RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod

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RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/21/2014 10:08:56 PM

mensrea

Posts: 233
Joined: 5/23/2014
From: Pittsburgh
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Thanks swizzle.

The thing is I'm not sure if it will apply to mods yet. Should be able to test it quickly though.

Also, I wanted to mention that I lost a bunch of data yesterday and that is why the Megarachnids are not finished. I will probably squeeze them into the next update which I am aiming to make the proper ROTS/Heresy story overlap. We are very close to being able to reproduce the Heresy storyline with the check of a box, but that doesn't mean I'm ruling out the scenario, which still would be superior.

I'm also a little concerned about my addition of fuel scoops. I fear I may have to remove them as it would be tremendously easy to stack a ton on a ship and make it never need refueling, which was not the intention (I only wanted 1 per ship).

< Message edited by mensrea -- 7/21/2014 11:12:54 PM >

(in reply to swizzlewizzle)

Post #: 121

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 12:36:46 AM

swizzlewizzle

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Honestly, refueling isn't really a big deal in this game. It might even be better for gameplay to just drop fuel resources all together and let ships fly wherever. I can't count the number of times i've seen the AI with 100+ ships clustered around a single gas mining station trying to get fuel. Might be better to just have ship's limited by their speed instead of their fuel amount.. at least until DW2.

(in reply to mensrea)

Post #: 122

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 1:04:59 AM

mensrea

Posts: 233
Joined: 5/23/2014
From: Pittsburgh
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Well, I can think of a couple ways to fix that. The best way would be to actually make reactors much more efficient and make fuel cells smaller. This could let them go the same distances for much less time at the pump. I did already make reactors more efficient, but I also increased the size of fuel cells. I also increased the cargo capacity of cargo modules, which may lead to longer loading times. That could be fixed as well, by altering cargo throughput.

I also realized that the onus of playing fair is largely on the player, so if a player chooses not to observe a 1 fuel scoop/shipsize rule then that is on them. On the other hand I can and will enforce a 1 fuel scoop per shipsize rule on the AI.

Can you guys tell me if there is a specific problem with AI refueling behavior with this mod, or in DW in general? I have made adjustments to things to try and fix issues I saw with the AI's behavior but I may not have covered everything or done some things right.

I was also hoping that I could get some feedback on racial and government balance. I think the legacy system should have changed things considerably in favor of the minor races. As far as government goes, no one has really commented on my new system, which probably falsely leads me to believe its okay.

EDIT: Actually, I'm not sure why cargo throughput is even taken into consideration. As long as a ship can dock it should be able to pick up cargo right away. Even in our time, we have intermodal transportation which uses standardized crate pallets and shipping containers. Everything should be packed and ready by teamsters, waiting for a cargo freighter to crane up and take off with. Its not like a bunch of wage slaves are just shuffling around tiny corridors with boxes of uranium or something.

< Message edited by mensrea -- 7/22/2014 2:08:41 AM >

(in reply to swizzlewizzle)

Post #: 123

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 1:12:44 AM

DeadlyShoe

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the two biggest ai problems with refueling are big fleets trying to refuel from platforms with not enough gas, and mixed-reactor fleets - the ai doesn't seem to know it should go for a hydrogen/caslon fuel point for a mixed reactor fleet.

the first one is best solved with higher fuel efficiency/smaller fuel cells, the second.... is difficult. you could remove the caslon/hydrogen distinction but that kinda sucks.

(in reply to mensrea)

Post #: 124

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 1:56:47 AM

mensrea

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Joined: 5/23/2014
From: Pittsburgh
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I have already made it so the only fuels are gas and hydrogen. Gas is used in nuclear reactors as a source of propellant, as the uranium used to build the component is providing power. Hydrogen is used as the fuel in fusion reactors and whatever is not used to generate electricity is used as exhaust. I'm thinking a solution would be to make it so gas is the only fuel (propellant) and either uranium or hydrogen (how electricity is generated) are used to make the reactor components themselves. Its the only solution I can think of that keeps the distinction but eliminates the hassle.

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Post #: 125

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 2:28:06 AM

SF-Inc

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Edit: wWas on the wrong page XD

< Message edited by SF-Inc -- 7/22/2014 3:28:39 AM >

(in reply to swizzlewizzle)

Post #: 126

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 2:42:53 AM

swizzlewizzle

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It's not looking like the startup INI warp drive changes are changing the speed at all. Could someone double check and confirm?

(in reply to SF-Inc)

Post #: 127

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 11:43:49 AM

GVind

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For some reason AI likes to stack nova cannons on ships resulting in 4 nova cannons frigate for example. Limiting cannon to cruiser+ ships and 1 per ship would be nice touch.

(in reply to swizzlewizzle)

Post #: 128

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 12:14:58 PM

SF-Inc

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I have been using that setting in all of my games so I can second Mensrea that it does work but let me double check with the latest version.
Actually, you need to make the change with a new game, if you load an old game it will use the setting that was there when the game was first started.
Are you starting a new game and it still isn't having any effect?

(in reply to swizzlewizzle)

Post #: 129

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 12:23:03 PM

swizzlewizzle

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Perhaps I am just misjudging the speed? The reasearch seems to state the same speed as an INI with 1.0 set as the value. Perhaps it doesn't modify any of the text strings to let you know if the setting is actually working or not?

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Post #: 130

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 12:48:16 PM

SF-Inc

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I don't know what to tell you... XD

I think you need the help of someone who knows what they are doing because my Gellar Field is up to 6000 with my Alpha Warp at 37500 right now.

You are closing the game, making the change, then checking right?

(in reply to swizzlewizzle)

Post #: 131

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 2:26:29 PM

SF-Inc

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Mensrea, are all of the upgrades for the Command Centers supposed to keep the Maintenance savings at 10%?

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Post #: 132

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 4:56:42 PM

mensrea

Posts: 233
Joined: 5/23/2014
From: Pittsburgh
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Gvind - I can only restrict them if I custom design the Imperials ships. To be frank I have not touched that aspect of modding yet but I guess its as a good a time as any. The quick fix would be to just make them heavier though, so that putting it on smaller ships would simply not be possible. 4 nova cannon frigates sound pretty scary, by the way.

SF-Inc - I must have mistakenly thought it would be cumulative but now I realize its sequential so I will fix it for the coming update. I will probably just restore the vanilla maintenance reductions.

This also makes me wonder about the cybernetic legacy. It grants a 20% maintenance reduction to cybernetic races right off the bat but what if they were to then research normal command center tech? Would it replace the 20% with 10%? In that case I will have to make a unique command center component and restrict the cybernetics access to normal command centers.

That's good new about the .ini thing. I can now readjust warp speeds to accommodate a wider range of players but I need to know whether more people want faster or slower warp drives.

(in reply to SF-Inc)

Post #: 133

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 5:16:54 PM

SF-Inc

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Yeah, I just checked the Cybernetic Legacy and that does seem to be a problem. Once that gets researched the 20% is overwritten for good.
Wouldn't just restricting the normal command center tech from the cybernetic races be enough?

Edit: Never mind, I forgot about the Regional Capitals and Academy. You could just give them 3 capitals and the Naval Academy off the bat then restrict the tech line because they are cyborgs and cyborgs are just that cool :D

< Message edited by SF-Inc -- 7/22/2014 6:19:10 PM >

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Post #: 134

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 6:41:17 PM

richieelias

Posts: 52
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Status: offline

If someone has the miniatures of the warhammer40k ships and posts top-down views of them, I could do vector art for the mod if you want.

_____________________________

Amarr Shipset
Caldari Shipset
Minmatar Shipset

(in reply to SF-Inc)

Post #: 135

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 10:07:23 PM

mensrea

Posts: 233
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From: Pittsburgh
Status: offline

Thanks for the offer rich, but I see you have some shipset links in your signature. Would you be all right with me using those? 90% of the races in this mod would have no formal ship models because they were basically footnotes in the Imperiums conquest, so there's no reason we couldn't use pretty much any shipsets.

I have decided to release an experimental version sometime soon. I want to make some changes to components and mess with fuels and such to try and improve the AI's behavior. I won't commit the changes unless it proves to work.

(in reply to richieelias)

Post #: 136

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/22/2014 10:15:24 PM

richieelias

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Joined: 3/26/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mensrea

Thanks for the offer rich, but I see you have some shipset links in your signature. Would you be all right with me using those? 90% of the races in this mod would have no formal ship models because they were basically footnotes in the Imperiums conquest, so there's no reason we couldn't use pretty much any shipsets.

I have decided to release an experimental version sometime soon. I want to make some changes to components and mess with fuels and such to try and improve the AI's behavior. I won't commit the changes unless it proves to work.

Haha, oh wow I'd completely forgotten about those. Sure you can use them, though there are probably better shipsets from EVE out there by now. I think someone even has them with the engines put in (mine don't)

_____________________________

Amarr Shipset
Caldari Shipset
Minmatar Shipset

(in reply to mensrea)

Post #: 137

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/23/2014 8:07:25 AM

swizzlewizzle

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Here are some updated balance files. Changelog:

- Multiplied all race growth rates by approx 1.5, with weighting applied for low/high birthrate races
- Made races less likely to pull out their fleets when odds are similar
- Doubled all resource extraction bonuses -> gave a +20% bonus to races that didn�t have it
- Increased early-game warp component speeds (~1.2-5x)
- Greatly increased late-game warp component speeds (~2x)
- Tripled overall shield/armor strength
- Increased shield regen rate and armor absorption by 1.5

I'm trying to make the game reach conclusion within 2-4 hours, and I want fleet battles to last longer. Torpedos and some of the other weapons need to have their speed doubled/tripled though.. they just lag things up and move too slowly. Also, for some reason, there is *way* too much money in the game.. think it has to do with happiness? At the beginning of a game as eldar with Tech level 1 I can put my homeworld to 100% tax and everyone is still happy... I literally cannot spend my money and resources become the bottleneck.

Also, sometimes the imperials (and other races) sit on their homeworld without colonizing.. not 100% sure why this is. Perhaps reducing colony ship build speed by a bit?

Attachment (1)

(in reply to richieelias)

Post #: 138

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/23/2014 6:05:09 PM

Phocian

Posts: 74
Joined: 5/10/2010
From: Old England
Status: offline

Scratch this post I worked out my issue.

Thanks

< Message edited by Phocian -- 7/23/2014 7:45:49 PM >

(in reply to swizzlewizzle)

Post #: 139

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/23/2014 8:38:44 PM

mensrea

Posts: 233
Joined: 5/23/2014
From: Pittsburgh
Status: offline

Swizzle - Please upload your changes as a complete package to dropbox so that I can link it in the OP as a variant and drop me your email so I can direct people to that if they have questions/suggestions/etc. I can't think of a name to prefix it but I'm thinking "WH40k naval combat mod". I also wanted to note that breeding rates are capped at 1.5 last I checked. Finally, the mining components could be buffed instead of buffing every race, probably a slightly easier approach but irrelevant now that you have already done all that work. It's probably just a good idea to max out mining components extraction rates anyway, so I will be doing that with mine as well.

As for the torpedo thing, I have decided to classify what exists as torpedoes as missiles, and missiles as torpedoes. The reason being is that there are no energy torpedoes in WH40k, just normal ones. Missiles are described as being smarter and faster versions of torpedoes in the lore, and where torpedoes are usually intercepted, missiles have sophisticated mechanisms for avoiding interception. As such, I will be making "torpedoes" much faster.

I think the reason there is too much money is because I vastly overvalued the resources, so basically the money you get from them being traded due to commerce components is that much greater. Most races aren't that happy so I would say that issue is isolated to the few races I have given significant happiness buffs to, which is acceptable to me.

Sadly, there is no way to make colony ships get built faster without colonies building everything faster. I have already attempted to alter the size and resource costs of colony modules but the effects are negligible. I don't think the cost/build time of colonies is the cause of this though, but I need to ask something of you so I can find out. Next time you find a race like this, go into the game editor, open up the empire editor, select the empire and see what techs they have. If they did not research colony techs there is a problem. If they did then I honestly don't know, unless they just aren't finding satisfactory worlds to settle.

EDIT: I'm curious how you made them less prone to running fro ma fight as there are no policy files and as far as I knew that's the only way to affect it.

< Message edited by mensrea -- 7/23/2014 9:56:16 PM >

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Post #: 140

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/24/2014 12:14:01 AM

swizzlewizzle

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Look for

ShipBattleCautionFactor
DefaultMilitaryFleeWhen

In the race policy files. If you drop the battle caution factor down, ships will not retreat as readily. Some of the default values are 2/3, which means if they have anything worse then 2:1 or 3:1 odds they will immediately warp away.

I actually forgot to attach my policy files so here we go: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/q3gw3lnyweysynt/AADPQZyx9WP1cLj9CbLsqqCUa

(in reply to mensrea)

Post #: 141

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/25/2014 1:32:53 AM

mensrea

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From: Pittsburgh
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Well, I am pretty sure that most of my legacy techs are useless. It seems that techs overwrite each other, so if a race starts off with a high bonus and then goes on to research another, lesser bonus, the first is overwritten. The bonuses have to be progressive which makes the idea of legacies kind of irrelevant. Kind of depressing, but I may be able to work something out, even if it means re-arranging a ton of stuff in the tech tree. I cannot block a race from researching a tech but I can guide them down a set research path that ends with techs that could basically be impossible to finish, essentially stalling them out and preventing them from undoing their legacy bonuses.

I can imagine the programmer reading that and cringing but I will do whatever I have to do to make things work.

(in reply to necaradan666)

Post #: 142

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/26/2014 1:21:33 PM

Raruto

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Can i kiss you?

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Post #: 143

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/26/2014 2:53:44 PM

SF-Inc

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Wait your turn!

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Post #: 144

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/27/2014 6:39:19 PM

Raruto

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Uff you're really evil SF-Inc

Nein lol

(in reply to SF-Inc)

Post #: 145

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/28/2014 3:56:18 AM

mensrea

Posts: 233
Joined: 5/23/2014
From: Pittsburgh
Status: offline

Thanks you two. Maybe if you are ever in town you can buy me some beer and see where it goes, heh.

Anyway, the new update is ready. This is another huge update with many fixes, additions and tweaks so please check the changelog below. As usual all bugs that were brought to my attention were addressed to the best of my ability, and many requests were taken into consideration. I feel that at this point I have now fixed both the economy problem and the refueling problem. I have tried to fix the expansion problem but even after many changes the AI isn't as expansive as I would like.

I also came up with a new idea since I am only 19 components away from the max: give each race a unique wonder that further distinguishes them. Facilities are maxed at 100 and techs have no max so that will not be an issue.

This update also marks the final procedurally generated heresy storyline benchmark. The campaign is now ready in full and I advise you all to play with the heresy storyline checked on when making a game.

Here it is: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/56152025/WH40k%20mod%20v.7.zip

EDIT: As of 10 minutes after this post I updated this file to fix a resource issue I did not want in.

v.7 changelog
-reworked legacy system to not be broken adding many new facilities and components in the process
-added subversive legacy
-finished megarachnid, loyalist and chaos; "heresy" is now fully playable
-removed hydrogen as a fuel leaving only gas, made engines 4 times more efficient and fuel cells 4 times smaller
-massive hydrogen costs on fusion reactor components
-component resource costs overhaul; much less uranium used in non engine parts, more use of rare ores and minerals
-tech tree flow overhaul adding and moving around many techs; check command center techs, troop logistics techs, energy collection techs
-buffs to the now renamed mining modules
-new components: cybernetic command node, trading complex, cloning center, pleasure complex, engineering bay, sensory camouflage, colonial marines barracks, neutronium armor, armored marine garrison, terminator garrison
-new facilities: enhancement centers, SSM batteries, spy camps, military camps, space camps
-balanced components: missile launch base, fuel scoops, pulsar weapons, super beams, nova cannon, dakka
-increased cargo throughput
-switched function of missiles and torpedoes
-major overhaul of bastard race behaviors, now more unique, aggressive and expansive
-race overhaul adding many new features to races and buffing several races constructions speeds as well as general balancing
-all significant techs and components renamed to fit lore
-major government balancing
-major resource balancing, mostly fixed overinflated economies and lack of uranium as well as uneven luxury distribution
-added ships for Chaos and improved Imperial ships with richieelias artwork (thanks!)
-Eldar character names and better human names

< Message edited by mensrea -- 7/28/2014 5:15:03 AM >

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Post #: 146

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/28/2014 11:12:06 AM

Raruto

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V7!!!!!!!

*KISSKISS* (but no beer... i'm poor...)

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Post #: 147

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/29/2014 1:07:24 AM

mensrea

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Joined: 5/23/2014
From: Pittsburgh
Status: offline

I was told today that the scenario wasn't working, so I looked into it and discovered multiple things were not copied correctly. I am going to release a minor version to cover the things that didn't copy for the scenario and also take care of some art and component issues I didn't like. Sorry for these issues but I hope you all understand that this is still in beta and I am no Erik Rutins.

Here it is: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/56152025/WH40k%20mod%20v.7.1.zip

I also updated the OP to contain more new and relevant info and to post Swizzles fleet battle variant.

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Post #: 148

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 7/30/2014 10:42:15 PM

mensrea

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From: Pittsburgh
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Someone on steam reported that they were still getting the crippling Chaos cult thing. I asked them what version they were using but they haven't responded yet and I want to squash this potential bug ASAP. The thing that blows my mind is that I have the values as such:

0, Chaos Cult Uprising, 0, 0.001, 12, 100, 5, N,

Basically, it shouldn't really be happening at all with how low I have come to set the values. I'm curious if this is happening to anyone else. If it is I will just remove it because at this point I have lowered plague values several times in trying to fix that issue, and if they get much lower there will be no use in having them at all.

The weird thing is that even with the last several updates the plague's were equivalent to vanilla ones, but I would still occasionally get a game where they spread throughout the entire universe and never went away.

(in reply to mensrea)

Post #: 149

RE: Warhammer 40k DW:U Mod - 8/2/2014 12:35:18 AM

mensrea

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Joined: 5/23/2014
From: Pittsburgh
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The steam issue was sorted out. I think it may have been attributed to something that has happened to me before, which is that you make a change to the mod but the game for some reason doesn't pick up on it until you start it a second time.

I also wanted to note that I will try to get the update ready for this Sunday, but I have decided to work on all race policies this time and address the issues that Icemania uncovered in his extensive AI improvement mod, so it may take longer than that, especially so if I alone thoroughly test it. On Ice's work, it seemed that a couple dozen changes were made to policies that helped the AI significantly, and I'm really eager to take advantage of his findings.

After playing with the missiles/torpedo swap and reading more about WH fleet weapons I also want to make some changes. I want to make smart and dumb torpedoes instead of torpedoes and missiles. They will both function like missiles but the difference will lie in range, power, speed, fire rate and component costs. I also wanted to add plasma weaponry that functions like vanilla torpedoes, but with different values. It will require a new branch of the tech tree.

I have also started adding characters for the major races. You may notice Malcador the Sigillite and of course, the God Emperor of Mankind, praise His name. Classic leaders of the Eldar and Orks next.

With all these additions building up we are gradually working our way towards a full release rather than these painful beta's I have unleashed on you guys. I have changed a lot but in the end I will be proud to say that we have a true total conversion, and more proud to have a campaign set in this period of WH history. Thanks for playing the mod and I hope you are enjoying it.

(in reply to mensrea)

Post #: 150