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riddle me this...

 
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riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 1:20:14 AM   
jcjordan

 

Posts: 1900
Joined: 6/27/2001
Status: offline 		Why would a say a 155mm(or 5-6" class) cd gun get as many or more hits firing on a ship landing troops than a ship w/ an equivalent sized gun (say 6" class) on a same ship in naval combat yet not sink it nor damage it as much while the naval combat ship can sink same ship w/ only a few hits? Seems something a bit off in damage delivered models in cd vs naval combat.
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RE: riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 1:34:03 AM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 10398
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Near Portland, OR
Status: offline 		A stationary gun is far more accurate than one on a ship. The base under the gun isn't moving. They are also firing at slow moving or stationary targets.

Bill

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RE: riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 1:34:52 AM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline 		Nothing odd at all.

1.  When was the last time you experienced the land you are standing on pitching up and down as you might when subject to see conditions.

2.  Land installations have preset range, firing solutions based on known landmarks/inflexible approach routes.  Know many well known landmarks once out at see firing at vessels which have considerable room to manoeuvre?

Historically no admiral has ever relished the thought of going up against shore guns because the advantage always lies with the land guns.

Alfred

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RE: riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 2:40:01 AM   
Reg


Posts: 2787
Joined: 5/26/2000
From: NSW, Australia
Status: offline
The one thing a land installation can't do is close the range. As the target has it tactical initiative they will set the engagement range which will usually be long range (unless they are attacking the defensive installation itself).

Long range fire equates to reduced damage but at least the land installation will be able hit at those distances.


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RE: riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 3:30:01 AM   
mike scholl 1

 

Posts: 1265
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline 		A dedicated Coast Defense gun has a naval style Fire Control System..., but one which has to deal with far fewer variables than a ship mounted gun. Couple that with a range-finding system that is far more accurate (because a ship-mounted range-finder is limited in size, but a land mounted one isn't) and a well trained Coast Defense system will be about 10 times more accurate.

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RE: riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 4:25:02 AM   
jcjordan

 

Posts: 1900
Joined: 6/27/2001
Status: offline 		Point was the cd guns were getting more hits but not sinking the ship but the naval combat while getting less hits was sinking ship, that's the strange part of it

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RE: riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 4:48:03 AM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline 		Not really easy to compare the two.

With combat between two SC TF you see where the shell struck, whether it penetrated, what sort of damage it caused.  One doesn't get the same detail from the landing combat animation.  Then there is the need to also factor the ballistics which will usually be different in the two different situations.

In a surface combat one sees the sinking ships.  That is not the case in amphibious operations.  Often one only finds out that a ship was sunk by CD guns some time afterwards when a confirmation is made in the CR that a vessel was sunk at a certain port 2-3 weeks previously.

Alfred

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RE: riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 8:58:14 AM   
msieving1


Posts: 526
Joined: 3/23/2007
From: Missouri
Status: offline 		Taking a quick glance in the database, the 6" naval guns generally have greater penetration and often greater effect than the 155mm CD gun. But how much damage a particular hit does is largely a matter of luck. You'd have to do a lot of trials under controlled conditions to determine if naval guns actually do greater damage than CD guns.

- Mark

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RE: riddle me this... - 3/22/2014 9:11:43 PM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline 		I also think that in game you are seeing "1 unit of hits" in the tables.

A 155mm M1 "Long Tom" fires around 1 round every 1.5 minutes, manual handling most of the way.

A 6 inch guna of the types used in USN, RN & IJN ships fires 5-8 round per minute with plenty of hydraulic assistance.

Does the game replicate a higher number of rounds on target or an increased effect per round but an equivalent rate of fire???

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RE: riddle me this... - 3/23/2014 2:04:55 PM   
Gaspote


Posts: 303
Joined: 6/30/2013
From: France
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffK

I also think that in game you are seeing "1 unit of hits" in the tables.

A 155mm M1 "Long Tom" fires around 1 round every 1.5 minutes, manual handling most of the way.

A 6 inch guna of the types used in USN, RN & IJN ships fires 5-8 round per minute with plenty of hydraulic assistance.

Does the game replicate a higher number of rounds on target or an increased effect per round but an equivalent rate of fire???


The rate of fire is include in the accuracy, assuming you have more chance to hit shooting more.

(in reply to JeffroK)
Post #: 10
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