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Ground combat mechanisms - 7/12/2013 12:36:20 PM   
Micke II


Posts: 218
Joined: 9/15/2007
From: Paris France
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On the forum I have made a lot of extensive research about ground combat mechanisms but I have founded that this component of the game is the less documented.
So, I open a list of questions and I would ask to the members of the forum to answer with their knowledge or to provide a link if the subject is already properly documented. Thanks in advance for your contribution.
1/ Ground combat replay:
What is the signification of the numbers in front of the units in the ground combat window which are diminishing sometime very quickly.
2/ aptitude of the commanders:
Do tests exist to compare the effectiveness and skills of commanders of ground units and commanders of HQ and their influence of the outcome of the combat?
Can we say if the assault value of commander n°1 is 50 and assault value of commander n°2 70 that the unit commanded by n°2 will have an increase fire power of 20 %?
3/ Contribution to the combat of the support squads?
Direct contribution: I have read somewhere 1/10 but 1/10 of what ? Only in defense ?
What is the effect of lack of support on a ground unit? I have read - 25 % but 25 % of what ?
If there are 75 support squads for 100 combat squads what happens?
4/ Contribution to the combat of a deactivated squad?
Nul?
Is a deactivated squad when retreating is always destroyed or some of them can remain deactivated?
5/ effect of supply:
If supply in red: assault value = - 75 %? Is it valid for all squads or only a part of it ?
You have case where the supply for a unit is in red but the available supply is just under the limit.
6/ Adjusted assault value:
is it the value before the start of the ground combat or before the assault phase and after the bombarding and defensing phase ?
7/ Is it possible to know the importance of the losses after the bombarding and defensive phases but before assault phase?
8/ Effect on the combat value of disruption?
Are figures available to measure it?
9/ Same questions for morale and experience?
10/ Level of preparation:
Apart from the reduction in disruption which is mentioned everywhere and the reduction of the number of deactivated squads during combat has the level of preparation some other benefits ?
Is it a plus minus effect? Level of preparation = 100 all benefits, below 100 nothing or is it a linear effect?
11/ effects of HQ:
Pretty well documented.
Corps HQ + 10 % Army HQ + 90%. The benefits of the 2 could be added.
12/ Soft and hard value of squads, artillery and armors
Is it the same value used in defensive and bombardment phase than in assault phase? What is the effect of the range? Is there a fire point blank effect?
A Chinese squad (according to the database) has a soft value of 11 versus a value of 20 for a Japanese squad. If the combat is just between these 2 squads will be the combat ratio 20:11 giving a final ratio of 1:1?



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RE: Ground combat mechanisms - 7/12/2013 3:26:12 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
First off, most of the internal formulae of the game engine have been kept secret from us. Some things have been revealed, but they do not want the game to be transformed into a math contest so many things simply will not be revealed. All of my answers below are to the best of my understanding and hinge also on my understanding of your questions.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Micke II

On the forum I have made a lot of extensive research about ground combat mechanisms but I have founded that this component of the game is the less documented.
So, I open a list of questions and I would ask to the members of the forum to answer with their knowledge or to provide a link if the subject is already properly documented. Thanks in advance for your contribution.
1/ Ground combat replay:
What is the signification of the numbers in front of the units in the ground combat window which are diminishing sometime very quickly. I believe that is the AV of the unit in question.

2/ aptitude of the commanders:
Do tests exist to compare the effectiveness and skills of commanders of ground units and commanders of HQ and their influence of the outcome of the combat? No. If you succeed in making one and getting useful results, be sure to share with the forum.

Can we say if the assault value of commander n°1 is 50 and assault value of commander n°2 70 that the unit commanded by n°2 will have an increase fire power of 20 %?
3/ Contribution to the combat of the support squads?
Direct contribution: I have read somewhere 1/10 but 1/10 of what ? Only in defense ?
What is the effect of lack of support on a ground unit? I have read - 25 % but 25 % of what ?
If there are 75 support squads for 100 combat squads what happens?
Non-combat squads (of all types) have some value for defense, I believe that is the 1/10. Support squads (whatever they be called, Support, Motorized Support...) have various functions. In combat they might (I am not sure) help combat squads to fight more effectively. IF that is true, then a 1 to 1 ratio is desirable and less would yield lesser results. Remember they don't give us all the formulae so some of this stuff is only known vaguely and some is only guessed at or inferred.

4/ Contribution to the combat of a deactivated squad?
Nul?
Is a deactivated squad when retreating is always destroyed or some of them can remain deactivated? I think you mean 'disabled'. AFAIK they have a reduced value for defense, maybe like a non-combat squad? Don't know. They do not contribute to attack. Also AFAIK, when chosen as a casualty, a fully-functioning squad is either disabled or destroyed; a disabled squad is destroyed. Disabled squads can certainly retreat without being destroyed. But, when a unit is forced to retreat, there is a much greater likelihood of casualties in greater numbers.

5/ effect of supply:
If supply in red: assault value = - 75 %? Is it valid for all squads or only a part of it ?
You have case where the supply for a unit is in red but the available supply is just under the limit. The color of the display has nothing to do with it. The display is the monthly figure, arrived at by taking the previous day of usage (or few days of usage?) and multiplying by 30. Notice that just after combat the "supply needed" figure will jump higher for one or more turns. The exact amount of supply required for combat by various types of ground devices might be in the manual but probably are not. Fighting when below the estimate of supply needed for the next 30 days is fine. When you are way below, you might start to see the "supply(-)" modifier in combat reports. You will have to gain a feel for this through experience.

6/ Adjusted assault value:
is it the value before the start of the ground combat or before the assault phase and after the bombarding and defensing phase ? Adjusted assault value is at the end of combat. It is the figure used to determine if an attacker can seize an enemy held base, or force the retreat of a defender out of a hex (if there is a retreat path).

7/ Is it possible to know the importance of the losses after the bombarding and defensive phases but before assault phase? What is "importance"? We get the combat report, and during turn resolution/replay we get the combat animation.

8/ Effect on the combat value of disruption?
Are figures available to measure it? No. If you succeed in making a test/formula, etc. share it.

9/ Same questions for morale and experience? No. If you succeed in making a test/formula, etc. share it.

10/ Level of preparation:
Apart from the reduction in disruption which is mentioned everywhere and the reduction of the number of deactivated squads during combat has the level of preparation some other benefits ?
Is it a plus minus effect? Level of preparation = 100 all benefits, below 100 nothing or is it a linear effect? AFAIK below 30 prep does not help. 30 or above its effect is prorated (not sure of exact formula). Preparation definitely helps with combat performance.

11/ effects of HQ:
Pretty well documented.
Corps HQ + 10 % Army HQ + 90%. The benefits of the 2 could be added.
12/ Soft and hard value of squads, artillery and armors
Is it the same value used in defensive and bombardment phase than in assault phase? What is the effect of the range? Is there a fire point blank effect? The exact formulae used are not shared. They have given a good overview of the various phases in ground combat (search the forum, I don't have a link. Maybe someone else does?). Basically the appropriate offensive value is used when a device shoots at something. The appropriate defensive value is used when a device is shot at. There are two or three 'ranges' in ground combat, 1 and 2, or maybe 0, 1, and 2. Some devices have a range of 2 and so get some advantage, like big enough artillery. Only things with a great enough range can bombard.

A Chinese squad (according to the database) has a soft value of 11 versus a value of 20 for a Japanese squad. If the combat is just between these 2 squads will be the combat ratio 20:11 giving a final ratio of 1:1? AFAIK no such ratio is used. You might find such a ratio helpful in determining likely outcomes... if so, share it.





< Message edited by witpqs -- 7/12/2013 3:31:39 PM >


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(in reply to Micke II)
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RE: Ground combat mechanisms - 7/12/2013 9:54:36 PM   
BigBadWolf


Posts: 584
Joined: 8/8/2007
From: Serbia
Status: offline
The first rule of WitP AE is that we do not talk about ground combat mechanism.

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