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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Back from London

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RE: Back from London - 10/25/2012 8:33:50 PM

Capt. Harlock

Posts: 5358
Joined: 9/15/2001
From: Los Angeles
Status: offline

quote:

My BBs bombarded (we managed to sweep all his mines in the last 2 months)

On the one hand, this was a good move -- I'm a BB bombardment fanboy.

On the other hand, this is a significant game weakness: there should have been major CD fire from Corregidor.

_____________________________

Civil war? What does that mean? Is there any foreign war? Isn't every war fought between men, between brothers?

--Victor Hugo

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 1081

RE: Back from London - 10/25/2012 8:39:27 PM

crsutton

Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

I see. Well, your game will help me to understand what happens when the Allies have control of the IO and West Oz bases to use in late 42 then!

Yes, you should be fine in Manila. It's just frustrating when you get a positive result but your casualties are greater.

Oh, i'm pretty sure that the west will be a main playing ground in this game. Java, Sumatra and Timor will need a lot of attention. I will need to study a good defensive plan for this whole area...cause we all know that if he puts a foot here and so gets close enough to the SRA oilfields...game over for Japan well before 1945!!!!

So i think i'll have to defend a little bit less in the pacific and concentrate more in the SRA... but it will be fun, no matter what!

Japan absolutely has to have a "fat" garrison on Siboret Island. If the Allies take it and build it up to a level 9 airfield, then you can say goodby to your DEI oil supply. He won't have to take a single oil producing base. But just base HB there. Sabang is also key and demands a stiff garrison early. The problem is as always that the Allies will have other options, no matter what you garrison.

It is much better to let him advance in Burma than to let him end run and take Sabang. Ask Viperpol.....

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 1082

RE: Back from London - 10/25/2012 8:40:05 PM

JocMeister

Posts: 8262
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
Status: offline

Well,

I think we are going to have to agree on disagreeing!

Q-ball is going to rebase all his subs to Cocos. That alone will give his subs what? 2-3 weeks longer time in the area before they have to return to replenish. Per sub.

He is going to use Cocos as a stepping stone to get in the SRA and bypass everything else. Just speculation but time will tell if I was right or not. But I�m convinced GJ before 43 is over is going to think a lot of times that he should have taken care of Cocos when he had the chance!

quote:

ORIGINAL: princep01

Ser Greyjoy, as much as�I respect Joc,�I totally disagree with him about Cocos Is.� Why all the focus on and fuss about�it?� It is just not worth the risk of losses or the resources expended to take a place of such�minimal value.

Answer this.� If the Allies do hold it, what do they do from there that they could not do by grabbing an island off Sumatra or coming in on a cloud of CVs.� That is, what is the risk to you of the Allies retaining it?� It is easy for the Allies to�retake if you grab it.� Good practice at low risk for them.�Worse, it�is just another exposed outpost you have to defend�(and you can't really defend it successfully).� Why bother?� The cost-benefit is just not there.

But, what�taking it�really is is another good example of Japanese overextension.� Overextension�seldom leads to anything good and frequently enough leads to having your Little Yellow Bastard head handed to you.� I would avoid the place like the plague at this point as it is certain to be well defended.�

Spend those resources on completing your STRATEGIC conquests, developing new toys�and building your defensive�lines (yes, lines, as in�defensive lines in depth).� Cocos is a diversion of the worst sort.� Don't go there.��

(in reply to princep01)

Post #: 1083

RE: Back from London - 10/25/2012 9:59:46 PM

BBfanboy

Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

It seems to come down to Cocos Is. being important if both sides think it is, and being unimportant if both side think so. I think either side can gain some use from having it, but I'm not convinced it is essential. It will be interesting to watch the situation play out and see what role Cocos plays ...

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to JocMeister)

Post #: 1084

RE: Back from London - 10/25/2012 10:54:39 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

Guys, it seems that opinions different a lot about Cocos... i took my decision long time ago, when i was getting way behind the scheldue in DEI... now it would be too late anyway!

We'll see what Brad will do with it in his hands... however i don't think that holding Cocos or Exmouth as a sub base can make much of a difference...

Siberoet and Sebang eh? I know...Padang too!... i'm trying to figure out what can i base there. My idea is to have, by the end of the year, at least 300 AVs behind decent forts in all those bases and keep a reserve (2 divisions at least) that can be moved there very fast if the enemy arrives...

But,as you know, Japan CANNOT simply garrison everything....too many islands...too many possible sensible targets.... you have to choose.

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Jul 27, 42

We crossed the river at Tienshui... but it didn't go as planned... 16k out of 60k of my men didn't move and their movement was reset to 0

...however, even if we achieve a 1-3 and lots of disablement, the enemy is cut from any supply path (see map) and now with 2 different bridgeheads we can slowly maul him and eventually dislodge!

Patience...i need patience....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Tienshui (81,38)

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 38585 troops, 343 guns, 100 vehicles, Assault Value = 1201

Defending force 51240 troops, 390 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1404

Japanese adjusted assault: 755

Allied adjusted defense: 2746

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 3 (fort level 1)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker: shock(+), disruption(-)

Japanese ground losses:
4299 casualties reported
Squads: 13 destroyed, 389 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 17 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 28 disabled
Guns lost 26 (1 destroyed, 25 disabled)
Vehicles lost 17 (2 destroyed, 15 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
899 casualties reported
Squads: 5 destroyed, 76 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 32 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 8 disabled

Assaulting units:
35th Division
27th Division
41st Division
Botanko Hvy Gun Regiment
Mongol Garrison Army
5th Medium Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
80th Chinese Corps
2nd Chinese Cavalry Corps
14th Chinese Corps
76th Chinese Corps
92nd Chinese Corps
12th Chinese Corps
89th Chinese Corps
3rd Chinese Cavalry Corps
38th Chinese Corps
1st Construction Regiment
85th Chinese Corps
4th Group Army
14th Group Army
57th AT Gun Regiment

Attachment (1)

(in reply to BBfanboy)

Post #: 1085

RE: Back from London - 10/25/2012 10:55:45 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Capt. Harlock

quote:

My BBs bombarded (we managed to sweep all his mines in the last 2 months)

On the one hand, this was a good move -- I'm a BB bombardment fanboy.

On the other hand, this is a significant game weakness: there should have been major CD fire from Corregidor.

Manila is at zero supply, that's why its CD guns didn't fire back at my minesweepers...

(in reply to Capt. Harlock)

Post #: 1086

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 7:51:59 AM

obvert

Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline

Are you using the follow option for your troops in China that were reset? It seems there are a lot of problems with that command.

_____________________________

"Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm." - Winston Churchill

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 1087

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 10:02:00 AM

JocMeister

Posts: 8262
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

We'll see what Brad will do with it in his hands... however i don't think that holding Cocos or Exmouth as a sub base can make much of a difference...

Well, counting very unscientifically and using lots of speculation it can make a big difference.

In 43 he will have something like 60-80 subs. If each one of those get 1 week (counting low) less transit time that means two more weeks per sub "in action". Counting each sub get about one shot per week off. Thats 2 more shots per sub. That would be 120 more tries per patrol batch. If you count each sub can do about 3 patrols per year that could mean 360 more potentially sunk IJN ships. About 1 more per day.

Not saying this is whats going to happen and I just drew most number out of thin air. But don�t discount the impact it could mean!

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 1088

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 11:21:11 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

We'll see what Brad will do with it in his hands... however i don't think that holding Cocos or Exmouth as a sub base can make much of a difference...

Well, counting very unscientifically and using lots of speculation it can make a big difference.

In 43 he will have something like 60-80 subs. If each one of those get 1 week (counting low) less transit time that means two more weeks per sub "in action". Counting each sub get about one shot per week off. Thats 2 more shots per sub. That would be 120 more tries per patrol batch. If you count each sub can do about 3 patrols per year that could mean 360 more potentially sunk IJN ships. About 1 more per day.

Not saying this is whats going to happen and I just drew most number out of thin air. But don�t discount the impact it could mean!

Perfectly understand Joc and i think you're right about that: the shorter the route, the more hits i'll suffer.

However the costs of taking about Cocos right now are, imho, way too many respect at the benefits i'd get.

I should have taken it when i could do it without much problems (during the amphib bonus)...but now, after months where he surely had strenghtened his defences there, Cocos may become a nightmare for me if i'd try to invade.

29.07.1942

Another slow day.

The only action took place in China where we deliberately attacked Chikkiang again. We suffered 300 disabled squads but obtained a 1-2 and forts down to 2... which is good. Slowly we'll get there!

More problems come from near Liuchow where 3 enemy corps managed to come out of the woods and cut the RR... 3 divisions weren't enough and were repulsed during the attack

... sending there 2 more divisions (the Chikkiang reserve) to solve the problem.

gathering 3 more divisions for another push south of Tienshui... i'm sure he cannot last long up there in his defensive positions.

BTW, he must be low on supplies in China...even at Chikkiang his troops suffered a (-) supply malus...

In the Gilberts a convoy bringing a SNLF is approaching Tabiutea. I have a good covering fleet so if he comes with his ships from Canton Is i'll be ready to face him

(in reply to JocMeister)

Post #: 1089

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 11:24:36 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Are you using the follow option for your troops in China that were reset? It seems there are a lot of problems with that command.

Yes..i know...but couldn't do differently... if u take a look at the DBB map with stacking limits, i was "invading" an hex with 60,000 st.limit, using two different starting hexes of 30,000 and 40,000... using two different type of roads (a trail and a secondary road) and with two army corps composed of different paced units (tanks and infantry)... i had to do that way if i wanted to coordinate.

But it doesn't matter much...the crossing was as good as it could be and now more units are flowing in...in a couple of weeks we'll be able to attack with a full 59,960 men army!

(love the stacking limit!!!!)

(in reply to obvert)

Post #: 1090

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 4:58:19 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

30 july 1942

Approaching August... the Helen KI-49 IIa is ready to come into production.
I have 2 R&D factories ready to produce them (30 and 20 size).
Considering that the IIb model isn't worth any R&D, i'm thinking of converting these two R&D factories into something else (consider i have realistic R&D ON)...probably some late war fighter R&D (thinking about KI-84b or, maybe, KI-83), while switching the 40 Sally factories and the 48 Lily factories into KI-49 IIa, while keeping, for some months at least, the big 70 KI-49 Ia factory into production (i'd like to stockpile a bit the Helen Ia for late war, when the radar will become available).
For late war ASW roles i'd like to have the KI-49 Ia, the Lorna (for short range choke points) and the G3N3.

So, the plan is to keep into production, for what concerns the IJAAF, something like 60 Ki-49 IIa and some 70 KI-49 Ia... what do you think?

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 1091

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 6:25:00 PM

SqzMyLemon

Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert

Are you using the follow option for your troops in China that were reset? It seems there are a lot of problems with that command.

Yes..i know...but couldn't do differently... if u take a look at the DBB map with stacking limits, i was "invading" an hex with 60,000 st.limit, using two different starting hexes of 30,000 and 40,000... using two different type of roads (a trail and a secondary road) and with two army corps composed of different paced units (tanks and infantry)... i had to do that way if i wanted to coordinate.

Set to march will work just fine to avoid the problems of using the follow command. Know your movement rates and you should be able to coordinate large amounts of troops easily. Artillery moves first, then infantry, then armour and HQ's. By switching from move to combat mode periodically you can get everyone to arrive simultaneously.

I've been burnt by the follow command too often. I know how to work around it now and have no problems other than enemy air interdiction on occasion.

_____________________________

Luck is the residue of design - John Milton

Don't mistake lack of talent for genius - Peter Steele (Type O Negative)

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 1092

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 6:59:22 PM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Jul 31, 42

PERATIONAL REPORT FOR Jul 31, 42

Cargo explodes during unloading of xAK Banshu Maru at Hirosaki/Aomori

Never seen this happening before!!! A ship simply exploded!!! damn! Lov this game

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

a good day for the empire! Manila fell at the very second attack! Yes!!! Now i have 3 more divisions and lot of artillery free to be used elsewhere!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Naval bombardment of Manila at 79,77

Japanese Ships
BB Ise
BB Fuso
BB Nagato
CA Suzuya
CA Mogami
CA Nachi
DD Akebono
DD Amagiri
DD Sagiri
DD Shikinami
DD Hibiki
DD Akatsuki

Allied ground losses:
1027 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 46 disabled
Non Combat: 19 destroyed, 67 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 3 disabled
Guns lost 25 (2 destroyed, 23 disabled)
Vehicles lost 5 (2 destroyed, 3 disabled)

Resources hits 2
Repair Shipyard hits 2
Manpower hits 4
Fires 868
Airbase hits 12
Airbase supply hits 10
Runway hits 63
Port hits 10
Port fuel hits 5
Port supply hits 5

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Wakkanai at 124,48

Japanese Ships
xAK Yamakisan Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
xAK Sanura Maru
PB Hirota Maru

Allied Ships
SS Sealion

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Manila (79,77)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 51216 troops, 669 guns, 315 vehicles, Assault Value = 1400

Defending force 60770 troops, 614 guns, 256 vehicles, Assault Value = 1662

Japanese adjusted assault: 1491

Allied adjusted defense: 365

Japanese assault odds: 4 to 1 (fort level 2)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Manila !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
2283 casualties reported
Squads: 7 destroyed, 188 disabled
Non Combat: 8 destroyed, 48 disabled
Engineers: 17 destroyed, 45 disabled
Guns lost 39 (1 destroyed, 38 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
73697 casualties reported
Squads: 2602 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 3056 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 157 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 736 (736 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 261 (261 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units destroyed 29

Assaulting units:
38th Division
21st Ind Engineer Regiment
23rd Nav Gd Unit
65th Brigade
16th Division
3rd Ind Engineer Regiment
6th Guards Division
8th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
1st Art.Mortar Regiment
4th Fleet
15th Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion
2nd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
3rd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
14th Army
1st Hvy.Artillery Regiment
20th Ind. Mtn Gun Battalion
2nd Mortar Battalion
1st Medium Field Artillery Regiment
9th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
2nd Ind.Art.Mortar Battalion

Defending units:
57th PS Infantry Regimental Combat Team
31st Infantry Regiment
45th PS Infantry Regimental Combat Team
91st PA Infantry Division
41st PA Infantry Division
1st PA Infantry Division
31st PA Infantry Division
71st PA Infantry Division
11th PA Infantry Division
102nd PA Infantry Division
4th Marine Regiment
21st PA Infantry Division
26th PS Cavalry Regiment
194th Tank Battalion
51st PA Infantry Division
2nd PA Constabulary Division
88th PS Field Artillery Regiment
I Philippine Corps
II Philippine Corps
200th & 515th Coast AA Regiment
Cavite USN Base Force
14th PS Engineer Regiment
Asiatic Fleet
USAFFE
Nichols Field AAF Base Force
301st Construction Battalion
Far East USAAF
Provisional GMC Grp
301st PA Field Artillery Regiment

Tomorrow we'll attack Tienshui with 59,455 men!

In CENTPAC finally we're unloading troops at Tabiutea...i cannot let him grab it for free (he's been reconning it for months now). A strong SCTF (undetected) is lingering 3 hexes north...Nells are ready at Makin and the KB is supporting the whole operation from 15 hexes north... all my mavis in the area are alerted...if his usual SCTF arrives to grab my merchants...i'll be able to ambush him

The Manila news is really a great one... i'm sending one division to Sumatra, 1 more to SOPAC and 1 to southern DEI.

I'm also changing the configuration of the Wake garrison... i'll remove the base force (which will be sent to Manus) and will use an AV for supporting the Mavis there... 2 naval guard units, a tank company and an arty unit will be sent for garrisoning duties (along with the static CD unit).

(in reply to SqzMyLemon)

Post #: 1093

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 7:10:23 PM

princep01

Posts: 943
Joined: 8/7/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

Ser, as you may know, the IJN actually lost a major fleet unit (BB Mutsu) in port when unstable cordite in the magazines went BLEWIE! Some numbnut sailor probably just had to have a smoke at the wrong time and place. It probably did the port no good either. I really like the game's ability to replicate such events as "at sea collisions", "lost, cause unknown" and "operational accidents" of the nature you just experienced. A rich detail.

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 1094

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 7:11:49 PM

Cribtop

Posts: 3890
Joined: 8/10/2008
From: Lone Star Nation
Status: offline

Banzai!

_____________________________

(in reply to GreyJoy)

Post #: 1095

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 7:28:04 PM

princep01

Posts: 943
Joined: 8/7/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

Oh yes, and the Manila victory sacks 73K POWs....treat them nicely, Ser. One does not want to see the Penquin sitting before a War Crimes Tribunal. Even when represented by that great barrister, Canoerebel, I don't think that would end well.

A thought on thwarting Allied subs. Have you ever tried creating a 4 ship ASW TF (good leader assigned) and having an important (or otherwise) merchant TF follow it to the destination port? I have been doing this in (IJN sub) infested waters and it seems to work unusually well. I have a more or less permanent ASW TF stationed at Noumea. The merchants travel with a very small or no escort toward Noumea. As they approach the port, I rendevous the two TFs about 6 hexes from the target port and then set the merchant's to follow the ASW TF into the port thru a cordon of Japanese subs. I have sent no less than 8 merchant TFs in this way. The IJN subs have engaged and been engaged by the ASW TF, but not once have the merchants or its close in escorts been engaged. I make sure the ASW TF react is set on zero so it does not wander off to engage one of the IJN subs while making that last run into the port. While in port unloading, the ASW TF remains in place (separate) but with a patrol zone of the port only and no react. Seems to work.

(in reply to princep01)

Post #: 1096

RE: Back from London - 10/26/2012 9:19:34 PM

BBfanboy

Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: princep01

Ser, as you may know, the IJN actually lost a major fleet unit (BB Mutsu) in port when unstable cordite in the magazines went BLEWIE!� Some numbnut sailor probably just had to have a smoke at the wrong time and place.� It probably did the port no good either.� I really like the game's ability to replicate such events as "at sea collisions", "lost, cause unknown"�and "operational accidents" of the nature you just experienced.� A rich detail.�

And also IRL, the US logistics base Port Chicago [close to one of the WC ports] was demolished when one of the ships being loaded blew up, causing a chain reaction among other ships and ammo on shore waiting for loading. Seems the officers were driving the black enlisted men hard to exceed the already high targets for tonnage loaded and ignored their fatigue and failure to follow safety procedures.

I saw video of troops rolling 500 lb bombs down a wooden ramp onto a lighter for transfer to a merchant ship. I know the bombs aren't supposed to go off without the detonator, but explosives are inherently unstable and you can only thump bombs together so hard before they go off. Someone probably moved too slow to "catch" his 500 pounder ...
I think the death toll was in the thousands - the surviving black enlisted men mutineed until they got proper training, handling equipment and freedom from loading "competitions".

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to princep01)

Post #: 1097

RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 8:32:40 AM

GreyJoy

Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: princep01

Oh yes, and the Manila victory sacks 73K POWs....treat them nicely, Ser.� One does not want to see the Penquin sitting before a War Crimes Tribunal.� Even when represented by that great barrister, Canoerebel, I don't think that would�end well.

A thought on thwarting Allied�subs.� Have you ever tried�creating a 4 ship ASW TF (good leader assigned)�and having an important (or otherwise) merchant TF follow it to the destination port?� I have been doing this in (IJN sub) infested waters and it seems to work unusually well.� I have a more or less permanent ASW TF stationed at Noumea.� The merchants travel with a very small or no escort toward Noumea.� As they approach the port, I rendevous the two TFs about�6 hexes from the target port�and then�set the merchant's to�follow the ASW TF into the port thru a cordon of Japanese subs.� I have sent no less than 8 merchant TFs in this way.� The IJN subs have engaged and been engaged by the ASW TF, but not once have the merchants or its close in escorts been engaged.� I make sure the ASW TF react is set on zero so it does not wander off to engage one of the IJN subs while making that last run into the port.� While in port unloading, the ASW TF remains in place (separate) but with a patrol zone of the port only and no react. Seems to work.

My Master...yes, i'm trying everything. I used to do that (a leading ASW TF followed up by transport TFs) but with the japs it doesn't work well... Consider that in this mod the jap ASW capabilities have been really nerfed (which is a good thing!)...now even in shallow waters you're lucky if a DD (so with high exp) makes a couple of light hits on a sub and doesn't get sunk in return

However, now that we are in the second half of 1942 i think i'll try to slowly change my convoys asset once again.
As Obvert has stated in his AAR, the superior escorts (say DDs and Es) don't do well when embedded with a convoy...better to use them as you suggest!

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Aug 01, 42

some good news from China finally??

The ordered attack at Tienshui went better than expected. The chinese army must be suffering of a very severe supply shortage... we achieved a 1-1 and now forts are down to zero... a couple of days of rest and we should be able to get the place!

Ground combat at Tienshui (81,38)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 50407 troops, 508 guns, 276 vehicles, Assault Value = 1447

Defending force 50418 troops, 387 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1337

Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 0

Japanese adjusted assault: 1429

Allied adjusted defense: 898

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1 (fort level 0)

Japanese Assault reduces fortifications to 0

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1881 casualties reported
Squads: 7 destroyed, 235 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 16 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 10 disabled
Guns lost 15 (1 destroyed, 14 disabled)
Vehicles lost 18 (1 destroyed, 17 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
2240 casualties reported
Squads: 9 destroyed, 239 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 42 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled
Guns lost 39 (2 destroyed, 37 disabled)

Assaulting units:
27th Division
35th Division
15th Tank Regiment
13th Tank Regiment
37th Division
41st Division
6th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
Botanko Hvy Gun Regiment
Mongol Garrison Army
1st Mortar Battalion
5th Medium Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
12th Chinese Corps
92nd Chinese Corps
76th Chinese Corps
2nd Chinese Cavalry Corps
89th Chinese Corps
80th Chinese Corps
14th Chinese Corps
3rd Chinese Cavalry Corps
1st Construction Regiment
4th Group Army
38th Chinese Corps
85th Chinese Corps
14th Group Army
57th AT Gun Regiment

The strategical implications are very important imho.
With the pressure applied to the central front (at Chikkiang), the fall of Tienshui would rapresent the fall of the only real bastion in his northern perimeter. Once Tienshui falls, there are no other bases left in chinese hands untill Kienko (which is already in the Chunking plains area).
In the meanwhile he has moved back his 70 fighters to India (remember that he had moved some 70 fighters to Chengtu few weeks ago, probably in order to try to ambush my unescorted bombers)... i was lucky to have noticed it in time to take the necessary countermeasures.

In CENTAPC his catalinas keep on spotting my unloading amphib TF at Tabiutea (which, btw, is taking forever to unload a SNLF!!)...and it seems that he has eaten the bite. A TF is spotted by my mavis moving fast west of Canton Is.! Probably is a cruiser TF sent to intercept and destroy my cargo ships... by the Yamato, 3 CAs and 8 DDs are lingering in the shades...

(in reply to princep01)

Post #: 1098

RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 8:46:57 AM

JocMeister

Posts: 8262
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
Status: offline

I think ASW has been tweaked to be less deadly for both sides in Babes?

(in reply to GreyJoy)

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RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 8:58:24 AM

GreyJoy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

I think ASW has been tweaked to be less deadly for both sides in Babes?

don't think it's for both sides...as far as i can tell they did modify the depth of the japanese deep charges so now, in deep waters, the american subs can always go deeper than the best jap DC...
What they did to both sides, afaik, is to have dimished the number of firing DCs, so now you won't see anymore those crazy results with late war jap E classes (that fired hundreds of DC rounds in a single shot)

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RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 9:11:54 AM

GreyJoy

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RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 10:44:43 AM

Encircled

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If he bases loads of subs at Cocos, can't you just night bomb it as its in Nell and Betty range?

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RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 11:42:06 AM

JeffroK

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled

If he bases loads of subs at Cocos, can't you just night bomb it as its in Nell and Betty range?

Yeah, plus he's got to keep up the fuel and supplies, juicy targets.

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RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 5:47:09 PM

GreyJoy

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August 3 1942

We ordered for tomorrow another general attack at Tienshui. I wanna have it!
My divisions have cleared their fatigue/distr levels and are now ready to fight again. supplies are at good levels and it's time to go.

In the Gilberts he ate the bait! My Mavis at Tarawa confirmed the arrival, at flank speed (30 knots) of 5 enemy CLs! The Yamato TF is still undetected... so i ordered to the bait TF(which has thank god finished to unload) to run away, while the Yamato&Co will move south... i expect him to arrive at max speed so to be there at Tabiutea by nighttime... and we all know that in 1942 the japs are almost unbeatable during nighttime engagements!
No sign of enemy CVs nor or other major enemy TF nearby... so i don't believe this is a trap... go and get em!!!!

I also decided to send most of the artillery that took Manila (10 units) back to China. I don't think i desperately need them elsewhere and in China artillery is way too important to let it rot somewhere in the pacific...

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RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 5:49:06 PM

GreyJoy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Encircled

If he bases loads of subs at Cocos, can't you just night bomb it as its in Nell and Betty range?

Well, yes, i'm building Christmas IO... in order to get a good Netties nest there...but if he bases fighters there i cannot use my precious Netties... yes, at night it may be possible, but i somehow don't like the idea to use night bombers untill night fighters arrive in theatre for the Allies...

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RE: Back from London - 10/27/2012 6:48:26 PM

princep01

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Dark Thoughts on Bombing at Night: It happened....it happened a lot all thru the war. However, I have seen an AaR around that uses a very good house rule on night bombing. The rule limits night bombing to those nights with 50%+ moonlight until 1943. That makes a lot of sense to me. Prior to radar being installable on bomber units, one did need some light to bomb even cities. So, you might mention this and see if a house rule is adaptable to your game. I really think that is a logical and realistic rule. They didn't call full moons, "bomber's moons" for nothing.

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RE: Back from London - 10/28/2012 1:33:41 AM

GreyJoy

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Couple of very important days...

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Aug 04, 42

The bait dind't work as intended...what should have been a big cruiser TF, revealed itself as a tint 2 DDs TF ...so i wasted lots of ammos against useless targets...
But, more important, i revealed my position for a couple of DDs

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Day Time Surface Combat, near Tabiteuea at 137,134, Range 20,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
BB Yamato, Shell hits 1
CA Kinugasa
CA Furutaka
CA Kako
DD Yukikaze
DD Maikaze
DD Isokaze, Shell hits 1
DD Shiranui
DD Tokitsukaze
DD Minegumo
DD Shirakumo
DD Isonami
DD Shirayuki

Allied Ships
DD MacDonough, Shell hits 6, and is sunk
DD Dewey, Shell hits 2, and is sunk

And my ships didn't react at night (yes, we had several Pates on night naval search)....

In China we conquered Kiuchuan, where a battered enemy Army, without any combat power left, succumbed to my tanks...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground combat at Kiuchuan (82,26)

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 1716 troops, 0 guns, 315 vehicles, Assault Value = 175

Defending force 3934 troops, 2 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 92

Japanese adjusted assault: 225

Allied adjusted defense: 10

Japanese assault odds: 22 to 1 (fort level 1)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Kiuchuan !!!

Allied aircraft
no flights

Allied aircraft losses
I-16-III: 1 destroyed

Combat modifiers
Defender: preparation(-), morale(-), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker: shock(+)

Allied ground losses:
1501 casualties reported
Squads: 55 destroyed, 18 disabled
Non Combat: 87 destroyed, 13 disabled
Engineers: 9 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 1 (1 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units retreated 9
Units destroyed 3

Assaulting units:
12th Tank Regiment
5th Armored Car Co
23rd Tank Regiment
9th Tank Regiment
11th Tank Regiment

Defending units:
34th Separate Brigade
19th Chinese Corps
55th Chinese Corps
82nd Chinese/A Corps
8th Chinese Base Force
42nd Chinese Corps
6th Chinese Base Force
15th Chinese Base Force
3rd Chinese Corps
10th Chinese Base Force
5th Chinese Base Force
82nd Chinese/B Corps

But, above all.... Tienshui fell!!!!!...now the gates for northern China are open

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Ground combat at Tienshui (81,38)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 49005 troops, 507 guns, 275 vehicles, Assault Value = 1303

Defending force 48393 troops, 385 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1134

Japanese adjusted assault: 1441

Allied adjusted defense: 670

Japanese assault odds: 2 to 1 (fort level 0)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Tienshui !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1235 casualties reported
Squads: 3 destroyed, 166 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 17 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Vehicles lost 34 (3 destroyed, 31 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
16624 casualties reported
Squads: 224 destroyed, 60 disabled
Non Combat: 205 destroyed, 51 disabled
Engineers: 93 destroyed, 2 disabled
Guns lost 89 (82 destroyed, 7 disabled)
Units retreated 14

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
15th Tank Regiment
35th Division
27th Division
13th Tank Regiment
37th Division
41st Division
1st Mortar Battalion
Botanko Hvy Gun Regiment
Mongol Garrison Army
6th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
5th Medium Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
80th Chinese Corps
12th Chinese Corps
89th Chinese Corps
92nd Chinese Corps
14th Chinese Corps
76th Chinese Corps
2nd Chinese Cavalry Corps
3rd Chinese Cavalry Corps
14th Group Army
38th Chinese Corps
4th Group Army
85th Chinese Corps
1st Construction Regiment
57th AT Gun Regiment

But the real news of the day is that a glenn-equipped sub, operating near Canton Is, spotted an enemy CV southwest of it!!! So he is really coming for Tabiutea (or at least that's what i thought-see later)!
No other ships are spotted...but at Canton the usual CL-TF is spotted by Emilies... so i retreated the Yamato TF back to Tarawa and ordered to the KB to immediately move at Flank Speed from Ponape to Tarawa area. All my G3N3s have been allerted at Makin and more Mavis are being trasfered from the Solomons, along with 100 Zeros and more 60 Betties!

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Aug 05, 42

On the night of the 5th the confirmation arrived... a huge enemy fleet is operating around Canton Is. The SS I-7 (glenn equipeed...the one who spotted the CV the day before) confirmed the presence of the POW and of several enemy CAs...

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ASW attack near Enderbury Island at 155,142

Japanese Ships
SS I-7

Allied Ships
DD Drayton
BB Prince of Wales
CA Houston
CA Indianapolis
CLAA San Diego
DD Flusser
DD Perkins
DD Case

During the morning, below several showers, a HUGE enemy fleet is spotted 1 hex east of Baker Island. So Tabiutea doesn't seem to be his first target... All my Nells weren't able to locate the target (starting from Makin is a long long way!) and none of the attacked...

But in the afternoon, after another several of contacts reported by the Mavises, a group of 13 G3N3s finally found the enemy invasion fleet...(more than 20 bombers didn't locate the target and returned to base!)...
President Polk is attacked and hit by 3 torps and immediately sunk, bringing down nearly 1300 men! Also the CL Detroit is hit! BANZAI!

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Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Baker Island at 150,136

Weather in hex: Clear sky

Raid detected at 25 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 9 minutes

Japanese aircraft
G3M3 Nell x 13

Japanese aircraft losses
G3M3 Nell: 3 damaged
G3M3 Nell: 1 destroyed by flak

Allied Ships
AP President Monroe
AK Alchiba
AP President Polk, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk
CL Detroit, Torpedo hits 1, heavy damage

Allied ground losses:
1268 casualties reported
Squads: 62 destroyed, 28 disabled
Non Combat: 50 destroyed, 11 disabled
Engineers: 8 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 52 (52 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 20 (20 destroyed, 0 disabled)

Aircraft Attacking:
13 x G3M3 Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp

Enemy CVs are spotted again...now we have a visual confirmation...north of Canton Island CVs and BBs are reported moving northwest...

The KB didn't move as planned (as always!) and only did 12 hexes instead of the planned 16!...we're still pretty far away.
I'm also collecting all the subs i have in the area from PH down to Pago Pago. Sending also the flottilla based at Kwalajein (8subs). In 3/4 days i should be able to have at least 16 subs around Canton Is.
The KB is divided in 3 different TFs, while another SCTF (2 BBs, 4 CLs, 8 DDs) is moving from Rabaul.
We'll refuel at Tarawa and then we'll try to engage at Flank Speed...the only problem is that the enemy alread arrived at 1 hex south of Baker...won't be able to be there in time to interdict the landings... i only have a SNLF unit at Baker

Will this be the decisive battle the japanese were looking for?

More news from NOPAC... the americans have based at attu several cruisers (for sure CA Vincennes) and lots of DDs.
Recently 50 P39s started to bomb Amchitka Island, tasting the fire of my AAs... it seems that he wants to open two fronts in a row (NOPAC and CENTPAC)...hopefully he has divided his CVs into two different groups....

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Afternoon Air attack on Amchitka Island , at 158,52

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 24 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Allied aircraft
P-39D Airacobra x 21

Allied aircraft losses
P-39D Airacobra: 3 damaged
P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed by flak

Aircraft Attacking:
19 x P-39D Airacobra bombing from 10000 feet
Airfield Attack: 1 x 500 lb GP Bomb

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RE: Back from London - 10/28/2012 1:34:44 AM

GreyJoy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: princep01

Dark Thoughts on Bombing at Night:� It happened....it happened a lot all thru the war.� However, I have seen an AaR around that uses a very good house rule on night bombing.� The rule limits night bombing to those nights with 50%+ moonlight until 1943.� That makes a lot of sense to me.� Prior to radar being installable�on bomber units, one did need some light to bomb even cities.� So, you might mention this and see if a house rule is adaptable to your game.� I really think that is a logical and realistic rule.� They didn't call full moons, "bomber's moons" for nothing.

We have that HR...but none of us has used night bombing so far in this game...probably we both feel that it's overpowered...however i'll talk to Brad about it

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RE: Back from London - 10/28/2012 1:54:04 AM

JohnDillworth

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quote:

My Master...yes, i'm trying everything. I used to do that (a leading ASW TF followed up by transport TFs) but with the japs it doesn't work well... Consider that in this mod the jap ASW capabilities have been really nerfed (which is a good thing!)...now even in shallow waters you're lucky if a DD (so with high exp) makes a couple of light hits on a sub and doesn't get sunk in return

Most of my experince is with the Allies but ASW works best with both ships and planes. If you can spot the subs with planes the ships can usually sink them. Forget right now if the planes should be on ASW or nav search, but once the planes know the subs are there the ASF ships are much more effective.

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RE: Back from London - 10/28/2012 3:49:39 AM

Cribtop

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First, you have done well to develop a mature and professional doctrine on troop rotation to maintain the pressure in China. Tienshui is a key get.

Second, looks like some fun about to go down near Baker. As the Allies, going up against KB and LBA in 1942 is a recipe for IJN victory.

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