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OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von Klei... - 3/13/2013 4:25:25 AM   
Grfin Zeppelin


Posts: 1515
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		I wish we had more men like him back at that time.

http://kenyadailyeye.jibostudios.com/2013/03/hitler-assassination-plotter-ewald-heinrich-von-kleist-dies/


o7

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/13/2013 4:39:04 AM   
pws1225

 

Posts: 1166
Joined: 8/9/2010
From: Tate's Hell, Florida
Status: offline 		I hadn't heard of this fellow before. Very interesting indeed.

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/13/2013 4:40:03 AM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
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Wow - I just this past weekend told a friend about that episode as he had never heard of it!

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/13/2013 2:21:14 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		What was the name of the Anti Nazi student movement in Munich during WWII?  The White Rose, or something like that?  It took tremendous guts to oppose Hitler, and surprisingly large number of Germans did.  Dietrich Bonhoeffer is one of my personal heroes.  How incredible is it that he wrote a book titled The Cost of Discipleship...

Thanks for the post.

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/13/2013 6:35:38 PM   
Rainer

 

Posts: 1210
Joined: 11/21/2000
From: Neuching, Bavaria, Germany
Status: offline 		"Weisse Rose"
Hans and Sophie Scholl and other students.
Murdered 22 Feb 1943 by the Nazis.

Edit: More here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophie_Scholl

< Message edited by Rainer -- 3/13/2013 6:36:51 PM >

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/13/2013 7:10:00 PM   
Sardaukar


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Status: offline 		http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_G%C3%B6ring

Hermann Göring's brother was apparently avid anti-Nazi and save hundreds of Jews. Quite surprising stuff.

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/13/2013 7:14:43 PM   
Speedysteve

 

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Status: offline 		Thanks for the link. Interesting

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/13/2013 7:44:46 PM   
jeffk3510


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_G%C3%B6ring

Hermann Göring's brother was apparently avid anti-Nazi and save hundreds of Jews. Quite surprising stuff.


Very intersting wiki article about Hermann's brother Albert.

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/13/2013 9:13:01 PM   
Grfin Zeppelin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_G%C3%B6ring

Hermann Göring's brother was apparently avid anti-Nazi and save hundreds of Jews. Quite surprising stuff.

Wow, just wow, thanks for that link.

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/14/2013 12:21:34 PM   
Joe D.


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin

I wish we had more men like him back at that time ...


(NEWSER)"A former German army lieutenant has died 69 years after he volunteered to wear a suicide vest to kill Adolf Hitler. The first plot involving Ewald-Heinrich von Kleist failed to come to pass ..."

Today, unfortunately, many mange to sucessfully blow themselves up in less nobler causes.



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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/14/2013 3:53:17 PM   
veji1

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin

I wish we had more men like him back at that time.

http://kenyadailyeye.jibostudios.com/2013/03/hitler-assassination-plotter-ewald-heinrich-von-kleist-dies/


o7


Sure, nevertheless I tend to find the quasi deification of Von Stauffenberg and the plotters, people who actively started plotting against Hitler because he was leading Germany to disaster, rather than because he was a Murdering Psycho of historic proportions, well disturbing...

Had the Axis been winning the war they would have stayed were they were, good obedient soldiers. Plotting against an inefficient leader out of wanting to avoid defeat is not the same as plotting against a monster because of what he is, a monster.

Well nevertheless, may Kleist rest in peace, I do not question his bravery at all, nor the fact that it was the right thing to do.


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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/14/2013 4:10:02 PM   
castor troy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: veji1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin

I wish we had more men like him back at that time.

http://kenyadailyeye.jibostudios.com/2013/03/hitler-assassination-plotter-ewald-heinrich-von-kleist-dies/


o7


Sure, nevertheless I tend to find the quasi deification of Von Stauffenberg and the plotters, people who actively started plotting against Hitler because he was leading Germany to disaster, rather than because he was a Murdering Psycho of historic proportions, well disturbing...

Had the Axis been winning the war they would have stayed were they were, good obedient soldiers. Plotting against an inefficient leader out of wanting to avoid defeat is not the same as plotting against a monster because of what he is, a monster.

Well nevertheless, may Kleist rest in peace, I do not question his bravery at all, nor the fact that it was the right thing to do.




Well, saying this as a citizen of a former part of Nazi Germany (with my grandfathers fighting in the Wehrmacht), if they (Nazi Germany) would have won the war, Hitler would be for us what Napoleon is for France, Stalin for the Soviets or Cesar for Italy. Being born 30 years after the end of WWII I am glad the Nazis (we) lost but ask someone in Nazi Germany in 43 about this. What percentage would say it would be better to lose the war because they (Nazi Germany) are responsible for the Holocaust and the whole war. The winner takes it all, no matter if it is correct or not. In the case of WWII we all are lucky the good guys won and the bad guys lost in the end.

I fully agree, would the Wehrmacht have won the war, which one of those high ranked officers would think about killing Hitler? I am a bit reluctant to call the assassinators heroes because the main reason for their plans was the obvious loss of the war. Those that were trying to kill Hitler and his foes before he was able to take the world into another world war are the real heroes for me, those that tried to kill Hitler late war were mostly officers that applauded him in the early years when the Wehrmacht was going from one victory to the next.

< Message edited by castor troy -- 3/14/2013 4:14:42 PM >

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/14/2013 4:12:13 PM   
Grfin Zeppelin


Posts: 1515
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: veji1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin

I wish we had more men like him back at that time.

http://kenyadailyeye.jibostudios.com/2013/03/hitler-assassination-plotter-ewald-heinrich-von-kleist-dies/


o7


Sure, nevertheless I tend to find the quasi deification of Von Stauffenberg and the plotters, people who actively started plotting against Hitler because he was leading Germany to disaster, rather than because he was a Murdering Psycho of historic proportions, well disturbing...

Had the Axis been winning the war they would have stayed were they were, good obedient soldiers. Plotting against an inefficient leader out of wanting to avoid defeat is not the same as plotting against a monster because of what he is, a monster.

Well nevertheless, may Kleist rest in peace, I do not question his bravery at all, nor the fact that it was the right thing to do.


In Stauffenbergs case that might apply but unlikely in von Kleists, look at his fathers prewar stance about the Nazis for example.


Oh and well said Castor.

< Message edited by Gräfin Zeppelin -- 3/14/2013 4:18:39 PM >

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/14/2013 4:23:23 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		Yup - I don't know the story of that family or man in particular, but I'm sure the criticism is valid for some people but not for others.

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/14/2013 5:20:46 PM   
Canoerebel


Posts: 21100
Joined: 12/14/2002
From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		Many anti Nazi Germans were opposed to Germany for the "right" reasons - because they detested Hitler and the Nazi reign of terror; not because Germany was losing the war.  Dietrich Bonhoeffer, who has already been mentioned, is an excellent example.

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Post #: 15
RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/15/2013 12:07:02 AM   
Joe D.


Posts: 4004
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From: Stratford, Connecticut
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: veji1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin

I wish we had more men like him back at that time.

http://kenyadailyeye.jibostudios.com/2013/03/hitler-assassination-plotter-ewald-heinrich-von-kleist-dies/


o7


Sure, nevertheless I tend to find the quasi deification of Von Stauffenberg and the plotters, people who actively started plotting against Hitler because he was leading Germany to disaster, rather than because he was a Murdering Psycho of historic proportions, well disturbing...

Had the Axis been winning the war they would have stayed were they were, good obedient soldiers. Plotting against an inefficient leader out of wanting to avoid defeat is not the same as plotting against a monster because of what he is, a monster ...


That sentiment was shared by "Maj. Grau" as played by Omar Sharif in "The Night of the Generals". Re the plot to kill Hitler, Grau said the generals were happy with him as long as they won, but Stauffenberg supposedly became disenchanted with his fuhrer early in the war, at least according to the German language film, "Stauffenberg".

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/15/2013 12:46:06 AM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline 		You'd have factor in excessive importance for German officers about oath. They had sworn one directly to guy they were tried to kill, not only to state.

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RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/15/2013 2:10:37 PM   
Joe D.


Posts: 4004
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From: Stratford, Connecticut
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

You'd have factor in excessive importance for German officers about oath. They had sworn one directly to guy they were tried to kill, not only to state.


I think their allegiance to Hitler actually replaced that of the state in the oath that was used under the former Wiemar Republic.

BTW, as I'm posting this I'm watching "Judgement at Nuremburg" courtesy of the MGM channel on satelite TV.

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The best fighter-bomber of World War II

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Post #: 18
RE: OT Hitler assassination plotter Ewald-Heinrich von ... - 3/15/2013 8:03:58 PM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

You'd have factor in excessive importance for German officers about oath. They had sworn one directly to guy they were tried to kill, not only to state.


I think their allegiance to Hitler actually replaced that of the state in the oath that was used under the former Wiemar Republic.

BTW, as I'm posting this I'm watching "Judgement at Nuremburg" courtesy of the MGM channel on satelite TV.


Yes, you are correct, old oath was replaced by oath to A. Hitler.


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"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von Bülov, 1870-


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