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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 5:01:19 PM

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In the screen before this one which I failed to save

it asked if both axis and allies wanted to continue the battle. I answerd yes for the sake of the AAR. If on the other hand if either had said no then the battle would have ended both sides aborting and have to return to their respective bases. But being bloodthirsty I said yes and the battle continued and the picture below was the result of the second part of the battle.

The Revenge was damaged in the first round of combat but could not durvive the second round[sunk]

The Gambia also damaged in round 1 has now been destroyed [sunk]

2 more cruisers the Canberra and the Frobisher have been aborted and if there had been a round 3 these 2 ships would not be in the equation they would have fled and the remaing ship would have been attacked. Only the BB Renown is left without damage and being a fair minded player I let her escape. Actually I forgot about her

Oh well!

Destroyed 3

BB Revenge
BB Resolution
Cl Gambia

Aborted 2

Cl Canberra
Cl Frobisher

Escaped

BB Renown

Final: if I had the carriers in the Coral sea instead of these small carriers in the Bay of Bengal no one would have escaped.

I will attempt to do the Battle in the Coral sea soon, it will include air to air combat first and you will see how that plays out. It seems maybe like this took a long time for the battle but you will be suprised at how quickly it plays out except for the constant decison making. [best part of the game]

Bo

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< Message edited by bo -- 9/14/2013 5:38:12 PM >

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Post #: 31

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 5:16:17 PM

Neilster

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From: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
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Am I wrong or is there an A5M1 fighter unit that has no other abilities and an air-to-air factor of zero? Surely they weren't that bad and what use is it then? Second fighter in an air-to-air combat (from my vague memory of the rules)?

Cheers, Neilster

< Message edited by Neilster -- 9/14/2013 5:20:43 PM >

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Post #: 32

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 5:40:18 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Neilster

Am I wrong or is there an A5M1 fighter unit that has no other abilities and an air-to-air factor of zero? Surely they weren't that bad and what use is it then? Second fighter in an air-to-air combat (from my vague memory of the rules)?

Cheers, Neilster

Hi Neilster hopefully better people than me can answer that question.

Cheers

Bo

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Post #: 33

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 6:37:53 PM

Centuur

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From: Hoorn (NED).
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quote:

ORIGINAL: bo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Neilster

Am I wrong or is there an A5M1 fighter unit that has no other abilities and an air-to-air factor of zero? Surely they weren't that bad and what use is it then? Second fighter in an air-to-air combat (from my vague memory of the rules)?

Cheers, Neilster

Hi Neilster hopefully better people than me can answer that question.

Cheers

Bo

Of course, Bo. Air-to-air factors of fighters (FTR) or in this case Carrier planes (CVP) acting as fighters start at 0 and goes up. There are indeed CVP which can only act as a FTR and have an air-to-air rating of 0.
The air-to-air table is based on the difference of the front FTR's air-to-air factor of both sides (where additional FTR's add an additional point as bonus). So if the CW has an air-to-air CVP with a 1 (and he also has got some low numbered CVP FTR's at start), and the Japanese only one with a 0, the results for the CW are rolled on the +1 column and the results of the Japanese on the -1 column, if both sides have only one FTR in the battle. Of course, the -1 column is worse than the +1 column...

It isn't the air-to-air value of the planes that are important, it is the difference between yours and the enemies air-to-air factor that gives you an advantage or disadvantage...

_____________________________

Peter

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Post #: 34

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 7:16:43 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Numdydar

Good work Bo. Please continue.

Also any thoughts on how it feels to play both sides? I assume it makes things harder as you have to track what both side are doing.

Hi Numdydar

Sorry I missed this post, will try to answer your question. I find it easy to do and I am no grognard, with the information Steve has put into this game, it is amazing you can keep track of anything anywheres. I will begin a post on the interface and maybe that will help all of us. This is a game that can be played solo though if someone had said that to me 2 years ago I would have thought they needed a shrink.

Bo

< Message edited by bo -- 9/14/2013 10:18:24 PM >

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Post #: 35

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 7:48:20 PM

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Before I do the the rest of the Guadalcanal AAR [Coral sea battle] I wanted to introduce some charts that you might find interesting. This is the optional rules screen.

You may use as many or as few as you desire, many will not change the course of the game much, but a few will drastically change the game IMO.

This is my chart for the rules that I use. When you get the game on your computer most likely it will have a fast start with novice rules, now I am not sure of that, that is up to the powers that be, it is beyond my pay grade.

I will comment on rules that to me are game changers, just my opinion.

If I do not get these perfect or to your liking please correct me. There is more to the rules then what I am showing.

1-Limited overseas supply-optional--this rule changes the way supply is handled for supplying troops over water [oceans,seas] without this rule Japanese troops on Tarawa or other islands are supplied automatically. With the rule in effect you need convoys chained together from sea area to sea area, I personally find the supply routine the most difficult for me to cope with, but thats just me.

2-Scs Transport rule-When in effect it handles how troops invade enemy shores. With this rule any infantry unit, divison, corp, army can invade an allowable hex. Also CL's can trasport Marine units and infantry divisions, very helpful for the Japanese in the Pacific theater.

3-Amphibious rule---This rule IMO changes the game. When this rule is in effect only marine units and infantry divisions can be used for invasions from transports. All large infantry units, Corps, Armies must invade from an Amphibious craft. This is just general information, a little more complicated than that.

4- Bottomed ships-- interesting rule. This rule makes port attacks a little more hazardous. If carrier planes attack a port, Pearl harbor, Calcutta, etc or any attack by any nation on any Port in the game, they have to deal with anti-aircraft fire first with maybe little rewards. If they bomb ships at sea and do great damage the ship might be destroyed [sunk] but possibly the same destruction in a harbor could lead to destroyed or a bottomed ship, the ships keel sits on the bottom and it can be salvaged in time.

5- Carrier planes [favorite rule] Without this rule carriers are the planes [implied attack power] I believe most new players and the WIFer's will use the carrier plane rule, your plane units are actual units with squadron names etc. Maxium 2 units on one carrier as long as they do not go over the carriers storage capacity.

6- Pilots - You need to train pilots to man the planes, you might have 3 planes available but one trained pilot so you have to careful as to what plane you assign him to, a carrier plane, land bomber or land fighter plane, what are your military needs at that time.

7-Oil rule- better people than me can explain the oil rule, I understand it but I might explain it wrong to new people.

If I make some mistakes hear I apoligize as I am pretty new at this game, I am just trying to give people here other than beta testers a taste of what's coming.

Bo

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< Message edited by bo -- 9/14/2013 10:44:40 PM >

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Post #: 36

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 8:47:32 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bo

sorry another screw up one day I will get this transferring pictures down right. doubt it.

Bo

< Message edited by bo -- 9/14/2013 9:37:23 PM >

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Post #: 37

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 8:51:59 PM

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This screen is probably the most important decison screen in the game. In many computer war games there are no restrictions as to how many moves you can make[units] [air] [naval] which could be very unrealistic.

In WW2 the US marines did not attack Tarawa, Iwo Jima, Kwajaline, Rabaul, Truk at the same time they had to do it in increments, they did not have enough landing boats to do all that at once and many other problematic things would impede such moves.

This screen keeps that in check.

Selections-Naval-Air-Land-Combined-Pass.

I will just do one the rest are self explanatory.

Naval selection

Air Missions -- allowed 2 air missions

Naval moves--unlimited --you can move every naval unit you have as long as it has moves coming [not disorganized etc.]

Rail moves--none

Land Moves--none

Land attacks --none

During one turn in MWIF [2 months] you may have as high as 6 of these impulses per side depending on the time of the year. Planning is essential to win. I am no Nimitz, I found that out.

One impulse you might do an all naval with 3 or 4 troop ships carrying marines for an invasion. Then on the next impulse use the land move selection which allows you to land all the marines into different areas and do unlimited ground attacks.

Personally I find this system amazing. If I have made mistakes please correct me and if I cannot answer a question because of lack of knowledge I will get one of our other beta testers to answer your question, I hope I am being helpfull.

Bo

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< Message edited by bo -- 9/14/2013 10:47:19 PM >

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Post #: 38

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 10:10:13 PM

JimMerson

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BRAVO!!!!

I love this AAR so far and can not wait for the Coral Sea battle.

Keep them coming!

Jim

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Post #: 39

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 11:51:23 PM

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Playing with novice rules is like driving a lechtractor

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Post #: 40

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 11:53:45 PM

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But when you play with advanced rules its like driving this

Get it.

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< Message edited by bo -- 9/14/2013 11:55:34 PM >

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Post #: 41

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/14/2013 11:58:04 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JimMerson

BRAVO!!!!

I love this AAR so far and can not wait for the Coral Sea battle.

Keep them coming!

Jim

Thank you Jim appreciate it.

Bo

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Post #: 42

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/15/2013 3:54:20 AM

Neilster

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From: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: bo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Neilster

Am I wrong or is there an A5M1 fighter unit that has no other abilities and an air-to-air factor of zero? Surely they weren't that bad and what use is it then? Second fighter in an air-to-air combat (from my vague memory of the rules)?

Cheers, Neilster

Hi Neilster hopefully better people than me can answer that question.

Cheers

Bo

Of course, Bo. Air-to-air factors of fighters (FTR) or in this case Carrier planes (CVP) acting as fighters start at 0 and goes up. There are indeed CVP which can only act as a FTR and have an air-to-air rating of 0.
The air-to-air table is based on the difference of the front FTR's air-to-air factor of both sides (where additional FTR's add an additional point as bonus). So if the CW has an air-to-air CVP with a 1 (and he also has got some low numbered CVP FTR's at start), and the Japanese only one with a 0, the results for the CW are rolled on the +1 column and the results of the Japanese on the -1 column, if both sides have only one FTR in the battle. Of course, the -1 column is worse than the +1 column...

It isn't the air-to-air value of the planes that are important, it is the difference between yours and the enemies air-to-air factor that gives you an advantage or disadvantage...

Thanks Peter. One of the many things I need to learn. I never really understood the naval rules (and many of the other rules, if I'm honest) and it was all a very long time ago anyway.

Cheers, Neilster

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Post #: 43

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/16/2013 11:25:40 AM

Easo79

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NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Some posts have been lost!!!

(well...perhaps some of my most embarrasing moments here at the forum are lost as well

)

< Message edited by Easo79 -- 9/16/2013 11:31:34 AM >

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Post #: 44

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/16/2013 3:54:46 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Easo79

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Some posts have been lost!!!

(well...perhaps some of my most embarrasing moments here at the forum are lost as well )

No Easo79 I saved the most embarrasing ones for all to enjoy again

Yeah it was a shame [the crash] but I am back at it and I do hope Orm gets back at it, he is way more in tune with the game and its rules than I am, already posted zoom and optional rules today hope you like them.

Bo

< Message edited by bo -- 9/16/2013 3:55:15 PM >

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/16/2013 4:02:55 PM

Extraneous

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Easo79

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Did you know that's an exact quote from the player I shot down in Richthofen's War at Origins when my critical said "Pilot Killed".

_____________________________

University of Science Music and Culture (USMC) class of 71 and 72 ~ Extraneous (AKA Mziln)

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 9/22/2013 1:52:48 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous

quote:

ORIGINAL: Easo79

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Did you know that's an exact quote from the player I shot down in Richthofen's War at Origins when my critical said "Pilot Killed".

Was that an online game or do you sit with other players at a gaming convention?

Bo

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Post #: 47

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/13/2013 11:08:48 PM

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Lots of questions invasion and such I want to bring this post to the front.

Bo

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Post #: 48

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/15/2013 9:39:00 PM

comsolut

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Seems odd that Guadalcanal is NOT an objective hex in this scenario.

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/15/2013 11:53:27 PM

Numdydar

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Historically it was not that much of an actual strategic objective. It is just that the US and Japan made it one. If Japan had not decided to build an airfield there, the action may have been located somewhere else, like around New Guniea versus the Solomons.

< Message edited by Numdydar -- 11/16/2013 12:53:42 AM >

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/16/2013 12:43:43 AM

brian brian

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whole games of World in Flames can occur with never a unit landing on Guadalcanal actually.

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/16/2013 12:59:59 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: brian brian

whole games of World in Flames can occur with never a unit landing on Guadalcanal actually.

You are 100% correct brian, the only reason I attacked Guadalcanal was just to show newcomers and experienced board game players how the computer handled invasions, another thing you could go the whole game and never see a sea battle, they were big areas Coral sea, Bay of bengal etc.

I forced naval interceptions as a beta tester, someone might have a possible percentage of naval interceptions through the long history of the board game.

Bo

< Message edited by bo -- 11/16/2013 2:00:54 AM >

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Post #: 52

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/16/2013 10:37:07 AM

comsolut

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I just wonder whether the scenario would improve by forcing a point of conflict.

Plus the scenario is titled Guadalcanal. Seems odd it is not a victory hex.

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/16/2013 11:15:10 AM

Neilster

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The scenario names are usually historically based to give a feel for when they are. The actual action can radically diverge from history.

As has been noted, it was an accident of history that momentous things happened at Guadalcanal. There's nothing intrinsically there that deserves a game objective hex. This scenario actually involves much of the Pacific Theatre of Operations.

Cheers, Neilster

< Message edited by Neilster -- 11/16/2013 12:18:26 PM >

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Post #: 54

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/16/2013 12:48:55 PM

captskillet

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bo since this was a new game I assume your setup is different than the quick start one, the SNLF start out in Singapore (in fact there is nothing in Rabaul at start) and I cant get them to the 'Canal in the 1st Impulse unless I am doing something wrong...in fact its Turn 2 before I can get the units reorganized to invade and by then I already have US waiting...........what am I doing wrong if anything?

_____________________________

"Git thar fust with the most men" - Gen. Nathan Bedford Forrest

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/16/2013 4:00:55 PM

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It is my mission here on MWIF to change your name from captskillet to captskilled

The picture below depicts several naval units in the Coral sea that came from the port of Singapore in one move and went into sea box 1. Did you mean you could reach the Coral sea but could not invade?

If you could not invade then you must have used the option "naval move'" Remember that in naval move no land moves are allowed and you must have land moves available to invade.

To invade in the same first turn you must use the Combine command, when the naval move comes up send your fleet with the Marines into the Coral sea, they will go in sea box 1. A game rule, if they were in sea box 0 they cannot invade.

When you go through the next few impulses like land moves air rebase etc, do nothing wait until you come to debark and invasion, you will see in the upper left corner box unit or units "do not do debark", the next impulse will be invasion, just move them onto Guadalcanal. Let me know if that helped you.

Bo

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/16/2013 5:57:59 PM

captskillet

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quote:

If you could not invade then you must have used the option "naval move'"

that was it bo..........my semi-old forgetful self forgot to use a combined move instead of naval only, moved to Coral Sea & invasion went off like a charm.............sons of Nippon now in control of the Slot.

_____________________________

"Git thar fust with the most men" - Gen. Nathan Bedford Forrest

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 11/16/2013 6:05:52 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: captskillet

quote:

If you could not invade then you must have used the option "naval move'"

that was it bo..........my semi-old forgetful self forgot to use a combined move instead of naval only, moved to Coral Sea & invasion went off like a charm.............sons of Nippon now in control of the Slot.

I bet you ignored the notional unit out of fear

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RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 1/29/2014 2:38:09 AM

76mm

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bo thanks for this, I have to say that after playing the Barbarossa scenario several times, I've been completely baffled thus far by the Guadalcanal scenario...in addition to general confusion about game mechanics, I don't think I've ever played a Pac wargame so don't know how to set up or what I'm trying to achieve...then I can't get planes to fly, troops to load, or fleets to find each other--virtually the entire Jap and US fleets have been in the same sea area (with carriers and aircraft) for about 3 impulses, and neither have been able to find each other--is that normal?

I will probably have additional detailed questions if you are still updating this AAR...

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Post #: 59

RE: Guadalcanal Scenario - 1/29/2014 4:04:34 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: 76mm

bo thanks for this, I have to say that after playing the Barbarossa scenario several times, I've been completely baffled thus far by the Guadalcanal scenario...in addition to general confusion about game mechanics, I don't think I've ever played a Pac wargame so don't know how to set up or what I'm trying to achieve...then I can't get planes to fly, troops to load, or fleets to find each other--virtually the entire Jap and US fleets have been in the same sea area (with carriers and aircraft) for about 3 impulses, and neither have been able to find each other--is that normal?

I will probably have additional detailed questions if you are still updating this AAR...

Hi 76mm

I usually dont look at the forums in this area, just happended to see this. I am not doing anymore with this AAR. But I will be glad to help you in any area I can with Guadalcanal to get you up to speed. We can do all the conversations here or by e-mail [bowenw1@verizon] the difference is I will be able to answer you more quickly with e-mail but it does not matter to me. I personally do not care how long it takes to get you up to snuff just that I can do it.

Answer to the question of 3 impulses and not finding each other. It is not only normal, but the two opposing naval forces may never see each other in the whole 5 turn scenario. What you saw in my sea battles is that I forced interception with my beta tools just for the sake of the AAR, the players other than beta tester will not be able to do that. Other than the forced interception I let the program play out with no interference by me.

Are you using Fast start or did you start a new game? The picture below is when I set up a new game and placed most of my forces in Rabaul. The next picture is the optional rules i have in effect, you do not have to use the rules I have you can delete or add to these your own rules if you prefer. NP.

You mentioned about you could not load troops. To load troops for either debarkation or invasion you must use either the Naval move or combination move EG: if you want to invade Guadalcanal on the first move you must select the combination move, because to invade you must have a land move available to you during the invasion phase and you cannot invade in a storm. You right click on the transport icon and select a Japanese marine unit and move it to a sea box in the Coral Sea.

As the program goes through its sequences it will come to land moves, do nothing, when it comes to debarkation do nothing, when it comes to invasion then invade Guadalcanal. If you use 2 Marine units then you have to have 2 land moves left to invade and they both must invade the same hex because you are only allowed 1 attack during that move.

Bo

Bill