RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941

Matrix Games Forums

Forums Register Login Photo Gallery Member List Search Calendars FAQ

My Profile Inbox Address Book My Subscription My Forums Log Out

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East Series >> After Action Reports >> RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941

Page: << < prev 2 3 [4] 5 6 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941 - 12/25/2013 12:22:38 AM

Gabriel B.

Posts: 501
Joined: 6/24/2013
Status: offline

SigUp
The southern hook does not realy ispire confidence at this point , the oka river is a formidable barier that should not be taken lightly .
for your sake I hope it is a faint, not the main aproach.

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 91

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941 - 12/25/2013 2:45:06 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

The target of 2nd Panzer's push isn't really Moscow. I'm trying to secure Tula before mud, while hopefully encircling some divisions around Kaluga. I had thought about utilizing 2nd Panzer in the space between Tula and Orel, but due to the two rivers standing in the way, discarded that idea. Right now I don't really know about Moscow, especially after that partisan stunt at Polotsk. I doubt I can capture the city. So my focus is on the short term goal of the units around Rzhev and Kaluga. Concerning the former, I think loki hasn't spotted LVI. in the woods at Belyi yet. So right now I can bank on the element of surprise, but XXXXI. needs another turn (hopefully not two due to the messed up rail net) before it is ready.

After that mud will probably hit and afterwards I'm thinking about swinging 2nd Panzer south and 1st Panzer north to secure as much space as possible for the blizzard retreat in the flatlands between Orel and Kharkov.

(in reply to Gabriel B.)

Post #: 92

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941 - 12/27/2013 9:44:05 AM

Gabriel B.

Posts: 501
Joined: 6/24/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SigUp

The target of 2nd Panzer's push isn't really Moscow. I'm trying to secure Tula before mud, while hopefully encircling some divisions around Kaluga. I had thought about utilizing 2nd Panzer in the space between Tula and Orel, but due to the two rivers standing in the way, discarded that idea. Right now I don't really know about Moscow, especially after that partisan stunt at Polotsk. I doubt I can capture the city. So my focus is on the short term goal of the units around Rzhev and Kaluga. Concerning the former, I think loki hasn't spotted LVI. in the woods at Belyi yet. So right now I can bank on the element of surprise, but XXXXI. needs another turn (hopefully not two due to the messed up rail net) before it is ready.

After that mud will probably hit and afterwards I'm thinking about swinging 2nd Panzer south and 1st Panzer north to secure as much space as possible for the blizzard retreat in the flatlands between Orel and Kharkov.

I am a firm beliver in the sheer force of infantry asault, but for that you need to use armor to cover the flanks and concentrate infantry.

4th army frontage : 60 milles.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Gabriel B. -- 12/27/2013 10:45:05 AM >

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 93

Turn 13: 11th September 1941 - 17th September 1941 - 1/5/2014 12:41:56 AM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

Turn 13: 11th September 1941 - 17th September 1941

Army Group North

In the second September week Army Group North continued its slow infantry advance, while the Fins held a loose line from Tikhvin to Lake Onega. Around Lake Ilmen X. AK and L. AK forced their way over the Msta at another two spots. At the same time XXVIII. AK crossed the Pola with two divisions.

Army Group Centre

On 11th September at long last the panzer strike of 3rd and 4th Panzer Groups was unleashed. North of Rzhev V., XXIII. and XXXXII. AK expanded the Volga bridgehead to 30 miles and cleared the road for von Manstein's LVI. AK (mot.) whose 3rd Motorized Division reached the Volga to the east on 16th September.

During the same stretch 3rd Panzer Group opened its strike around Gzhatsk with a massive infantry assault conducted by Model's elite I. AK with support from XX. and XXXVIII. AK. By 13th September a 30 miles wide and 20 miles deep hole was breached into the Soviet lines and Hoth's panzers poured through. Schmidt's XXXIX. AK (mot.) reached the eastern bank of the Volga two days later where it waited for LVI. AK (mot.) to close the pocket on 16 Soviet divisions. Meanwhile recon showed that the first line of the Moscow defense line stopped around Volokolamsk and no Soviet units were guarding the Lama up to Turginovo. Hoth and the commander of LVII. AK (mot.) Kuntzen decided to take the chance and poured the corps into the gap. Klin was captured in the early morning hours of the 16th September and forward elements of 12th Panzer Division reached the Moskva-Volga Canal a few hours later. While 18th Motorized and 20th Panzer Division fanned out to hold open a corridor, 12th Panzer Division raided the Soviet airbases north of Khimki before pulling back to Povarovo, 20 miles away from the Soviet capital. [Note 1]

Soviet high command, however, reacted quick and counterattacks were conducted against LVI. AK (mot.)'s lines in the North and XXXIX. AK (mot.)'s lines in the East. While Manstein succeded in repelling the assaults, Schmidt's 19th Panzer Division was forced to retreat and Schmidt's HQ had to be hastily evacuated. Thus on the evening of the 17th September a small corridor was reopened to the trapped Soviet formations around Rzhev. [Note 2]

South of Kaluga Guderian began to pull his panzers out after the infantry of 4th Army crossed the Oka to relieve them.

Army Group South

In the South 6th Army closed in on Belgorod and reached the Donets, while 17th Army created a bridgehead over the river south of Kharkov. von Kleist's panzers rushed into that hole and threatened with encirclement the Soviets pulled out of Kharkov save for a lone division left to hold the city.

In the Crimea LIV. AK captured Simferopol and began to close in on the fortress of Sevastopol. To its east the Rumanian 4th Army was on the verge of splitting the peninsula in two with its march toward Kerch.

Air War

The week from 11th to 17th September saw heavy air combat and the German losses soared. All in all the Luftwaffe lost 109 combat aircraft. The VVS, however, also suffered from the battles and coupled with 12th Panzer Division's raid on the airbases north of Khimki a total of 579 combat aircraft were destroyed. [Note 3]

[Note 1: 12th Panzer Division had enough MPs to get into Khimki, but it would have been more than easy for loki to rout the division out.]

[Note 2: The counterattacks of this turn have increased my doubts of the 1:1 = 2:1 rule. This especially in combination with the sometimes massive CV increases. For example in the attack to reopen the pocket the Soviet CV was modified by 2.14 and factoring the +1 rule it was effectively increased by 4 times for a ratio of 2.1:1. Likewise a counterattack near Orel by 3 rifle and 1 cavalry division had its CV modified by 5.5 times for a 2.2:1 attack.]

[Note 3: Stukas are so brittle that I don't know how to utilize them properly. Every time they arrive in mass they are shot down in dozens by flak fire. Every single one of my 30 Stuka losses was due to anti aircraft fire.]

< Message edited by SigUp -- 1/5/2014 1:42:29 AM >

(in reply to Gabriel B.)

Post #: 94

RE: Turn 13: 11th September 1941 - 17th September 1941 - 1/5/2014 12:48:59 AM

Bozo_the_Clown

Posts: 890
Joined: 6/25/2013
From: Bozotown
Status: offline

quote:

[Note 2: The counterattacks of this turn have increased my doubts of the 1:1 = 2:1 rule. This especially in combination with the sometimes massive CV increases. For example in the attack to reopen the pocket the Soviet CV was modified by 2.14 and factoring the +1 rule it was effectively increased by 4 times for a ratio of 2.1:1. Likewise a counterattack near Orel by 3 rifle and 1 cavalry division had its CV modified by 5.5 times for a 2.2:1 attack.]

I understand your objection but from a game play point of view it's much more interesting to have the pocket reopened then to just let those troops die. The 2:1 rule makes it more like to reopen pockets.

I would also like to point out that your Tula salient looks like a giant breast with nipple.

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 95

RE: Turn 13: 11th September 1941 - 17th September 1941 - 1/5/2014 6:43:40 AM

Gabriel B.

Posts: 501
Joined: 6/24/2013
Status: offline

Look like Typhoon has started early

Imv you should not waste to much time resealing the Rhzev pocket , the soviets have hundreds of divisions by now and 16 more or less
would not matter . Nevertheles the area must be cleared of soviet presence .

The answer to soviet counter atacks are defensive reserves , in the picture I posted, the 22 ofensive cv stack of the 4th army is just that , also the 21 cv stack of the 9th to the north .
Also you need to stack you forces in clear open terain , for instance it would take 7 good soviet divisions to drive a german division out of the woods, but only 5 to kick 2 german divisions in the clear

(in reply to Bozo_the_Clown)

Post #: 96

RE: Turn 13: 11th September 1941 - 17th September 1941 - 1/5/2014 8:11:54 AM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gabriel B.

Look like Typhoon has started early

Imv you should not waste to much time resealing the Rhzev pocket , the soviets have hundreds of divisions by now and 16 more or less
would not matter . Nevertheles the area must be cleared of soviet presence .

The answer to soviet counter atacks are defensive reserves , in the picture I posted, the 22 ofensive cv stack of the 4th army is just that , also the 21 cv stack of the 9th to the north .
Also you need to stack you forces in clear open terain , for instance it would take 7 good soviet divisions to drive a german division out of the woods, but only 5 to kick 2 german divisions in the clear

I think I'll still reseal the pocket. The Soviets there have had enough time to dig strong forts and Rzhev will be difficult to take without the CV reductions from encirclement. From our email correspondence loki seems to think that I will use all three panzer groups for a massive Moscow strike but currently I am not too sure. I'm tempted to use 4th Panzer Group to try to force him to evacuate the Valdai and 2nd Panzer to gain ground between Tula and Kursk (with elements of 1st Panzer driving north).

As for defensive reserves, I use them wherever I can, problem is, in these situations I don't have the units with enough MPs as all of them were busy punching open the Soviet lines. In regards to the panzer division that was bounced, I had hoped that marching into a ZOC controlled hex would rob the Soviets of some MPs and the Lama would provide some protection. Guess I was wrong. Perhaps I should have moved that division 1 hex west to Shakovskaya to gain more separation, but then LVII. AK would have been even more exposed.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bozo_the_Clown

I understand your objection but from a game play point of view it's much more interesting to have the pocket reopened then to just let those troops die. The 2:1 rule makes it more like to reopen pockets.

Well, all three of my 10+ division pockets after the turn 1 encirclements have been broken during his turn. It is a little bit irritating that whenever the Soviets have enough units around the Germans need to stack deep in order to avoid having a pocket broken every single time. My worry right now is that he'll be able to break the Rzhev pocket a second time due to the way my units are lined up in that part of the front.

EDIT: Oh, and I'd also like to point out that we're playing with Soviet morale on 95. So the damage the Soviets can do is already somewhat reduced.

< Message edited by SigUp -- 1/5/2014 9:20:57 AM >

(in reply to Gabriel B.)

Post #: 97

RE: Turn 13: 11th September 1941 - 17th September 1941 - 1/5/2014 11:23:11 AM

Gabriel B.

Posts: 501
Joined: 6/24/2013
Status: offline

I cant see the figures on the counters from your screenhot but i asume the lower stack had around 8-9 ofensive Cv while the
northern one ,even acros the Lama would bring 4-5 to the fight for a total of 12-14 .

While a fresh panzer division might witstand that , fatigue brings your defensive cv down. If they mach your defensive cv
the masive numerical advantage would work for the soviets even with a average leader .

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 98

RE: Turn 13: 11th September 1941 - 17th September 1941 - 1/5/2014 11:40:13 AM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gabriel B.

I cant see the figures on the counters from your screenhot but i asume the lower stack had around 8-9 ofensive Cv while the
northern one ,even acros the Lama would bring 4-5 to the fight for a total of 12-14 .

While a fresh panzer division might witstand that , fatigue brings your defensive cv down. If they mach your defensive cv
the masive numerical advantage would work for the soviets even with a average leader .

He attacked with 6 rifle divisions, 3 from the South, 1 over the Lama, 2 from inside the pocket. In total these divisions attacked with 73 CV versus my panzer division with 145. The fatigue of the panzers was around 34-35, while the number of the motorized rifle squad was at 49. The attack was prepared by a bomber strike with 51 bombers costing the division 31 men and 1 AFV in direct casualties.

(in reply to Gabriel B.)

Post #: 99

RE: Turn 13: 11th September 1941 - 17th September 1941 - 1/5/2014 1:31:05 PM

Gabriel B.

Posts: 501
Joined: 6/24/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SigUp

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gabriel B.

I cant see the figures on the counters from your screenhot but i asume the lower stack had around 8-9 ofensive Cv while the
northern one ,even acros the Lama would bring 4-5 to the fight for a total of 12-14 .

While a fresh panzer division might witstand that , fatigue brings your defensive cv down. If they mach your defensive cv
the masive numerical advantage would work for the soviets even with a average leader .

He attacked with 6 rifle divisions, 3 from the South, 1 over the Lama, 2 from inside the pocket. In total these divisions attacked with 73 CV versus my panzer division with 145. The fatigue of the panzers was around 34-35, while the number of the motorized rifle squad was at 49. The attack was prepared by a bomber strike with 51 bombers costing the division 31 men and 1 AFV in direct casualties.

145 is very good so late in the campaign and with so low initial odds your fustration is understandable .

< Message edited by Gabriel B. -- 1/5/2014 2:35:10 PM >

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 100

Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 2:22:43 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941

Army Group North

Around mid-late September von Leeb's Army Group began to reach its absolute limits of advance in the northernmost part of the front. In the vicinity of Lake Ilmen, however, the force concentration was still strong enough to beat back heavily dug-in Soviet divisions and push them away from Msta and Pola. At a conference in Smolensk between Halder and von Leeb the two generals agreed to turn 4th Panzer Group north as soon as the situation allowed it. The Panzer Group was asked to capture Kalinin and Torzhok while forcing a Soviet evacuation of the Valdai Hills - an area von Leeb considered of utmost importance for an effective defence.

Army Group Centre

A little mistake there "Juzhnyj" Front should read "Zapadnyj" of course.

A day after the Rzhev pocket was opened by a Soviet counterattack Hoth assembled Model's elite I. AK to push the Soviet forces back. In seven days of hard battles the corps restored the pocket while clearing a corridor of 30 miles width. By 24th September the three divisions stood in the Lama - Moskva gap, determined to drive the Red Army further towards Moscow. A decisive push, however, was still out of reach with the majority of 9th Army bound by the Rzhev pocket, which it hope to eliminate by the end of the month.

A concern to the commanders of Army Group Centre was the bulge of Kaluga which severely restricted German mobility in the Kaluga - Tula region. With the Soviets fortifying the Moskva-Volga Canal von Bock and his staff began to discuss the possibility of rerouting 3rd Panzer Group's mobile forces, as well as significant portions of 9th Army to the Temkino sector, in order to push the Soviets out. [Note 1]

Meanwhile to the south Orel and Kursk became heavily fortified frontline cities. With the Germans lacking the infantry strength for frontal assaults Guderian's panzers were driven south with the intention to bypass and encircle the cities.

Army Group South

In the South the German advance still couldn't generate enough steam with logistics and urban areas playing the role of stumbling blocks. Still, in the week from 18th to 24th September 1st Panzer Group managed to push six Soviet divisions into a pocket around the Donets east of Kharkov. The Ukrainian metropole itself was captured in a combined effort on the 22nd, with Belgorod falling a day later. Thus the road towards Kursk - Oskol lay open and the Red Army responded by pulling back, leaving only a few divisions as roadblocks.

On the Crimea LIV. AK continued to work its way towards Sevastopol with resistance increasing with every day. Adding to that, torrent-like rainfalls commenced on the evening of the 24th, turning the ground into severe mud.

Partisan War

Continuing the trend from the early September weeks, partisans began to attack the German rail net in all parts of the country. In the North a partisan battallion managed to break Army Group North's sole rail line between Vore and Petseri. Meanwhile south of Vitebsk the secondary rail line towards Gomel was attacked at Bogushevsk. But luckily for the Germans construction troops managed to repair the damage by the end of the week. Last but not least two seperate partisan units blew up rails near Zatishye and Bessarabskaya with no consequence to Army Group South's second West-East line from Ungeny to Apostolovo.

[Note 1: AGC's northern flank begins to stretch to a breaking point. I don't have the infantry forces to cover it while attacking towards Moscow the same time. So by default I already have to send out 4th Panzer Group north. The issue, however, is what to do once November hits. I have no desire of leaving an entire Panzer Group out in the blizzard.]

(in reply to Gabriel B.)

Post #: 101

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 3:50:57 PM

jwolf

Posts: 2493
Joined: 12/3/2013
Status: offline

quote:

AGC's northern flank begins to stretch to a breaking point.

Disappointing, but it seems realistic. You can't drive seriously against Moscow without more infantry -- or a much weakened Russian army -- neither of which you have. But if you are successful with your Valdai operation, is it possible you could still threaten Moscow during November?

Kaluga seems to be a really critical position that is difficult to root out unless you have taken Tula and can threaten the Russian rear if they stay in Kaluga.

Good luck on the rest of your campaign. I really appreciate your great maps and commentary.

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 102

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 4:05:57 PM

Zovs

Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline

Prob a dumb question, but how did you (or where did you) get those big icons that show the position of the Army display?

_____________________________

Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific
Valor & Victory
DG CWIE 2
SPWW2 & SPMBT scenario creator

(in reply to jwolf)

Post #: 103

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 4:10:19 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

I got them from Callistrid.

His AAR

(in reply to Zovs)

Post #: 104

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 4:47:52 PM

hfarrish

Posts: 734
Joined: 1/3/2011
Status: offline

I wouldn't get too frustrated yet...I am playing as the Soviets in a game that was in a remarkably similar point in late September, and I am not feeling all that confident heading into the Spring of '42. The reduced blizzard effects are meaningful (although it may not feel that way at first) and the Red Army should look pretty weak by even mid-February and begin offering opportunities. I think your gains in '42 may surprise you...

_____________________________

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 105

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 4:57:45 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: hfarrish

I wouldn't get too frustrated yet...I am playing as the Soviets in a game that was in a remarkably similar point in late September, and I am not feeling all that confident heading into the Spring of '42. The reduced blizzard effects are meaningful (although it may not feel that way at first) and the Red Army should look pretty weak by even mid-February and begin offering opportunities. I think your gains in '42 may surprise you...

Funny thing, loki in our email exchanges has been looking quite bleak (well, not for this turn, but the one before). He expressed his fear that Moscow's probably lost, while I have the feeling that my advance is coming to a halt. Guess the grass on the other side is always greener. Well, I have no real experience in 1942 nor with the reduced blizzard, so a lot of unknown right now. I'm already looking for suitable holding lines for the blizzard. If the Moscow 41-42 game against loki (under the old blizzard rules) has taught me anything, it's that a fortified line is quite impregnable in good terrain come January 42. But the wide open terrain from Tula southwards is another matter.

(in reply to hfarrish)

Post #: 106

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 5:25:41 PM

hfarrish

Posts: 734
Joined: 1/3/2011
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SigUp

Funny thing, loki in our email exchanges has been looking quite bleak (well, not for this turn, but the one before). He expressed his fear that Moscow's probably lost, while I have the feeling that my advance is coming to a halt. Guess the grass on the other side is always greener. Well, I have no real experience in 1942 nor with the reduced blizzard, so a lot of unknown right now. I'm already looking for suitable holding lines for the blizzard. If the Moscow 41-42 game against loki (under the old blizzard rules) has taught me anything, it's that a fortified line is quite impregnable in good terrain come January 42. But the wide open terrain from Tula southwards is another matter.

My opponent was aggressive right up to blizzard, so he was not dug in heavily in a lot of spots...as such I was able to make some good gains in these areas, less so in others. Overall though he should run out of steam starting in mid- to late-Jan (earlier if you are going to dig in during snow rather than fight, although this is a mixed bag...my blizzard was weaker than it would have been precisely b/c my forces were in disarray following a lot of snow battles). I guess to me the biggest difference is he is able to make meaningful counterattacks starting in late Jan and definitely in February, which would not at all have been the case under the old rules.

_____________________________

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 107

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 5:35:52 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

In the battle scenario against loki I pushed right up to Moscow's gates with parts of my forces while leaving a couple of infantry divisions broken up in regiments to dig some 4 hexes behind. So by the time he reached these in early January it was fortified to level two, which in light woods were a hard nut to crack, even under the old rules. But I doubt I can repeat it this time as he has far too many divisions for me to split the duties. Furthermore I can't utilize another aspect of my previous blizzard defence. That was throwing around the panzer divisions as mobile reserves in order to hold the lines. Can't allow the morale of those divisions to go down the drain. But to be honest, I am not too worried about the centre. It is about the areas from the Oka southwards where I wonder if I should construct fort zones. Not visible on the screens are the couple of forts I erected along the Volkhov. Perhaps they will be a waste, but I didn't want to see these forts decay away in case I need them, which could be the case if I can't drive him out of the Valdai Hills.

(in reply to hfarrish)

Post #: 108

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 9:16:21 PM

gingerbread

Posts: 2994
Joined: 1/4/2007
From: Sweden
Status: offline

A losses screen shot would be interesting after the AGC pocket is eliminated. Please scroll down so that the Soviet vehicle losses are visible.

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 109

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 9:41:49 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

Will do after this turn is complete. It's time for the monthly report anyway. As for the vehicle losses, I just tell you that now. Before any moves on my part it's at 82.044, can't say whether this is few, average or many due to lack of experience with that.

(in reply to gingerbread)

Post #: 110

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 9:59:03 PM

gingerbread

Posts: 2994
Joined: 1/4/2007
From: Sweden
Status: offline

82k Soviet vehicle losses by turn 15, without a full Lwov is a lot, but not dramatically so. I take it that quite a few Armour & Mot have been made to surrender even after the border battles

I think you are stronger than you realize. The 95 morale is a big give. That means the the Soviet NM during '42 will be 43 or possibly 42. That means that the units will be brittle. Attrition will be a killer...

Is AGB during '41 in your plans (Azov, Bataysk, and Manych)?

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 111

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 10:41:50 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

I'll try but I don't think the chances are very good. First Rostov still has to be cleared, then loki already has units across the Don digging forts. If I counted right only 10 tank and motorized divisions were eliminated after turn 3. However, some others were utilized in the late July counterattacks, so that could be a contributing factor.

(in reply to gingerbread)

Post #: 112

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 10:56:54 PM

gingerbread

Posts: 2994
Joined: 1/4/2007
From: Sweden
Status: offline

As I see in the latest screen shot, 11 (at least) out of 15 units in the far south are Cav. You really want to cause casualties to those as the cav squads cost a lot of ARM to replace. If he is using those to defend with, everything that can has gone to Moscow. So even an somewhat unsuccessful drive to release AGB will have a pay off.

If you and loki have gents agreement not to metagame, then it another thing.

Edit: The cav cost goes for the German as well. Be very careful with your Cav Div. It will withdraw and can cause a major hit to your ARM if it has to draw replacements.

< Message edited by gingerbread -- 1/9/2014 11:59:07 PM >

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 113

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/9/2014 11:03:13 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

Yes, I've been bouncing these cavalry divisions in the South for the last couple of turns now. Nothing too dramatic, just a few hasty attacks to keep the Mius divisions moving. As for my own, he managed to force it to retreat the last turn, that hurt and the cavalry squad percentage is down to 70 percent... Guess that was it for the cavalry division in terms of active duty.

(in reply to gingerbread)

Post #: 114

RE: Turn 14: 18th September 1941 - 24th September 1941 - 1/13/2014 4:58:43 PM

Gabriel B.

Posts: 501
Joined: 6/24/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SigUp

In the battle scenario against loki I pushed right up to Moscow's gates with parts of my forces while leaving a couple of infantry divisions broken up in regiments to dig some 4 hexes behind. So by the time he reached these in early January it was fortified to level two, which in light woods were a hard nut to crack, even under the old rules. But I doubt I can repeat it this time as he has far too many divisions for me to split the duties. Furthermore I can't utilize another aspect of my previous blizzard defence. That was throwing around the panzer divisions as mobile reserves in order to hold the lines. Can't allow the morale of those divisions to go down the drain. But to be honest, I am not too worried about the centre. It is about the areas from the Oka southwards where I wonder if I should construct fort zones. Not visible on the screens are the couple of forts I erected along the Volkhov. Perhaps they will be a waste, but I didn't want to see these forts decay away in case I need them, which could be the case if I can't drive him out of the Valdai Hills.

You could still send the motorised divisions in Germany during the blizard , in terms of defensive action they are no better than a infantry division with 10 points less morale , in 1942 you get tanks and that would put them in the 13-14 cv range where they belong
with the obvious high mobility advantage .

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 115

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941 - 1/17/2014 5:44:49 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

Got the turn back, before I post the update sometimes the next few days a little rant by me...

First of all, can somebody enlighten me why those units didn't benefit from the fort bonus on their base unadjusted CV?

Second, this battle is the perfect example of why I've come to detest the 1:1=2:1 rule. The Red Army attacks with not even 46% of my CV. In quite a surprise my units actually get a higher modified CV, but it is of no use as the Soviet one jumps by nearly 2.8 times, enough to push it over 1:1 to get the bonus. That's my main issue. With the rule in place base CV means pretty much nothing to the Soviets while attacking. Just get to about 50% of the German CV and you are close to certain victory unless the German side manages to get in a reserve activation.

Attachment (1)

(in reply to Gabriel B.)

Post #: 116

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941 - 1/17/2014 7:11:04 PM

jwolf

Posts: 2493
Joined: 12/3/2013
Status: offline

Aside from your fort effectively disappearing, Loki's Russians got an offensive reserve activation which seems preposterous at this point of the war. Sure it's consistent with normal game mechanics but it just sounds way off to me in September 1941.

Q: Where was the Luftwaffe during this attack? Out of range?

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 117

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941 - 1/17/2014 7:15:09 PM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

Oh, I can tell you, the Red Army gets lots of reserve activations on defence too. It is a matter of putting Zhukov into Stavka. With the amount of units the Soviets have they are bound to get activations. As for the Luftwaffe, no, not out of range, just that I need the Luftwaffe during my turn. Therefore once it gets to him the number of operational planes is down a lot, perhaps they don't even have the mileage to fly (don't know whether that is reset once I klick end turn).

(in reply to jwolf)

Post #: 118

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941 - 1/18/2014 8:34:33 AM

Gabriel B.

Posts: 501
Joined: 6/24/2013
Status: offline

Get rid of leaders with infantry skill les than 6 fast ,if you did not already have .

by 4th turn is posible for the soviets to eliminate all corps (and the idiots in charge ) and have half the force at 6 or 7.
guys with 5 combat ratings simply no longer have a edge .

(in reply to SigUp)

Post #: 119

RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941 - 1/18/2014 8:52:11 AM

SigUp

Posts: 1062
Joined: 11/29/2012
Status: offline

Mostly done. Three remaining, all in relatively calm sectors. Intend to replace the one in front of Rostov to prepare for the strike against the city. The other two will also be replaced soon, the next turn perhaps.

Right now the sector between Kaluga and Tula is worrisome. Half of 4th Army was badly mauled by a counterattack (the one you saw above was part of it). Two divisions were encircled and most of them are 5-6 CV ants. It will be no problem to relieve them, but the offensive there is pretty much over. Can't do much more than dig in for the blizzard. I fear Tula will hold out. Does it make any sense to construct some fort zones right now?

< Message edited by SigUp -- 1/18/2014 9:53:02 AM >

(in reply to Gabriel B.)

Post #: 120

Page: << < prev 2 3 [4] 5 6 next > >>

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East Series >> After Action Reports >> RE: Turn 12: 4th September 1941 - 10th September 1941