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Help request - 1/20/2001 7:01:00 AM

Lorenzo

Posts: 26
Joined: 6/13/2000
From: Italy
Status: offline

Hi, I am looking after a few answers concerning the Command & Control system for SP:WAW. Is there anybody out there willing to help a rookie? 1. How can I assign new objectives to units or formations on 'Advance' missions? I have tried to click everywhere, but I am only able to shift between 'Advance' and 'Defense'. The objective hex selected at the beginning of the scenario is never highlighted and I am unable to alter it. 2. Why are some formations set to advance on an unexisting "222,222" hex at the beginning of some scenarios? 3. What are the "Movement Waypoints" listed in the Headquarter screen, and how do I use them? 4. I noticed that in the Tutorial scenario the Greyhounds (Formation D) and the command squad (A0) are the only units allowed to move without expending orders for doing so. Why do other units need individual orders, if they already belong to a Formation? Thanks in advance, and please excuse my broken English, Lorenzo.

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Post #: 1

- 1/20/2001 7:38:00 AM

lnp4668

Posts: 517
Joined: 11/10/2000
From: Arlington, TX, USA
Status: offline

1. During setup, click on the blue flag with the formation selected. It should allows you to set objective for that formation. During game play, click on the red flag if it is highlighted to set waypoint. Why different color? I don't know |-) 2. All units are set to advanced to 222,222 or defense 222, 222 depends on their mission at the beginning of the scenario. You could changes this if you want to during setup. 3. Movement waypoints are to set the computer to take control of units and move them to the waypoint. I never use this since I like to react to situation as they came up. 4. If you right click on a unit to gets to its info screen, any unit with a recon line ability could move without setting objectives.

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Post #: 2

- 1/20/2001 7:47:00 AM

Captn_Jack

Posts: 62
Joined: 10/4/2000
From: Reedsville, WV, USA
Status: offline

quote:

Originally posted by Lorenzo: Hi, I am looking after a few answers concerning the Command & Control system for SP:WAW. Is there anybody out there willing to help a rookie? 1. How can I assign new objectives to units or formations on 'Advance' missions? I have tried to click everywhere, but I am only able to shift between 'Advance' and 'Defense'. The objective hex selected at the beginning of the scenario is never highlighted and I am unable to alter it. 2. Why are some formations set to advance on an unexisting "222,222" hex at the beginning of some scenarios? 3. What are the "Movement Waypoints" listed in the Headquarter screen, and how do I use them? 4. I noticed that in the Tutorial scenario the Greyhounds (Formation D) and the command squad (A0) are the only units allowed to move without expending orders for doing so. Why do other units need individual orders, if they already belong to a Formation? Thanks in advance, and please excuse my broken English, Lorenzo.

I'll give this one a try: 1. You should assign an initial objective to each platoon leader, the X0 unit, in the deploy phase. All units in the platoon will then be free to move towards this objective without needing orders. To change a units objective. Look for the Red Flag on the right side of the screen or use the ";" key. First highlight the unit for whose objective you wish to change. Click the Red Flag or use the ";" key and choose a new objective. You must have 3 orders to do this. If you do not have the orders, the Red Flag will be greyed out. Units must then be in Advance mode to move. If in Defend stance, no movement is permitted. 2. I have no answer for this except that it is the default setting. It is a starting hex number just to fill a value for the computer I would guess. 3. Movement waypoints are used mainly by scenarios designers to get computer controlled units to travel a certain path. You may use them by changing the unit to Computer Contolled, clicking the Waypoint button and setting paths on the map for the unit to move to. The computer will then move the unit, to each waypoint you have set for it. 4. Greyhounds are recon units and all recon units move free of the orders restrictions. All units of the same formation may move freely towards the objective set for the unit leader. There are limits to how much free movement each unit may travel. When you click on a unit that has an objective, the hexes that are highlighted are the limit of free travel. Some units are capable of going farther than allowed for free, and this will cost orders to do so. Hope this has helped. My thanks to Gurney Halleck for helping me with command control. CJ

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Post #: 3

- 1/21/2001 9:20:00 AM

Lorenzo

Posts: 26
Joined: 6/13/2000
From: Italy
Status: offline

Thanks to you both. I am going to try your advice and see what comes out... :-)

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Post #: 4

- 1/21/2001 6:48:00 PM

Reg

Posts: 2787
Joined: 5/26/2000
From: NSW, Australia
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Very good summary Captn_Jack but I would like to add a subtle addition. All your units within a formation must be in contact (either direct contact - within 3 hexes or by radio if equipped with one) for new orders to be passed down the command chain. For example a platoon of infantry (without radios) are all adjacent to the command squad (for example 'B0'). B0 sets the objective flag to hex 22,33. All squads have 22,33 setas their objective hex. Off every one goes but B3 moves more that 3 hexes away from B0. B0 decides that the platoon is now required more urgently at 18,11. He expends the 3 orders and the objective for B0, B1, and B2 is now 18,11. But B3 is still heading for 22,33 because he was out of contact when the objective was changed!!!! Being out of contact means B3 has no orders and he needs one order to move in a direction away from his last objective (22,33)!!! The only way to get B3 back on track to the correct objective is to get him back in contact when the new objective will be passed on. This can be done by sending B0 (or A0) after them and getting within 3 hexes of B3 (or re-establishing radio contact if equipped). With this in mind, it is very important to keep your formations in contact (as in real life)!!!! Reg. [This message has been edited by Reg (edited January 22, 2001).]

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Post #: 5

- 1/21/2001 7:09:00 PM

Lorenzo

Posts: 26
Joined: 6/13/2000
From: Italy
Status: offline

Thanks for your specification. Is radio contact (and the eventual loss of it) compleately randomized, i.e. managed by the computer, or is there anything I can do about it? Unfortunately, the manual seems to be the worst part of an otherwise excellent game: information is sparse and game routines inadequately explained. Probably the issue was already raised here, but that's a point that should be stressed in the eyes of the people at Matrix. I do not feel in a mood to complain in the case of a free game :-) , but I would expect better documentation from their future, commercial efforts. Cheers, Lorenzo

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Post #: 6

- 1/21/2001 9:55:00 PM

Lorenzo

Posts: 26
Joined: 6/13/2000
From: Italy
Status: offline

One last question. I've been trying to apply your advice and everything has worked out nicely, but I still can't understand what is the "set up" or "deploy" phase you mentioned. There is no available option other that 'Start' after I select a scenario. Or perhaps you mean that I should enter the Editor, load the scenario I am interested into playing, deploy my formations and assign them new objectives, sace it & load the saved file from start? As always, lots of thanks to anybody who'll take the pain of answering my piteous pleas... :-) Maybe I am too much of a 'grognard', but I find the game a bit simplistic with the C&C option toggled off. Cheers, Lorenzo

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Post #: 7

- 1/21/2001 10:24:00 PM

Arralen

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Joined: 5/21/2000
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quote:

Originally posted by Lorenzo: ... but I still can't understand what is the "set up" or "deploy" phase you mentioned. There is no available option other that 'Start' after I select a scenario.

That's correct - scenarios don't have a setup phase .. the scenario designer has done that for you. So if you find objectives not set at all for all units, the scenario is most likely to be played with C&C OFF

You could still assign objectives before actually moving the units within the first turn (and of course anytime thereafter), and that's what I usually do. But be warned - this makes scenarios much harder, as you may have to re-set the objectives as soon as you meet the enemy (where you didn't thought him to be, as ever

); if your commanders ("..0" -units) haven't build up enough command points during that few turns, you're troops may be in trouble; Likewise the calling of Arty is much more difficult, as it uses command points as well. A "Setup" or "deploy" phase you'll have when playing generated battles/campaigns, where you'll have to buy units by our own - ad of course have to set them up for battle as well .. thus "setup phase". Setting of objectives and pre-battle bombardments are free of command point costs here, so think well before proceeding to the actual battle

Hope this helps. Uups, forgot about the radio. Radio contact is calculated by the game engine, and there's no way you could do something about this - besides maybe that units with higher experience are said to have a higher chance to handle their radios correctly .. but I'm not shure if this really have any impact. For short - units will be "out of radio" at the very same moment you'll have to give them new orders most desperatly .. but that's only the "reality factor" build into the game

Arralen [This message has been edited by Arralen (edited January 21, 2001).]

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Post #: 8

- 1/22/2001 2:21:00 AM

Captn_Jack

Posts: 62
Joined: 10/4/2000
From: Reedsville, WV, USA
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That was a good point I overlooked on the radios Reg. I myself have only ever played one "real" game vs a human using command control and survived. But was taught a good lesson on countering flanking moves. Especially when it takes 3 orders to change the objective and you have none. ;-) Again, my thanks To Gurney Halleck who "held my hand" through the process and explained it very well to me. CJ

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Post #: 9

- 1/22/2001 4:46:00 PM

Reg

Posts: 2787
Joined: 5/26/2000
From: NSW, Australia
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It can't be overstated the affect C&C can have on a game. I had a PBEM game recently where I was totally immobilised. My A0 unit was dead (how was I to know a B-26 was going to unload all those 500lb bombs on that hex - especially one that I had just moved to??) and all my command squads were under a terrific artillery bombardment. If you read your manual you will notice that suppressed leaders do not generate new orders quickly. The few orders I did generate were used to direct defensive mortar fire to break up his attacks. This left me with no orders what so ever to maneuver my forces, especially since I had put them in the defence stance before the bombardment started. I was totally pinned and couldn't move a single unit!!!! Thank goodness I was in a strong defensive position. My only relief came after he shifted his bombardment fire, as my leaders became unsuppressed and started generating orders again (after cautiously emerging from their makeshift hiding places in the cratered and smoking landscape). God, I love this game Reg.

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Cheers,
Reg.

(One day I will learn to spell - or check before posting....)
Uh oh, Firefox has a spell checker!! What excuse can I use now!!!

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Post #: 10

- 1/23/2001 3:59:00 AM

Lorenzo

Posts: 26
Joined: 6/13/2000
From: Italy
Status: offline

If a command unit (platoon or field leader) is destroyed, are its command capabilities (especially in concern with generating orders) shifted to a next-in-chain-of-command, or are they destroyed altogheter? For the rest, this last night I tried to play the tutorial with the C&C option toggled on, and it worked out royally. Of course I won - I don't think anybody can lose that match playing the yankees, but I mean that the I now feel to have acquired a degree of control over the system, and to be able to progress toward more challenging scenarios. This game seems to be a real challenge: not as realistic and complex as Tigers On the Prawls from HPS, but certainly much faster and playable without being simplistic. My wife is enthusiastic over the gorgeous graphics and we're going to start our third game soon. I am looking after the oncoming Matrix games with a new eye... Lorenzo

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Post #: 11

- 1/23/2001 4:36:00 AM

Wild Bill

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Joined: 4/7/2000
From: Smyrna, Ga, 30080
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Don Llewellyn has a project of a series of tutorials, with some very talented SPWAW gamers, one of which will deal with just this theme, command and control. This will be a real help for those trying to get a grip on how it works and what it will mean in fighting a battle...WB ------------------ In Arduis Fidelis Wild Bill Wilder Coordinator, Scenario Design Matrix Games

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