Slitherine

quote:

ORIGINAL: ferg1234

Wow. I think I will cross this game off my wishlist. I have purchased 23 games from Matrix but this won't be my next one. I can't imagine there is much free thought allowed on here. I guess if you have almost 15,000 post you can act like a forum bully. Its too bad that the action of one forum member can ruin an entire game.

Don't bother typing out a long winded reply to me. I can't imagine you have anything intelligent to say. Perhaps the people who are trying to make a profit off this game should realize money is being lost because of a bully.

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: kimsand

quote:

ORIGINAL: markb50k

For a game of this size and scope, $99 is arguably ON PAR with other huge grognard games that Matrix has released.  It was a steal when they released it (AND you got books!)

But people complained due to customs/additional shipping etc, and asked for a DL only version.

They gave it to you.  End of story, guys.  Sheesh.

What are you talking about... They still put on taxes which brings this game that has NO AI up to a total of
about 140$ us

Someone, dunno WHO, but someone has done some seriously wrong Price/demand calculations.

There are games out there that has cost hundreds of millions of dollars to produce and they sell for 70-80 bucks,
and said with deep respect for this one mans huge effort, it have not cost a fraction of that.

If they actually sold it at a resonable Price, more people would buy it, i know i certainly would. This would create
more revenue and they would earn more Money AND they would have a lot of very satisfied and loyal customers, instead
of no customers and small income.

warspite1

Can you do us a favour please? Its easy to spout anything that comes into your head and present it as fact, but how about you provide some facts to support what you say?

On what basis do you matter of factly state the price/demand calculations are wrong?

On what basis do you matter of factly state that the price charged is not reasonable?

What prey tell, is a "reasonable price"? Reasonable for who? Matrix? The customers? The developer? ADG? who? Please confirm the economics of the deal to justify such comments and enable us to understand.

What research have you done such that you know a drop in price guarantees a higher revenue - where is that price, and how many people will buy at which price? If my local Mercedes dealer sold a CLK at a reasonable price I know I would certainly buy it. The price I could afford it at would bankrupt Mercedes, but hey, lets not let cold economic facts of life get in the way.

The game is the game at the moment, warts and all, good and bad. How will getting more customers, guarantee more very satisfied and loyal customers - what like Dabrion you mean?

No customers and no income? Please explain further.

Finally, if dropping price is a retailers nirvana for happy, prosperous trading, please tell us why any company goes out of business.

Thank-you. I look forward to your detailed response

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: ferg1234

Wow. I think I will cross this game off my wishlist. I have purchased 23 games from Matrix but this won't be my next one. I can't imagine there is much free thought allowed on here. I guess if you have almost 15,000 post you can act like a forum bully. Its too bad that the action of one forum member can ruin an entire game.

Don't bother typing out a long winded reply to me. I can't imagine you have anything intelligent to say. Perhaps the people who are trying to make a profit off this game should realize money is being lost because of a bully.

warspite1

Forum bully? Interesting comment. So the people that have come on here slagging Erik, the company, the game, the developer, the beta testers - they're okay yeah? they're the good guys? Anyone that supports the company position is a bully?

And please, the idea that grown adults will not buy a game because they are hurt and upset by someone's postings? That really is about as lame a comment as you will see on this or any forum....

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: kimsand

quote:

ORIGINAL: markb50k

For a game of this size and scope, $99 is arguably ON PAR with other huge grognard games that Matrix has released.  It was a steal when they released it (AND you got books!)

But people complained due to customs/additional shipping etc, and asked for a DL only version.

They gave it to you.  End of story, guys.  Sheesh.

What are you talking about... They still put on taxes which brings this game that has NO AI up to a total of
about 140$ us

Someone, dunno WHO, but someone has done some seriously wrong Price/demand calculations.

There are games out there that has cost hundreds of millions of dollars to produce and they sell for 70-80 bucks,
and said with deep respect for this one mans huge effort, it have not cost a fraction of that.

If they actually sold it at a resonable Price, more people would buy it, i know i certainly would. This would create
more revenue and they would earn more Money AND they would have a lot of very satisfied and loyal customers, instead
of no customers and small income.

warspite1

Can you do us a favour please? Its easy to spout anything that comes into your head and present it as fact, but how about you provide some facts to support what you say?

On what basis do you matter of factly state the price/demand calculations are wrong?

On what basis do you matter of factly state that the price charged is not reasonable?

What prey tell, is a "reasonable price"? Reasonable for who? Matrix? The customers? The developer? ADG? who? Please confirm the economics of the deal to justify such comments and enable us to understand.

What research have you done such that you know a drop in price guarantees a higher revenue - where is that price, and how many people will buy at which price? If my local Mercedes dealer sold a CLK at a reasonable price I know I would certainly buy it. The price I could afford it at would bankrupt Mercedes, but hey, lets not let cold economic facts of life get in the way.

The game is the game at the moment, warts and all, good and bad. How will getting more customers, guarantee more very satisfied and loyal customers - what like Dabrion you mean?

No customers and no income? Please explain further.

Finally, if dropping price is a retailers nirvana for happy, prosperous trading, please tell us why any company goes out of business.

Thank-you. I look forward to your detailed response

Anybody is entitled upon his or her opinion on the price of the game. If it is too high, don't buy it...

These questions are way out of line and don't have to be answered by anyone, be it Matrix or any other person.

It's simple enough to disagree on what is a reasonable price or not.

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: ferg1234

Wow. I think I will cross this game off my wishlist. I have purchased 23 games from Matrix but this won't be my next one. I can't imagine there is much free thought allowed on here. I guess if you have almost 15,000 post you can act like a forum bully. Its too bad that the action of one forum member can ruin an entire game.

Don't bother typing out a long winded reply to me. I can't imagine you have anything intelligent to say. Perhaps the people who are trying to make a profit off this game should realize money is being lost because of a bully.

warspite1

Forum bully? Interesting comment. So the people that have come on here slagging Erik, the company, the game, the developer, the beta testers - they're okay yeah? they're the good guys? Anyone that supports the company position is a bully?

And please, the idea that grown adults will not buy a game because they are hurt and upset by someone's postings? That really is about as lame a comment as you will see on this or any forum....

There are people in the forums who don't support this game, for whatever reason. They are entitled to give their opinions and to get over and over again in discussions with these people makes things worse, not better...

Let Matrix clear up this mess or not. I only hope that people who see this topic, will do some more information gathering here, before making statements that are unfortunately only based on the way a few people think and act...

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: kimsand

quote:

ORIGINAL: markb50k

For a game of this size and scope, $99 is arguably ON PAR with other huge grognard games that Matrix has released.  It was a steal when they released it (AND you got books!)

But people complained due to customs/additional shipping etc, and asked for a DL only version.

They gave it to you.  End of story, guys.  Sheesh.

What are you talking about... They still put on taxes which brings this game that has NO AI up to a total of
about 140$ us

Someone, dunno WHO, but someone has done some seriously wrong Price/demand calculations.

There are games out there that has cost hundreds of millions of dollars to produce and they sell for 70-80 bucks,
and said with deep respect for this one mans huge effort, it have not cost a fraction of that.

If they actually sold it at a resonable Price, more people would buy it, i know i certainly would. This would create
more revenue and they would earn more Money AND they would have a lot of very satisfied and loyal customers, instead
of no customers and small income.

warspite1

Can you do us a favour please? Its easy to spout anything that comes into your head and present it as fact, but how about you provide some facts to support what you say?

On what basis do you matter of factly state the price/demand calculations are wrong?

On what basis do you matter of factly state that the price charged is not reasonable?

What prey tell, is a "reasonable price"? Reasonable for who? Matrix? The customers? The developer? ADG? who? Please confirm the economics of the deal to justify such comments and enable us to understand.

What research have you done such that you know a drop in price guarantees a higher revenue - where is that price, and how many people will buy at which price? If my local Mercedes dealer sold a CLK at a reasonable price I know I would certainly buy it. The price I could afford it at would bankrupt Mercedes, but hey, lets not let cold economic facts of life get in the way.

The game is the game at the moment, warts and all, good and bad. How will getting more customers, guarantee more very satisfied and loyal customers - what like Dabrion you mean?

No customers and no income? Please explain further.

Finally, if dropping price is a retailers nirvana for happy, prosperous trading, please tell us why any company goes out of business.

Thank-you. I look forward to your detailed response

Anybody is entitled upon his or her opinion on the price of the game. If it is too high, don't buy it...

These questions are way out of line and don't have to be answered by anyone, be it Matrix or any other person.

It's simple enough to disagree on what is a reasonable price or not.

warspite1

Quelle surprise!

I never went to university so lets make sure I have this right.

A poster comes on matter of factly stating that Matrix has the price completely wrong - such that they are unreasonable and, as a result, have no customers and no income.

I ask said poster to back up said "facts" - and that's out of line?

Right.....

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: ferg1234

Wow. I think I will cross this game off my wishlist. I have purchased 23 games from Matrix but this won't be my next one. I can't imagine there is much free thought allowed on here. I guess if you have almost 15,000 post you can act like a forum bully. Its too bad that the action of one forum member can ruin an entire game.

Don't bother typing out a long winded reply to me. I can't imagine you have anything intelligent to say. Perhaps the people who are trying to make a profit off this game should realize money is being lost because of a bully.

warspite1

Forum bully? Interesting comment. So the people that have come on here slagging Erik, the company, the game, the developer, the beta testers - they're okay yeah? they're the good guys? Anyone that supports the company position is a bully?

And please, the idea that grown adults will not buy a game because they are hurt and upset by someone's postings? That really is about as lame a comment as you will see on this or any forum....

There are people in the forums who don't support this game, for whatever reason. They are entitled to give their opinions and to get over and over again in discussions with these people makes things worse, not better...

Let Matrix clear up this mess or not. I only hope that people who see this topic, will do some more information gathering here, before making statements that are unfortunately only based on the way a few people think and act...

warspite1

They are 100% entitled to give their opinion - but for that matter so am I - or so I thought. But once again it appears that, according to you, I shouldn't. Well sorry, but I have as much right as they do.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: kimsand

quote:

ORIGINAL: markb50k

For a game of this size and scope, $99 is arguably ON PAR with other huge grognard games that Matrix has released.  It was a steal when they released it (AND you got books!)

But people complained due to customs/additional shipping etc, and asked for a DL only version.

They gave it to you.  End of story, guys.  Sheesh.

What are you talking about... They still put on taxes which brings this game that has NO AI up to a total of
about 140$ us

Someone, dunno WHO, but someone has done some seriously wrong Price/demand calculations.

There are games out there that has cost hundreds of millions of dollars to produce and they sell for 70-80 bucks,
and said with deep respect for this one mans huge effort, it have not cost a fraction of that.

If they actually sold it at a resonable Price, more people would buy it, i know i certainly would. This would create
more revenue and they would earn more Money AND they would have a lot of very satisfied and loyal customers, instead
of no customers and small income.

warspite1

Can you do us a favour please? Its easy to spout anything that comes into your head and present it as fact, but how about you provide some facts to support what you say?

On what basis do you matter of factly state the price/demand calculations are wrong?

On what basis do you matter of factly state that the price charged is not reasonable?

What prey tell, is a "reasonable price"? Reasonable for who? Matrix? The customers? The developer? ADG? who? Please confirm the economics of the deal to justify such comments and enable us to understand.

What research have you done such that you know a drop in price guarantees a higher revenue - where is that price, and how many people will buy at which price? If my local Mercedes dealer sold a CLK at a reasonable price I know I would certainly buy it. The price I could afford it at would bankrupt Mercedes, but hey, lets not let cold economic facts of life get in the way.

The game is the game at the moment, warts and all, good and bad. How will getting more customers, guarantee more very satisfied and loyal customers - what like Dabrion you mean?

No customers and no income? Please explain further.

Finally, if dropping price is a retailers nirvana for happy, prosperous trading, please tell us why any company goes out of business.

Thank-you. I look forward to your detailed response

Anybody is entitled upon his or her opinion on the price of the game. If it is too high, don't buy it...

These questions are way out of line and don't have to be answered by anyone, be it Matrix or any other person.

It's simple enough to disagree on what is a reasonable price or not.

warspite1

Quelle surprise!

I never went to university so lets make sure I have this right.

A poster comes on matter of factly stating that Matrix has the price completely wrong - such that they are unreasonable and, as a result, have no customers and no income.

I ask said poster to back up said "facts" - and that's out of line?

Right.....

Yes. You don't have any facts either which supports the way Matrix set his prices. You don't know the contract with ADG, you know exactly the same as the poster, which is absolutely nothing, same as the poster who gives his opinion about the price of this game.

I could turn all those question around to you, asking you for the details to prove that you are right. You can't do so either.

Therefore, it's Matrix who can react, not anyone else. You aren't employed by Matrix and I don't think it wise to argue about the game price. It's set and that's it. And anyone here might say it's too high and Matrix isn't therefore maximising profits out of sales. That's their opinion and we should respect this and not ask questions which can't be answered by you (for proving the price is right) or by the other person (for proving the price is wrong).

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: ferg1234

Wow. I think I will cross this game off my wishlist. I have purchased 23 games from Matrix but this won't be my next one. I can't imagine there is much free thought allowed on here. I guess if you have almost 15,000 post you can act like a forum bully. Its too bad that the action of one forum member can ruin an entire game.

Don't bother typing out a long winded reply to me. I can't imagine you have anything intelligent to say. Perhaps the people who are trying to make a profit off this game should realize money is being lost because of a bully.

warspite1

Forum bully? Interesting comment. So the people that have come on here slagging Erik, the company, the game, the developer, the beta testers - they're okay yeah? they're the good guys? Anyone that supports the company position is a bully?

And please, the idea that grown adults will not buy a game because they are hurt and upset by someone's postings? That really is about as lame a comment as you will see on this or any forum....

There are people in the forums who don't support this game, for whatever reason. They are entitled to give their opinions and to get over and over again in discussions with these people makes things worse, not better...

Let Matrix clear up this mess or not. I only hope that people who see this topic, will do some more information gathering here, before making statements that are unfortunately only based on the way a few people think and act...

warspite1

They are 100% entitled to give their opinion - but for that matter so am I - or so I thought. But once again it appears that, according to you, I shouldn't. Well sorry, but I have as much right as they do.

Agreed. However, you shouldn't ask anyone to prove that they are right and you are wrong if you can't prove the opposite...

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: kimsand

Wow. Warspite Im sorry to have stepped on your toes there, not my intention at all.

Im not stating anything as a fact, im stating my opinion and asumptions,
which i hope im entiteld to, and as i also wrote, i have the deepest respect
for the guy WHO went through this massive task and made this game come to the PC.

I am dissapointed in MatrixGames, i would have loved to buy the game and relive old days
but i feel the pricing is extreme for a game, which if you compare it to practically
all the other games on the market lack in a very important feature it has no AI.

I was a Alpha/beta tester on the first installment of Computer WIF, and ive followed this
game regularly since then.

BUT despite all this, i would have bought it supported it and played it, staying with the community
and Watch the game mature through patches IF it was priced in just an acceptable pricerange.

Be cool, Be nice and stay friends.

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: ferg1234

Wow. I think I will cross this game off my wishlist. I have purchased 23 games from Matrix but this won't be my next one. I can't imagine there is much free thought allowed on here. I guess if you have almost 15,000 post you can act like a forum bully. Its too bad that the action of one forum member can ruin an entire game.

Don't bother typing out a long winded reply to me. I can't imagine you have anything intelligent to say. Perhaps the people who are trying to make a profit off this game should realize money is being lost because of a bully.

warspite1

Forum bully? Interesting comment. So the people that have come on here slagging Erik, the company, the game, the developer, the beta testers - they're okay yeah? they're the good guys? Anyone that supports the company position is a bully?

And please, the idea that grown adults will not buy a game because they are hurt and upset by someone's postings? That really is about as lame a comment as you will see on this or any forum....

There are people in the forums who don't support this game, for whatever reason. They are entitled to give their opinions and to get over and over again in discussions with these people makes things worse, not better...

Let Matrix clear up this mess or not. I only hope that people who see this topic, will do some more information gathering here, before making statements that are unfortunately only based on the way a few people think and act...

warspite1

They are 100% entitled to give their opinion - but for that matter so am I - or so I thought. But once again it appears that, according to you, I shouldn't. Well sorry, but I have as much right as they do.

Agreed. However, you shouldn't ask anyone to prove that they are right and you are wrong if you can't prove the opposite...

warspite1

Please see above post - I am not saying I am right - I have nothing to try and prove

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: ferg1234

Wow. I think I will cross this game off my wishlist. I have purchased 23 games from Matrix but this won't be my next one. I can't imagine there is much free thought allowed on here. I guess if you have almost 15,000 post you can act like a forum bully. Its too bad that the action of one forum member can ruin an entire game.

Don't bother typing out a long winded reply to me. I can't imagine you have anything intelligent to say. Perhaps the people who are trying to make a profit off this game should realize money is being lost because of a bully.

warspite1

Forum bully? Interesting comment. So the people that have come on here slagging Erik, the company, the game, the developer, the beta testers - they're okay yeah? they're the good guys? Anyone that supports the company position is a bully?

And please, the idea that grown adults will not buy a game because they are hurt and upset by someone's postings? That really is about as lame a comment as you will see on this or any forum....

There are people in the forums who don't support this game, for whatever reason. They are entitled to give their opinions and to get over and over again in discussions with these people makes things worse, not better...

Let Matrix clear up this mess or not. I only hope that people who see this topic, will do some more information gathering here, before making statements that are unfortunately only based on the way a few people think and act...

warspite1

They are 100% entitled to give their opinion - but for that matter so am I - or so I thought. But once again it appears that, according to you, I shouldn't. Well sorry, but I have as much right as they do.

Agreed. However, you shouldn't ask anyone to prove that they are right and you are wrong if you can't prove the opposite...

warspite1

Please see above post - I am not saying I am right - I have nothing to try and prove

But why are you than stating that you want people who have a different opinion on this, to prove they are right? That's the thing I'm worried about. Sure, you don't say you are right, but by doing this, you are surely giving the impression that you are right and others are wrong...

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:


99% of the people who objected said they'd buy the game at the stated price except they didn't want to pay the shipping (and possible customs) for the books. Now Matrix has accommodated them and unsurprisingly we now get the whining, carping and complaining from those whom nothing will satisfy...

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Is Paulderyncks "statement of fact" allowable then because it takes the view of a side you agree with (members "whining, carping and complaining")?

quote:


99% of the people who objected said they'd buy the game at the stated price except they didn't want to pay the shipping (and possible customs) for the books. Now Matrix has accommodated them and unsurprisingly we now get the whining, carping and complaining from those whom nothing will satisfy...

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

quote:

ORIGINAL: AxelNL
Dabrion - aren't you violating copyright rules when you act as you describe? (copying rules etc and providing them to others?)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dabrion

quote:

ORIGINAL: AxelNL
Dabrion - aren't you violating copyright rules when you act as you describe? (copying rules etc and providing them to others?)

I hope not! Not providing them to others on demand. Only to (potential) members of my gaming group, which is personal use afaik. This is a convenience measure, not a business plan ;)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AxelNL

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dabrion

quote:

ORIGINAL: AxelNL
Dabrion - aren't you violating copyright rules when you act as you describe? (copying rules etc and providing them to others?)

I hope not! Not providing them to others on demand. Only to (potential) members of my gaming group, which is personal use afaik. This is a convenience measure, not a business plan ;)

I think most of us copy rules booklets to have more than one around when playing the boardgame. You do it a bit more professional than I as I see from the pictures!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

To my knowledge, there are translations of the rules in German, French and Spanish. There might be more, but that's what I know...

Btw... Thanks for commenting on my lousy English...

quote:

ORIGINAL: AxelNL

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

To my knowledge, there are translations of the rules in German, French and Spanish. There might be more, but that's what I know...

Btw... Thanks for commenting on my lousy English...

Bo, I have the utmost respect for our Italian, Chinese and other brethren I have seen in this forum. English is for us almost a second language as most our TV/Movies are subtitled and we learn it throughout our school days (my kids started to learn it at 8). As a small trading nation we have a lot of focus on learning other languages (look at the WiF map where all our flags wave). At high school it is even obliged to graduate with a second foreign language - even if you are destined to go to a Technical University, where English is enough and the other languages will be mathematics or programming languages.
Usually the other language chosen is German (largest trading nation with us) or French (other language neighbour, including the southern part of Belgium). Most schools offer Spanish and nowadays some also Chinese (in my highschool days some of my classmates choose to study Japanese - it had the trading position China has now). No Scandinavian languages, although our culture is much closer to that of Norway/Denmark/Sweden than our closer neighbours.

I myself had the privilege to be able to do my Master's in Paris, where strangely enough I learned more English and discovered Malt Whisky instead of French and their wine.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

quote:

ORIGINAL: AxelNL

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

To my knowledge, there are translations of the rules in German, French and Spanish. There might be more, but that's what I know...

Btw... Thanks for commenting on my lousy English...

Bo, I have the utmost respect for our Italian, Chinese and other brethren I have seen in this forum. English is for us almost a second language as most our TV/Movies are subtitled and we learn it throughout our school days (my kids started to learn it at 8). As a small trading nation we have a lot of focus on learning other languages (look at the WiF map where all our flags wave). At high school it is even obliged to graduate with a second foreign language - even if you are destined to go to a Technical University, where English is enough and the other languages will be mathematics or programming languages.
Usually the other language chosen is German (largest trading nation with us) or French (other language neighbour, including the southern part of Belgium). Most schools offer Spanish and nowadays some also Chinese (in my highschool days some of my classmates choose to study Japanese - it had the trading position China has now). No Scandinavian languages, although our culture is much closer to that of Norway/Denmark/Sweden than our closer neighbours.

I myself had the privilege to be able to do my Master's in Paris, where strangely enough I learned more English and discovered Malt Whisky instead of French and their wine.

Well, I think French wine is overrated... Anyhow, I learned my English while working for an English company who had a daughtercompany over here. Other than that, I've got family in Austria, so my German is also quite good, since that is a language I've spoken since childhood when we always went to Austria for a 7 weeks holiday over the summer (my father being a teacher at highschool helped a lot with the long summer vacation...).

quote:

ORIGINAL: icitrom_y

I apologize in advance if this has already been mentioned. I gave up at the end of page 2.

Putting on my ESP cap, I suspect Matrix/Slitherine chose the lesser of two evils. Had they offered the new download-only version at the usual substantial discount, you'd have a whole bunch of MWiF owners screaming bloody murder as many wanted to not purchase the books but went ahead anyway because they were told there is not and would not be another option.

So, instead of a bunch of non-owners rightly questioning why the download-only version is not discounted, you'd likely have a bunch of owners demanding money back. That's a whole other kettle of fish.

It's a balancing act, weighing a certain but unclear amount of lost sales vs. the mitigation of the risk of current owners creating a big stink that could cost even more money, either directly, or indirectly with lost future repeat sales from disgruntled owners.
.

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805