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Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 11/6/2011 11:20:10 PM   
pws1225

 

Posts: 1166
Joined: 8/9/2010
From: Tate's Hell, Florida
Status: offline 		My apologies if this has been asked and answered before, but I am unable to find the exact expiration date of Japan's early war amphibious landing bonus. The manual says that the bonus is in effect for the 'first four months' of the war. I can interpret this to mean either that the bonus expires at the end of March '42 or on April 6, '42 depending on how the clock flies. In my PBEM game against Dr.Hal, it is currently Mar 21, '42 so I either have 10 days or 16 days left to capitalize on this feature. An additional 6 days would greatly expand my horizons of opportunity, but to assume it's there when in fact it's not would be very 'disruptive'. Any help from more experienced JFBs would be greatly appreciated.

BTW, this is my first game playing as Japan and I have yet to crash the economy. Hats off to Mike Solli for his sound advice!

Regards, Paul
Post #: 1
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 11/7/2011 3:46:01 AM   
DivePac88


Posts: 3119
Joined: 10/9/2008
From: Somewhere in the South Pacific.
Status: offline 		6.3.3.3.2 : Note that there is an "initial operations" bonus for Japanese during the first 4 months of the war.

6.3.3.3.2.1 : Special Japanese early war bonus of 1200 for all AP/AK and xAP/xAK types.

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You understand now, Why you came this way

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Post #: 2
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 11/7/2011 5:22:37 AM   
Quixote


Posts: 773
Joined: 8/14/2008
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		It's sometimes a dangerous assumption, but this is one of those rules that probably hasn't changed since original WitP. Since no one else has given you a definitive answer yet, I'll go out on what I think is a sturdy limb and tell you that it's through March 42, since that's how it was worded in the original manual. (It was not only worded that way, it worked that way, too. Sorry, I don't have any turns or saves on AE from that period to be 100% sure it hasn't for some unknown reason changed, though.)

(in reply to DivePac88)
Post #: 3
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 11/7/2011 5:34:27 AM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		The early-war landing bonus expires at the end of March 1942.  Thus, it isn't in effect as of April 1.  But, dang, that four-month period seems like it lasts forever.

(in reply to Quixote)
Post #: 4
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 11/7/2011 1:21:45 PM   
Mike Solli


Posts: 15792
Joined: 10/18/2000
From: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
Status: offline 		I agree, it's 31 Mar 42. Try an invasion on 1 April (even unopposed) and watch your disruption skyrocket. From the Japanese side, the bonus is all too short CR.

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Post #: 5
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 11/7/2011 1:26:02 PM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

I agree, it's 31 Mar 42. Try an invasion on 1 April (even unopposed) and watch your disruption skyrocket. From the Japanese side, the bonus is all too short CR.

+1

should extend AT LEAST another 12 months! Oh, and while dreaming, a geisha ...

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Pax

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Post #: 6
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 11/7/2011 3:27:29 PM   
pws1225

 

Posts: 1166
Joined: 8/9/2010
From: Tate's Hell, Florida
Status: offline 		Thanks to all for the quick response. The end of March it is.

(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 7
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 11/7/2011 4:30:55 PM   
dr.hal


Posts: 3335
Joined: 6/3/2006
From: Covington LA via Montreal!
Status: offline 		Sorry about that Paul, looks like you will just have to pack a lot in the next 10 days.... without me noticing! Hal

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Post #: 8
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 12:08:15 PM   
koontz

 

Posts: 274
Joined: 8/27/2009
Status: offline 		Does it end at the same date in scenario 2 ?

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Post #: 9
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 12:35:00 PM   
obvert


Posts: 14050
Joined: 1/17/2011
From: PDX (and now) London, UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: koontz

Does it end at the same date in scenario 2 ?


Yes.

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Post #: 10
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 3:38:26 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert


quote:

ORIGINAL: koontz

Does it end at the same date in scenario 2 ?


Yes.


(Evil laugh. In a moose that involves a lot of snot.)

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The Moose

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Post #: 11
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 3:46:15 PM   
1EyedJacks


Posts: 2244
Joined: 3/12/2006
From: The Eastern Sierras
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58


quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert


quote:

ORIGINAL: koontz

Does it end at the same date in scenario 2 ?


Yes.


(Evil laugh. In a moose that involves a lot of snot.)


We don't need no stinking bonus... Just saying...

_____________________________

TTFN,

Mike

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 12
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 4:21:42 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		To the best of my recollection, I have never seen one of the developers clarify the answer to the OP's question. In my mind it is unresolved whether the last day of the bonus is 31 March '42 or 6 April '42.

I know that many people are convinced it is 31 March, i just don't recall seeing an authority provide the answer.

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Post #: 13
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 4:32:22 PM   
nashvillen


Posts: 3836
Joined: 7/3/2006
From: Christiana, TN
Status: offline 		If it is 31 MAR 42 or 6 APR 42, matters not. It is during that time period and the difference of a week should not be significant over the extent of the length of the war.

As the allies, you need to find a way to put a kink in the Japanese efforts during this timeline. As the Japanese, you need to keep the schedule going by crushing the allies, in men, equipment, and most of all spirit to take advantage of this time period.

Having been on both sides, I can now see the importance of both statements!

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Post #: 14
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 4:39:07 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: 1EyedJacks


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58


quote:

ORIGINAL: obvert


quote:

ORIGINAL: koontz

Does it end at the same date in scenario 2 ?


Yes.


(Evil laugh. In a moose that involves a lot of snot.)


We don't need no stinking bonus... Just saying...


(Clears throat.) Apparently not.

_____________________________

The Moose

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Post #: 15
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 5:33:00 PM   
Chickenboy


Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline 		OP:  Get a foothold into any major theatres that you intend to occupy in earnest prior to the expiration of the bonus-it's quite helpful.  Also, use this time to take the nuisance 'bitsa' dot hexes throughout the map.  After April 1, they will be that much more annoying to take without incurring major disruption to your units.

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Post #: 16
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 5:52:20 PM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

OP:  Get a foothold into any major theatres that you intend to occupy in earnest prior to the expiration of the bonus-it's quite helpful.  Also, use this time to take the nuisance 'bitsa' dot hexes throughout the map.  After April 1, they will be that much more annoying to take without incurring major disruption to your units.


After 3/31, I use paratroopers/paratrooper fragments almost exclusively. Paratroops via Mavis are actually a great way to do it for the entirety, IMO.

(in reply to Chickenboy)
Post #: 17
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 6:01:02 PM   
Chickenboy


Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna


quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

OP:  Get a foothold into any major theatres that you intend to occupy in earnest prior to the expiration of the bonus-it's quite helpful.  Also, use this time to take the nuisance 'bitsa' dot hexes throughout the map.  After April 1, they will be that much more annoying to take without incurring major disruption to your units.


After 3/31, I use paratroopers/paratrooper fragments almost exclusively. Paratroops via Mavis are actually a great way to do it for the entirety, IMO.


That's all well and good for foothold entry into theatres with undefended bases. The IJ player can't assume being able to bring more than about 50-75 AV by paratroop drop. That just won't do against a marginally defended site.

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Post #: 18
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 6:34:40 PM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna


quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

OP:  Get a foothold into any major theatres that you intend to occupy in earnest prior to the expiration of the bonus-it's quite helpful.  Also, use this time to take the nuisance 'bitsa' dot hexes throughout the map.  After April 1, they will be that much more annoying to take without incurring major disruption to your units.


After 3/31, I use paratroopers/paratrooper fragments almost exclusively. Paratroops via Mavis are actually a great way to do it for the entirety, IMO.


That's all well and good for foothold entry into theatres with undefended bases. The IJ player can't assume being able to bring more than about 50-75 AV by paratroop drop. That just won't do against a marginally defended site.


Yeah, I was mostly referring to the little ones with no Allied presence. Particularly around the Celebes where there's just a lot of landing to do at tiny/nonexistent ports.

(in reply to Chickenboy)
Post #: 19
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 10:05:13 PM   
John 3rd


Posts: 17178
Joined: 9/8/2005
From: La Salle, Colorado
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

The early-war landing bonus expires at the end of March 1942.  Thus, it isn't in effect as of April 1.  But, dang, that four-month period seems like it lasts forever.


IT ROCKS! I always plan my war operations around that dreaded date.


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Reluctant Admiral Mod:
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Post #: 20
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/22/2013 11:57:28 PM   
Jorge_Stanbury


Posts: 4320
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
Status: offline 		What "MUST" be invaded before that fateful date?

I am thinking:
- All the DEI (Borneo, Sumatra, Java, etc)
- All the PI; or at least all interesting islands
- Malaya and Pt Blair
- All PNG; or at least Pt Moresby
- Tarawa, Wake, Ocean, Nauru, Makin, Guam
- Midway if you plan to invade it (I might not)
- The Aleutians (Adak)
- North Australia, if you plan to invade

Am I missing anything?

(in reply to John 3rd)
Post #: 21
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/23/2013 12:04:23 AM   
AW1Steve


Posts: 14507
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: Mordor Illlinois
Status: offline 		Early war landing Bonus! 1st day "warp movement" bonus! The late lamented Zero bonus! Why am I not impressed when JFB's whine about some aspect that allows the allies to actually hit back and call it "unrealistic" and "gamey"?

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Post #: 22
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/23/2013 12:31:47 AM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

What "MUST" be invaded before that fateful date?

I am thinking:
- All the DEI (Borneo, Sumatra, Java, etc)
- All the PI; or at least all interesting islands
- Malaya and Pt Blair
- All PNG; or at least Pt Moresby
- Tarawa, Wake, Ocean, Nauru, Makin, Guam
- Midway if you plan to invade it (I might not)
- The Aleutians (Adak)
- North Australia, if you plan to invade

Am I missing anything?



That's quite a list already. Do you expect the Allies to just wave the doors open and go have a cocktail?


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Post #: 23
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/23/2013 12:35:09 AM   
Jorge_Stanbury


Posts: 4320
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

What "MUST" be invaded before that fateful date?

I am thinking:
- All the DEI (Borneo, Sumatra, Java, etc)
- All the PI; or at least all interesting islands
- Malaya and Pt Blair
- All PNG; or at least Pt Moresby
- Tarawa, Wake, Ocean, Nauru, Makin, Guam
- Midway if you plan to invade it (I might not)
- The Aleutians (Adak)
- North Australia, if you plan to invade

Am I missing anything?



That's quite a list already. Do you expect the Allies to just wave the doors open and go have a cocktail?



I am playing against the AI... so yes, sake on the rocks!

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 24
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/23/2013 8:46:40 PM   
Terrion

 

Posts: 4
Joined: 2/10/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: nashvillen

If it is 31 MAR 42 or 6 APR 42, matters not. It is during that time period and the difference of a week should not be significant over the extent of the length of the war.



That seems rather dismissive. It may not be significant over the length of the war, but it is sort of important for a player deciding whether to launch an invasion during the first week of April.

< Message edited by Terrion -- 2/23/2013 8:47:58 PM >

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Post #: 25
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/24/2013 8:20:22 PM   
John 3rd


Posts: 17178
Joined: 9/8/2005
From: La Salle, Colorado
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

Early war landing Bonus! 1st day "warp movement" bonus! The late lamented Zero bonus! Why am I not impressed when JFB's whine about some aspect that allows the allies to actually hit back and call it "unrealistic" and "gamey"?


Sounds to me like A NEW PLAYER who is asking a decent question. Should be treated as such. I'll wager this person hasn't been around for those old arguments.

Jorge: As you may know, this bonus reflects the historical rapidity of the Japanese early war advance. No way to adequately reflect this except by employing the bonus to give that speed and flexibility to the Japanese player through the historical advance period to the end of March 1942.

For this JFB, my list includes the DEI, early Central, South Pacific, and Aleutians moves. I usually add one more 'swing for the fence operation to this list in each game I start.

_____________________________



Member: Treaty, Reluctant Admiral and Between the Storms Mod Team.

Reluctant Admiral Mod:
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Post #: 26
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/24/2013 11:38:05 PM   
AW1Steve


Posts: 14507
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: Mordor Illlinois
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd


quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

Early war landing Bonus! 1st day "warp movement" bonus! The late lamented Zero bonus! Why am I not impressed when JFB's whine about some aspect that allows the allies to actually hit back and call it "unrealistic" and "gamey"?


Sounds to me like A NEW PLAYER who is asking a decent question. Should be treated as such. I'll wager this person hasn't been around for those old arguments.

Jorge: As you may know, this bonus reflects the historical rapidity of the Japanese early war advance. No way to adequately reflect this except by employing the bonus to give that speed and flexibility to the Japanese player through the historical advance period to the end of March 1942.

For this JFB, my list includes the DEI, early Central, South Pacific, and Aleutians moves. I usually add one more 'swing for the fence operation to this list in each game I start.



Of course John. Did you not notice this in my post? It's the smiley for humor. Perhaps you are familiar with it? We do that when we are speaking "tongue in cheek".

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Post #: 27
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/25/2013 12:06:41 AM   
Chickenboy


Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve


quote:

ORIGINAL: John 3rd


quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

Early war landing Bonus! 1st day "warp movement" bonus! The late lamented Zero bonus! Why am I not impressed when JFB's whine about some aspect that allows the allies to actually hit back and call it "unrealistic" and "gamey"?


Sounds to me like A NEW PLAYER who is asking a decent question. Should be treated as such. I'll wager this person hasn't been around for those old arguments.

Jorge: As you may know, this bonus reflects the historical rapidity of the Japanese early war advance. No way to adequately reflect this except by employing the bonus to give that speed and flexibility to the Japanese player through the historical advance period to the end of March 1942.

For this JFB, my list includes the DEI, early Central, South Pacific, and Aleutians moves. I usually add one more 'swing for the fence operation to this list in each game I start.



Of course John. Did you not notice this in my post? It's the smiley for humor. Perhaps you are familiar with it? We do that when we are speaking "tongue in cheek".


Steve-another call for the 'sarcasm smiley' that you pine for so often?

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Post #: 28
RE: Japanese Early War Amphibious Landing Bonus - 2/25/2013 2:01:33 AM   
John 3rd


Posts: 17178
Joined: 9/8/2005
From: La Salle, Colorado
Status: offline 		I'll provide a sarcasm smiley.

Problem is that a lot of people don't get that. It is pretty clear within Steve's Posting but could be seen otherwise. I think we are just WAAAAAAY too hard on players asking questions that we vets have argued/discussed over the years. Most new players don't get the sarcasm or might be put off by it. This is my only real concern. We, as vets, know each other and can see/read this...

My .02...

_____________________________



Member: Treaty, Reluctant Admiral and Between the Storms Mod Team.

Reluctant Admiral Mod:
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(in reply to Chickenboy)
Post #: 29
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