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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent

 
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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/24/2013 7:33:57 PM   
GreyJoy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: paullus99

His inaction in Burma is very interesting - I don't think he realized just how powerful the allies can get in this theater, as you get substantial reinforcements over the next few months which can allow a pretty powerful offensive operation (and if he's forced to defend in the open, he's toast).


+1

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/24/2013 7:34:19 PM   
GreyJoy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: paullus99

If he comes back to hit you at in the Gilberts - he's beyond the date for the Jap Amphib bonus & he'll be landing at an atoll, plus little or no prep?

Isn't that a bit insane?


+2

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/24/2013 7:51:32 PM   
Canoerebel


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Gilberts:  KB gives up the chase of Allied shipping to commit full strikes against Tarawa and Makin.  Two IJN BBs bombard Tarawa.  SigInt that 14th Division is aboard a maru bound for Nauru Island.  That - particularly the latter - is a wonderful reaction from an Allied point of view.  Barring sub interdictions, the final tally on the Gilberts invasion is in:  The Allies lose one xAP and five xAK.  The Japanese may have lost three DD (one by mine strike at Tarawa today). 

SoPac:  Enemy giving more attention by bombing of Luganville.  An xAK will arrive tonight.  I hope she gets to unload much-needed supply.  I think John left behind some slow carriers at Tulagi - recon showed three a few days ago.

Australia:  No question now that the Allied carriers will win any conceivable race to cover the Exmouth invasion.  The KB is out of position and I don't think John will sniff this one out for a few days or longer.  Amphibious ships will reach Esperance in two days to begin loading, though one of the two infantry units is a few days out by rail and will have to convert to combat mode.

Bay of Bengal:  A UK brigade and a base force begin landing at Ramree Island.  No air strikes - no reaction whatsoever - by Japan.  Still lots of Sallys and stuff flying in China, so I'm wondering if John has a real lack of base forces and supply in Burma.  It's either that or isn't aware of how significant this operation is.  No detection noted by any of my four TFs at Ramree nor the carriers offshore a few hexes.  Nice.  Strange, but nice.

China:  As noted, still lots of Japanese bomber activity.  Overall things look good at the moment.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/24/2013 7:56:52 PM   
Miller


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Yes, landing on a atoll without 100 prep is bad in so many ways. So he must wait or he will get destroyed landing.


Even with 100% prep it can still be bad in so many ways! I wouldn't even consider an attempt to retake it if I was in his shoes.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/24/2013 8:01:28 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		If 14th Division is going to Nauru, he may be choosing to cauterize the wound.  IE, he might not invade the Gilberts, but create a wall just to the west.  Either sounds good to me.  But after Midway and Luganville, John definitely is going to be leary of invading an atoll.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/24/2013 8:19:31 PM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Miller


quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Yes, landing on a atoll without 100 prep is bad in so many ways. So he must wait or he will get destroyed landing.


Even with 100% prep it can still be bad in so many ways! I wouldn't even consider an attempt to retake it if I was in his shoes.


+1


_____________________________

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/24/2013 10:17:51 PM   
JeffroK


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Status: offline 		CR, do you hold Baker Is??
Or use Tabiteua?

If yes,

Can you build a suplly dump and resupply using APD or even fly supplies in??

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/24/2013 11:34:39 PM   
Houtje

 

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Status: offline 		I dont think CR holds either of those, JeffK - see post # 1076 for a map of the area.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 11:36:34 AM   
Canoerebel


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Bay of Bengal:  The inevitable Japanese combat TF is targeted to Ramree Island, but runs afoul of the Allied carriers.  I think three IJN DDs (each 13 points, so fairly good ones) are sunk.  This will up the ante, both because John will need to bring more and because he knows at least one USN carrier is in the Bay of Bengal.  At Ramree, engineers are coming ashore and the garrison is up to 184 AV.

Burma:  An Indian division has joined BFF Brigade in defending the upper most of the line of jungle hexes.  7th Aussie Div. is 33 miles towards joining the two Indian brigades defending the next lower hex.  At that point, the line of hexes is basically secure.  41 USA Div. arrives at Capetown in three weeks.  It'll be inserted into this line, though that will take a good 45 to 60 days.  Upon arrival, though, the Allies should then be in a position to begin moving forward.  From my perspective it seems like John still hasn't recognized the significance of this theater, but I'm almost surely underestimating.  He's probably got alot in the works.  But this theater is far more important than the Gilberts.

China:  SigInt that 1st Raiding Regiment - late in Australia - is prepping for Paoshan.

NoPac:  SigInt that 7th Division (that's the Soporro folks) on a maru bound for Akutan Island.  That base has been out of supply for months.  The defensive AV is something like 125.  I'll try to get some supply there via air transport.  But an IJ move might be very good as it should leave John feeling more secure about his Aluetians defenses.  I'm still planning to jump past his big forward bases to hit Attu sometime late in the year.

CenPac:  One element of the KB is near Makin.  I've lost track of the others.  Most of my north flank ships are approaching Johnson.  The south flank ships are safely on their way to Tahiti.

SoPac:  Two IJN BBs bombard Luganville, catching my little supply xAK.

Oz:  6th Australian Cavalry Brigade - 59% prepped with AV of 174 - can begin loading at Esperance tomorrow.  I may go with just that since it will be another three or four days before 102nd US Infantry Bn. is ready.  The four USN carriers are south of Albany.

Japan:  It really looks like John is shifting into a Pacific frame of mind.  7th Div. to Akutan; 14th Div. to Nauru; three divisions in New Caledonia; Luganville probably a future target; KB and most BBs in the Pacific.  This is a good setup as the Allies are concentrating on the Bay of Bengal and prepare to move on western Oz.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 1:34:33 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		Here's the key theater in the war. For an illustration of how this theater mgiht look in mid 1943 if Japan establishes a strong forward line of defense, take a look at GreyJoy's AAR - he posted a map this morning. I am really hoping John isn't reading GJ's AAR.




Attachment (1)

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 2:04:29 PM   
Canoerebel


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One of the pleasures of life in the rural South is Sunday school.  Yesterday was one of the two hardest times I’ve laughed while teaching Sunday school over the years.

We were discussing the fact that Judas Iscariot kissed Jesus so that the authorities would know who to arrest. The question was posed: Wasn’t Jesus so well known by that point that this really wasn’t necessary? A class member pointed out that it’s quite possible not to recognize famous people. This was a good observation, so I was searching for an example while the class continued to discuss the point. Justin Bieber popped to mind, so I tried to think of a person in our class unlikely to be familiar with Beiber. One member, I’ll call him Mike, came to mind. He is a hard working, quiet gentleman unlikely to watch Entertainment Tonight or to read People magazine.

So, at a lull in the conversation, I turned to him and asked, "Mike, do you know who Justin Beiber is?"

Mike thought for a second, smiled, and said, "Is he the guy on Leave it to Beaver?"

The other instance came shortly after I began teaching the class in 2010. Wayne, our beloved teacher for many, many years, had stepped down and was no longer a member of our class.  The lesson was about the wonders of creation. To illustrate some of the complexities and marvels, I had done some research about the human mind – its makeup and capacity.

We came to a point where I began to ask a question, "Do you know how many brain cells the average human...."

At that moment, our old teacher, Wayne, surprised us by walking into the room. Inspired, I continued the question: "… - like Wayne – has?"

Without missing a beat, David, a retired master sergeant in the air force, deadpanned: "Three?"

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 2:21:41 PM   
GreyJoy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

Here's the key theater in the war. For an illustration of how this theater mgiht look in mid 1943 if Japan establishes a strong forward line of defense, take a look at GreyJoy's AAR - he posted a map this morning. I am really hoping John isn't reading GJ's AAR.






Cannot agree more: john is really really screwed here. Even if he sees the risk and move several divisions to block your approaching paths to the plains, you have now the controll of those hexes and you can easily decide when and where to push towards the plains.
The Ramree island ops was a masterfull piece of strategy: really well planned and executed! With his left flank so open now, john would be better considering already building a defensive perimeter around moulmein and chang-mai if he doesn t want to replicate what happened to the japs in Crackaces's game

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 2:26:50 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		There is a small chance that John could decide on a counterattack.  If I bring too many troops forward too fast, a landing behind my lines might catch me with slim defenses at hand.  If so, it would take me a long, long time to retrieve units that are in the jungle far beyond the nearest rail heads. 

Such a move is unlikely, but I'm keeping reasonable garrisons "just in case."  The Chittagong and Calcutta areas remain well defended and in depth.  Bombay and Karachi each have 250 AV.  18th UK Div. is still at Diego Garcia.  But the best defense is probably the appearance of depth and strenght.  Base building at Viz, Bombay, Karachi, Socatra, and Dante (an extended map base on the coast of Italian East Africa) lend the appearance of strength to Allied rear areas.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 2:43:05 PM   
ny59giants


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Status: offline 		I would be sending significant number of American SeaBee units to India/Burma via Cape Town to aid in building up bases quickly. I sent some in my game (March '43), but should have sent more.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 2:47:15 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		I agree.  This area has an acute need for engineers.  I have everything possible pushed forward, but Akyab in particular is in dire need.

I have two American EAB at Imphal and the Bobcats unit at Diego Garcia.  Only a half dozen Sea Bee units have arrived to date and all of them have gone to Oz, Tahiti and on ship for the Gilberts, though I'm not sure they're going to get in.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 2:55:34 PM   
Bullwinkle58


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I agree.  This area has an acute need for engineers.  I have everything possible pushed forward, but Akyab in particular is in dire need.

I have two American EAB at Imphal and the Bobcats unit at Diego Garcia.  Only a half dozen Sea Bee units have arrived to date and all of them have gone to Oz, Tahiti and on ship for the Gilberts, though I'm not sure they're going to get in.


The EABs have always made me wonder. They were Engineer Aviation Battalions. Specially designed and manned to build forward air bases, runways, and defend/repair same.

I've always wondered if the game really treats Allied engineers as generics. Or if, perhaps, deep in the EXE file there is a tweak to make EABs favor AF construction and disfavor ports and forts. Seabees are generalists. I wonder if EABs are.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 3:00:05 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		I suspect EABs are just generic, though assumptions like these often prove wrong when I make them.

A US Army EAB arrives at Dacca as a reinforcement in about 21 days, so that will help things a bit.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 3:19:53 PM   
ny59giants


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Status: offline 		Just a friendly FYI, but don't forget to get a BF with Naval Support squads to Ramree Island. They will speed up the unloading of supplies and troops.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 3:33:50 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		A fast transport TF carrying one of the American port service units is en route, currently north of Diego Garcia.  This was one of the units targeting Cocos Island before I scrubbed that mission a month ago.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 5:05:28 PM   
Canoerebel


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Bay of Bengal:  A lone IJN DD tangles with an Allied TF consisting of CL Newcastle and a handful of DDs...and sinks Newcastle.  Drat, the first loss of this operation for the Allies.  No enemy air strikes, but John at long last has some patrols in place.  The Allies are nearly finished unloading at Ramree.  My big fast transport TF will be busy for the next week carrying engineers and base forces forward to Akyab.  I'm mulling over how John will react to this operation plus a known USN carrier in the Bay of Bengal.  He's gonna react, but how?

Arabian Sea:  An IJN sub wolfpack sinks two good UK tankers south of Karachi.

Luzon:  The Japanese take Clark Field on a shock attack (that's the third of three elements of a good day for John, probably giving him a needed dose of adrenaline).  I love the new touch to the game as the US Armed Forces Radio Network Announces:  "Greetings to the Allied Forces across the Pacific, the Indian Ocean and in Asia.  The stout defenders of Clark Field finally retired to Bataan today.  General Homma, the Japanese commander who promised to deliver this to the Emporer months ago, committed seppuku today.  His final words to the Emporer:  "Dang, Emporer, I really messed this up.  My bad."

Australia:  Oops, 6th Australian Cavalry division is restricted, so 550 PP are paid to buy her out (that leaves me with 1,000 in the bank, but I need much more than that when 41st Div. arrives at Capetown in 9 days).  6th Cav. begins loading on transports at Esperance.  The US Army battalion reaches Esperance but needs two more days to stand down from strat mode.  So I may go with just the Aussies.  D-Day Exmouth perhaps 10 days.

SoPac:  Quiet.  The enemy fails to take Noumea despite overwhelming odds, but it will fall to a shock attack tomorrow unless John forgets to issue orders.

CenPac:  One branch of the KB sends a raid against Makin.  The second branch may be approaching Tarawa from the east, after scouting those waters (not sure its a carrier TF, might be just combat ships).  A combat TF is well to the southeast, either looking for stray Allied shipping or planning to visit places like Christmas Island.  The Allied invasion ships are beginning to reach Pearl and will unload the remnant units.

NoPac:  Waiting to see if 7th Div. is actually inbound to Akutan.  I think so.


< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 3/25/2013 5:06:31 PM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 6:58:10 PM   
Canoerebel


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Bay of Bengal:  Still unusually quiet, though recon showing a big build up of enemy aircraft at Rangoon (apparently Mandaly is the only other field John has operational in Burma).  On the basis that he's had enough time to observe, orient, decide, and implement a plan, my amphibious ships and escorts will retire, mainly to Chittagagong, where the Allies can efficient fast transport.  Another decision is what to do with my carriers.  They are kind of hemmed in and might get trapped if John sends the full KB this way, but the Allies also have big airfields and lots of fighters.  I don't want to siphon off fighters to provide cover somewhere distant, like Colombo, so I may keep my carriers at Calcutta.  Need to think that over, though, as enemy recon would make that uncomfortable.

China:  The Chinese withdrawal continues in good order.  I'm not sure if John is honoring his previously announced "I'm coming no further" vow or if he's accepted my "don't stand down" suggestion.  Either way the Chinese are fine.

Australia:  6th Aussie Cav. has finished loading.  I'm debating whether to swing out wide to try to sneak up on Exmouth or, alternatively, to take a direct route and have my carriers, en route, bomb the Japanese airfield at Carnavon.  My experience with SBDs bombing airfield hasn't been that good, but shutting down the field would help.  4EB and perhaps some bombardment runs could help.

SoPac:  Another supply xAK is two days away from Luganville.  Noumea didn't fall today despite a deliberate attack, but will tomorrow.

CenPac:  Two BBs bombard Makin and one branch of the KB sends strike aircraft against the base.  Two of the three APs involved in the invasion made it back to Pearl with the third two days out.  All DMs are also back.

NoPac:  No sign of the pending Akutan invasion.  CV Wasp will arrive in less than two weeks.  I may detail her and BB North Carolina to NoPac.  We'll see.


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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 8:20:30 PM   
obvert


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

6/9/42

CenPac:  Two BBs bombard Makin and one branch of the KB sends strike aircraft against the base.  Two of the three APs involved in the invasion made it back to Pearl with the third two days out.  All DMs are also back.



What kind of effect is there from the bombardment?

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 8:29:19 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		This particular bombardment (by Hiei and Kirishima, which are KB darlings, right?) had little impact:

Night Naval bombardment of Makin at 136,125

Japanese Ships
     BB Kirishima
     BB Hiei

Allied ground losses:
     20 casualties reported
        Squads: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
        Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
        Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Port hits 6
Port supply hits 3

BB Kirishima firing at Makin
BB Hiei firing at 21st Infantry Regiment


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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 8:37:14 PM   
paullus99


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Status: offline 		Become a huge thorn is his side here - the more supply and forts you can build, the worse off it will be for him when he comes back.....lol

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 8:40:26 PM   
Miller


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Status: offline 		The Allies can really pour the troops into Burma relatively early in the game. Japan's best hope of stopping any advance there is to knock out most of China ASAP and then send the bulk of the then redundant Divs to Rangoon for redeployment. However judging by his progress in China he will not be in a position to do that for a looong time, if ever.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 9:28:39 PM   
Canoerebel


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Cocos Island:  SigInt that 5th Division is posted here.  Wow, I'm glad I scrubbed that invasion.  This is important news, because it helps me account for another of John's division.  This was one of the conquerors of Port Blair and I was sure it would go to Burma, but apparently only 33rd went of that group (and I had SigInt that 4th Div. was inbound).  He's got so many spread out so far that the chances of him invading India are essentially nil.  Therefore, I am moving additional units forward - some to Akyab in preparation for a march down the road to Prome.  I'd buy a couple of Indian divisions, but I think I'm best served saving them to buy 41st USA Div. after it reaches Capetown.  That unit will be really tough on Japan.

Bay of Bengal:  Quiet today.  Cox's Bazaar airfield to level one.

China:  Until something major develops, I'll shorthand this "situation good," meaning that the Chinese withdrawl and building of the second MLR is going smoothly with no major threats posed by Japan.

NoPac:  Still no sign of that SigInt-telegraphed move on Akutan.

West Coast:  A big convoy about to depart LA carrying reinforcements to Pearl Harbor.

CenPac:  Supply is already running low at Makin and Tarawa due to continued bombings and bombardments (two more BBs - Haruna and Kongo - show up at Tarawa today.  I'm going to have real problems supplying these islands in the face of a full commitment by John, but a full commitment is worth whatever becomes of my garrisons.  I'll try to wedge some stuff in, but I'm not optimistic.

Australia:  However, I think the situation in the Pacific plus the Allied carries in Bay of Bengal have John's full attention.  This may help greatly with the invasion of Exmouth, which doesn't have an airfield.  Neither does Port Headland.  The two threats are Carnavon (level five) and Corunna Downs (level three).  The former is the greater threat.  I will bombard and use 4EB from Geraldton and Kalgoorlie.  I may also use my SBDs via carrier strike.  I have an army moving on Carnavon, but I don't think it makes it prior to D-Day (if it did, and if it posed a real threat to the base, John might have to withdraw aircraft to avoid losing them if the base fell).  Whatever happens at Exmouth, the overland move on Carnavon is intended to take the base. I'll have something like 750 AV included a good tank unit.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 10:01:36 PM   
Cribtop


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Status: offline 		Will the overland army at least get adjacent (and thus visible to) Carnarvon before D-Day? If not, can you order the armored unit to speed ahead alone? The appearance of an adjacent unit could provide John with a mental explanation for why you're 4E bombing Carnarvon other than "Hey, CR is about to mount an amphib Op in Northern Oz!"

This may be minor as he probably doesn't have time to react all the way back from the Gilberts, but every little thing helps.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/25/2013 10:40:37 PM   
Canoerebel


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Status: offline 		I've thunk it and thunk it and thunk it over.  Conclusions:

1.  KB way out of position; no chance over intervention except by small carrier force.
2.  A total sneak play probably gets sighted by long-range patrols two or three days out so that Carnavon gets filled with Netties.  So this isn't the best option.
3.  Try to sneak my carriers close to orchestrate a big airfield raid by naval and LB air time to coincide or just precede naval bombardment by what's on hand.  This is probably my preferred option.
4.  No sneak naval attack but hope to close the field by LBA and bombardments.  This isn't likely to succeed, so this ins't a good option.

Under option three, the presence of my ground troops won't be relevant one way or the other.  They marching along and it's possible my advanced units - a tanks unit and a US Army motorized brigade - could reach the adjacent hex.  But that's fine, I think.

I don't think John is monitoring the advance by my ground units (no harrassing bombing raids; no recon). That's great, because it suggests he might not be thinking "Allies are moving on Carnavon."

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 3/25/2013 10:41:13 PM >

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/26/2013 12:01:57 AM   
Cribtop


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Status: offline 		Yeah, if you are bringing in the CVs plus a bombardment plus 4Es, that is probably the safest Netty reduction option available. However, once you show the CVs, you are correct that the time for fancy misdirection here is over. It would still be good for the armor to show up adjacent for some last minute confusion in John's mind, but once he sees CVs, the jig is up.

Conversely, I'd work to get Hornet spotted again by patrol aircraft just before this whole thing goes off. Never hurts to have him thinking your CVs are somewhere else just before the hammer falls.

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RE: The Good The Bad & The Indifferent - 3/26/2013 1:35:55 PM   
Canoerebel


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From: Northwestern Georgia, USA
Status: offline 		6/11/42
 
Bay of Bengal:  Enemy subs pick off two xAK at Akyab.  The airfield at Rangoon is filling up but isn't actively on the offensive yet.  Engineers arrive at Akyab to expedite base building.  The Allies have so many troops and big airfields in proxmity to Ramree, Akyab and the line of jungle hexes that a successful Japanese counterattack is quite unlikely.  I think John will have to be satisfied with trying to create an MLR that can hold, though, knowing him, he may take a crack at Ramree, possibly by land.

Australia:  The amphibious TF with 6th Aus. Cav. is about 26 hexes south of Exmouth (between Perth and Albany), pretty close to the coast.  It'll go strait in.  The carriers are due west (true) of Perth and will time things with a bombardment TF to hit Carnavon ahead of the invasion TF.  No signs of detection or concern in this region. 

SoPac:  The Japanese take Noumea and sink an xAKL bringing supply into Luganville.

CenPac:  Both elements of the KB are at Jaluit and a TF of some sort is at Tabituea, almost certainly bringing in reinforcements.  Subs at Pearl will take supply to Tarawa.  I'll continue to work the angle, but mainly I'll keep any eye on the KB.  If it stays, the door is closed but at a good price.  If the KB departs, I'll work harder.

NoPac:  Large enemy sweep of Cold Bay, which is good news as its yet another active front.

After Oz:  If the Exmouth and Carnavon operation goes well, the Allies have four choices in deploying carriers, as follows:  (1) stick at Oz to help with a move on Port Headland and Broome (this will be expected by John, so I probably won't do it); (2) move to the Bay of Bengal to help with a move on Moulmein (that would put all my carriers in one corner of the map and is probably going to far too early); (3) move to eastern Oz to support a move somewhere along the rim of the Coral Sea - Milne Bay, New Caledonia, etc. (this is more feasible if the KB remains away); (4) move into CenPac to support/contest the Gilberts area (I don't want to take on the concentrated might of the KB, so unlikely unless a window of opportunity opens).

(in reply to Cribtop)
Post #: 1170
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