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American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 8:47:11 AM

Xilana

Posts: 36
Joined: 5/7/2012
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Curious...

Does anyone consider playing with fixed US torpedoes early when playing an opponent. I would think its a fair play given the ability of the players to change tactics/doctrine based on lessons learned from history.

Post #: 1

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 8:58:28 AM

LoBaron

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From: Vienna, Austria
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As far as PBEM is concerned, you will not get many Japanese players to agree to this. Working torps can be absolutely devastating early war if an Allied player knows how to best deploy subs.

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Post #: 2

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 10:17:31 AM

zuluhour

Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
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nice try.

(in reply to LoBaron)

Post #: 3

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 2:04:22 PM

HexHead

Posts: 464
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From: I'm from New Hampshire; I only work in cyberspace
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My IJ opponent agreed to this in a Scen 2 PbeM.

We're at the end of Dec41 & it's been OK, so far. Nothing spectacular - I may or may not have put a scare into a CV or two and perhaps a bit more - but maybe nothing.

In a Scen 1 PbeM, still early 42, I have sunk a CV with a Dutch boat (I think - somewhat sure). The Working Torps PbeM has seen a 'steadier' results curve for AKs, but that's about it, so far.

_____________________________

"Goddamn it, they're gittin' away!!"
- unknown tincan sailor near the end of Leyte Gulf, when Kurita retired

(in reply to zuluhour)

Post #: 4

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 3:59:13 PM

Flicker

Posts: 229
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From: Rocket City USA
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IIRC the dud torpedoes are carried by USN fleet boats; Dutch, British, and USN Sugar boats can be fairly effective early in the war.

(in reply to HexHead)

Post #: 5

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 5:25:34 PM

kaleun

Posts: 5145
Joined: 5/29/2002
From: Colorado
Status: offline

quote:

IIRC the dud torpedoes are carried by USN fleet boats; Dutch, British, and USN Sugar boats can be fairly effective early in the war.

Yes, it is always nice to see the Dutch and S boats at work!.

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Appear at places to which he must hasten; move swiftly where he does not expect you.
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Post #: 6

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 5:42:21 PM

mike scholl 1

Posts: 1265
Joined: 2/17/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: venividivici10044a

Curious...

Does anyone consider playing with fixed US torpedoes early when playing an opponent. I would think its a fair play given the ability of the players to change tactics/doctrine based on lessons learned from history.

Not much chance unless your opponent is asking for something totally non-historic as well..., like PDU ON.

(in reply to Xilana)

Post #: 7

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 7:15:38 PM

Lokasenna

Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HexHead

In a Scen 1 PbeM, still early 42, I have sunk a CV with a Dutch boat (I think - somewhat sure). The Working Torps PbeM has seen a 'steadier' results curve for AKs, but that's about it, so far.

Have you, now?

Mostly reliable torps makes a difference against xAKs, as that's where most of your attacks will be, but it's certainly deadly to warships as well.

(in reply to HexHead)

Post #: 8

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 7:17:15 PM

Lokasenna

Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1

quote:

ORIGINAL: venividivici10044a

Curious...

Does anyone consider playing with fixed US torpedoes early when playing an opponent. I would think its a fair play given the ability of the players to change tactics/doctrine based on lessons learned from history.

Not much chance unless your opponent is asking for something totally non-historic as well..., like PDU ON.

IMO PDU On is just about as useful to the Allies as to Japan. A better tradeoff might be reliable torps for not having to pay PPs for marching across borders and Realistic R&D Off. Even then...reliable torps might have a far greater effect than 3k AV from Manchukuo and being able to change between R&D and production factories.

(in reply to mike scholl 1)

Post #: 9

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/12/2013 9:13:17 PM

HexHead

Posts: 464
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From: I'm from New Hampshire; I only work in cyberspace
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

quote:

ORIGINAL: HexHead

In a Scen 1 PbeM, still early 42, I have sunk a CV with a Dutch boat (I think - somewhat sure). The Working Torps PbeM has seen a 'steadier' results curve for AKs, but that's about it, so far.

Have you, now?

Mostly reliable torps makes a difference against xAKs, as that's where most of your attacks will be, but it's certainly deadly to warships as well.

Small sample, one month, but just a little bit of difference seems apparent already. More like bagging six merchies instead of two in the opening weeks.

A guerre de course is now playable from the start. Attrition of merchant and tanker hulls, from the beginning - I'll take it. Sending IJN keels to the bottom is gravy.

_____________________________

"Goddamn it, they're gittin' away!!"
- unknown tincan sailor near the end of Leyte Gulf, when Kurita retired

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 10

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 12:02:10 AM

crsutton

Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
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Don't do it. If you get into 1945 as the Allies, you will be embarrassed that you even considered it. All things equal, the Japanese player needs all the help he can get.

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Post #: 11

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 7:31:10 AM

GreyJoy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Don't do it. If you get into 1945 as the Allies, you will be embarrassed that you even considered it. All things equal, the Japanese player needs all the help he can get.

The allied SS fleet is so big and grows so large that, with reliable torps, it will soon become almost impossible for the japs to move anything outside the LBA ASW umbrella.
Also, if you play DBB, the Japanese naval ASW is so nerfed that the game will really be umbalanced.

my 0.00002 cents

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 12

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 2:36:10 PM

mike scholl 1

Posts: 1265
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

quote:

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1

quote:

ORIGINAL: venividivici10044a

Curious...

Does anyone consider playing with fixed US torpedoes early when playing an opponent. I would think its a fair play given the ability of the players to change tactics/doctrine based on lessons learned from history.

Not much chance unless your opponent is asking for something totally non-historic as well..., like PDU ON.

IMO PDU On is just about as useful to the Allies as to Japan. A better tradeoff might be reliable torps for not having to pay PPs for marching across borders and Realistic R&D Off. Even then...reliable torps might have a far greater effect than 3k AV from Manchukuo and being able to change between R&D and production factories.

In truth, I was just making a point. What I would really ask for in exchange for PDU ON is "Withdrawals OFF". Not because I think the Allies need extra units..., but to save the endless hours spent in hunting down the right unit and getting it to the right place. This is just "busywork" (the unit is ALWAYS somewhere hard to get when it needs to be withdrawn).

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 13

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 4:52:35 PM

LoBaron

Posts: 4776
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From: Vienna, Austria
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1
but to save the endless hours spent in hunting down the right unit and getting it to the right place

Either you are doing it wrong (by the intel screen/ship withdrawals), or you are hopelessly exaggerating.

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Post #: 14

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 5:00:59 PM

HexHead

Posts: 464
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From: I'm from New Hampshire; I only work in cyberspace
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LoBaron

quote:

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1
but to save the endless hours spent in hunting down the right unit and getting it to the right place

Either you are doing it wrong (by the intel screen/ship withdrawals), or you are hopelessly exaggerating.

Well, it is a PITA. As long as one is going to 'adjust' certain quasi-historical 'realities', why not this one? Do the 'extra' units make all that big a diff?

_____________________________

"Goddamn it, they're gittin' away!!"
- unknown tincan sailor near the end of Leyte Gulf, when Kurita retired

(in reply to LoBaron)

Post #: 15

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 6:25:01 PM

LoBaron

Posts: 4776
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Vienna, Austria
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HexHead

quote:

ORIGINAL: LoBaron

quote:

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1
but to save the endless hours spent in hunting down the right unit and getting it to the right place

Either you are doing it wrong (by the intel screen/ship withdrawals), or you are hopelessly exaggerating.

Well, it is a PITA. As long as one is going to 'adjust' certain quasi-historical 'realities', why not this one? Do the 'extra' units make all that big a diff?

Are you kidding? Ships is only part of it. Countless air units, and most of all masses of LCUs get withdrawn. You bet that makes a difference.

And I might add that it is a piece of cake compared to managing the Japanese industry and avoid that single mistake that makes you lose the war...

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Post #: 16

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 9:33:19 PM

HexHead

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I dunno, I'd hafta look at the Ground W-draw screen again. Didn't seem like an immensity to me.

Frankly, if, like Jellicoe, one feels like one can lose the war in an afternoon, then one is in the wrong game.

I am diametrically opposite in this view. It's Petrosian, not Tal. It's a patient accumulation of perhaps small, yet telling, advantages, that, over months and years, integrate and fuse to enable victory on the map.

Still, the central point is Ahistorical is Ahistorical. I agreed to a Scen2 game with very few HRs. Esteemed opponent pulled a Mersing, which I had forgotten about. Tough, get used to it, crybaby.

I don't think No Ws would be a crusher - mebbe I'm wrong.

_____________________________

"Goddamn it, they're gittin' away!!"
- unknown tincan sailor near the end of Leyte Gulf, when Kurita retired

(in reply to LoBaron)

Post #: 17

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 9:55:10 PM

axyarthur

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Joined: 10/1/2012
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In my first game against AI, I made the mistake of turning reliable torpedoes on. The result is that by mid 1943, Japan has less than 100 AKs and xAks and exactly 1 AP afloat. Granted not all of them are sunk by subs, and this is the AI, but the effect can be devastating.
I stopped the game shortly after that.

(in reply to Xilana)

Post #: 18

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/13/2013 11:12:45 PM

AW1Steve

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From: Mordor Illlinois
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I find it very amusing that so many JFB's are always looking for an opponent to play an "upgraded" scenario that favors the Japanese , then proceed to come up with an amazing list of HR's to further emasculate the allies. THEN then crow about how good they are in their AAR's.

Yet I never hear AFB's requesting mods or selection like "reliable torpedoes".

Now when I play as the Japanese (yes I know I haven't played them yet in a GC...but I've played them in every single other scenario to many players) I don't are if I win or lose , simply that I do better then the actual Japanese admiral did. I recognize the challenge. And accept it. I just think JFB's are (please insert wise ass sarcastic smiley here) pansy's.

So there!

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Post #: 19

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/14/2013 2:08:53 AM

Wirraway_Ace

Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Don't do it. If you get into 1945 as the Allies, you will be embarrassed that you even considered it. All things equal, the Japanese player needs all the help he can get.

So true.

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 20

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/14/2013 2:40:28 AM

Lokasenna

Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I find it very amusing that so many JFB's are always looking for an opponent to play an "upgraded" scenario that favors the Japanese , then proceed to come up with an amazing list of HR's to further emasculate the allies. THEN then crow about how good they are in their AAR's. Yet I never hear AFB's requesting mods or selection like "reliable torpedoes".

Now when I play as the Japanese (yes I know I haven't played them yet in a GC...but I've played them in every single other scenario to many players) I don't are if I win or lose , simply that I do better then the actual Japanese admiral did. I recognize the challenge. And accept it. I just think JFB's are (please insert wise ass sarcastic smiley here) pansy's. So there!

Oh?

Real men, AFB or JFB, play with no HRs. At all.

;)

(in reply to AW1Steve)

Post #: 21

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/14/2013 5:47:29 AM

LoBaron

Posts: 4776
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Vienna, Austria
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: HexHead

I dunno, I'd hafta look at the Ground W-draw screen again. Didn't seem like an immensity to me.

It does not need to be.

As Japanese you have to set target dates and keep timelines. To get the fuel production up and running and to give enough time to set up a defensive perimeter (or several FWIIW) for when the Allied counterattack begins.
Every unit not disappearing is another roadblock to overcome. Every eng squad builds up forts faster. Most of the units are small and second rate, but they prevent the Japanese from keeping timelines and to take freebees. Same for air units, or ships.

quote:

Still, the central point is Ahistorical is Ahistorical. I agreed to a Scen2 game with very few HRs. Esteemed opponent pulled a Mersing, which I had forgotten about. Tough, get used to it, crybaby.

I don't think No Ws would be a crusher - mebbe I'm wrong.

Scen2 is different. I never talk about Scen2 if a discussion revolves around additional help for the Japanese. Scen2 IS the additional help already. It is a fantasy scenario and nothing of what I have said above applies to it.

In Scen1 OTOH, what Allied players often love to forget, 20/20 hindsight works stronger for the Allies than for the JApanese and this including PDU ON. I don�t think I am such a superior Allied player compared to the rest that I am the only one who notices that.

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Post #: 22

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/14/2013 3:41:16 PM

crsutton

Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LoBaron

quote:

ORIGINAL: HexHead

quote:

ORIGINAL: LoBaron

quote:

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1
but to save the endless hours spent in hunting down the right unit and getting it to the right place

Either you are doing it wrong (by the intel screen/ship withdrawals), or you are hopelessly exaggerating.

Well, it is a PITA. As long as one is going to 'adjust' certain quasi-historical 'realities', why not this one? Do the 'extra' units make all that big a diff?

Are you kidding? Ships is only part of it. Countless air units, and most of all masses of LCUs get withdrawn. You bet that makes a difference.

And I might add that it is a piece of cake compared to managing the Japanese industry and avoid that single mistake that makes you lose the war...

Basically, you should give pretty much any advantage to you IJN partner that you can. All things being equal, they will need it and you will have the pleasure of going deeper into the game. I would never do Quiet China though.

My only experience has been as the Allies playing scen #2. If I were playing stock it is the only one I would want to play. It is a bit hairy in 42 and 43, but in the end much more exciting with the realistic expectation that you will have a challenging fun game that can go deep into 1945. I have said it before and will say it again, if the Allied player keeps his cool and his carriers intact, there is no situation that he can't recover from, and with players of equal skill-he should always win.

I did a lot of whining about the edge that my Japanese opponents had but that was when I was stuck in 1942 and 43. Now I am a bit embarrassed about my complaining. Those of you who have got to 45 in a game know what I am saying. The Allies just get so much stuff from mid 44 on that it is really impossible to use it all. And unless you really screw the pooch, you pretty much can whip butt anywhere you want. Just ask Viperpol who had played a great game from the Japanese side in our campaign. Heck, a vanilla US Infantry division has 27 pershing tanks and 27 Sherman 105 support tanks in 1945. Try to find two Japanese divisions that can stand up to it. And I am about to turn my Soviet dogs loose on Ark. You should see what a Soviet Mech corps looks like. It is unholy with about 800 AV for a single unit!

Next campaign for me will be one of the Babes.

< Message edited by crsutton -- 11/14/2013 4:56:59 PM >

_____________________________

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Post #: 23

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/14/2013 3:44:31 PM

AW1Steve

Posts: 14507
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: Mordor Illlinois
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I find it very amusing that so many JFB's are always looking for an opponent to play an "upgraded" scenario that favors the Japanese , then proceed to come up with an amazing list of HR's to further emasculate the allies. THEN then crow about how good they are in their AAR's. Yet I never hear AFB's requesting mods or selection like "reliable torpedoes".

Now when I play as the Japanese (yes I know I haven't played them yet in a GC...but I've played them in every single other scenario to many players) I don't are if I win or lose , simply that I do better then the actual Japanese admiral did. I recognize the challenge. And accept it. I just think JFB's are (please insert wise ass sarcastic smiley here) pansy's. So there!

Oh?

Real men, AFB or JFB, play with no HRs. At all.

;)

Could not agree more!~

_____________________________

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 24

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/14/2013 3:47:56 PM

AW1Steve

Posts: 14507
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: Mordor Illlinois
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

quote:

ORIGINAL: LoBaron

quote:

ORIGINAL: HexHead

quote:

ORIGINAL: LoBaron

quote:

ORIGINAL: mike scholl 1
but to save the endless hours spent in hunting down the right unit and getting it to the right place

Either you are doing it wrong (by the intel screen/ship withdrawals), or you are hopelessly exaggerating.

Well, it is a PITA. As long as one is going to 'adjust' certain quasi-historical 'realities', why not this one? Do the 'extra' units make all that big a diff?

Are you kidding? Ships is only part of it. Countless air units, and most of all masses of LCUs get withdrawn. You bet that makes a difference.

And I might add that it is a piece of cake compared to managing the Japanese industry and avoid that single mistake that makes you lose the war...

Basically, you should give pretty much any advantage to you IJN partner that you can. All things being equal, they will need it and you will have the pleasure of going deeper into the game. I would never do quite China though.

But the point is all things are NOT equal. The point of the game is to see if you are better than the commander. NOTHING in war is ever equal. Unless you are trying "an experiment" , when you mess with the order , you mess with reality. An equivalent would be giving Lee 50,000 more men at Gettysburg. What would that prove?

If you want an equal game , try chess. If you want the near ultimate challenge , try WITP AE.

_____________________________

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Post #: 25

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/15/2013 3:23:54 AM

Chickenboy

Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I find it very amusing that so many JFB's are always looking for an opponent to play an "upgraded" scenario that favors the Japanese , then proceed to come up with an amazing list of HR's to further emasculate the allies. THEN then crow about how good they are in their AAR's. Yet I never hear AFB's requesting mods or selection like "reliable torpedoes".

Now when I play as the Japanese (yes I know I haven't played them yet in a GC...but I've played them in every single other scenario to many players) I don't are if I win or lose , simply that I do better then the actual Japanese admiral did. I recognize the challenge. And accept it. I just think JFB's are (please insert wise ass sarcastic smiley here) pansy's. So there!

Oh?

Real men, AFB or JFB, play with no HRs. At all.

;)

Meh. I'm more impressed with Japanese players that tackle no HR games. There's something decidedly girly about insisting on the 'stronger' position (the Allies) for the long game and then insisting on no HRs to mitigate the gameplay moving forward. Not an equal contest by any stretch. Japanese players that stick to games like that have my respect.

Allied players? There's no sacrifice in assuring yourself the strong hand in the long run and expediting the demise of your opponent's ability to resist.

_____________________________

(in reply to Lokasenna)

Post #: 26

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/15/2013 3:26:36 AM

Chickenboy

Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

But the point is all things are NOT equal. The point of the game is to see if you are better than the commander.

Nooooo.... The point of the game is for both parties to have fun. What specific mental gymnastics you go through to validate your gameplay fun factor is up to you. If it takes you pretending that you're better than the real life commander, then that's how you motivate yourself. Other people's motives(including mine own) vary.

< Message edited by Chickenboy -- 11/15/2013 4:26:53 AM >

_____________________________

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Post #: 27

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/15/2013 1:21:02 PM

Bullwinkle58

Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I find it very amusing that so many JFB's are always looking for an opponent to play an "upgraded" scenario that favors the Japanese , then proceed to come up with an amazing list of HR's to further emasculate the allies. THEN then crow about how good they are in their AAR's. Yet I never hear AFB's requesting mods or selection like "reliable torpedoes".

Now when I play as the Japanese (yes I know I haven't played them yet in a GC...but I've played them in every single other scenario to many players) I don't are if I win or lose , simply that I do better then the actual Japanese admiral did. I recognize the challenge. And accept it. I just think JFB's are (please insert wise ass sarcastic smiley here) pansy's. So there!

Oh?

Real men, AFB or JFB, play with no HRs. At all.

;)

Meh. I'm more impressed with Japanese players that tackle no HR games. There's something decidedly girly about insisting on the 'stronger' position (the Allies) for the long game and then insisting on no HRs to mitigate the gameplay moving forward. Not an equal contest by any stretch. Japanese players that stick to games like that have my respect.

Allied players? There's no sacrifice in assuring yourself the strong hand in the long run and expediting the demise of your opponent's ability to resist.

Interesting that you essentially admit that HRs exist solely to aid the Japanese player. Few Japan players would be so bold, or truthful.

In both my games, including one against Lokasenna, Japan has:

1) Scenario 2
2) Non-historic R&D
3) Advanced weather OFF
4) PDU ON
5) Dud torpedoes ON

In addition, I told Lokasenna that if he wanted to he could set my reinforcements to any variable time he liked and not tell me. From memory I don't think he told me what he did, nor do I need to know now.

In exchange for that menu of Japan-aid all I ask is for BOTH sides to play the game as designed and balanced. The features built into the game--op tempo, "rice" av gas, multi-engine torpedo accuracy, Allied float plane wonderments, submarine patrol cycle times and all the rest--are what they are and we don't tweak them subjectively. Some features exist to balance other features.

But I think the above menu of Japan-aid gives a Japanese player the very best chance they need to get an auto-vic. Further hampering the Allies in 1942 is just not on.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to Chickenboy)

Post #: 28

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/15/2013 2:01:15 PM

AW1Steve

Posts: 14507
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: Mordor Illlinois
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

But the point is all things are NOT equal. The point of the game is to see if you are better than the commander.

Nooooo.... The point of the game is for both parties to have fun. What specific mental gymnastics you go through to validate your gameplay fun factor is up to you. If it takes you pretending that you're better than the real life commander, then that's how you motivate yourself. Other people's motives(including mine own) vary.

Stacking the deck against your opponent as much as possible is your definition of "having fun"?

Hmmmmm....

_____________________________

(in reply to Chickenboy)

Post #: 29

RE: American Torpedoes - 11/15/2013 2:01:57 PM

AW1Steve

Posts: 14507
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: Mordor Illlinois
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I find it very amusing that so many JFB's are always looking for an opponent to play an "upgraded" scenario that favors the Japanese , then proceed to come up with an amazing list of HR's to further emasculate the allies. THEN then crow about how good they are in their AAR's. Yet I never hear AFB's requesting mods or selection like "reliable torpedoes".

Now when I play as the Japanese (yes I know I haven't played them yet in a GC...but I've played them in every single other scenario to many players) I don't are if I win or lose , simply that I do better then the actual Japanese admiral did. I recognize the challenge. And accept it. I just think JFB's are (please insert wise ass sarcastic smiley here) pansy's. So there!

Oh?

Real men, AFB or JFB, play with no HRs. At all.

;)

Meh. I'm more impressed with Japanese players that tackle no HR games. There's something decidedly girly about insisting on the 'stronger' position (the Allies) for the long game and then insisting on no HRs to mitigate the gameplay moving forward. Not an equal contest by any stretch. Japanese players that stick to games like that have my respect.

Allied players? There's no sacrifice in assuring yourself the strong hand in the long run and expediting the demise of your opponent's ability to resist.

Interesting that you essentially admit that HRs exist solely to aid the Japanese player. Few Japan players would be so bold, or truthful.

In both my games, including one against Lokasenna, Japan has:

1) Scenario 2
2) Non-historic R&D
3) Advanced weather OFF
4) PDU ON
5) Dud torpedoes ON

In addition, I told Lokasenna that if he wanted to he could set my reinforcements to any variable time he liked and not tell me. From memory I don't think he told me what he did, nor do I need to know now.

In exchange for that menu of Japan-aid all I ask is for BOTH sides to play the game as designed and balanced. The features built into the game--op tempo, "rice" av gas, multi-engine torpedo accuracy, Allied float plane wonderments, submarine patrol cycle times and all the rest--are what they are and we don't tweak them subjectively. Some features exist to balance other features.

But I think the above menu of Japan-aid gives a Japanese player the very best chance they need to get an auto-vic. Further hampering the Allies in 1942 is just not on.