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RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/28/2014 8:17:03 PM

Dabrion

Posts: 733
Joined: 11/5/2013
From: Northpole
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Reserve navy officer, learned my share of (German) naval history there. I enjoy visiting vessels of any kind and age ;)

Also in Germany the (geo-)political developments from the after 1914 to 1939 are a compulsory part of high school curriculum. I remember I enjoyed the lectures, and although not directly about the war, it set me up with some knowledge about the political structures in Europe during the first half of last century. Something I would not have gotten into on my own. A friend of mine has quite the library about WWII, sadly 90% is in French (not my strong suite), so I sticked to the ones with the pictures ;)

Grandparents were born in the 30's, and my great grandparents wouldn't talk about the war (to a child).

_____________________________

�WiF is like sex: sure, it may give some practical results, but that's not why we do it.�
- Richard P. Feynman, 'WiF, Sex, and the Dual Slit Experiment'.

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 31

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/29/2014 4:04:27 AM

tom730_slith

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Joined: 1/28/2014
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What is My key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history? Both game and history. My first war game was Stalingrad by Avalon Hill back in the late 60's. World in Flames was my favorite but like so many games took so long to set up and took up so much space that I haven't played it in over a decade. I was delighted to learn they had finally converted the game to PC.

What is My level of WWII knowledge? I was reading "Life's Picture History of World War Two" since I learned to read! I used to belong to a Military Book Club and my father and I used to routinely buy WW2 books as gifts for each other.

What is My main interest in WWII (e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics)? Strategy and politics.

What started My interest in WWII history? My father was a gunner in B-17s in the Eighth Air Force, flying out of England during the war. I actually bought him a book on the Eighth Air Force for Christmas one year and as he was thumbing through it he found a picture of himself and the rest of the crew he flew with! He was sitting on the wing and was only about 17 or 18 years old. It was AMAZING!

(in reply to Dabrion)

Post #: 32

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/29/2014 5:34:37 AM

warspite1

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Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tom730

What is My key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history? Both game and history. My first war game was Stalingrad by Avalon Hill back in the late 60's. World in Flames was my favorite but like so many games took so long to set up and took up so much space that I haven't played it in over a decade. I was delighted to learn they had finally converted the game to PC.

What is My level of WWII knowledge? I was reading "Life's Picture History of World War Two" since I learned to read! I used to belong to a Military Book Club and my father and I used to routinely buy WW2 books as gifts for each other.

What is My main interest in WWII (e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics)? Strategy and politics.

What started My interest in WWII history? My father was a gunner in B-17s in the Eighth Air Force, flying out of England during the war. I actually bought him a book on the Eighth Air Force for Christmas one year and as he was thumbing through it he found a picture of himself and the rest of the crew he flew with! He was sitting on the wing and was only about 17 or 18 years old. It was AMAZING!

warspite1

Welcome aboard tom730. Nice story

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Post #: 33

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/29/2014 7:27:43 AM

Maucat

Posts: 18
Joined: 3/13/2007
From: Rome, Italy
Status: offline

What is My key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history? Both game and history and an interest in alternative history (what if...) due to my passion for SF. My first war game was Third Reich by Avalon Hill back in the late 70's. World in Flames was my favorite but like so many games took so long to set up and took up so much space that I haven't played it in over a decade. I waited the PC version for all this years and now I'm delighted finally to play it again.

What is My level of WWII knowledge? I think very good, I'm an History fan so my home is filled by hundreds of books (I read them all) and almost half of them are on WWII.

What is My main interest in WWII (e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics)? Strategy, economics and politics.

What started My interest in WWII history? My father fought the WWII during the invasion of Jugoslavia in 1941 and remain there until 1943, my uncles fought in North Africa from 1940 to 1942 and a my father's cousin fought in Russia in 1942, They were lucky to survive the war and their tales and their old creased photos when I was child kindled my interest in the history. I like all history from the Ancient to Modern but my favorite periods are the Roman History (I'm italian...), Napoleon's campaigns and WWI/WWII (I consider the two wars at one, WWI was the first time and WWII was the second time).

PS I apologize for my English is certainly not accurate

< Message edited by Maucat -- 1/29/2014 8:31:58 AM >

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I played WIF since the first edition and now finally play the computer game !!!

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Post #: 34

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/29/2014 10:18:23 AM

Tankograd

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From: Aix-en-Provence, France
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What is My key driver for playing (M)WIF - game or history? Well military history is my job, and also my passion! I started to play wargames with Air Force and Third Reich by Avalon Hill in the 1980s, and I never stop

Throughout these years, World in Flames will have been my favorite game, and like Maucat and so many other Wif players, I looked forward to the PC version! I ve to say that since I installed the game on my computer, I sleep not much at night!

What is My level of WWII knowledge? I m the chairman of a French company (Caraktere - sorry, I can't post a link as I'm a newbie on the foum) which publishes six magazines of military history in France, and I also write books, among which recently a biography of general Patton. So, I hope to have a good level in military history (at any rate, better than in English)! I��m also a reserve officer of the armored branch of the French Army.

What is My main interest in WWII (e.g. land, air, naval, high level strategy, battles, personalities, economics)? Strategy, battles, weapons, personalities and economics.

What started My interest in WWII history? I began to be interested in the history of the Second World War at the beginning of 1980s, when I was 11 years old. It is moreover like that that I learnt English, because most of the interesting books were in English. Among the friends of my parents and relatives, there was former numerous soldiers and officers who had made the Second World War, some among the allied armies, others within the German troops. Some among them agreed to tell me their story, and so I began to be interested in the war.

< Message edited by Tankograd -- 1/29/2014 11:19:59 AM >

(in reply to Maucat)

Post #: 35

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/29/2014 10:53:27 AM

Extraneous

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Carakt�re presse & �ditions?

[ url = address from address bar ] Your description [ /url ]

Do not include the spaces except in the "Your description" area.

< Message edited by Extraneous -- 1/29/2014 11:54:36 AM >

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Post #: 36

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/29/2014 11:16:30 AM

Tankograd

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Thanks for the explanations Extraneous

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Post #: 37

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/29/2014 1:04:22 PM

Empire101

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From: Coruscant
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Parents... Well, that came later for me. My father was a history teacher and had a lot of books on WW II (among those the ones I read as a boy...). I raided his collection when I was a teenager (helped by the fact that according to my wife I can read a book in an amazing short amount of time. See once timed me -without me knowing it- reading a 200 page book in less than 2 hours. To her, that was amazingly fast. I don't know if it is, since that's normal for me...

Also, I found out when I was 16 that I had two family members who were in the war. One as a grand-uncle in Austria (from my mothers side. After he died his war diary came available to the family. He never talked about the war to anyone...). He fought in the Sturmpioniere in Stalingrad (got wounded there and was shipped out on one of the last planes leaving), the other my oldest uncle on my fathers side, who got away to England during the war and applied for the Dutch navy.

This strange fact made my already existing interest for WW II even higher...

Fascinating!! A very lucky soldier to have not only survived the horrendous fighting, but also to have been lucky enough to get out before the terrible end. No wonder he was so reluctant to talk about his experiences.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tom730
What started My interest in WWII history? My father was a gunner in B-17s in the Eighth Air Force, flying out of England during the war. I actually bought him a book on the Eighth Air Force for Christmas one year and as he was thumbing through it he found a picture of himself and the rest of the crew he flew with! He was sitting on the wing and was only about 17 or 18 years old. It was AMAZING!

How amazing is that!!! I bet that photo bought back some memories.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Maucat
What started My interest in WWII history? My father fought the WWII during the invasion of Jugoslavia in 1941 and remain there until 1943, my uncles fought in North Africa from 1940 to 1942 and a my father's cousin fought in Russia in 1942, They were lucky to survive the war and their tales and their old creased photos when I was child kindled my interest in the history. I like all history from the Ancient to Modern but my favorite periods are the Roman History (I'm italian...), Napoleon's campaigns and WWI/WWII (I consider the two wars at one, WWI was the first time and WWII was the second time).

Another fascinating family history! Reading this and many other posts here shows the rich and varied family histories that many have who are interested in MWiF.

One of my uncles fought at El Alamein in the Artillery, and was rather reluctant to talk about the war.

My mothers father was gassed in WWI, and never really recovered. My mother told me he NEVER talked about WWI.

A Great Uncle fought at Jutland, and he could'nt stop talking about it!!!

Keep it up chaps!! Great thread Warspite!

< Message edited by Empire101 -- 1/29/2014 2:06:49 PM >

_____________________________

Our lives may be more boring than those who lived in apocalyptic times,
but being bored is greatly preferable to being prematurely dead because of some ideological fantasy. - Michael Burleigh

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 38

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/30/2014 9:36:41 AM

Maucat

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From: Rome, Italy
Status: offline

The amazing common thing of all this thread is that the parents or grandparents of all of us fought the WWII on opposite sides and now we're all here to speak friendly each other telling our old family's stories all around the same "digital" table of MWIF...

Thanks Warspite for this thread...

_____________________________

I played WIF since the first edition and now finally play the computer game !!!

(in reply to Empire101)

Post #: 39

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/30/2014 12:00:32 PM

Extraneous

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Joined: 6/14/2008
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My father was in the United States Navy in WWII and parked P-40's in Pensacola, Florida. He was scheduled to go overseas as a radio operator for a PBY Catalina but the war ended.

My uncle on the other hand was in the United States Marines in WWII. He started at Guadalcanal and continued throughout the Pacific until Japans surrender. The only thing he ever had to say about the war was that he felt President Truman saved his life ending the war. Otherwise he would have been part of Operation Coronet during the invasion of Japan.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Extraneous -- 1/30/2014 1:01:08 PM >

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University of Science Music and Culture (USMC) class of 71 and 72 ~ Extraneous (AKA Mziln)

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Post #: 40

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/30/2014 1:47:32 PM

Sabre21

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From: on a mountain in Idaho
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Extraneous

My father was in the United States Navy in WWII and parked P-40's in Pensacola, Florida. He was scheduled to go overseas as a radio operator for a PBY Catalina but the war ended.

My uncle on the other hand was in the United States Marines in WWII. He started at Guadalcanal and continued throughout the Pacific until Japans surrender. The only thing he ever had to say about the war was that he felt President Truman saved his life ending the war. Otherwise he would have been part of Operation Coronet during the invasion of Japan.

My dad was an infantry first sergeant in the 24th ID and I probably wouldn't be here if it hadn't been for the atomic bomb being dropped.

When I was stationed in Germany, I listened to many stories from German veterans of WWII. I knew a night fighter ace that was running a bar in Heidelberg, then the maintenance man of the house I lived in at Gieblestadt was an anti-aircraft gunner at Ploesti and was captured by the Russians. Another regular patron of a guesthouse I stayed at was in the Kriegsmarine at the start of the war and got blown of the E-boat he was on and was picked up by the British and spent the rest of the war in Canadian PW camp. He was 17 at the time and it was mid September 1939.

There are so many other stories, like when a couple buddies and I at Schweinfurt walked into a downtown bar and felt as if we were sent back in time 50 years. Horst Wessel was playing in the background on an old record player, there was a bust of Hitler up on a shelf above the bar and all of the coasters at the bar were Nazi armbands. The people inside got pretty quiet while we were there, but the bartender was pretty friendly. That was back in the 80's, I doubt it is still there.

< Message edited by Sabre21 -- 1/30/2014 2:48:32 PM >

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Post #: 41

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/30/2014 2:08:59 PM

Empire101

Posts: 1950
Joined: 5/20/2008
From: Coruscant
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Maucat

The amazing common thing of all this thread is that the parents or grandparents of all of us fought the WWII on opposite sides and now we're all here to speak friendly each other telling our old family's stories all around the same "digital" table of MWIF...

Thanks Warspite for this thread...

Thankfully, 99.9% of people who have an interest in or purchase Matrix games and history in general and post in these forums, are friendly intelligent people.

Extraneous's and Sabre21's post's are a small sobering reminder of the ordinary soldier's hopes and fears on any side. In Extraneous's uncle's case, to have fought at Guadalcanal, and then to have fought the Japanese across the Pacific is a remarkable achievement not only of survival, but of sheer bloody guts.

I take my hat off to him, and all who suffered and endured.

_____________________________

Our lives may be more boring than those who lived in apocalyptic times,
but being bored is greatly preferable to being prematurely dead because of some ideological fantasy. - Michael Burleigh

(in reply to Maucat)

Post #: 42

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/30/2014 9:23:13 PM

warspite1

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From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Maucat

The amazing common thing of all this thread is that the parents or grandparents of all of us fought the WWII on opposite sides and now we're all here to speak friendly each other telling our old family's stories all around the same "digital" table of MWIF...

warspite1

Indeed. My eldest cousin (son of my dad's elder sister) married an Austrian girl. She grew up never knowing her father - he was killed at Stalingrad. She has lived in England all her adult life.

My dad's younger brother, fighting in the British Army's 43rd Wessex Division, had his leg blown off by a landmine right at the end of the war in northern Germany.

One family two sides...

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

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Post #: 43

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/31/2014 5:14:49 AM

Empire101

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From: Coruscant
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Amazing Warspite!!

Now that would make an interesting book!!

I'd love to be a fly on the wall when you are all sitting around watching Basil Fawlty in 'The Germans' episode!!

_____________________________

Our lives may be more boring than those who lived in apocalyptic times,
but being bored is greatly preferable to being prematurely dead because of some ideological fantasy. - Michael Burleigh

(in reply to warspite1)

Post #: 44

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/31/2014 7:17:53 AM

paulderynck

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From: Canada
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I mentioned it once, but I think I got away with it.

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Paul

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Post #: 45

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/31/2014 1:36:01 PM

Empire101

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From: Coruscant
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quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

I mentioned it once, but I think I got away with it.

Just reading that quote made me burst out laughing

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Our lives may be more boring than those who lived in apocalyptic times,
but being bored is greatly preferable to being prematurely dead because of some ideological fantasy. - Michael Burleigh

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Post #: 46

RE: Just out of interest..... - 1/31/2014 5:58:31 PM

warspite1

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From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Empire101

quote:

ORIGINAL: paulderynck

I mentioned it once, but I think I got away with it.

Just reading that quote made me burst out laughing

warspite1

You started it....

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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

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Post #: 47

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/1/2014 4:57:58 AM

Empire101

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From: Coruscant
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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

You started it....

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Our lives may be more boring than those who lived in apocalyptic times,
but being bored is greatly preferable to being prematurely dead because of some ideological fantasy. - Michael Burleigh

(in reply to warspite1)

Post #: 48

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/1/2014 5:12:34 AM

warspite1

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From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Empire101

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

You started it....

warspite1

The correct rejoinder was "No we didn't, you did - you invaded Poland"

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

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Post #: 49

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/5/2014 2:17:42 PM

Schnaufer

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Great topic Warspite,

1) Both, I have know of WiF for a while, and I enjoy strategy games.

2) I think my knowledge level is average-good. Used to read a lot of books about WW2 from multiple points of view.

3) Really hard question - I like to try to understand as many aspects as possible. The how and why of a global conflict that killed so many. Civilization advanced so far and then tried to destroy itself twice ?

4) My small family started my interest, as a child I wondered why there were so few of us. Only 1 grandparent alive, 1 uncle, and 3 aunts. My dad was Polish, but "drafted" into the German military when he was 15, captured in France in 1944, returned home in 1946. He said he got better treatment than the German soldiers in the camp. That's about all he told me of the war. My mother was born in Latvia in 1926. She told me they had to flee as refugees to Germany after the Russians were ceded the Baltic states in 1941. She spent time in southern Germany where it was mostly quiet in 1942-1943. Later she was moved to Berlin, and was trained in re-assembling aircraft instrumentation from damaged parts of aircraft. She said they used young ladies because they had small fingers. She also told me they were bombed almost round the clock in late 1944. Those were not good memories for her, so when I got a little older I stopped asking.

As some have said, it is quite a testament that we are now able to co-exist with others and accept others points of view in a world stage.
Have a good day all

(in reply to warspite1)

Post #: 50

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/5/2014 2:22:22 PM

warspite1

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Thanks Schaufer, so which country were you born in?

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Post #: 51

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/5/2014 2:35:53 PM

Schnaufer

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I was born in Canada Warspite. My parents emigrated there in 1955.

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Post #: 52

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/5/2014 2:59:15 PM

warspite1

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From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Schnaufer

I was born in Canada Warspite. My parents emigrated there in 1955.

warspite1

Ah..I was trying to figure whether it was Poland or Germany, I didn't allow for another possibility

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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

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Post #: 53

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/5/2014 3:00:34 PM

mjjcpa

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1. My interest is evolving with my age. I think when I was younger, I enjoyed the strategy/tactics aspect, but now I think I'm more interested in the geo-political and economic aspects and how they relate to current events.

2. Varied. Some areas I consider myself expert. Some areas I know little or nothing about. I'm constantly searching for new material. I actually prefer older books, especially biographies. One of my first was Panzer Commander by Hans Von Luck.

3. Varied. I've read a number of books about Guadalcanal and the various air, ground and sea battles that occurred there. I've read about pilots on both sides like Sakai and Boyington.

I also find the Battle of Britain and the Atlantic interesting. I've been reluctant to read anything about the war in China. The war in Russia was brutal enough for me.

4. The conundrum of war. Why don't we address the problems of peace with the same zeal and unified purpose as we do war? When war does arrive, you need to be as ruthless as your enemy. One day, you wake up, and you are more ruthless than your enemy, defeating the purpose. This is why most soldiers are so loathe to go to war, even though they train for it.

Si vis pacem, para bellum

(in reply to AxelNL)

Post #: 54

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/5/2014 8:25:23 PM

ezzler

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My Grandfather was a musician. Well known in England in his day. Had his own orchestra. Played for the BBc and the film companies and such in the 1930s.

He tried to establish a 25-piece light orchestra in the Royal Air Force to provide entertainment for RAF personnel as and where required. The RAF thought that this was a wonderful idea and the the orchestra were conscripted 'en bloc'. Unfortunately pop's eyesight was not very good and he failed his medical examination. As a result, the whole idea fell through, but the musicians who had already joined the RAF had to remain there for the duration, having lost the special posting for which they had volunteered!

So he lost his band and had them sent overseas. Nice one!
He got another orchestra. Carried on until the 1950's when large orchestras were a thing of the past and no longer required.

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Post #: 55

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/6/2014 1:28:31 AM

tom730_slith

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I mentioned my father seeing himself along with the rest of the crew of one of the B-17s he flew in earlier. Someone mentioned how it is nice we can "get along" online here, and I immediately thought of a story my dad told me from late in the war. After D-Day he had more than enough missions to be rotated stateside, which he did, but found Army life too restrictive after his experience in England, so he volunteered to return. By the time he got back they didn't need B-17 crews so he ended up a top turret gunner in a B-25. He said it was a different war at that point - we "owned the skies" and rarely saw any German fighters. He said they would go out in groups of 3 bombers to hit targets like observation posts and such, and on one such mission he had a very memorable experience. The tactic they used was to fly in fast and low and bank sharply after dropping bombs, at which point the gunner (my dad) would swing his twin 50 cal MGs around to the target in case anyone was firing at the plane. On this one particular mission they hit a house on a hill being used as a command/observation center. The bombs had not only torn the house apart, but also knocked over the "outhouse" behind the main house. A very confused/surprised German soldier (with his pants around his ankles) was looking around to see what happened. My dad had him right in his cross hairs�but he couldn't bring himself to fire. He told me that it was one thing when he was at 25,000 feet firing back at ME-109s or FW-190s, but quite another to see this poor guy on the ground totally helpless! Obviously the twin 50 cal MGs would have made very short work of him, but the war was almost over and my dad said he just couldn't bring himself to do it.
True story.

(in reply to ezzler)

Post #: 56

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/6/2014 12:46:39 PM

warspite1

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From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tom730

I mentioned my father seeing himself along with the rest of the crew of one of the B-17s he flew in earlier. Someone mentioned how it is nice we can "get along" online here, and I immediately thought of a story my dad told me from late in the war. After D-Day he had more than enough missions to be rotated stateside, which he did, but found Army life too restrictive after his experience in England, so he volunteered to return. By the time he got back they didn't need B-17 crews so he ended up a top turret gunner in a B-25. He said it was a different war at that point - we "owned the skies" and rarely saw any German fighters. He said they would go out in groups of 3 bombers to hit targets like observation posts and such, and on one such mission he had a very memorable experience. The tactic they used was to fly in fast and low and bank sharply after dropping bombs, at which point the gunner (my dad) would swing his twin 50 cal MGs around to the target in case anyone was firing at the plane. On this one particular mission they hit a house on a hill being used as a command/observation center. The bombs had not only torn the house apart, but also knocked over the "outhouse" behind the main house. A very confused/surprised German soldier (with his pants around his ankles) was looking around to see what happened. My dad had him right in his cross hairs�but he couldn't bring himself to fire. He told me that it was one thing when he was at 25,000 feet firing back at ME-109s or FW-190s, but quite another to see this poor guy on the ground totally helpless! Obviously the twin 50 cal MGs would have made very short work of him, but the war was almost over and my dad said he just couldn't bring himself to do it.
True story.

warspite1

I suspect he would have forever hated himself having pulled the trigger under the circumstances. Good call.

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

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Post #: 57

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/6/2014 12:59:09 PM

warspite1

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From: England
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On the other side of the line....

I visited a client back in the late 90s. First time I met him was at his house - he had a business working from home.

I couldn't help but notice that there were a number of black and white pictures around the house of two men in RAF uniform.

Given my WWII interest I asked him about the pictures. Turns out one of the men was my client, the other his then, best friend. My client served as a member of the ground crew for a tank-buster squadron (can't recall whether Typhoon or Tempest) his friend was a pilot. Turns out his friend was killed after crash landing during a mission in northern France. At the time of the meeting I had not heard the stories of what the Germans did to tank buster pilots...I only hope that fate did not befall his friend.

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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

(in reply to warspite1)

Post #: 58

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/6/2014 2:10:01 PM

Ostwindflak

Posts: 668
Joined: 1/23/2014
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

I am an avid World War II enthusiast and reader of all aspects of the war. Just curious as what you mean by how tank buster pilots were treated by the Germans. I have heard and read about many different stories of prisoner treatment from all sides involved in WWII, however I can't recall any about tank buster pilots in particular. Care to share sometime?

(in reply to warspite1)

Post #: 59

RE: Just out of interest..... - 2/8/2014 1:59:20 AM

warspite1

Posts: 41353
Joined: 2/2/2008
From: England
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Apologies for the delay, I have been trying to locate the source, but without joy. I read that, in response to the devastating effect of the tank busters (notably at Falaise) the Germans decided to dish out special treatment (castration) to any captured tank buster pilot. Whether this was generally applied or a one-off I do not recall.

As I say, I cannot locate the source