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Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 12:34:56 AM   
Krupinski


Posts: 365
Joined: 8/28/2010
Status: offline 		Did someone master the "Monster Tutorial" as german?

It's nearly impossible! Any tips on that? Thx!
Post #: 1
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 9:18:15 AM   
major.pain

 

Posts: 179
Joined: 3/27/2012
Status: offline 		Its a tough one. I fail at that. I have it on good authority that this is one of the more difficult scenarios to win as the germans against the AI, putting it in as one of the tutorials is a bit sick.
I skipped over that one to the "General Petrov" scenario, theres only so many back to back defeats i can cope with

(in reply to Krupinski)
Post #: 2
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 2:00:30 PM   
robc04_1

 

Posts: 146
Joined: 1/15/2012
Status: offline 		The tutorials definitely aren't a cakewalk like in many games. I won the other two - the first in 1 try, the second in 2. I tried the third a couple times and failed, but I have an idea how to succeed. I just need to pull it off.

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Post #: 3
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 2:19:54 PM   
Bison36

 

Posts: 480
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline 		My dice hate me is what I've discovered during the dozen or so attempts to beat it. And it doesn't matter if I'm the Germans or Soviets. When the die is cast, it often comes up low. Very, very low.

(in reply to robc04_1)
Post #: 4
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 2:34:11 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		Give it a try on "Easy" if you're having too much trouble on "Normal". We're going to make sure all the tutorials are set to "Easy" in the next update as well.

Regards,

- Erik

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(in reply to Bison36)
Post #: 5
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 2:45:12 PM   
tgb

 

Posts: 766
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline 		I want to go back and tackle it again now that I have a better grasp of the game.

(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 6
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 4:10:24 PM   
robc04_1

 

Posts: 146
Joined: 1/15/2012
Status: offline 		Holy cow. I saw something that I wasn't aware of in my prior play of the this one. I've got a couple ideas but I can't say I'm feeling confident about them.

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Post #: 7
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 4:15:40 PM   
RockKahn

 

Posts: 165
Joined: 10/27/2011
From: USA
Status: offline 		I lost Monsters twice playing normal. Then I switched to easy and won the second game on Easy. I'm going go back to Normal to try the strategy used to win on Easy.

(in reply to robc04_1)
Post #: 8
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 4:18:56 PM   
stormbringer3

 

Posts: 875
Joined: 7/26/2007
From: Staunton, Va.
Status: offline 		I know what you mean about the dice rolls. The amount of low rolls seems to be statistically high. I certainly don't want to dumb down the game by skewing the dice toward high rolls, all I would hope is that the rolls are completely statistically accurate. Maybe we just have a lot of bad luck stored up for use in this game's dice rolls.

(in reply to tgb)
Post #: 9
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 4:21:45 PM   
tgb

 

Posts: 766
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline 		I don't know - for every miss I've gotten with 70% probability to hit, I've also hit with 16% probability.

(in reply to stormbringer3)
Post #: 10
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 4:40:20 PM   
Lebatron


Posts: 2166
Joined: 5/30/2005
From: Upper Michigan
Status: offline 		Speaking of dice rolls. It seems like 50% of the time I roll a 4. I wish there was a statistics page for game conclusion that showed the total dice rolls for each sum, and then a final overall average. I need to know if 4 is coming up way more often than it should:)

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Post #: 11
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 5:25:35 PM   
stormbringer3

 

Posts: 875
Joined: 7/26/2007
From: Staunton, Va.
Status: offline 		I see the 4 a lot too.

(in reply to Lebatron)
Post #: 12
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 5:47:18 PM   
danlongman

 

Posts: 586
Joined: 3/27/2012
From: Over the hills and far away
Status: offline 		Maybe record it. But you know your chances of rolling 4 are the same every time you roll.
It seems intuitively wrong, especially when you are losing, but it is the same. At the real life Battle of Midway the USN rolled "Boxcars" (or "snake eyes"- whatever) four times in a row.
The old infinite number of monkeys on an infinite number of typewriters..... here is proof:
"Call me Ishmael, but don't call me late for dinner. Azm%$wqp][" - a thousand monkeys on a thousand typewriters for one year.
cheers

(in reply to stormbringer3)
Post #: 13
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/12/2012 10:35:45 PM   
Lebatron


Posts: 2166
Joined: 5/30/2005
From: Upper Michigan
Status: offline 		I know, but I still want a complete log of the entire games dice rolls so I can see just where my and my opponents average was. Other MP games do so, I would like to see that included here as well.

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Post #: 14
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 3:59:45 AM   
JFalk68


Posts: 223
Joined: 11/5/2007
Status: offline 		So has anyone figured out a solid strategy for this scenario?

I have tried grouping tanks, smoke to blind them, tried placing my AT guns together in a group and I am getting massacred by the Soviets. With 5 turns you really can't go on the defensive.

Oh, the dice hate me and the Soviets always get better cards lol :)

Tired of losing my Pz IIIe's to T-26b's haha, that 45mm gun is killing me!

(in reply to Lebatron)
Post #: 15
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 4:03:52 AM   
Bison36

 

Posts: 480
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline 		I'm going to beat this scenario someday, but it's quickly becoming the single most difficult wargame scenario I've ever played.

(in reply to JFalk68)
Post #: 16
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 4:07:54 AM   
JFalk68


Posts: 223
Joined: 11/5/2007
Status: offline 		I agree Bison, I recall I had a tough tutorial scenario with HPS' Red Victory, but this by far is the toughest. T-34's arent even needed, I am pretty much ineffective as a fighting force at that point.

(in reply to Bison36)
Post #: 17
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 4:59:53 AM   
Lebatron


Posts: 2166
Joined: 5/30/2005
From: Upper Michigan
Status: offline 		One small error in Monsters that can have a big impact on balance is the initiative. It's supposed to be the Germans that start so that they can do a smoke round or whatever first thing. Instead in the PC version the starting force is random. This should be fixed.

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Development team- GG's WAW A World Divided

(in reply to JFalk68)
Post #: 18
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 6:36:00 AM   
stormbringer3

 

Posts: 875
Joined: 7/26/2007
From: Staunton, Va.
Status: offline 		It took me about two days to beat the scenario. I use my 1st two turns to lay smoke and protect my PzIIIe units. Once they are obscured the AI always moves a T-26 forward. I let it advance close enough so I can easily take it out. I move the left flank forward and add the Pz IIIe units to that advance also. The anti-tank guns move forward and bear toward the right using the light woods. I leave as little as possible to hold the right and focus most of my forces to the left. I use my best units to take the objectives in the center and I send two units along the left side to take the rear objectives. If I lose one of the PzIIIe units right away I hit the restart button. I'm sure that there are other ways to win this scenario. I hope this helps.

(in reply to Lebatron)
Post #: 19
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 6:50:57 AM   
JFalk68


Posts: 223
Joined: 11/5/2007
Status: offline 		I don't care for scenarios where your fate is decided on the luck of the dice (like losing a PzIIIe first turn). There should be enough room in the scenario to have some bad dice rolls but still prevail if you had good tactical sense. If the only way to win the scenario is to roll well and the Soviets to roll poorly I don't consider that mastering the scenario.

I'm still reserving judgement on this scenario, I can give it some leeway since its a training scenario and war is meant to be hell. Monsters is the
kobayashi maru of Conflict of Heroes :)

quote:

ORIGINAL: stormbringer3

It took me about two days to beat the scenario. I use my 1st two turns to lay smoke and protect my PzIIIe units. Once they are obscured the AI always moves a T-26 forward. I let it advance close enough so I can easily take it out. I move the left flank forward and add the Pz IIIe units to that advance also. The anti-tank guns move forward and bear toward the right using the light woods. I leave as little as possible to hold the right and focus most of my forces to the left. I use my best units to take the objectives in the center and I send two units along the left side to take the rear objectives. If I lose one of the PzIIIe units right away I hit the restart button. I'm sure that there are other ways to win this scenario. I hope this helps.


(in reply to stormbringer3)
Post #: 20
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 4:29:08 PM   
blastpop


Posts: 395
Joined: 11/27/2005
From: Connecticut
Status: offline 		It is a tough scenario in the boardgame version. Yet, despite the perceived difficulty for the German, there is something classic about the scenario. It is more puzzle like in the computer version based on what I hear (yet to download) maybe since it can be setup played and picked up (saved) quicker so it gets more plays.

Regardless, I like difficult challenges so I am looking forward to this scenario once I purchase it.

< Message edited by blastpop -- 5/17/2012 4:30:29 PM >

(in reply to JFalk68)
Post #: 21
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 6:54:00 PM   
JFalk68


Posts: 223
Joined: 11/5/2007
Status: offline 		I haven't cracked it yet but I found some success grouping or platooning my tanks. I got 4 of them grouped and I started to roll up the left side of the map and was able to take out 3 of the Soviets armor pieces. Of course I suffered heavy losses and was destroyed but I did better then the last 27 times!

(in reply to blastpop)
Post #: 22
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 7:06:03 PM   
stormbringer3

 

Posts: 875
Joined: 7/26/2007
From: Staunton, Va.
Status: offline 		Be sure to use group firing when you are battling for the center objectives. You need the dice roll bonus.

(in reply to JFalk68)
Post #: 23
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/17/2012 8:49:05 PM   
Bison36

 

Posts: 480
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline 		The hardest part of the scenario is that the German units are so spread out that it's a struggle to group and smoke screen an advance or defense before the Soviets on the high ground begin to systematically destroy you.

(in reply to stormbringer3)
Post #: 24
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/18/2012 1:39:38 AM   
jomni


Posts: 2827
Joined: 11/19/2007
Status: offline 		I still haven't won The Gap as the Germans.  Grrrr.

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Post #: 25
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/18/2012 7:33:21 AM   
VALENT PHILIPPE

 

Posts: 113
Joined: 7/11/2003
From: france
Status: offline 		i have a problem

quote:

and the Soviets always get better cards lol :)

a friend who plays this game says that the IA play better than the player: the odds are for the IA in the same conditions!!

the game is not good balenced (equilibré in french)bad IA too hard

Cyberstratege forum:
." Il y a juste quelques moments, ou scénarios peut-être, plus frustrants que d'autres."
"Je suis un peu sceptique sur l'IA, qui parfois tire trop bien, mieux que ce que mes unités me semblent pouvoir faire (dans des conditions similaires, distance, etc...)."
Sorry its a little bit difficult to traduce in english it was so bad lol
a great player this one

< Message edited by VALENT PHILIPPE -- 5/18/2012 7:34:25 AM >

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Post #: 26
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/18/2012 3:30:40 PM   
Krupinski


Posts: 365
Joined: 8/28/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: stormbringer3

It took me about two days to beat the scenario. I use my 1st two turns to lay smoke and protect my PzIIIe units. Once they are obscured the AI always moves a T-26 forward. I let it advance close enough so I can easily take it out. I move the left flank forward and add the Pz IIIe units to that advance also. The anti-tank guns move forward and bear toward the right using the light woods. I leave as little as possible to hold the right and focus most of my forces to the left. I use my best units to take the objectives in the center and I send two units along the left side to take the rear objectives. If I lose one of the PzIIIe units right away I hit the restart button. I'm sure that there are other ways to win this scenario. I hope this helps.


Tried different approaches about 100 times. No one worked. I dont believe that its possible to win. sorry. but without proof i cant believe it.

< Message edited by hafer -- 5/18/2012 3:31:30 PM >

(in reply to stormbringer3)
Post #: 27
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/19/2012 11:30:13 AM   
kvob

 

Posts: 99
Joined: 5/19/2002
Status: offline 		Well, after being trounced for the umpteenth time in this scenario, I'm glad I dropped by here. At least I know now that I'm not alone.

I've tried everything I can think of but still no luck. The German starting position appears very poor with most lines being impossible shots. I've tried smoke whilst trying to manouver into better positions but, because the turn system alternates between players, I move one tank and, next thing I know, another has just been taken out.

Frankly, I'm very close to throwing the PC out the window.

(in reply to Krupinski)
Post #: 28
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/19/2012 1:57:40 PM   
Blind Sniper


Posts: 863
Joined: 8/9/2008
From: Turin, Italy
Status: offline 		Surely is very difficult, moreover if the Russian win the initiative and get some lucky roll the game is already lost in the first turn.
Against a human opponet this Firefight is unbalanced.

In the original boardgame the German has the initiative in the first turn and a Pz38t.


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Post #: 29
RE: Monster Tutorial - 5/19/2012 4:16:23 PM   
stormbringer3

 

Posts: 875
Joined: 7/26/2007
From: Staunton, Va.
Status: offline 		Here's a couple of things that helped me finally win. The taking of the rear objective on the right has to be timed just perfectly. If you take it too soon, the last T-34 will turn and retake it. If you time it just right, it will turn to retake the hex removing it from the fight in the center, but it won't have enough turns to retake the objective. It will fall just short. Also put a PzII in the woods on the right of the center objectives. When the 1st T-34 moves adjacent, move your PzII away toward your lines and right. Most of the time the T-34 will chase and you keep moving away, keeping your unit alive as long as possible. As the T-34 turns to chase it will turn toward the right exposing it's flank and rear to your PzIIIs. If possible go for the kill. If you get the kill then you only have the middle T-34 to contend with and it doesn't matter how many units you lose as long as you keep it from retaking one of the objective hexes.
I hope this helps.

(in reply to Blind Sniper)
Post #: 30
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