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RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 3:57:03 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

Unfortunately taking even losses with the enemy at a 3:1 advantage is a losing proposition. It won't be long now before the allied forces are expelled from PH.


I agree. However, in fighting the superior IJA forces to a bloody standstill for many months, the Allies have effectively engaged in an attritional battle that they are better equipped to recover from. Provided, of course, that the Allied forces aren't liquidated in situ, that is.

So-how about that airdrop on Corruna Downs to open up that retreat route?

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Post #: 6721
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 5:15:42 PM   
Cap Mandrake


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

Unfortunately taking even losses with the enemy at a 3:1 advantage is a losing proposition. It won't be long now before the allied forces are expelled from PH.


That is what I thought 3 and 2 weeks ago.

Unfortunately, you may be right. Furthermore, there will be no "expelling" as we still don't have an exit hexside. There will just be lots of surrendering.

We can have the air effort shift exclusively to PH today with about 90% of the bombers targeted on the ground troops. I was trying to avoid the disaster of the airfield becoming active again.


< Message edited by Cap Mandrake -- 3/2/2012 5:55:06 PM >

(in reply to Itdepends)
Post #: 6722
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 5:18:29 PM   
Cap Mandrake


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

Unfortunately taking even losses with the enemy at a 3:1 advantage is a losing proposition. It won't be long now before the allied forces are expelled from PH.


I agree. However, in fighting the superior IJA forces to a bloody standstill for many months, the Allies have effectively engaged in an attritional battle that they are better equipped to recover from. Provided, of course, that the Allied forces aren't liquidated in situ, that is.

So-how about that airdrop on Corruna Downs to open up that retreat route?


I concur on the air drop thingy. JJ has moved the SNLF and the troops there are getting beat up by the Beauforts from Carnarvon.

(in reply to Chickenboy)
Post #: 6723
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 5:25:26 PM   
witpqs


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Post #: 6724
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 5:30:47 PM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

Unfortunately taking even losses with the enemy at a 3:1 advantage is a losing proposition. It won't be long now before the allied forces are expelled from PH.


... Unfortunately, you may be right. Furthermore, there will be no "expelling" as we still don't have an exit hexside. There will just be lots of surrendering...



You only need a single squad to enter Port Hedland to give you control of that hexside. Therefore why don't you just create a really small amphibious or landing craft TF to carrying a small enough fragment which can only in a single phase directly land onto the land desert hex to the left of Port Hedland, and then march due east into Port Hedland. As you own Exmouth, that should allow you to trace a supply path from Port Hedland back to Exmouth, and allow you to get some small amount of overland supply into Port hedland but more importantly allow for a retreat rather than an outright surrender.

Alfred

< Message edited by Alfred -- 3/2/2012 5:31:30 PM >

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Post #: 6725
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 5:59:20 PM   
Cap Mandrake


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

quote:

ORIGINAL: Itdepends

Unfortunately taking even losses with the enemy at a 3:1 advantage is a losing proposition. It won't be long now before the allied forces are expelled from PH.


... Unfortunately, you may be right. Furthermore, there will be no "expelling" as we still don't have an exit hexside. There will just be lots of surrendering...



You only need a single squad to enter Port Hedland to give you control of that hexside. Therefore why don't you just create a really small amphibious or landing craft TF to carrying a small enough fragment which can only in a single phase directly land onto the land desert hex to the left of Port Hedland, and then march due east into Port Hedland. As you own Exmouth, that should allow you to trace a supply path from Port Hedland back to Exmouth, and allow you to get some small amount of overland supply into Port hedland but more importantly allow for a retreat rather than an outright surrender.

Alfred


Yes, this is an obvious solution, but I was afraid we may have had a house rule about that (non dot hex landings).

Admiral Lord Sprior, do you recall?


We have some up-armored sorghum harvesters driving up from Meekathara on the magic mushroom trail. We have a batallion or so of Br. 2nd Div marching overland from Exmouth and some Wolverines (the tank destroyers not the comic book characters) driving overland from Exmouth.

Everything is at least a week away.

I suspect Admiral Lord Sprior has the Aussie paras dedicated to the operation at Darwin, but I'm not sure.


< Message edited by Cap Mandrake -- 3/2/2012 6:01:25 PM >

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Post #: 6726
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 6:06:10 PM   
sprior


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quote:

Admiral Lord Sprior, do you recall?


Yes, I think we said no non-dot base invasions

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Post #: 6727
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 6:07:15 PM   
sprior


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quote:

Everything is at least a week away.


Yes but we do have LooBs for all the majot combat formations so if the worst comes to the worst we can rebuild them

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Post #: 6728
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 6:07:47 PM   
sprior


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quote:

Admiral Lord Sprior has the Aussie paras dedicated to the operation at Darwin


Am I running that op too?

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Post #: 6729
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 6:08:20 PM   
Alfred

 

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Status: offline 		Well isn't the usual justification for outlawing a non base landing is to force the invaders to run the gamut of the enemy CD guns. You have already faced that problem of landing in the teeth of the enemy defences.

Couldn't you just claim that the 3 squads you land to the left merely lost their way during the night and mistook that beach for the beach at Port Hedland? Its not as if you are landing a big enough force which can itself march in and capture Port Hedland.

Alfred

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Post #: 6730
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 6:23:20 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Well isn't the usual justification for outlawing a non base landing is to force the invaders to run the gamut of the enemy CD guns. You have already faced that problem of landing in the teeth of the enemy defences.

Couldn't you just claim that the 3 squads you land to the left merely lost their way during the night and mistook that beach for the beach at Port Hedland? Its not as if you are landing a big enough force which can itself march in and capture Port Hedland.

Alfred

It still sounds gamey to me. Having the HR not only forces you to brave the CD guns but you have to enter a lions' den where there is no exit - you prevail or else. It forces the attacker to consider whether he is risking losing the whole shooting match if he lands there.
And as the Lord Admiral has indicated, they kept back a couple of quartermasters to rebuild if the lions dine well.

(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 6731
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 6:27:08 PM   
witpqs


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Status: offline 		I dislike that house rule as the action is not gamey. But - if you have the house rule then it would be gamey to do it.

Bomb and bombard the snot out of them until the armor arrives.

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Post #: 6732
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 6:53:00 PM   
Cap Mandrake


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sprior

quote:

Admiral Lord Sprior has the Aussie paras dedicated to the operation at Darwin


Am I running that op too?




Well, the Plenary Committee isn't done deliberating yet?

Let's see...over half of the Darwin amphibious force is Aussie. The overland component is British and Aussie. The Marines and naval support are SouPac. Most of the ships are USN. It is another all-in thing.

Shall I do the amphib and you do the overland attack?

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Post #: 6733
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 8:42:13 PM   
sprior


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quote:

Assaulting units:
4th Infantry Regiment
6th Guards Division
21st Ind. Engineer Regiment
4th Ind. Engineer Regiment
5th Division
56th Recon Regiment
65th Brigade
24th Infantry Regiment
56th Engineer Regiment
77th Infantry Regiment
66th Infantry Group
Yokosuka Assault SNLF /2
9th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
22nd Air Flotilla
30th Fld AA Gun Co
2nd Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
9th Field AF Construction Battalion
16th Army
51st JNAF AF Unit


Have I missed something or does this list keep growing?

_____________________________

"Grown ups are what's left when skool is finished."
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.



(in reply to Cap Mandrake)
Post #: 6734
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 8:43:28 PM   
sprior


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quote:

Shall I do the amphib and you do the overland attack?


Sounds like a good idea to me. Shall I take over driving the crabs, both domestic and foreign?

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"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.



(in reply to Cap Mandrake)
Post #: 6735
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 8:46:47 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sprior

quote:

Assaulting units:
4th Infantry Regiment
6th Guards Division
21st Ind. Engineer Regiment
4th Ind. Engineer Regiment
5th Division
56th Recon Regiment
65th Brigade
24th Infantry Regiment
56th Engineer Regiment
77th Infantry Regiment
66th Infantry Group
Yokosuka Assault SNLF /2
9th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
22nd Air Flotilla
30th Fld AA Gun Co
2nd Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
9th Field AF Construction Battalion
16th Army
51st JNAF AF Unit


Have I missed something or does this list keep growing?

It's likely. Yes. Two answers.

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Post #: 6736
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 9:01:23 PM   
sprior


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Status: offline 		More heckling from the cheap seats. The price we artistes have to pay.

_____________________________

"Grown ups are what's left when skool is finished."
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.



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Post #: 6737
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/2/2012 9:31:26 PM   
Cap Mandrake


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sprior

quote:

Assaulting units:
4th Infantry Regiment
6th Guards Division
21st Ind. Engineer Regiment
4th Ind. Engineer Regiment
5th Division
56th Recon Regiment
65th Brigade
24th Infantry Regiment
56th Engineer Regiment
77th Infantry Regiment
66th Infantry Group
Yokosuka Assault SNLF /2
9th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
22nd Air Flotilla
30th Fld AA Gun Co
2nd Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
9th Field AF Construction Battalion
16th Army
51st JNAF AF Unit


Have I missed something or does this list keep growing?


66th Inf Group was present at the last attack but I think there is at least one more infantry regiment. There are now 3 full infantry division equivalents plus two brigade-sized infantry units plus Engineers, Recon and Arty.

I think the Little Yellow Bastards are marching in from Broome. Smaller units may have arrived from Corrunna

(in reply to sprior)
Post #: 6738
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 1:36:45 AM   
Itdepends

 

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Status: offline 		Unlikely they're marching in from Broome as the rough desert on the coast between PH and Broome takes a looooong time to march through. It's faster to detour south where you only have to deal with 1 hex of rough desert to go through.
Could they be airlifting troops in?

(in reply to Cap Mandrake)
Post #: 6739
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 2:36:47 PM   
sprior


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Attachment (1)

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"Grown ups are what's left when skool is finished."
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.



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Post #: 6740
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 2:37:35 PM   
sprior


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Status: offline 		Troops gathering at Daly Waters:






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"Grown ups are what's left when skool is finished."
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.



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Post #: 6741
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 2:38:57 PM   
sprior


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Status: offline 		The troops prepping at Sydney for Darwin:








Attachment (1)

< Message edited by sprior -- 3/3/2012 2:39:53 PM >

_____________________________

"Grown ups are what's left when skool is finished."
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.



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Post #: 6742
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 4:11:18 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sprior

The troops prepping at Sydney for Darwin:


Quite the collection of Aussies you've got there. Any idea of the entrenchment or enemy AVs at Darwin?

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Post #: 6743
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 4:28:32 PM   
sprior


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From: Portsmouth, UK
Status: offline 		This:






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"Grown ups are what's left when skool is finished."
"History started badly and hav been geting steadily worse."
- Nigel Molesworth.



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Post #: 6744
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 4:43:41 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Cap Mandrake

****************Dec 4, 1942**************


Oz: The same Allied surface group (minus one DD and most of their torps but with 80% main gun ammo) is sent back to PH to guard the transports and are driven off after a rough draw in combat damage.

Night Time Surface Combat, near Port Hedland at 57,129, Range 7,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Atago, Shell hits 3, on fire
CA Haguro, Shell hits 4, on fire
DD Akizuki
DD Makinami
DD Oshio, Shell hits 1
DD Arashio
DD Natsugumo
DD Murasame
DD Yamakaze
DD Isonami
DD Fuyo, Shell hits 1

Allied Ships
CA San Francisco, Shell hits 2
CL Durban
CL Ceres, Shell hits 3, on fire
CL Caradoc, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Foxhound
DD Hotspur, Shell hits 3, on fire
DD Isis

But then there is this bit.

Night Time Surface Combat, near Port Hedland at 57,129, Range 2,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Atago, on fire
CA Haguro, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
DD Akizuki
DD Makinami
DD Oshio
DD Arashio
DD Natsugumo
DD Murasame
DD Yamakaze
DD Isonami
DD Fuyo

Allied Ships
PT-153
PT-158

JJ also finds two SC's on ASW patrol.

Night Time Surface Combat, near Port Hedland at 57,129, Range 11,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Atago, on fire
CA Haguro
DD Akizuki
DD Makinami
DD Oshio
DD Arashio
DD Natsugumo
DD Murasame
DD Yamakaze
DD Isonami
DD Fuyo

Allied Ships
SC-519, Shell hits 2, and is sunk
SC-738, Shell hits 1

So CA Haguro takes 4 shell hits in the first clash, a single torp in the second one, and in the third clash she is not showing fire or heavy damage - then she shows up in the list of ships sunk? Unless those shell hits triggered "massive explosive damage" or "engine room hit" [which usually means flooding], I highly doubt she would sink from a single torp hit. Allied intel types have the "wishful thinking disease" again!

(in reply to Cap Mandrake)
Post #: 6745
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 4:52:35 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sprior

This:




Very light forces. Oughta be a pushover. Even for English / commonwealth troops.

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Post #: 6746
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 6:38:42 PM   
Cap Mandrake


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Status: offline 		What we got: BB/BC

Colorado is in Perth and I think can be ready in time for a pre-Christmas landing. Repulse could use a short time in dry dock at Sydney as she is down to 27 kts., but we could take her as is.

That gives us 2 slow BB's for bombardment, Colorado and Maryland, which just arrived in Oz (or will soon) after being repaired from the Pearl Harbor attack.

The survivors from Force Z, Repulse and PoW

and Washington and Indiana.

I think we will be up against Yamato for sure which is likely in Timor or Java. Nagato seems likely to be in the shop somehwere. Not sure when Musashi is ready.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Cap Mandrake -- 3/3/2012 6:39:23 PM >

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Post #: 6747
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 6:44:22 PM   
khyberbill


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From: new milford, ct
Status: offline 		It will be interesting to see what the reaction to your taking of Dobo will be. Holding that base is like driving a rusty nail into their knee.

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(in reply to Cap Mandrake)
Post #: 6748
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 6:49:06 PM   
Cap Mandrake


Posts: 23184
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From: Southern California
Status: offline 		Carriers;

CV:

Wasp, Yorktown and Irrustrious.

Wasp could use a short dry dock time to repair up but can be used as is if we dont have enough space at Sydney.

CVE:

Copahee, Nassau, Altamaha, Prince William and Long Island

We have two more modern CVE's arriving Panama next 3-7 d but they might not make it in time.

Hermes got sent out on a training exericise when the RN CV's left Ceylon. Her crew is quite proud as the Opfor has not spotted her for 2 months.






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(in reply to Cap Mandrake)
Post #: 6749
RE: With the Wren Detachment - 3/3/2012 7:00:38 PM   
Cap Mandrake


Posts: 23184
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From: Southern California
Status: offline 		The cruisers. The USN CA's have really been murdered. Leander is sunk. Wichita will stay around Fiji to support the diversionary stuff in New Caledonia and the New adn Improved Hebrides.

Seems like we need at least 1 and maybe two CA's to support the PH forces (if they survive) and provide plausible evidence we have not given up there. There is one RN CA in Melbourne in drydock...Cornwall maybe? She may be ready.

We have 3 modern USN CLAA's for AAA for the carrier groups.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Cap Mandrake -- 3/3/2012 7:02:59 PM >

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Post #: 6750
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