Matrix Games Forums

Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

Semi OT: New Izumo is launched...

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... Page: [1] 2 3   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 9:46:58 AM   
Apollo11


Posts: 24082
Joined: 6/7/2001
From: Zagreb, Croatia
Status: offline
Hi all,

Semi OT: New Izumo is launched...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Izumo-class_helicopter_destroyer


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2385430/Japan-warship-Izumo-aircraft-carrier-flat-topped-destroyer.html


quote:


It looks like an aircraft carrier, it sounds like an aircraft carrier... but the Japanese are adamant their biggest ship since WW2 is a 'flat-topped destroyer'

- Japan launches 250m destroyer Izumo which it says will be used for defence
- Critics claim the large flat-topped ship can function as aircraft carrier
- Country is banned from warfare thanks to post-WW2 pacifist constitution
- But prime minister is keen to strike a more aggressive stance against China


By Daily Mail UK

Japan has been accused of ignoring its policy of self-defence after launching its largest warship since the end of the Second World War as the government faces down China over a disputed chain of islands.

The new ship is designed to carry up to 14 helicopters at once - but Japanese officials insist it is not an aircraft carrier and will not be used to launch military jets.

The 250m vessel, named 'Izumo', is officially labelled a destroyer, although it has a flat top which functions as a flight deck like that on an aircraft carrier.

The country is officially banned from all military actions apart from self-defence and humanitarian aid under the terms of the constitution imposed on it by the U.S. after the Second World War.


New ship: The destroyer Izumo is Japan's largest boat since the end of World War II:




Flat-topped: But officials insist the ship is not an aircraft carrier and will not be used to launch planes:




Japan unveils its latest helicopter destroyer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23yDqHkLwR8


Its 'Peace Constitution' , which was designed by Allied leaders, followed Japan's involvement in the Second World War which included the devastating attack on US naval base Pearl Harbour in 1941.

This eventually led to the U.S. dropping a nuclear bomb on Hiroshima in 1945, which brought about Japan's surrender and the end of the war in 1945.

Officials say the new ship will be used to defend Japan and deliver personnel and supplies to areas hit by natural disasters, such as the devastating 2011 earthquake.

Japan's conservative prime minister Shinzo Abe is keen to change the constitution to allow the country to maintain a standing army for the first time in seven decades.

The unveiling of the new destroyer - which has been under development since 2009 - also coincides with a dispute between Japan and China over a chain of tiny islands in the South China Sea.

The two countries conduct regular patrols of the waters around the islands, which are called the Senkakus in Japan and the Diaoyus in China.


Celebration: The ship was launched today with a large ceremony in the port of Yokohama:






China reacted with alarm to the news of Izumo's launch and accused the Japanese government of aggressive intent towards other countries.

'We express our concern at Japan's constant expansion of its military equipment,' a spokesman for China's defence ministry told AFP. 'This trend is worthy of high vigilance by Japan's Asian neighbours and the international community.

'Japan should learn from history, adhere to its policy of self-defence and abide by its promise of taking the road of peaceful development.'


quote:


PEARL HARBOR AND HIROSHIMA ATTACKS LED TO 'PEACE CONSTITUTION'

Japan's constitution, known as the Peace Constitution, is most famous for the renunciation of the right to wage war.

It was drawn up under the Allied occupation which followed World War II and was intended to replace Japan's previous militaristic and absolute monarchy system with liberal democracy.

Japan was responsible for drawing the U.S. into World War II after it launched a surprise attack on the U.S naval base Pearl Harbor in 1941.


Grim: This shows the devastation caused by an U.S. nuclear bomb being dropped on Hiroshima in 1945:




The attack was intended as a preventive action to keep the U.S. from interfering with its planned military actions in Southeast Asia, which included overseas territories of the UK, Netherlands, and the United States.

The conflict escalated massively when the U.S dropped an atomic bomb on Hiroshima on August 6, 1945.


On fire: This shows a U.S. warship burning after the surprise Japanese attack on U.S base Pearl Harbour in 1941:




This led to the surrender of the Empire of Japan on September 2, 1945 and brought the hostilities of World War II to a close.

Japan's constitution was enacted on May 3, 1947.



Tokyo's ties with Beijing chilled sharply last year after the Japanese government bought the rocky islands - known as the Senkaku in Japan and the Diaoyu in China - in the East China Sea.

The islands are controlled by Japan but also claimed by China.

The United States says the islets fall under a U.S.-Japan security pact, but Washington is keen to avoid a clash in the economically vital region.

Many people in Japan have called for beefed-up naval and air forces to enable the country to enforce its territorial claims against China, which recently began operating an aircraft carrier purchased from Russia and is planning to build another.


Popular: A conflict with China over the Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands has led to more aggressive sentiments:




Streamers: The boat will supposedly be used for Japan's self-defence and humanitarian missions:




Japan has one of the best equipped and trained navies in the Pacific, despite the constitutional restrictions on its deployment.

The new destroyer could potentially be used launch fighter jets, or other aircraft which can take off vertically, although officials insist they have no plans to do so.

The Izumo does not have a catapult for launching fighters, or a 'ski-jump' ramp for fixed-wing aircraft.

It bears the same name as an armoured cruiser which was in operation between 1900 and 1945.


Danger? China has warned Japan against building up its military capabilities in the South China Sea:




The association with a vessel from the most aggressive period of Japan's imperial past could strengthen the impression that it is designed as a move towards militarisation.

The original Izumo fought against Russia in the 1904-5 battle for dominance of north-east Asia, and was also involved in the Japanese invasion of China during the build-up to the Second World War.



Leo "Apollo11"

_____________________________



Prior Preparation & Planning Prevents Pathetically Poor Performance!

A & B: WitW, WitE, WbtS, GGWaW, GGWaW2-AWD, HttR, CotA, BftB, CF
P: UV, WitP, WitP-AE
Post #: 1
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 11:26:58 AM   
fodder


Posts: 2160
Joined: 4/11/2010
From: Daytona Beach
Status: offline
From the pics it looks like it has only one elevator, shouldn't there be at least two?

_____________________________


(in reply to Apollo11)
Post #: 2
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 11:30:39 AM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline
It's supposed to be a helicopter carrier, so to speak..so, they probably get along with one elevator. And since Japan is buying F-35A and not F-35B/C, they won't have any fighters able to operate from the ship.

< Message edited by Sardaukar -- 8/7/2013 11:31:27 AM >


_____________________________

"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von Bülov, 1870-


(in reply to fodder)
Post #: 3
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 11:31:56 AM   
tk208

 

Posts: 140
Joined: 11/6/2006
From: Australia
Status: offline
Funniest looking DD I've ever seen lol

(in reply to Apollo11)
Post #: 4
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 12:10:52 PM   
HansBolter


Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

It's supposed to be a helicopter carrier, so to speak..so, they probably get along with one elevator. And since Japan is buying F-35A and not F-35B/C, they won't have any fighters able to operate from the ship.


Yes. it also lacks catapults.

_____________________________

Hans


(in reply to Sardaukar)
Post #: 5
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 12:12:13 PM   
Ursa MAior

 

Posts: 1416
Joined: 4/20/2005
From: Hungary, EU
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

It's supposed to be a helicopter carrier, so to speak..so, they probably get along with one elevator. And since Japan is buying F-35A and not F-35B/C, they won't have any fighters able to operate from the ship.


Hell yeah. They will have to relearn flight ops again. Guess it wont take long. Installing a ski jump is a piece of cake, and they have probably learned from the yankees, that you can store some planes on the deck see WW2 US practice. Switching between the ordered F-35 subtypes should also not pose a problem.

_____________________________


Art by the amazing Dixie

(in reply to Sardaukar)
Post #: 6
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 1:03:58 PM   
dr.hal


Posts: 3335
Joined: 6/3/2006
From: Covington LA via Montreal!
Status: offline
A future Harrier platform? VSTOL doesn't need a long deck, catapults or arresting gear.

_____________________________


(in reply to Ursa MAior)
Post #: 7
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 1:25:39 PM   
catwhoorg


Posts: 686
Joined: 9/27/2012
From: Uk expat lving near Atlanta
Status: offline
Took about a year to install the ski-jump on HMS Hermes, though that was part of a wider refit as well.

I love the way that reusing an older ship name is portrayed by the Mail as aggressive, but its pretty standard practice in the Royal Navy and elsewhere. The jingoism of that rag, never fails to amuse.

(in reply to dr.hal)
Post #: 8
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 1:34:27 PM   
Rodia


Posts: 123
Joined: 9/19/2012
Status: offline
I'm amused by China regime making "militarist" accusations.



(in reply to catwhoorg)
Post #: 9
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 1:36:28 PM   
Jorge_Stanbury


Posts: 4320
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
Status: offline
An helicopter carrier is more useful and makes a lot more sense when your adversary is China.

In a potential war, each and every PLAN surface vessel big enough to reach Japan will be quickly eliminated by the USN. Submarines will be trickier an can potentially interdict Japanese lines of communications.



_____________________________


(in reply to catwhoorg)
Post #: 10
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 2:25:47 PM   
dr.hal


Posts: 3335
Joined: 6/3/2006
From: Covington LA via Montreal!
Status: offline
You're right Catwhoorg, how many "Enterprises" have we had, including Starships?

_____________________________


(in reply to catwhoorg)
Post #: 11
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 2:35:50 PM   
catwhoorg


Posts: 686
Joined: 9/27/2012
From: Uk expat lving near Atlanta
Status: offline
2 Continental Navy
6 US navy, with the 7th planned (A Gerald Ford class CVN)

One Shuttle (not that it ever went into Space) and the Virgin VSS Enterprise

At least 15 HMS Enterprises from the Royal Navy

Then at least a dozen Star Trek ones ...

(in reply to dr.hal)
Post #: 12
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 3:30:11 PM   
Dixie


Posts: 10303
Joined: 3/10/2006
From: UK
Status: offline
Ah the good old Daily Mail. All I'll say about their article is:

Through deck cruisers.

_____________________________



Bigger boys stole my sig

(in reply to catwhoorg)
Post #: 13
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 3:41:09 PM   
catwhoorg


Posts: 686
Joined: 9/27/2012
From: Uk expat lving near Atlanta
Status: offline
Yes
Through deck cruiser indeed.




(in reply to Dixie)
Post #: 14
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 5:38:18 PM   
Sardaukar


Posts: 9847
Joined: 11/28/2001
From: Finland/Israel
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dixie

Ah the good old Daily Mail. All I'll say about their article is:

Through deck cruisers.


You mean "Daily Heil" Amusing nicknames some UK newspapers have..like "Gruniard" (for bad spelling early on).


_____________________________

"To meaningless French Idealism, Liberty, Fraternity and Equality...we answer with German Realism, Infantry, Cavalry and Artillery" -Prince von Bülov, 1870-


(in reply to Dixie)
Post #: 15
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 6:39:45 PM   
Dixie


Posts: 10303
Joined: 3/10/2006
From: UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dixie

Ah the good old Daily Mail. All I'll say about their article is:

Through deck cruisers.


You mean "Daily Heil" Amusing nicknames some UK newspapers have..like "Gruniard" (for bad spelling early on).



Daily Wail is another one I've heard. Still, it's the best way to find out what the middle classes should be scared of this week.

< Message edited by Dixie -- 8/7/2013 6:40:23 PM >


_____________________________



Bigger boys stole my sig

(in reply to Sardaukar)
Post #: 16
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 7:02:25 PM   
Phanatikk


Posts: 162
Joined: 10/22/2009
From: Nashville
Status: offline
Perhaps this new class of destroyer is simply designed to be stacked, for easy storage.

(in reply to Dixie)
Post #: 17
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 7:11:07 PM   
Cap Mandrake


Posts: 23184
Joined: 11/15/2002
From: Southern California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

An helicopter carrier is more useful and makes a lot more sense when your adversary is China.

In a potential war, each and every PLAN surface vessel big enough to reach Japan will be quickly eliminated by the USN. Submarines will be trickier an can potentially interdict Japanese lines of communications.





Yes, that is exactly right. Japan is not going to attack mainland China with a helicopter carrier.


It's for ASW duties, mainly.

(in reply to Jorge_Stanbury)
Post #: 18
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 7:57:04 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline
It's a big ship (27K), but with quite a small air group. Good flag for an ASW group.

BTW, the MSDF calls everything "destroyers" because the wording of the post-war constitution forbids anything larger. Their newest AEGIS ships of the Atago class are essentially cruisers.

_____________________________

We are all dreams of the Giant Space Butterfly.

(in reply to Cap Mandrake)
Post #: 19
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 8:16:28 PM   
tocaff


Posts: 4781
Joined: 10/12/2006
From: USA now in Brasil
Status: offline
What's in a name? If you were Japan how much faith would you have in the USA defending you? I thought so, I'd trust myself too. I'm surprised that they haven't changed the constitution that was forced on them by the victors.

_____________________________

Todd

I never thought that doing an AAR would be so time consuming and difficult.
www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2080768

(in reply to Terminus)
Post #: 20
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/7/2013 8:34:14 PM   
catwhoorg


Posts: 686
Joined: 9/27/2012
From: Uk expat lving near Atlanta
Status: offline
They have pretty much pushed the concept of 'self defence force' to the limits, and now having being asked to help in peacekeeping and anti-piracy, they have some leverage to change it.


The world has changed, and I do not think a stronger Japanese military is anything but positive for regional stability. China needs to be countered.

(in reply to tocaff)
Post #: 21
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/8/2013 1:20:06 AM   
John 3rd


Posts: 17178
Joined: 9/8/2005
From: La Salle, Colorado
Status: offline
I say CONGRATS to the Japanese. I wouldn't look to us for reliable protection. Better to rely on ones own self FIRST!

_____________________________



Member: Treaty, Reluctant Admiral and Between the Storms Mod Team.

Reluctant Admiral Mod:
https://sites.google.com/site/reluctantadmiral/

(in reply to catwhoorg)
Post #: 22
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/8/2013 6:10:07 AM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline
Yep, we seemed to have no problem with Germany re-arming. I doubt that there is a Western power that would be interested in interfering with Japanese defense concerns. Peace terms or not. Personally, I think that Japan's limited military spending has helped them economically over the intervening years. Costs a lost of GDP to have a large military.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to John 3rd)
Post #: 23
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/8/2013 2:34:13 PM   
Jim Stevens

 

Posts: 164
Joined: 3/25/2009
From: Woodstock, Georgia USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

It's supposed to be a helicopter carrier, so to speak..so, they probably get along with one elevator. And since Japan is buying F-35A and not F-35B/C, they won't have any fighters able to operate from the ship.


Yes. it also lacks catapults.


Catapults are only on the LXE model...

(in reply to HansBolter)
Post #: 24
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/8/2013 2:34:52 PM   
Jim Stevens

 

Posts: 164
Joined: 3/25/2009
From: Woodstock, Georgia USA
Status: offline
Way to go Japan! Banzi!!

(in reply to Jim Stevens)
Post #: 25
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/8/2013 9:07:25 PM   
geofflambert


Posts: 14863
Joined: 12/23/2010
From: St. Louis
Status: offline
It wouldn't bother me if we mothballed old nuclear CVs for eventual resale to Japan. They'll still be expensive and every year they get more and more vulnerable. Maybe we should throw in some nuclear attack subs too. Call it Rend-Rease (boo hiss)

(in reply to Jim Stevens)
Post #: 26
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/8/2013 9:36:54 PM   
Phanatikk


Posts: 162
Joined: 10/22/2009
From: Nashville
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: geofflambert

It wouldn't bother me if we mothballed old nuclear CVs for eventual resale to Japan. They'll still be expensive and every year they get more and more vulnerable. Maybe we should throw in some nuclear attack subs too. Call it Rend-Rease (boo hiss)


Rotsa ruck on that.

(in reply to geofflambert)
Post #: 27
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/9/2013 1:48:47 AM   
Ddog

 

Posts: 230
Joined: 2/17/2005
From: Cincinnati, OH
Status: offline
I think it's a great move for NATO.  The Japanese defense forces has an assortment of weapons that can be used offensively.  (F-15's for example) 

The fact that Russia only has 2 ports that don't freeze, Vladivostok in the Pacific and Murmansk for Atlantic operations, puts Japan in a key ASW position against Russian subs.  Back in the 80's we did 24hr flight plans for Meiwa-PS1's that would fly to certain postions land and drop sonar. 

I couldn't think of a better ASW weapon than a small carrier full of SH-60's......Has anyone heard what type of Helo's they plan on using?

_____________________________

I'd rather be lucky than good.


(in reply to Phanatikk)
Post #: 28
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/9/2013 2:30:15 AM   
greg_slith


Posts: 490
Joined: 9/14/2004
Status: offline
How, exactly, did the US "escalate" the war by dropping A-Bombs?

(in reply to Ddog)
Post #: 29
RE: Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... - 8/9/2013 4:29:14 AM   
geofflambert


Posts: 14863
Joined: 12/23/2010
From: St. Louis
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ecwgcx

How, exactly, did the US "escalate" the war by dropping A-Bombs?


I spent a minute looking for what you were referencing but didn't find it. I'm sure there's something, so let me try and answer you. We got really tired of fire bombing civilians so we took it to another level. You need go no further than William Tecumseh Sherman for the explanation. Not saying the Japanese didn't do horrible things, or wouldn't have used A-bombs if they had the power, but it is what it is.

(in reply to greg_slith)
Post #: 30
Page:   [1] 2 3   next >   >>
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> Semi OT: New Izumo is launched... Page: [1] 2 3   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.906