ASW Tutorial Question

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ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 5:03:25 PM

tmastern1

Posts: 2
Joined: 9/25/2013
Status: offline

In the second tutorial, my sub has fired off 6 torpedo's, and merrily chased them into the target area. Now ,I've got 6 fish and the sub all driving around in the target box, looking for the Chinese sub.
Shouldn't the blue sub avoid the area where 6 torpedo's are actively searching for the target?

Troy

Post #: 1

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 6:57:33 PM

jmscho

Posts: 126
Joined: 9/21/2004
From: York, UK
Status: offline

Sounds a bit like overkill. I've played the ASW tutorial twice. Once allowing the AI to do most of the work and again using closer manual control. The second method had the better result. I found that the targets like to run away so I could follow up deep at high speed ready to slow down and make the next shot.

(in reply to tmastern1)

Post #: 2

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 7:02:21 PM

tmastern1

Posts: 2
Joined: 9/25/2013
Status: offline

Yeah, manual would probably be better, but I'm more concerned with the fact that 6 torpedos and my sub were all within a few thousand meters of each other, and the topedos didn't acquire me.....

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Post #: 3

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 7:36:59 PM

NefariousKoel

Posts: 2930
Joined: 7/23/2002
From: Murderous Missouri Scum
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tmastern@gmail.com

Yeah, manual would probably be better, but I'm more concerned with the fact that 6 torpedos and my sub were all within a few thousand meters of each other, and the topedos didn't acquire me.....

Not sure if accidental wire-cutting is modelled, but if they still had wires then they could be kept from seeking on you. Although I believe many older subs had a limit on how many wire-guided torpedoes they could control at once.

The AI firing six submarine-launched torpedoes at one target sounds rather extreme, too.

I would expect two in most cases, and probably one if the target is damaged. Torpedoes are a very limited resource on a sub. Driving into the middle of Active torpedoes can't be a good thing though, no matter which way you cut it.

I'm gonna try to remember to regularly save my gaves under different names, in case this stuff pops up. Don't really want to test at all but if I manage to catch something that's pretty clear-cut then I'd feel negligent if I didn't send it in.

< Message edited by NefariousKoel -- 9/25/2013 7:38:10 PM >

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Post #: 4

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 9:50:41 PM

tmastern_slith

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Joined: 9/25/2013
Status: offline

Also noticed that the sub fired at the DDG in area B two more times AFTER the Luhu sunk event had been triggered.

Troy

(in reply to NefariousKoel)

Post #: 5

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 9:59:11 PM

mikmykWS

Posts: 11524
Joined: 3/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tmastern@gmail.com

In the second tutorial, my sub has fired off 6 torpedo's, and merrily chased them into the target area. Now ,I've got 6 fish and the sub all driving around in the target box, looking for the Chinese sub.
Shouldn't the blue sub avoid the area where 6 torpedo's are actively searching for the target?

Troy

Yes probably. How did you order the attack and I'll walk through the logic and how you can prevent it.

Thanks!

Mike

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Post #: 6

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 10:13:22 PM

tmastern_slith

Posts: 6
Joined: 9/25/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

quote:

ORIGINAL: tmastern@gmail.com

In the second tutorial, my sub has fired off 6 torpedo's, and merrily chased them into the target area. Now ,I've got 6 fish and the sub all driving around in the target box, looking for the Chinese sub.
Shouldn't the blue sub avoid the area where 6 torpedo's are actively searching for the target?

Troy

Yes probably. How did you order the attack and I'll walk through the logic and how you can prevent it.

Thanks!

Mike

Hi Mike,

It was all strictly AI control. I just set up the patrol area and let the sub have at it...
As soon as it fired, it went to flank speed directly towards the contact, cavitating all the way, and firing 5 more shots. The contact ended up being false, as the target was actually several miles away, but on the same bearing. But the 6 actively searching torpedos and the sub continued to swarm around the original target area,with the torpedos never acquiring the sub. even though they were right on top of each other.....

Troy

(in reply to mikmykWS)

Post #: 7

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 10:24:42 PM

mikmykWS

Posts: 11524
Joined: 3/22/2005
Status: offline

Okay there is a ROE called Engaging Ambiguous targets. If you set that to pessimistic if won't fire as many. 6 seems alot even for optimistic so I'm wondering if the target was acquired a couple of times. Hmmm.. I'll play around abit and take a look.

As far as hitting the firing unit with its own torps and wire cutting we're looking at that now. Its a level of detail we need to take a look at.

Mike

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Post #: 8

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 11:04:13 PM

NefariousKoel

Posts: 2930
Joined: 7/23/2002
From: Murderous Missouri Scum
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tmastern

Also noticed that the sub fired at the DDG in area B two more times AFTER the Luhu sunk event had been triggered.

Troy

I've had this happen with missiles recently, too. Although I can't reliably reproduce it. It must take the right mixture to encite, possibly mixed with the text window pop-up triggered by the destruction of the tutorial target(s) involved.

I posted a thread on such behavior here: http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3417459

It may not be reliably reproduced, maybe we can capture it with the Record option sometime. Although recording makes some of the interface more sluggish for me.

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Post #: 9

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/25/2013 11:11:42 PM

NefariousKoel

Posts: 2930
Joined: 7/23/2002
From: Murderous Missouri Scum
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

Okay there is a ROE called Engaging Ambiguous targets. If you set that to pessimistic if won't fire as many. 6 seems alot even for optimistic so I'm wondering if the target was acquired a couple of times. Hmmm.. I'll play around abit and take a look.

I'm pretty sure the default setting for that is already on Pessimistic. Or should we be using Optimistic to save ammo?

quote:

As far as hitting the firing unit with its own torps and wire cutting we're looking at that now. Its a level of detail we need to take a look at.

Mike

I'd be concerned about the 'assistant' AI being able to avoid it's own torpedoes, if that were added. If you guys can get it to avoid going near it's own torpedoes, and they can home in on their own, then great! However, it sounds like something that would take a lot of fine tuning.

Also, if it's added, I'd like to be able to shut down or self-destruct my wire-guided torpedoes if need be. Sometimes my first torpedo hits home and I have a second one on the loose, searching for another target with active sonar. Makes me nervous even if friendly torpedoes can't currently hit your own side, they can still lock on to neutrals can't they?

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Post #: 10

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/26/2013 12:03:00 AM

ExMachina

Posts: 462
Joined: 9/25/2013
Status: offline

quote:

Also noticed that the sub fired at the DDG in area B two more times AFTER the Luhu sunk event had been triggered.

Troy

I'll add a "me too" to this one

(in reply to tmastern_slith)

Post #: 11

RE: ASW Tutorial Question - 9/26/2013 12:11:02 AM

tmastern_slith

Posts: 6
Joined: 9/25/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NefariousKoel

quote:

ORIGINAL: mikmyk

Okay there is a ROE called Engaging Ambiguous targets. If you set that to pessimistic if won't fire as many. 6 seems alot even for optimistic so I'm wondering if the target was acquired a couple of times. Hmmm.. I'll play around abit and take a look.

I'm pretty sure the default setting for that is already on Pessimistic. Or should we be using Optimistic to save ammo?

quote:

As far as hitting the firing unit with its own torps and wire cutting we're looking at that now. Its a level of detail we need to take a look at.

Mike

I'd be concerned about the 'assistant' AI being able to avoid it's own torpedoes, if that were added. If you guys can get it to avoid going near it's own torpedoes, and they can home in on their own, then great! However, it sounds like something that would take a lot of fine tuning.

Also, if it's added, I'd like to be able to shut down or self-destruct my wire-guided torpedoes if need be. Sometimes my first torpedo hits home and I have a second one on the loose, searching for another target with active sonar. Makes me nervous even if friendly torpedoes can't currently hit your own side, they can still lock on to neutrals can't they?