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RE: Events 11/10---11/17 - 7/1/2013 12:57:00 PM

ny59giants

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quote:

Fuel is a little low but Dan moving the fight to the DEI is GREAT! Don't have to haul any out of the Home Islands and can stockpile. Supply--Resources are rock solid right now. Still have bunches of it at sea prior to the Sumatra situation.

I would ensure that Oosthaven is built up to max Port (4) and use CS Convoys to transport fuel to Batavia vs Palembang. I would use more small TKs to go into Palembang to get the Oil. Use Java as collect point to get fuel/oil to Japan vs Singapore. Most of my "Std-x" xAK converted to TKs would be use in these operations and not risk my larger TKs at Singapore and Palembang for the foreseeable future.

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RE: Events 11/10---11/17 - 7/1/2013 3:00:05 PM

John 3rd

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Excellent thinking Michael. Have mvoed several of my TK TF to Soerabaja already to clear them out of the action. One advantage I've got now is having Merak--Oosthaven mined and now the Strait of Malacca mined Dan's SS are a bit less of a threat.

Am having some issues getting mines for my CM. How does one check the mine stockpile? Anyone know?

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Post #: 1082

RE: Events 11/10---11/17 - 7/1/2013 3:31:56 PM

zuluhour

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info screen: bottom right: sort by nat and type.

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Post #: 1083

RE: Events 11/10---11/17 - 7/1/2013 3:56:52 PM

John 3rd

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THANKS!

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Post #: 1084

RE: Events 11/10---11/17 - 7/1/2013 4:08:00 PM

JohnDillworth

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Don't know when, don't know why....but somewhere in the next few weeks, I would not be surprised if there was a big dust-up in the Strait of Malaca

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Post #: 1085

Kido Butai - 7/1/2013 4:10:28 PM

John 3rd

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Here is the current deployment of the Kido Butai:

KB-1 102 Zero, 54 Val, 53 Kate
Akagi (36Z--27V--15K)
Kaga (39Z--27V--20K)
Ryujo (30Z--18K)
2 BC (Hiei and Kirishima), 4 Tone-Class CA, 1 Agano-CL, and 8 DD

Added a pair of Zero Chutai to CarDiv1 for 18 more Fighters.

KB-2 70 Zero, 49 Val, 41 Kate
Hiryu (25Z--25V--17K)
Soryu (24Z--24V--15K)
Shoho (21Z--9K)
2 BC (Haruna and Kongo), 2 CA, 1 Agano-CL, 9 DD

KB-3 70 Zero, 21 Val, 26 Kate
Hiyo (21Z--21V--14K)
Ryuho (18Z--12K)
Nisshin (31Z)
Agano-CL, 8 DD

KB-4 85 Zero, 54 Val, 36 Kate
Shokaku (27Z--27V--18K)
Zuikaku (27Z--27V--18K)
Zuiho (31 Z)
2 BB (Yamtao and Musashi), 2 CA, 11 DD

TOTAL: 330 Zero, 178 Val, and 156 Kate

Got some room on Sho--Zui to add a few more lanes and just might do that. Headed to Soerabaja for fuel and a bit of re-organization also want to get all my Admirals set and straight. Looks like Nagumo and Yamaguchi for a pair of the CV TF. Have to sort for the other pair. Will detail the CVEs in just a second.

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Post #: 1086

Kido Butai, Jr - 7/1/2013 4:17:00 PM

John 3rd

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OK. The CVEs with a true hodge-podge of planes:

Hosho (15Z--6K)
Chuyo (21 V)
Unyo (12Z--15V
Taiyo (27 V)
Saiyen (9Z--9V)
Kuzuryu (18K)
7 DD

TOTAL: 36 Zero, 75 Val, 24 Kate

Other Warships in the Area:
1. BB Fuso, CL, and 8 DD
2. 4 CA, 2 CL, and 6 DD

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Post #: 1087

RE: Kido Butai, Jr - 7/1/2013 4:17:17 PM

John 3rd

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Running turn...

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Post #: 1088

RE: Kido Butai, Jr - 7/1/2013 5:03:11 PM

Paladin1dcs

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From the PoV of an AFB, your CVE aircraft loads are a bit strange. Is that a reflection of attrition, some other planned usage of air units, or is that just a true hodgepodge?

I mean, a CVE with nothing but Vals?

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RE: Kido Butai, Jr - 7/1/2013 5:04:21 PM

Miller

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Paladin1dcs

From the PoV of an AFB, your CVE aircraft loads are a bit strange. Is that a reflection of attrition, some other planned usage of air units, or is that just a true hodgepodge?

I mean, a CVE with nothing but Vals?

Should be either Zeros or Vals as no CVEs other than Hosho have torps.

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Post #: 1090

RE: Kido Butai, Jr - 7/1/2013 5:27:59 PM

John 3rd

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The Saiyen and Kuzuryu each have---wait for it--NINE TTs! Correct regarding the Vals. I can only get three sorties from the CVEs before they run out (have 90 on most CVE) so I've got three smacks with the Vals and then have to retire. Don't think there is much over here on the edge of the board but do want to check before linking up to KB.

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Post #: 1091

Nov 18, 1942 - 7/1/2013 5:43:46 PM

John 3rd

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Combat Report
November 18, 1942

A pretty good darned round for Japan this day. We reached out and touched a nice number of Allied ships!

Alor Star's improvised defense finally collapses as the garrison is hit--yet again--by a BB Bombardment (BB Revenge). Thanks fully the survivors retreat south and protect things in that direction. This is a problem but all I really see is a POW Camp for the 18th ID, 99th Indian Brigade, and a TK unit. My airpower is now strong enough to do some serious sea denial for anything going to Phuket, Langkari, and Georgetown.

Victoria Point got creamed by a CA--CL Bombardment two days ago. FRUSTRATING that I cannot get this result when I hit the darned targets! AF still operating but looks like he will hit it yet again tomorrow. Hope Pt Blair can get after those ships with some Betty.

Singora and Alor Star are hit by bombers. Transports are shot down flying into Singora.

I sent a pair of DDs up the Strait to cause trouble and they do GREAT! First they encounter Arleigh Burke with 3 DDs. They BLAST O'Bannon (do we get the leaders???) and seriously damage the other pair for NO DAMAGE. They then continue north and encounter 4 Allied DDs where--yet again--they take little damage and instead land solids and multiple hits on all four of the enemy. Lastly they sink an AK just off Langkari. Out of AMMO, they head home. Solid work.

Mines laid at the Strait.

Port Blair manages to really do some serious whacking this day. Her Betty--Nells fly several strikes and 5 AK, damage another 3 AK and an AP.

Kates from Tand??? nail 4 AK at Langsa and sink 3 of them.

A STF of 3 DD smash DD Perkins on picket duty west of Padang.

Sibolga gets the attention of Fuso and the bombardment nets about 95 Casualties. Three Betty and Kate strikes follow doing some harm to the troops. The Allied attack gains a 1-1 and lowers Forts to 3. Just might try to run reinforcements in since I've got a 120 AV Garrison unit unloading at Oosthaven. Be nice to keep that but don't think we'll have enough time here.

Rangoon is hit by 4EB and my Tojo and AAs knock down SIX of the 24 bombers. NICE!

The 16th and 33rd ID have crossed over the Irrawaddy but get nailed by Allied bombers without escorts. Move 3 full strength Tojo Sentai to set-up a CAP Trap. Maybe we'll get lucky and do some serious damage to the Allied Burma bomber force.

Engineering
Changteh AF--3. Plan to begin bombing Chungking in a turn or two. Planning on launching an offensive in southern China in about 7-10 days.

Attachment (1)

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Post #: 1092

Spotted - 7/1/2013 5:45:08 PM

John 3rd

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Got a sniff of the Allied CVs (or at least a portion of them):

Attachment (1)

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Post #: 1093

RE: Kido Butai - 7/1/2013 6:40:00 PM

JohnDillworth

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quote:

KB-4 85 Zero, 54 Val, 36 Kate
Shokaku (27Z--27V--18K)
Zuikaku (27Z--27V--18K)
Zuiho (31 Z)
2 BB (Yamtao and Musashi), 2 CA, 11 DD

He is a little nitpick from someone that grew up reading ship stats. Each of your divisions has a noticeable discrepancy in top speeds between the slowest and the fastest ships. Mostly, but not entirely, because of the CVLs. I realize most players always operate the KB as one big death star, but why not have one carrier division that could sprint after an opportunity if it arose. Here you have the Shokaku & Zuikaku, arguably the 2 finest carriers of the war, with a top speed of 34 knots, tied to the Yamatao & Zuiho while the slow Kaga gets to hang with the fast BC's. Why not create a division that could sprint after something if it had to? Sho &Zui and some good CA's plus the good AA DD's?. Maybe the situation never arises but if it does it might be better than switching ships on the fly. I wonder if a fast TF gets any defensive bonus or bonus vs subs?
my 2 cents

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/1/2013 10:23:49 PM

SqzMyLemon

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

Each of your divisions has a noticeable discrepancy in top speeds between the slowest and the fastest ships. Mostly, but not entirely, because of the CVLs. I realize most players always operate the KB as one big death star, but why not have one carrier division that could sprint after an opportunity if it arose. Here you have the Shokaku & Zuikaku, arguably the 2 finest carriers of the war, with a top speed of 34 knots, tied to the Yamatao & Zuiho while the slow Kaga gets to hang with the fast BC's. Why not create a division that could sprint after something if it had to? Sho & Zui and some good CA's plus the good AA DD's?. Maybe the situation never arises but if it does it might be better than switching ships on the fly.

I have to agree with JD's assessment. The combat model seems to penalize/punish poor TF composition when various ship types are grouped together if speed, range and firepower are not considered. I'd suggest you optimize the strength of your TF's by matching speeds and combat capabilities together rather than handicuffing your better ships with slower, less maneuverable ship types.

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/1/2013 10:43:17 PM

jeffk3510

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SqzMyLemon

quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnDillworth

Each of your divisions has a noticeable discrepancy in top speeds between the slowest and the fastest ships. Mostly, but not entirely, because of the CVLs. I realize most players always operate the KB as one big death star, but why not have one carrier division that could sprint after an opportunity if it arose. Here you have the Shokaku & Zuikaku, arguably the 2 finest carriers of the war, with a top speed of 34 knots, tied to the Yamatao & Zuiho while the slow Kaga gets to hang with the fast BC's. Why not create a division that could sprint after something if it had to? Sho & Zui and some good CA's plus the good AA DD's?. Maybe the situation never arises but if it does it might be better than switching ships on the fly.

I have to agree with JD's assessment. The combat model seems to penalize/punish poor TF composition when various ship types are grouped together if speed, range and firepower are not considered. I'd suggest you optimize the strength of your TF's by matching speeds and combat capabilities together rather than handicuffing your better ships with slower, less maneuverable ship types.

Nemo has a very good article in Greyjoy's first AAR about how to maximize your taskforces...sure works well.

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 12:22:13 AM

Saros

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I'd say you have too many heavy combat ships tied to your KB taskforces. Split off 2 BC, 2 CA and a few DD's to act as a leading force the other TF's follow rather than integrating them into the carrier formations.

Also the others are right about grouping the fast carriers together. I usually put the CVL and Junyo class converted liners in one task force with the slow CV's in a second (Kaga etc) and the fast ones in a third. I have noticed the faster ships seem to be hit less when grouped together and I suspect that speed is limited by the slowest ship and it significantly influences hit odds when under attack.

Finally do you really need the Yamato's with the KB? They are MASSIVE fuel hogs and really you want them to be engaging the enemy with those 18 inch guns rather than running escort on the carriers. I will admit their high VP value does make them popular torpedo/bomb magnets as it messes up the allied aircraft targeting priorities.

< Message edited by Saros -- 7/2/2013 12:29:58 AM >

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 1:56:11 AM

JohnDillworth

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quote:

Finally do you really need the Yamato's with the KB? They are MASSIVE fuel hogs and really you want them to be engaging the enemy with those 18 inch guns rather than running escort on the carriers. I will admit their high VP value does make them popular torpedo/bomb magnets as it messes up the allied aircraft targeting priorities.

They do soak up an awful lot of DB attention and provide some serious AA. That said Japanese AA only gets a small percentage of kills compared to CAP. I'd leave those monsters home or on Bombardment duty

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 6:13:58 AM

John 3rd

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We got in three turns today! Now at Nov 20th.

Have all the KB resting for its second day at Soerabaja and have been thinking on what has been written here.

Proposal:
KB--1 (Fast) Shokaku, Zuikaku, Hiryu, Soryu
KB--2 (Slower) Akagi, Kaga, Hiyo, and Ryujo
KB--3 (OK Speed) Zuiho, Nisshin, and Shoho

Shifting from four to three CV TF would open up a bunch of Escort Ships that could be used to cause chaos as STF--Bombardment.

It is late and I am up early for work so no update other then...

Speaking of the CVEs:

Attachment (1)

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 12:41:11 PM

Chickenboy

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Well, you certainly won't be surprising him with your carriers, especially after you've eaten the steady feed of picket ships he's been giving you. So, the calculus has changed IMO, John. Since you're unlikely to surprise the enemy now, what is your goal in the IO for KB? In the absence of surprise, are there any tactical concerns that you now have for this foray?

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 3:31:07 PM

Cavalry Corp

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Remember Japs also have 200 plane or more coordination issue?
For me by Dec 42 in your or scn 2 I do not want to let one small group of carriers race off after something and probably get hit by LBA. By Summer 42 the speed of carriers is not so important to me, unless its a deep raid where I do not expect to meet LBA especially. Having said that in your mod you have more and better fast escort ships over stock scn 2.

I tend to put 2 cv and 1 cvl as main groups and these follow each other but sometimes I put them a hex apart to confuse the allies. I put a CVE behind with Zeros on LRCAP ( all my other CVE ferry planes or are specialist ASW spread over the map. I use Hosho as main fleet support ( usually just behind with an oiler or in same hex if she catches up)with 20 Jeans on specialist ASW. In both my games RA and scn 2 the Hosho has sunk around 6 - 8 allied subs by Dec 42. The Jean has performed well in this roll for me carried 2 x 250kg, not bad.

< Message edited by cavalry -- 7/2/2013 3:39:16 PM >

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 4:01:42 PM

John 3rd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

Well, you certainly won't be surprising him with your carriers, especially after you've eaten the steady feed of picket ships he's been giving you. So, the calculus has changed IMO, John. Since you're unlikely to surprise the enemy now, what is your goal in the IO for KB? In the absence of surprise, are there any tactical concerns that you now have for this foray?

He has seen two (now) small little 12 plane strikes. Pretty obviously from CVEs.

KB finishes R&R at Soerabaja and raises anchor. They leave and head for Cocos.

GOAL? CRUSH his shipping west of Sumatra. Simple. This is not Jousting and/or fencing right now. It is the hammer arriving to clear the sea for a while so everything else can arrive. We can fence once I've gotten the troops safely ashore.

His shore bombardments are killing me right with Victoria Point and Georgetown. Got 5 DD, 4 CA, and 8 CL involved currently doing this.

Langsa and Sibolga fell this turn (Nov 22nd). MUST get my three arriving ID into the fight.

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 4:10:12 PM

pws1225

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Hey John, I have a question for you. Dan had landed in both northern Sumatra and Malaya. Which of the two landings do you believe to be more threatening, and which do you intend to deal with first?

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 4:22:15 PM

John 3rd

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Man. It is a tough question. I vote Sumatra as the more serious for the moment. He has elements of the 18th Brit ID, an Indian Brigade, and a TK Bn (as of yesterday) in Malaya (+Paras). I can deal with that. I cannot allow him to get dug-in in Sumatra.

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 5:16:15 PM

janh

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Absolutely Sumatra. And absolutely stunning move from Dan. Very creative. You said he'd be aggressive, but this was brilliantly set up and brilliantly supported by the guise in the Coral sea. In retrospect one could perhaps have guessed it as he did neither strongly (CV) contest your landings in the Hebrides, nor attempt to fight for his poor guys in the Marshals, but instead kept a very aggressive forward posture in Burma at such a time, including having US ground assets and CVs deployed. Hell, this guy's not to be underestimated! He really has now grown a huge center of gravity for his main push. Look at all these TFs!

You need to get him away from Singers and Palembang, from your tanker routes. If he can securely set up some bases in Sumatra, he'll substantially shorten his sub roundabouts, and in addition he can rather easily send some short-legged DD raiders into the Indochinese sea.

I also agree with the above posts, the islands West of Sumatra are as important as the main island. If Dan expands them and starts a serious air campaign here, the war will be over within a year, if not sooner. Without retaking the Malayan slot, you'll only be able to run resupply convoys to Burma with a long detour around the IO, and likely only under heavy cover such as KB. Burma would essentially be lost, but actually there wouldn't be any point in holding any further than the Thai border anyway. The theater would be obsolete at the moment you'd have to concede that you cannot drive Dan back this time.

Worse would be that Singers, Oosthaven, and Palembang would be under continuous air threat and getting oil and fuel home...? The further south and east he can advance and set up airbases (that is if not thrown into the sea within the next 2-3 months), the worse the air threat to bases in the whole DEI gets. And without Sumatra's, Northern Borneos, and Javas oil and resources... how long can you last?

Fingers crossed. Dan certainly brought tons of supply, and I bet he is putting the whole USAAF on Sumatra soon. Not sure if he plans on keeping the CV in action other than fleet cover, I rather expect that he'll rely on the supply brought ashore to sustain him while his LBA will probably soon provide cover from at least 1/4 the way to Colombo. I think you really need to bring about a decisive CV encounter now, one that allows to isolate Sumatra for at least 3-6 months even with CVE/BB forces. Even assuming a crushing victory in a CV encounter (which I do very much hope you'll soon be able to report!), having to keep KB around for a lengthy investment would sound to me like inviting trouble elsewhere...

Good luck and good hunting, John!

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 6:18:38 PM

Miller

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You would have to be very careful if the decide to go after his CVs IMO. He will have the advantage of LBA (assuming you approach in the IO). You could of course have Nettys based in Southern Sumatra and Malaya in range, however they are very unreliable for launching at long ranges....lots of failed to find target messages in my experience. Be warned!

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RE: Kido Butai - 7/2/2013 10:32:55 PM

John 3rd

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Very conscious of this issue. I want to move up the west coast of Sumatra about 7-8 hexes from the edge so I don't get caught in Sabang's CAP. He has about 200 fighters there (WHERE do they all come from???!!!).

So far he has moved NOTHING into Alor Star or Singora and I am bombing those AF everyday. The only other airbase he has taken is Langsa (Lvl-2). Nothing there yet either.

LESSON FOR ALL JFB: I did not build-up ANY of the west coast AFs above Padang. Didn't touch the islands either. This is a Godsend. Nothing there for him to use presently. This will change but right now it works well for the situation.

< Message edited by John 3rd -- 7/2/2013 10:33:18 PM >

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Post #: 1107

Knife Fight - 7/3/2013 8:52:34 AM

John 3rd

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November 22, 1942

For the second time in three days the Kaigun's DD Force fights a pitched battle and comes off the victor. Four DDs were sent to provide some cover at Tand??? and they ran into a pair of Brit DDs and 3 American DMS. A series of fights erupt that shatter the pleasant night and at the end of it the Japanese sinks DDs Napier and Vampire plus at least one or two of the DMS. In exchange for this action, one Japanese DD takes moderate damage (SYS 40). NICE!

Infantry Division Status:
1. 14th ID is fully unloaded at Singapore and will load into 40+ AK--AKL tomorrow to reinforce Tand???. BB Yamato and Musashi will Cover this convoy.
2. The 2nd ID is unloading at Batavia and shall depart in a day or two once more AK--AKL arrive. It will land on the west side of Sumatra.
3. The 4th ID has nearly 50% of its strength at Medan now. Medan might be a fairly hard nut to crack for Dan. Forts are nearly 3 and there is an AV of 275 present.
4. The 48th begins loading at Rangoon with its destination set of Phuket and Langkari.
5. The other ID (cannot remember the #) is passing Koepang presently and headed for Singers at the moment.

KB prepares to round Merak and move on to Cocos. Detach a pair of BC and 2 DD to form a STF where we shall find the BEST darned Admiral possible. Am thinking of detaching all 4 BC on a run into Sabang when we get close. Tanaka will command Yamato and Musashi. Anyone got a recommendation for a solid and MARVELOUS Admiral to place in command of a force that is truly going in Harm's Way?