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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Norm Koger's The Operational Art Of War III >> Artillery and Aircraft

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Artillery and Aircraft - 8/19/2012 12:29:51 AM

Metalist

Posts: 28
Joined: 4/6/2012
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Hey guys,
I find that artilley units can automatically support their cooperative units in combart, unless the artillery is mobile. I was manually ordering allllllll my artillery units to bombard the enemy units before knowing that. However, i still need some answers before trying to beat the Poles again:
1) Since my artillery should not be in mobile deployment, which deployment suits them best? Tactical or local reserve?
2) When should i control my artillery directly? Is it ok to leave them on their own all the time?
3) Something unrelated, what about aircraft? For example, should fighters' mission be Air Superiorty, while Tactical Bombers have Interdiction and Stukas Combat Support?

I guess i am finally having some idea about the game. Tomorrow i will start reading On War by Carl von Clausewitz and after that i will read Indirect Approach by Liddel Hart. Being an "Armchair General" is my ultimate goal at the moment. Do you have any other books to suggest? They should be popular though, in Turkey military is not something that has academic value therefore not popular. Only books that are very popular like i told above can be find in Turkish. And i don't like to read in PDF.

Thanks in advance.

Post #: 1

RE: Artillery and Aircraft - 8/19/2012 12:46:03 AM

Menschenfresser

Posts: 252
Joined: 3/26/2004
From: United States
Status: offline

You'll want to check the manual on artillery bombardment. IIRC, it used to be, prior to TOAW3, units bombarding automatically because of being in LR, TR, or Dug In, did so at 50% their strength. If you set up a bombardment manually, it was at full strength.

I believe it has changed.

Now I think those bombarding automatically because of reserve settings do so according to how much equipment is involved in the direct attack. I'm not sure of this. Check the manual (or the Toaw3 change log), or someone far more knowledgeable than me will jump in.

_____________________________

Make wargames, not war.

(in reply to Metalist)

Post #: 2

RE: Artillery and Aircraft - 8/19/2012 3:38:56 AM

Curtis Lemay

Posts: 12969
Joined: 9/17/2004
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Metalist

Hey guys,
I find that artilley units can automatically support their cooperative units in combart, unless the artillery is mobile. I was manually ordering allllllll my artillery units to bombard the enemy units before knowing that. However, i still need some answers before trying to beat the Poles again:
1) Since my artillery should not be in mobile deployment, which deployment suits them best? Tactical or local reserve?

Tactical Reserve allows artillery to support attacks and defenses, and it won't advance them into the arms of the enemy during his turn - unlike Local Reserve, which can. So Tactical Reserve is preferable to Local Reserve for artillery. But don't forget digging in, as well - but save that for the end of the turn. It supports just like Tactical Reserve but adds defensive strength.

quote:

2) When should i control my artillery directly? Is it ok to leave them on their own all the time?

I'm not sure what you mean.

If you mean bombarding separately vs. supporting attacks, note that in support, artillery's strength is significantly increased vs. bombarding alone (provided the Assault Ratio test is passed). Furthermore, bombards are subject to counterbattery if the target hex contains artillery itself. Nevertheless, there are circumstances where bombardment can be a good deal - especially if your opponent has overstacked a location with infantry or other soft targets.

If you mean directly assigning to a specific attack vs. leaving them to support cooperative attacks, that depends upon the circumstances. If there are a lot of cooperative attacks in the vicinity, unassigned artillery may have greater impact than assigned. But assigned artillery attacks at full strength (and consumes full supply for that one attack), while unassigned cooperative artillery supports at half strength (and consumes half supply each time it supports).

quote:

3) Something unrelated, what about aircraft? For example, should fighters' mission be Air Superiorty, while Tactical Bombers have Interdiction and Stukas Combat Support?

That really depends upon the situation. Do you have air superiority or does your opponent? If your opponent does, your bombers may have to lay low. Dive bombers (like Stukas) may need to be held in reserve to deal with naval units if that is an enemy strength.

< Message edited by Curtis Lemay -- 8/19/2012 3:50:47 AM >

(in reply to Metalist)

Post #: 3

RE: Artillery and Aircraft - 8/19/2012 3:44:06 AM

Curtis Lemay

Posts: 12969
Joined: 9/17/2004
From: Houston, TX
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Menschenfresser

You'll want to check the manual on artillery bombardment. IIRC, it used to be, prior to TOAW3, units bombarding automatically because of being in LR, TR, or Dug In, did so at 50% their strength. If you set up a bombardment manually, it was at full strength.

Still correct. But note that they could support as many cooperative attacks as were in range, and pay half supply for each. Direct assigned only support that one attack, but at full strength and full supply cost.

quote:

I believe it has changed.

Nope.

quote:

Now I think those bombarding automatically because of reserve settings do so according to how much equipment is involved in the direct attack. I'm not sure of this. Check the manual (or the Toaw3 change log), or someone far more knowledgeable than me will jump in.

You're confusing the rule about adjacent artillery. Adjacent artillery ordered to attack will bombard if half or more of its equipment is ranged. Less and it will assault.

(in reply to Menschenfresser)

Post #: 4

RE: Artillery and Aircraft - 8/19/2012 4:06:51 AM

sPzAbt653

Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline

quote:

When should i control my artillery directly?

Your questions will have different answers depending on scenario and situation. The more you play a scneario, the better you will get at figuring out how to best handle your units. But for some general info :

If on the offense you have plenty of artillery and your opponent is not to strong, I like to put most or all of the artillery in Tactical Reserve. That way it will lob some shells at all combats within range (if cooperative, another subject). This way, if you are advancing you can move your artillery to keep it in range, then hit 'T' on the keyboard for each unit as you end its move and it will continue to support and not affect the rounds burned.

If you are facing a strong defense, its better to directly assign artillery to support attacks, but this way moving the units to keep them in range will have effect on rounds used, so it takes more planning.

If on defense, dig in the artillery, but you may need to keep one or more artillery units in mobile status so that they are left out of combats. This because if the opponent is making a lot of attacks, your artillery in support will quickly run low on supply and effectiveness.

(in reply to Metalist)

Post #: 5

RE: Artillery and Aircraft - 8/19/2012 2:07:17 PM

Metalist

Posts: 28
Joined: 4/6/2012
Status: offline

Thanks guys, you answered my questions perfectly

(in reply to sPzAbt653)

Post #: 6

RE: Artillery and Aircraft - 1/23/2013 2:57:39 AM

murphstein

Posts: 26
Joined: 8/3/2006
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A follow-up newbie question on this topic -- is there any way to tell from the combat reports (screen or Sit-Rep txt file) whether the supporting arty was assigned to the combat or "just" contributing in TR or dug-in mode? I'm trying to figure out how Elmer-as-Axis gets so many rounds AND such good early results in Autumn Fog... ;-)

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Dan Murphy

(in reply to Metalist)

Post #: 7

RE: Artillery and Aircraft - 1/23/2013 5:25:13 AM

sPzAbt653

Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/3/2007
From: east coast, usa
Status: offline

quote:

is there any way to tell from the combat reports (screen or Sit-Rep txt file) whether the supporting arty was assigned to the combat or "just" contributing

I don't recall if this is written anywhere, but I seem to think that artillery assigned directly will be reported as 'Unit X Bombards' while artillery set to Tactical or Dug-in will be reported as 'Unit X Supports'.

quote:

I'm trying to figure out how Elmer-as-Axis gets so many rounds AND such good early results in Autumn Fog

Elmer cheats

, plus he is very good at optimizing combat rounds. Also, in Autumn Fog the Axis has built-in advantages for the early turns.

(in reply to murphstein)

Post #: 8

RE: Artillery and Aircraft - 1/24/2013 5:57:10 PM

murphstein

Posts: 26
Joined: 8/3/2006
Status: offline

OK, arty units directly assigned to an attack (full strength, full supply cost) shows up as "attacks" in both the .txt SitRep file and combat results dialog window.

Supporting units (half strength, half supply) show up in both places as "supports the attack".

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Dan Murphy

(in reply to sPzAbt653)

Post #: 9