one map alone.
You can remedy this by doing two things: refrain from using pastel colors and use only the basic colors as advised on another place in this forum (Someone put a color stale for colorblind in) or make more maps.
Another option is to make these map on an A3 format. This is because the size of the map will reduce the amount of cluttering, provided you do not add more items (i.e. more colors) on the map itself.

What you could do however, is to make this map interactive in MWIF.
You already have a world map for control and the weather in MWIF. Simply add one for terrain (make the mountains Red), Roads/railroads, Cities/capitals, Minor/Major ports and factories/resources. Buttons can than be used by colourblind people to reduce the cluttering. Cluttering is the main problem of colorblind people...

_____________________________

Peter

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 12

RE: Printable Map - 2/18/2012 4:34:10 PM

dragon_troop

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I like the map showing oil resources factories. I know it would clutter the map, but ports, and rail lines would be nice to see on the same map.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 13

RE: Printable Map - 2/18/2012 6:26:48 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: dragon_troop

I like the map showing oil resources factories. I know it would clutter the map, but ports, and rail lines would be nice to see on the same map.

Ports and rail lines can't be added (in my opinion). We are working with only 16 pixels (4 by 4) and there is only so much you can do in so limited a space.

By the way, the example I presented for resources, factories, etc. left out those belonging to neutral minor countries (e.g., NEI). That would be corrected in any version we printed - so all the resources, oil and non-oil, and factories are shown.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to dragon_troop)

Post #: 14

RE: Printable Map - 2/18/2012 6:31:30 PM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shannon V. OKeets

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

I have troubles with the suggested colours. The sea and mountains are looking the same to me on this map. Especially the Pacific and the Med are giving me problems (being colourblind. However: this could be solved by drawing a white line along the coastlines).
For size: the size Steve is suggesting is A4. That is a common size used in the world. Legal size, I'm afraid, isn't used a lot around mainland Europe. That's why I would prefer A4. It is impossible to store an "legal size" paper in an A4 folder. The opposite is however good possible, since the legal papers are a little larger. The "A" types of paper are standard in Europe and storage space for papers are based on those.

Hmmm. I have to think about this.

My initial response is that maybe the mountain color should be changed. If that change is made, would there still be problems?

That is a difficult question for me, since it depends on the color used to do so. Also: if something is going to get printed on paper, it will look different for me as compared to something I see on a monitor (strange as it will sound to someone who hasn't got this problem).
In maps as the one you are going to get printed, it is always difficult for me to get through to the details. This is due to the fact that my eyes registrate a lot of cluttering in colors. If I look at the Med, the cluttering is simply so large, that I am not able to see the individual victory hexes in and around Italy. For colorblind, that means that there is too much information on this one map alone.
You can remedy this by doing two things: refrain from using pastel colors and use only the basic colors as advised on another place in this forum (Someone put a color stale for colorblind in) or make more maps.
Another option is to make these map on an A3 format. This is because the size of the map will reduce the amount of cluttering, provided you do not add more items (i.e. more colors) on the map itself.

What you could do however, is to make this map interactive in MWIF.
You already have a world map for control and the weather in MWIF. Simply add one for terrain (make the mountains Red), Roads/railroads, Cities/capitals, Minor/Major ports and factories/resources. Buttons can than be used by colour blind people to reduce the cluttering. Cluttering is the main problem of colorblind people...

When playing the game, the global map offers multiple schemes for presenting information: hex control, units, production, terrain, weather. The convoys can be displayed using any of those 'backgrounds'. I think I will leave them as is.

But for printing, I'll leave the choice of colors up to the professional printers. They make decisions about 3-part and 4-part colors that are way out of my range of expertise. So long as they get something roughly similar to what is on the screen it will be ok by me. Hopefully, they can choose colors that can be differentiated by all players.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 15

RE: Printable Map - 2/22/2012 5:37:30 AM

brian brian

Posts: 3191
Joined: 11/16/2005
Status: offline

I have been wondering something. On the hexes, the weather effects can be turned on or off. Also, the weather zone boundaries are shown in white hex-sides. But where can a player learn which zone is which? On the paper maps, this is printed right on the map. I presume that this was not used in MWiF due to the levels of zoom. But to plan for the future, you have to know what zone a hex is in, even if the whole world is currently experiencing "Fine" weather.

Perhaps this could be a part of a 'Printable' map?

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 16

RE: Printable Map - 2/22/2012 8:01:47 AM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: brian brian

I have been wondering something. On the hexes, the weather effects can be turned on or off. Also, the weather zone boundaries are shown in white hex-sides. But where can a player learn which zone is which? On the paper maps, this is printed right on the map. I presume that this was not used in MWiF due to the levels of zoom. But to plan for the future, you have to know what zone a hex is in, even if the whole world is currently experiencing "Fine" weather.

Perhaps this could be a part of a 'Printable' map?

There is a toggle to insert a 2 letter code into each hex: Ar, NT, ST, Me, NM, SM (if I remember them correctly).

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to brian brian)

Post #: 17

RE: Printable Map - 3/30/2012 7:37:03 PM

Edfactor