RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08

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RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 6/27/2013 12:43:20 AM

Joel Billings

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mktours

Does that cause problems to my current doing campaign, which is being done for more than a month now, if i install this patch in the middle?
And does it cause problems when one is doing a pbem game if either side or both upgrade to newer patch?

If you upgrade, you should upgrade at the same time as your opponent. It's not a good idea to upgrade and then send your turn to someone using an older version. You can upgrade mid game and many players always upgrade as changes are made. You won't get data changes, but code changes will impact your existing games. Of course changes can impact balance mid-game, so you have to decide if you are ok with that, but I generally recommend upgrading and would do so myself.

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Post #: 31

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 6/27/2013 12:09:27 PM

mktours

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thanks, Joel. you are very kind to give this info! it is very helpful.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joel Billings

quote:

ORIGINAL: mktours

Does that cause problems to my current doing campaign, which is being done for more than a month now, if i install this patch in the middle?
And does it cause problems when one is doing a pbem game if either side or both upgrade to newer patch?

If you upgrade, you should upgrade at the same time as your opponent. It's not a good idea to upgrade and then send your turn to someone using an older version. You can upgrade mid game and many players always upgrade as changes are made. You won't get data changes, but code changes will impact your existing games. Of course changes can impact balance mid-game, so you have to decide if you are ok with that, but I generally recommend upgrading and would do so myself.

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Post #: 32

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 11:40:50 AM

SigUp

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I am wondering whether this change:

1. Formula Change - Greatly reduced the chance that a unit below its national morale will receive the die(10% of national morale) increase in morale.

has any effect, aside from making it harder for German units to get their morale up. Because as far as I can see it, units under 50 morale (Soviets, Rumanians and Hungarians) shoot up to 50 in an instant. My Germans, however, seem to take endlessly. On turn 38 I put 161st Infantry Division with 68 morale on refit in Orsha (far more than 10 hexes from the front). Now it's turn 42 and it still is on 68. On turn 39 I sent 292nd with 65 morale back to Poland on refit. A turn later 137th with 65 morale and 263rd with 68 morale. These three divisions also haven't gained a single morale point. So, up till now out of four divisions below the NM of 70, not a single one has gained a morale point. Now, it could be that I'm simply unlucky. I have read some people say, that in the long run the morale gain changes benefits the German side (after blizzard, then 43 onwards), but if the gain is really so slow (and not I am just getting bad dice roll after bad dice roll), then this entire business of the morale gain correction of 1.07.08 was somehow senseless from a German-only point of view.

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Post #: 33

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 12:36:46 PM

smokindave34

Posts: 877
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SigUp

I am wondering whether this change:

1. Formula Change - Greatly reduced the chance that a unit below its national morale will receive the die(10% of national morale) increase in morale.

has any effect, aside from making it harder for German units to get their morale up. Because as far as I can see it, units under 50 morale (Soviets, Rumanians and Hungarians) shoot up to 50 in an instant. My Germans, however, seem to take endlessly. On turn 38 I put 161st Infantry Division with 68 morale on refit in Orsha (far more than 10 hexes from the front). Now it's turn 42 and it still is on 68. On turn 39 I sent 292nd with 65 morale back to Poland on refit. A turn later 137th with 65 morale and 263rd with 68 morale. These three divisions also haven't gained a single morale point. So, up till now out of four divisions below the NM of 70, not a single one has gained a morale point. Now, it could be that I'm simply unlucky. I have read some people say, that in the long run the morale gain changes benefits the German side (after blizzard, then 43 onwards), but if the gain is really so slow (and not I am just getting bad dice roll after bad dice roll), then this entire business of the morale gain correction of 1.07.08 was somehow senseless from a German-only point of view.

I agree SigUp. I have seen the same thing - the morale change has a dramatic effect on units below a morale level of 50. This is a huge advantage for the Soviets - they have dozens of units below a morale of 50 that get this immediate benefit to their morale and CV whereas the Germans have none. My units destroyed during the blizzard have come back with a morale in the high 50's and have been sitting for turn after turn stuck at the same morale level....I'm not sure how any of this can been seen as a help for the axis late in the war. The only effect of this change has been to allow all the Soviet units below a morale of 50 to get >50 in a few turns and slow the axis in '41.

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Post #: 34

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 12:41:20 PM

Disgruntled Veteran

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Here's a helpful tip that will help you a little bit as axis.

In commanders tab go to each allied country and put all frozen units on refit especially Romania-Hungary starting T1. That way as these divisions unlock they will be in mid fifty morale and have 4-5CV's. Hell, even the Italian infantry can have around 2-3 CV. Its a slight help at least.

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Post #: 35

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 12:49:10 PM

smokindave34

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Disgruntled Veteran

Here's a helpful tip that will help you a little bit as axis.

In commanders tab go to each allied country and put all frozen units on refit especially Romania-Hungary starting T1. That way as these divisions unlock they will be in mid fifty morale and have 4-5CV's. Hell, even the Italian infantry can have around 2-3 CV. Its a slight help at least.

Thanks DV - I have been doing that and I agree it helps. I was happy to see my Rumanian reinforcements start with a CV of 4 until I realized that as easy as it was for me to get a Rumanian division to a CV of 4 my Soviet opponents could do the same for dozens of their Soviet divisions just as easily.

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Post #: 36

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 1:04:34 PM

SigUp

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quote:

ORIGINAL: smokindave34
My units destroyed during the blizzard have come back with a morale in the high 50's and have been sitting for turn after turn stuck at the same morale level....

Well, then it is not me getting bad dice rolls. Guess I can give up my plan to rotate units out of the frontline to recover morale. Just pull them out to the next railhead and have them up their TOE, then send them back to the front.

As for Rumanians and Hungarians, true. I have a 56 morale Rumanian infantry division sitting in Bukarest and another one at 54, a couple at 52 and then more at 50. With the Hungarians it is similar.

While I do think that in the past the Rumanians and Hungarians were too weak, now they are kind of too strong. A 2 CV, in some rare cases 3 CV Rumanian / Hungarian division is pretty good. But now, the Rumanians at least, are all at 3 to 4 CV with some cases being even at 5.

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Post #: 37

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 1:33:25 PM

smokindave34

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I'd actually be O.K. with the new morale rule that makes the Soviets much stronger (and able to counterattack) if we could scale back the ridiculous blizzard rules. Gettting ZOC locked turn after turn by tank brigades with no ability to counterattack because my CV's are in the dirt is very frustrating.

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Post #: 38

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 1:43:56 PM

SigUp

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quote:

ORIGINAL: smokindave34

I'd actually be O.K. with the new morale rule that makes the Soviets much stronger (and able to counterattack) if we could scale back the ridiculous blizzard rules. Gettting ZOC locked turn after turn by tank brigades with no ability to counterattack because my CV's are in the dirt is very frustrating.

I'm in the same camp. Although units with 50 morale or above never routing unless they have no retreat space is certainly a little bit problematic for the German. But all in all I think it is good that the Soviets get a certain boost increasing their ability to counterattack and also inflicting slightly more losses on the Germans. Therefore I think what needs to be reduced are the blizzard morale penalties for the German, as well as the CV punishment. Upping Soviet CV while reducing German CV combined with the morale losses basically force the German to run, and to run the German has to do better than historical. So, what I would like would be a fix for the ridiculous aerial supply (perhaps forbidding bombers to resupply, or make the wear and tear on them prohibitively high, so that people would only use them as suppliers when there is no alternative), and a fix for the blizzard. But both these changes are most likely too complex for 2by3 to consider, so all in all a morale fix would be "simpler".

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Post #: 39

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 1:49:46 PM

Disgruntled Veteran

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quote:

ORIGINAL: smokindave34

I'd actually be O.K. with the new morale rule that makes the Soviets much stronger (and able to counterattack) if we could scale back the ridiculous blizzard rules. Gettting ZOC locked turn after turn by tank brigades with no ability to counterattack because my CV's are in the dirt is very frustrating.

I agree and have mentioned this before.

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Post #: 40

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 2:21:00 PM

Peltonx

Posts: 7250
Joined: 4/9/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SigUp

I am wondering whether this change:

1. Formula Change - Greatly reduced the chance that a unit below its national morale will receive the die(10% of national morale) increase in morale.

has any effect, aside from making it harder for German units to get their morale up. Because as far as I can see it, units under 50 morale (Soviets, Rumanians and Hungarians) shoot up to 50 in an instant. My Germans, however, seem to take endlessly. On turn 38 I put 161st Infantry Division with 68 morale on refit in Orsha (far more than 10 hexes from the front). Now it's turn 42 and it still is on 68. On turn 39 I sent 292nd with 65 morale back to Poland on refit. A turn later 137th with 65 morale and 263rd with 68 morale. These three divisions also haven't gained a single morale point. So, up till now out of four divisions below the NM of 70, not a single one has gained a morale point. Now, it could be that I'm simply unlucky. I have read some people say, that in the long run the morale gain changes benefits the German side (after blizzard, then 43 onwards), but if the gain is really so slow (and not I am just getting bad dice roll after bad dice roll), then this entire business of the morale gain correction of 1.07.08 was somehow senseless from a German-only point of view.

I have been posting this for ove 2 yrs now peeps.

GHC units or SHC will not get pts over 60 morale (5%) basicly not worth doing.

I have tested this all, 50-60 units will have a 18% chance basicly.

boosts over 60 have to come from combat.

The rule changes made it easyer to get boosts above NM from combat, which is HUGE as GHC if you know how to max these inc.

The next patch will nerf the 1 win = 2 wins for SHC units tring to get guards, this again will be HUGEthis one "exploit" will very much weaken SHC come 42.

< Message edited by Pelton -- 7/28/2013 2:23:28 PM >

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Post #: 41

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/28/2013 6:17:36 PM

SigUp

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Good, then I can start sending those units back East and not waste further time. The reorganisation for Fall Blau is on the doorstep.

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Post #: 42

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 7/29/2013 6:52:21 PM

Denniss

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quote:

1. Formula Change - Greatly reduced the chance that a unit below its national morale will receive the die(10% of national morale) increase in morale.

If this change is still present those morale boosts we see mostly on the soviet side just comes from the <50 morale rule which is way too effective now with the bugs fixed.

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Post #: 43

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 8/8/2013 6:17:23 PM

Schmart

Posts: 662
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From: Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SigUp
My Germans, however, seem to take endlessly. On turn 38 I put 161st Infantry Division with 68 morale on refit in Orsha (far more than 10 hexes from the front). Now it's turn 42 and it still is on 68. On turn 39 I sent 292nd with 65 morale back to Poland on refit. A turn later 137th with 65 morale and 263rd with 68 morale. These three divisions also haven't gained a single morale point. So, up till now out of four divisions below the NM of 70, not a single one has gained a morale point. Now, it could be that I'm simply unlucky. I have read some people say, that in the long run the morale gain changes benefits the German side (after blizzard, then 43 onwards), but if the gain is really so slow (and not I am just getting bad dice roll after bad dice roll), then this entire business of the morale gain correction of 1.07.08 was somehow senseless from a German-only point of view.

Do units need to be within HQ range to get the leader die-roll benefits which can help morale gain?

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Post #: 44

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/21/2013 5:44:12 PM

blow56

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Joined: 11/28/2010
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Can't download this via the game updater - it keeps giving me an error message. I do not have any add-on dlc.

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Post #: 45

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/21/2013 6:02:41 PM

Joel Billings

Posts: 32265
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From: Santa Rosa, CA
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1.07.11 is now the latest official version. Are you trying to get 1.07.08?

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Post #: 46

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/23/2013 6:45:34 AM

HOTEC

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How to turn off the video?

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Post #: 47

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/23/2013 7:44:50 AM

Oberst_Klink

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HOTEC

How to turn off the video?

Not sure if there is a switch for the desktop shortcut like i.e. for WitP AE, but you can simply rename the Video folder, that will skip the video intro, but the victory/defeat videos, too. So, just rename the videos you don't want to be shown and Bob is your uncle.

Klink, Oberst

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Post #: 48

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/23/2013 2:22:03 PM

swkuh

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The Oberst is most correct, but simply pressing the space bar gets past each opening screen that delays getting started... thinks 3 taps.

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Post #: 49

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/23/2013 4:25:05 PM

HOTEC

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Rename the Video folder would not work. Pressing the space bar for pasting by the opening screen seems a quick way getting start. Thanks.

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Post #: 50

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/24/2013 12:58:20 PM

HOTEC

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The device of Stug IIIb of "Ground Elem" is 75mm StuK37 L/24 gun with its data as -5 of ROF and 220 of ACC. In "Device", the rate of fire of the gun shows as 10.

If ROF stands for rate of fire, what is the meaning its negative value shown in the above? Sometimes, this ROF shows 0 or positive value.
What is the full name of ACC? Some have a number or otherwise 0.

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Post #: 51

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/24/2013 1:48:52 PM

Priapus1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HOTEC

The device of Stug IIIb of "Ground Elem" is 75mm StuK37 L/24 gun with its data as -5 of ROF and 220 of ACC. In "Device", the rate of fire of the gun shows as 10.

If ROF stands for rate of fire, what is the meaning its negative value shown in the above? Sometimes, this ROF shows 0 or positive value.
What is the full name of ACC? Some have a number or otherwise 0.

heh, coincidentally I'm running testing right now with the same questions. The majority of tanks have their MG ROF's set to 0 and they are not firing in combat. I'm increasing ROF and accuracy and seeing the tanks actually destroy soft targets, rather than only firing at enemy tanks. I even saw a nahverteidigungswaffe in action. I'm not sure if the tank ground element data overrides the gun or MG device data.

edit: also, panzershreks, panzerfausts and all flame type weapons are not firing in combat. Managed to get the flamethrowers to work by changing their type from flame to man weapon. I assume this will work for the others.

edit2: after some testing I don't think HEAT penetration is working at all.

< Message edited by Priapus1 -- 11/24/2013 5:21:05 PM >

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Post #: 52

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/24/2013 6:05:22 PM

HOTEC

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It would be interested to learn how do you explore their functionality of them when the element of chance inherits in the win/loss situation unless an equation shows.

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Post #: 53

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/25/2013 4:10:06 AM

Priapus1

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If you set combat resolution message level to anything above 3 you can see which elements are firing at each other in combat. HEAT and flame type weapons are not firing.

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Post #: 54

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/25/2013 10:16:08 AM

demyansk

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I was playing as the Soviets in the 42-43 scenario, Question

What settings allow the game to played the most quickly?

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Post #: 55

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/25/2013 11:37:43 AM

HOTEC

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Priapus1,

Has any idea on why it is negative value -5 on 75mm StuK37 L/24 gun of ROF and what is 220 of ACC standing for.

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Post #: 56

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/25/2013 12:01:05 PM

Priapus1

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acc is accuracy. I don't know if the numbers in the ground elements tab override the numbers in the device tab. Some of the big artillery guns in the device tab also have negative values for rate of fire. I don't know why. The editor manual isn't very clear on much.

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Post #: 57

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/25/2013 12:15:32 PM

morvael

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They are modifiers. Base device range and accuracy is modified by adding values specified in ground element "mount" for that weapon.

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Post #: 58

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/25/2013 1:02:49 PM

Priapus1

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Do you know what the equation is? I'm trying to get tanks to be more active in combat, but no matter what I change I can't get them to shoot their main guns.

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Post #: 59

RE: War in the East Update 1.07.08 - 11/25/2013 1:10:32 PM

morvael

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There is no simple equation, rather tens of pages of code, so naturally nothing that can be described in few short sentences. However, since a significant number of combat-related changes may be released with patch .12, I would wait for it, before experimenting more with the engine.

As for your tank/MG issue I can say that there is a limit on secondary weapons (like machine guns on tanks) to fire less than main weapon (gun), therefore you may see them firing less often, even with high RoF. I think this is a good idea. Tank exists to carry the gun, machine guns are mainly for it's self-defense.

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Post #: 60